Wheel of Time Season 3 - Full Season Discussion

[Mailman]

@Elder_Haman @SinisterDeath All those things could be the reason why. I just thought it a slightly interesting comparison as it's hard to get good numbers. I would not trust the info coming out of the studios themselves these days as they are not in any way independent.

[SinisterDeath]

  On 3/14/2025 at 9:50 PM, Mailman said:

@Elder_Haman @SinisterDeath All those things could be the reason why. I just thought it a slightly interesting comparison as it's hard to get good numbers. I would not trust the info coming out of the studios themselves these days as they are not in any way independent.

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Maybe this will help? (This is site wide activity)

 

 

 

 

 

[blindandboosted]

  On 3/14/2025 at 1:04 PM, Elder_Haman said:

This doesn't happen here. Sorry, it just doesn't. Nobody gets kicked here for being critical.

People are freely permitted to criticize the show provided that criticism is grounded in something more than name calling.

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Yeah it's not an issue here, it's a problem on the wheel of time subreddit, it has a serious issue with powertripping mods, who remove posts that disagree with them, you can easily see some examples of such if you want by going to the sub and checking out the history of the mod https://www.reddit.com/user/LunalGalgan/ the guy is a serious issue gaslights and claims people are doing things that he's doing, just got banned for calling him out after seeing him yet again go on a powertrip and remove any negative comments. dudes an incredibly toxic moderator. linking because it doesn't even take much sleuthing to see examples of the mod on the sub doing exactly what the other guy was talking about. This forum is a much better and fairer discussion forum than the sub.

[Mailman]

  On 3/14/2025 at 11:02 PM, SinisterDeath said:

Maybe this will help? (This is site wide activity)

 

 

 

 

 

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The visitor number for season 2 seem so small.

 

And i'm not sure if i'm misreading the posts data but 6881 posts would be 350 pages of responses and considering there is under 15 pages in the TV forum thread that has been active since Wednesday at best i am not sure what i am looking at.

[SinisterDeath]

  On 3/14/2025 at 11:03 PM, blindandboosted said:

Yeah it's not an issue here, it's a problem on the wheel of time subreddit, it has a serious issue with powertripping mods, who remove posts that disagree with them, you can easily see some examples of such if you want by going to the sub and checking out the history of the mod https://www.reddit.com/user/LunalGalgan/ the guy is a serious issue gaslights and claims people are doing things that he's doing, just got banned for calling him out after seeing him yet again go on a powertrip and remove any negative comments. dudes an incredibly toxic moderator. linking because it doesn't even take much sleuthing to see examples of the mod on the sub doing exactly what the other guy was talking about. This forum is a much better and fairer discussion forum than the sub.

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There's no reason to further steer this discussion, which is about Season 3 of the Wheel of TIme, further off topic, by bringing up how other websites, forums, and social media sites and their staff handle negative comments.

 

From a community aspect, It's also not a great look to completely bypass the "Introduce Yourself" forum, and make this your first post, which also indicates that you've probably ignored this forum as well. Forum Rules & Guides. Dragonmount Code of Conduct. 

 

  On 3/14/2025 at 11:21 PM, Mailman said:

The visitor number for season 2 seem so small.

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Yep. And mind you, from what I showed, the visitor count I showed you was the pigeon hole number for Thursday & Friday (the days you were looking at). 

And then the Post/Topic Count is the Month leading up to the Show Release.

 

Anecdotally, I met several people who watched the first Season, but they had NO IDEA, that the second season was even coming out. The 2 year wait time between seasons really sucks for viewer retention... But this is literally par the course for Amazon.

[Mailman]

  On 3/15/2025 at 12:31 AM, SinisterDeath said:

 

 

Yep. And mind you, from what I showed, the visitor count I showed you was the pigeon hole number for Thursday & Friday (the days you were looking at). 

And then the Post/Topic Count is the Month leading up to the Show Release.

 

Anecdotally, I met several people who watched the first Season, but they had NO IDEA, that the second season was even coming out. The 2 year wait time between seasons really sucks for viewer retention... But this is literally par the course for Amazon.

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Ah that makes more sense. 

 

Totally agree 2 year waits for what are fairly low episode count seasons are horrid. This is going to be what a 6 week run of content after 18 months of wait. I long for the old days of 24 epsiode seasons that released every year.

[blindandboosted]

  On 3/15/2025 at 12:31 AM, SinisterDeath said:

There's no reason to further steer this discussion, which is about Season 3 of the Wheel of TIme, further off topic, by bringing up how other websites, forums, and social media sites and their staff handle negative comments.

