Recycled Bad Guys

[RAND AL THOR]

Well, we have, what, a year and a half to figure it all out.

 

That is our assumption. I have come to realize that it is not worth trusting publishers on publishing dates.

[DemandredFO]

Especially dont trust anything amazon.com says they seem to never get it right.

[Guest Toad]

Well, we have, what, a year and a half to figure it all out.

 

That is our assumption. I have come to realize that it is not worth trusting publishers on publishing dates.

 

Guess it is just wishful thinking on my part.  I just finished the series again about a month ago.  Maybe by the time book twelve comes out I'll be ready to read it again - and maybe understand who all these people in their second skin are.

[Asmo]

Guess it is just wishful thinking on my part.  I just finished the series again about a month ago.  Maybe by the time book twelve comes out I'll be ready to read it again - and maybe understand who all these people in their second skin are.

 

Ishamael = Moridin = the guy who saved Rand in Shadar Logoth in the end of Book 7 = the guy who was observing Aviendha and the others in the beginning of Book 8

 

Balthamel = Aran'gar = Halima Soranov = the girl in Egwene's camp who takes care of her headaches

 

Aginor = Osan'gar = Corlan Dashiva = the renegade Asha'man Elza owned at the Cleansing

 

Lanfear = Cyndane = the girl Alivia faced at the Cleansing

 

These are all the ressurections so far.

[Guest Toad]

Very helpful, don't think I've seen them all in one place before...

[Ealdur Tinuviel]

"The Grave is no bar to my call" is the enscription on the Horn of Valere...

 

Yeah, but that's not what Dreadlord said, is it?

 

The Dark One: "The bar is no grave to my call."

[Bob T Dwarf]

No, the bar isn't...

 

But closing time is. ;)

[aslansrevenge]

Leave Taim alone!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He is himself, not anybody in disguise, just a male channeler who went over to the Shadow and has been taught by the Forsaken

 

I have to agree with this quote Taim appered before the forsaken were free he is spoken of in the great hunt and he has a history with Bashere

[Avery]

Taim appered before the forsaken were free he is spoken of in the great hunt and he has a history with Bashere

 

While I totally agree that Taim=Taim and no one else, that isn't really proof. We know that it's quite possible to pose as someone else with an inverted Mask of Mirrors. A close study could mimic his mannerisms, that is if any of our characters hung out with him for a time before he showed up in Caemlyn.

 

Nevertheless, Taim is Taim; likely a Darkfriend, maybe a Dreadlord, perhaps a new age Chosen. We'll see.

[Rasta Ashaman]

Leave Taim alone!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He is himself, not anybody in disguise, just a male channeler who went over to the Shadow and has been taught by the Forsaken

I think that Taim is not just "Taim himself", but Taim with Beidomon in his head (as LTT in Rands'), with Beidomon having taken full control. That would explain all his peculiar traits - like being weird towards Rand (that Perrin sniffs all the time), his "so called Aiel" remark, his knowledge of saidin (Taim didn't go "Ooooh!" when Rand showed him the gateway; and he taught the Asha'man all those neat tricks they used at Dumais). That would also explain why Taim switched to the Dark Side - being pissed that he was forced to commit suicide, Beidomon might have wanted to exact some sort of revenge.

[Guest Toad]

Interesting thought, but who is Beidomon?

[Rasta Ashaman]

Interesting thought, but who is Beidomon?

He's the AS from the Age of Legends that assisted Mierin/Lanfear in drilling the Bore.

[Leopoled Boothe]

Leave Taim alone!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He is himself, not anybody in disguise, just a male channeler who went over to the Shadow and has been taught by the Forsaken

I think that Taim is not just "Taim himself", but Taim with Beidomon in his head (as LTT in Rands'), with Beidomon having taken full control. That would explain all his peculiar traits - like being weird towards Rand (that Perrin sniffs all the time), his "so called Aiel" remark, his knowledge of saidin (Taim didn't go "Ooooh!" when Rand showed him the gateway; and he taught the Asha'man all those neat tricks they used at Dumais). That would also explain why Taim switched to the Dark Side - being pissed that he was forced to commit suicide, Beidomon might have wanted to exact some sort of revenge.

 

Now this is a very unique and interesting theory.  I would suggest that you post this as its own topic on this board as I'm sure it will bring alot of discussion.  I have sometimes wondered if some of the other male channelers might have voices in their heads, but I never considered that one of them might have completely taken control of the body.  Cool theory.