 

From a community aspect, It's also not a great look to completely bypass the "Introduce Yourself" forum, and make this your first post, which also indicates that you've probably ignored this forum as well. Forum Rules & Guides. Dragonmount Code of Conduct. 

 

Yep. And mind you, from what I showed, the visitor count I showed you was the pigeon hole number for Thursday & Friday (the days you were looking at). 

And then the Post/Topic Count is the Month leading up to the Show Release.

 

Anecdotally, I met several people who watched the first Season, but they had NO IDEA, that the second season was even coming out. The 2 year wait time between seasons really sucks for viewer retention... But this is literally par the course for Amazon.

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I didn't think introducing myself was a mandatory thing, to me it seemed a lot more like a suggestion than something that I had to do.

[SinisterDeath]

  On 3/15/2025 at 12:49 AM, Mailman said:

Ah that makes more sense. 

 

Totally agree 2 year waits for what are fairly low episode count seasons are horrid. This is going to be what a 6 week run of content after 18 months of wait. I long for the old days of 24 epsiode seasons that released every year.

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I'd balefire someone for 13 episode seasons.

[Mailman]

  On 3/15/2025 at 1:20 AM, SinisterDeath said:

I'd balefire someone for 13 episode seasons.

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Same. I don't even really understand why it stopped there is far more money being pumped into shows than ever before and in a climate where having content is key to keeping subscriptions active it feels counterproductive to have 18 month+ breaks.

[bringbackthomsmoustache]

  On 3/15/2025 at 12:49 AM, Mailman said:

I long for the old days of 24 epsiode seasons that released every year.

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I think those were all series set in the contemporary world (usually medical or police dramas) - relatively low production costs other than wages once you have built the regularly used sets.   Wardrobe and props are all off the peg.  For fantasy and historic drama every costume, prop and location is a bespoke item (+ CGI costs).  Even GOT at its height had only 10 episode seasons (although some episodes were longer than 1 h).

[Mailman]

  On 3/15/2025 at 3:46 AM, bringbackthomsmoustache said:

I think those were all series set in the contemporary world (usually medical or police dramas) - relatively low production costs other than wages once you have built the regularly used sets.   Wardrobe and props are all off the peg.  For fantasy and historic drama every costume, prop and location is a bespoke item (+ CGI costs).  Even GOT at its height had only 10 episode seasons (although some episodes were longer than 1 h).

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I'm going back to things like Stargate. Used to have 24 episodes a year and a midseason break. Large number of sets in it too.

[Irvyne]

I've mentioned it in the episode posts, but so far I'm MUCH happier with this season than the previous ones.

Rand is better. Mat is better. Elayne actually has something to do. New characters are great. And for the most part, characters are actually heading in the right directions.

Even though it's a change, I think heading towards the end of Book 3, via Book 4, is actually a very smart choice.

[Turin Turambar]

  On 3/15/2025 at 10:54 AM, Irvyne said:

I've mentioned it in the episode posts, but so far I'm MUCH happier with this season than the previous ones.

Rand is better. Mat is better. Elayne actually has something to do. New characters are great. And for the most part, characters are actually heading in the right directions.

Even though it's a change, I think heading towards the end of Book 3, via Book 4, is actually a very smart choice.

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Yes. If you go back into book 3 most of the entire trek from Falme.to Tear is kinda fluff. I mean some cool stuff but a lot of it pretty much "could have been a memo".

[Windigo]

  On 3/15/2025 at 11:44 AM, Turin Turambar said:

Yes. If you go back into book 3 most of the entire trek from Falme.to Tear is kinda fluff. I mean some cool stuff but a lot of it pretty much "could have been a memo".

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It is a smart move,  Jordan had to backtrack for book 4 to build out the story of the People of the Dragon, It works in long form to have all of the culture and story described on the page, and the understanding of dreamwalkers may have told them to take the Stone, but for media it make's a lot more sense of why the Aiel go to Tear at this particular time, and to have the dreamwalking "magic" and things explained on screen. 

I think one thing I have found at least with myself, is I have hit the point where I understand the choices of the changes, so in addition to everything that has improved since season 2, my trust in Showrunners and the writers has increased.  I can look at the changes and see how they fit, even if I still have to speculate and try and figure out what they mean. 

[Jaysen Gore]

  On 3/13/2025 at 6:46 PM, Pandemonium said:

watched the first 3 episodes.  This season is great so far-- I can't imagine why book readers would have too many issues with what has been shown so far.  I am very curious why she has those tremors-- some kind of PTSD from visions maybe?

It was a little odd to see Gawyn and Galad getting some action with the novice/accepted already.  They are both the same cocky personality so far.  I am interested to see them differentiate into the Gawyn and Galad's we know from the books.  

 

The only thing I didn't really like so far is that the show is putting too much suspicion on Verin already.  Verin taking over Sheriam's role for discovering the grey man is a little risky as we don't want the endpoint spoiled too early.

 

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My major complaints as an avid book reader (and while I understand most of them, I think they're real)

- lack of attention to time, space, and geography.  Walking from TV to Rhuidean would be a months long trek with mounts and packhorses. And getting from Falme to TV by boat makes no sense, especially if both Moiraine and Lanfear wanted Rand in Tear

 

- Both Black Ajah events were way, way, way too public. In the books almost none of the general public even knew the tower broke, or that the BA existed. 

 

- The power up of Aes Sedai is a problem, especially with healing. By book logic, Liandrin died at least twice in the first 10 minutes of the episode, as should have Siuan, Leane, and Alannah. This breaks the stakes of the show in a big way, and will impact dramatic quality going forward

 

- The Galad change (banging the novices) is small, but really impactful - it makes him just another hypocritical neoconservative and let's the audience dismiss his arguments out of hand.

 

- Moraine and Lanfear collaborating to isolate Rand. Setting aside even the book logic of this, earlier in the series, Moraine slit Lanfear's throat, and Lanfear threatened to kill Moraine. I would expect that if they were interacting this much, Lanfear would have give Moraine the Dark Willow "Bored Now" treatment

 

Most of these changes fall under rule of cool, or edginess for ratings, or visual story telling, but for a book fan, they could be big problems.

[Jaysen Gore]

  On 3/15/2025 at 4:25 AM, Mailman said:

I'm going back to things like Stargate. Used to have 24 episodes a year and a midseason break. Large number of sets in it too.

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Stargate's props, costuming and sets were mostly off the rack, lower quality and repeated. And while I haven't seen it broken down, it wouldn't surprise me of the S-FX budget for just channeling on WoT exceeded all of Stargate's non-actor budget.

[Turin Turambar]

  On 3/15/2025 at 5:15 PM, Jaysen Gore said:

 

My major complaints as an avid book reader (and while I understand most of them, I think they're real)

- lack of attention to time, space, and geography.  Walking from TV to Rhuidean would be a months long trek with mounts and packhorses. And getting from Falme to TV by boat makes no sense, especially if both Moiraine and Lanfear wanted Rand in Tear

 

- Both Black Ajah events were way, way, way too public. In the books almost none of the general public even knew the tower broke, or that the BA existed. 

 

- The power up of Aes Sedai is a problem, especially with healing. By book logic, Liandrin died at least twice in the first 10 minutes of the episode, as should have Siuan, Leane, and Alannah. This breaks the stakes of the show in a big way, and will impact dramatic quality going forward

 

- The Galad change (banging the novices) is small, but really impactful - it makes him just another hypocritical neoconservative and let's the audience dismiss his arguments out of hand.

 

- Moraine and Lanfear collaborating to isolate Rand. Setting aside even the book logic of this, earlier in the series, Moraine slit Lanfear's throat, and Lanfear threatened to kill Moraine. I would expect that if they were interacting this much, Lanfear would have give Moraine the Dark Willow "Bored Now" treatment

 

Most of these changes fall under rule of cool, or edginess for ratings, or visual story telling, but for a book fan, they could be big problems.

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The changes don't really bother me for the most part and I've been reading the books since 1990. The only one that I really noticed and was kinda "wut" was the insta healing and then the healed person being right back in the fight.

The travel was okay. Yes they needed more supplies to go into the waste. I guess it could be explained by the Aiel with them knowing where available water could be found. They had to go to TV first because the girls needed to be taken back and everyone alerted to the BA in person. That info is not going by pigeon/letter.

Only the fight in the streetwise public and it looked like people were actively avoiding it. Afterwards, a plausible cover story would be released and people would most likely forget about it or itwould become a gossip item. They didn't even tell Morgase about the attack when she arrived. Everything was tidy and neat when she arrived. 

Glad was always a jerk, that he became a "rules for thee, not for me" type is a small leap. I don't necessarily agree but it's small potatoes.