[Rasta Ashaman]

Leave Taim alone!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He is himself, not anybody in disguise, just a male channeler who went over to the Shadow and has been taught by the Forsaken

I think that Taim is not just "Taim himself", but Taim with Beidomon in his head (as LTT in Rands'), with Beidomon having taken full control. That would explain all his peculiar traits - like being weird towards Rand (that Perrin sniffs all the time), his "so called Aiel" remark, his knowledge of saidin (Taim didn't go "Ooooh!" when Rand showed him the gateway; and he taught the Asha'man all those neat tricks they used at Dumais). That would also explain why Taim switched to the Dark Side - being pissed that he was forced to commit suicide, Beidomon might have wanted to exact some sort of revenge.

 

Now this is a very unique and interesting theory.  I would suggest that you post this as its own topic on this board as I'm sure it will bring alot of discussion.  I have sometimes wondered if some of the other male channelers might have voices in their heads, but I never considered that one of them might have completely taken control of the body.  Cool theory.

 

I don't think there's much to discuss - there's no proof either way, so it's just another of those 50/50 theories :) but it adds nicely to another theory (by Luckers?), re Taim being a new Chosen.

[Majsju]

I would not call it a 50/50 theory, as there is very little to suggest there being much chance of it, while there are certainly things speaking against it.

 

Take Beidomon, if he had been so upset about how he was treated, why not join the shadow when they seemed to be winning, instead of committing suicide?

If he had popped up in Taims head like LTT in Rands, he would be in a world where those who judged him are 3000 tears dead and gone. It would rather be a chance for him to redeem himself, helping repairing the damage he once created.

 

As for taking over, look at what happened when LTT "took over" Rand...LTT controlled saidin, Rand the rest. Rand moved the body, rand did the talking, all LTT could do was channeling, and even that was limited since he could not even lift the arms, he had to ask rand to do that.

[yankee]

Well...

"No more things should be presumed to exist than are absolutely necessary."

I like this sentence, because there is an infinite number of things that do not exist and that's existence can not be proved or disproved.

Thus I believe that Taim is Taim until further information.

The given reasons can be explained otherwise. Taim has been a Darkfriend for years and might have some connection to the dark one (he didn't go mad in all the years and I don't know whether every Darkfriend gets that bonus). But he has some experience with the OP and he probably met one of the Forsaken before and thus knows that a good deal of things are possible that he does not know how to do with the OP. --> He won't go "Ohhhh" when Rand showed the Gateway to him.

 

Anyway, back to the recycling issue:

The cool thing about it is, that you can't solve the whole problem just be killing a couple of guys which is quite easy since they do not work in a team. Instead a more permanent solution (repairing the bore as Haedric Fel figured out) must be found.

[Guest Dreadlord]

I want to know why there has been no mention after the Cleansing of a woman that channels Saidin. Balthamel being reincarnated in a womans body was funny, and very interesting, yet when she was discovered at Shadar Logoth and then escaped, and theres been no more mention of her, I find it strange that people havent even wondered how a woman can channel Saidin.

 

I really really hope Rand finds out Moridin is Ishamael in the last book, and not just when they meet next. That link is a well good idea, Dragon Reborn and Nae'blis connected, each others nemesis to a point, the Light and Darks highest members. That link could be used to build up to an incredible one-on-one, especially if it happened early in AMoL. I think telepathy should be possible via that link. Lews Therin should mutter something when he sees Moridins face next, Moridins thoughts come across "Lews Therin?" and mutter something about their meeting in EotW prologue, and Lews should start screaming "ISHAMAEL!" and then Rand should figure it out.

 

I want to see Rands reaction to learning that the Forsaken arent staying dead.

[Majsju]

It is mentioned in KOD, when it is relevant to moving the plot forward. It is very likely that rand and cadsuane has been told about a saidin-wielding woman, just that we did not see it, because it is not very relevant to their part of the story atm.

[yankee]

Well... I always assumed, that it was actually a dude who used illusion. Those strange hands are a good indicator that the look of that person is modified...

Although of course there is that feeling (or what was it) that Egwene had... Of something hurt because of touching saidin *mhhh*.

[Avery]

Well... I always assumed, that it was actually a dude who used illusion.

 

Oh, it's definetely a female, through-and-through. It's Balthemal reincarnated in a woman's body.

[Guest Toad]

Well... I always assumed, that it was actually a dude who used illusion. Those strange hands are a good indicator that the look of that person is modified...

Although of course there is that feeling (or what was it) that Egwene had... Of something hurt because of touching saidin *mhhh*.

 

Like Man-hands from Seinfeld? ;D