Moraine and Lanfear are both portrayed as pragmatic and willing to do most anything to achieve their goals. I'd say they were within there moral guidelines to work together in this instance. Moraine already followed her to stay with Rand through the ways.

It sets up some things for later as well. My biggest peeve is now I have to wait a week for each new episode to drop. 

[DreadLord31]

Alright - upon a rewatch - I’m still at “it’s really good Tv and I really hope it gets renewed for a 4th Season!” 
 

But … I have more compliments and knits to pick (as a book fan - and Tv fan)! 

Here they are: 

1) Writing wise their strength is definitely dialogue & big picture character development. They have done remarkably well with the Forsaken scenes in particular.
 

But they are quite weak as writers when it comes to “fake out deaths” (healing is super leveled up), fantasy metaphysics (OP levels of Aes Sedai), and action sequences (many of their actions made no sense - like Alanna standing doing nothing to the BA until they hold her Warders swords from cutting off Liandrins head). 
 

2) The costuming people are some of the best I’ve ever seen. The casting is spot on. The acting is superb. And the special effects are much better than previous seasons. 
 

But we still need more and longer episodes. They have too much to do in too little time. Even if it was just 10 episode seasons and 90 min run-times; they could lean into their strengths a lot more. 
 

3) The above comments make me nervous about the season finale - if this finale flops the show is probably done (and maybe even if it doesn’t) & I think they are gonna end with the battle of the 2 Rivers. Battles seem to be where they are weakest. Sooo here we go. Loins girded! 

[A Memory Of Why]

Just gotta say, all the things they're pull out of books is just lovely isn't it. Scenes and dialogue, though a bit changed here and there is just so fun to see on screen.

 

The bubbles of evil were awesome 👌 

 

Prophecy, Prophecy,  prophesies ☺️

 

Mat and Suians scene was great, may have cracked a tear on that one 😢 

 

Rand and Lan sword training, Lan calling him a sheep hearer 🤗

 

Faile calling herself Mandarb, laughed right along with Perrin (it's pronounced "fail" dammit 😤) - on that note I'm liking what "little" we've got of her so far (get it? "Little)

 

Mat vs the princes, how cool was that!? It was built up well and the fight made me happy. (The books were better 🤫)

 

The forsaken meeting was incredibly fun!

 

Perring rallying the stubborn two rivers 🐺 

 

Oh, and did anyone pick up on Avi and the rabbit that wasn't fast enough?

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Avi getting chased by Rand, running fast like a scared rabbit, but not fast enough and he catches her with his short spear 😏

 

On top of this season already showing greater quality isn't this just wonderful.

 

Excited for the next episode, we going to Rhuidean! A bit apprehensive, it is a high bar after all.. heck, what am I saying, it's all a high bar.

[DigificWriter]

I might be the only person out there who isn't worried about the show's chances of renewal.

[Elder_Haman]

  On 3/15/2025 at 11:06 PM, DigificWriter said:

I might be the only person out there who isn't worried about the show's chances of renewal.

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Seems Pollyanna-ish. 

[Mailman]

  On 3/15/2025 at 5:19 PM, Jaysen Gore said:

Stargate's props, costuming and sets were mostly off the rack, lower quality and repeated. And while I haven't seen it broken down, it wouldn't surprise me of the S-FX budget for just channeling on WoT exceeded all of Stargate's non-actor budget.

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But thats kind of my point i would far rather the special effects budget where Stargate level if they could devote 24 episodes to a season.

[DigificWriter]

  On 3/16/2025 at 12:17 AM, Elder_Haman said:

Seems Pollyanna-ish. 

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I'm not worried because I feel confident that Amazon will continue to get whatever it is that it wants out of the show and therefore renew it. 

[Mailman]

  On 3/16/2025 at 2:04 AM, DigificWriter said:

 

I'm not worried because I feel confident that Amazon will continue to get whatever it is that it wants out of the show and therefore renew it. 

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It depends if it's just the studio it will mostly relate to numbers which who knows what the hell they are.

 

If it's Bezos is it ego padding or does he have more important matters going on such as getting his feet under king trumps table.

[DigificWriter]

We've already gotten indications that a decision on Season 4 will be made based on views, and while we'll never actually know what the show's 'success threshold' is, I feel confident in its ability to reach/surpass said threshold just because of the prevalence of Prime Video and the general pervasive interest in the Fantasy genre that dominates societal culture.