tv show spoilers S1E5: Blood Calls Blood

[DaddyFinn]

18 minutes ago, Elder_Haman said:

I know I am in the minority, but I actually enjoyed the funeral scene at the end. I like the beating of the breast and the ceremonial rending of garments as an expression of grief. I didn't get any sense that Lan was weak in that moment - he was doing his duty. Leading a ceremony, the purpose of which was for him to express the grief and pain of all the people present in the room.

 

Happy to be a part of this minority

[Deviations]

5 minutes ago, DaddyFinn said:

I know I am in the minority, but I actually enjoyed the funeral scene at the end. I like the beating of the breast and the ceremonial rending of garments as an expression of grief.

Help me if I'm missing a piece of my memory (it does happen from time to time), but is there anything like this in the book?  Anything besides a few people standing near a just buried companion for more than a moment or two?

 

My feeling is that the borderlanders (including and especially Lan) are so used to death being a part of the journey that the last embrace of the mother is all that's needed.

[Harad the White]

18 minutes ago, MasterAblar said:

I think if Lan was given a bit more chance to shine in his role as a warrior equaled by none, I wouldn't be bothered by him at all.

The battle at EF was the start. He held off a few squads of Trollocs while Mo handled the rest. There's something to grown on. Not so much to do in the Camp skirmish, tho he kept Nyn safe.

[Meskell]

28 minutes ago, Elder_Haman said:

I know I am in the minority, but I actually enjoyed the funeral scene at the end. I like the beating of the breast and the ceremonial rending of garments as an expression of grief. I didn't get any sense that Lan was weak in that moment - he was doing his duty. Leading a ceremony, the purpose of which was for him to express the grief and pain of all the people present in the room.

 

It’s not about weakness for me, it’s that the way his character is described is that he cannot express/feel emotion because of the trauma of his life and his sense of duty to Moiraine outweighing all else. This makes Nynaeve breaking down his emotional walls so much more impactful, which is now lost because he is willing to show so much emotion in public. 
 

I understand that this is an adaptation, so some liberties will be taken, but if nobody had used his name in this series, would you even be aware that this character should be Lan?

[TheDreadReader]

3 minutes ago, Meskell said:

It’s not about weakness for me, it’s that the way his character is described is that he cannot express/feel emotion because of the trauma of his life and his sense of duty to Moiraine outweighing all else. This makes Nynaeve breaking down his emotional walls so much more impactful, which is now lost because he is willing to show so much emotion in public. 

 

Nynaeve may be breaking down his emotional walls already.   Some of what Moiraine says and does can be seen as her realizing that is happening.

 

 

[Vartija]

The Stepin stuff felt a little long winded to me. Might be a book reader issue because I knew where it was heading and didn't feel like investing much in his story. It's one of those things where you go "why are they wasting time on him when there's so much book stuff to go through?". But I can see it working much better for non readers, and there was a point to it in explaining the Warder-AS relationship. 

 

The melting of the ring gave a clear LoTR vibe. They aren't very subtle with borrowing from LoTR, are they? Personally I would be more cautious with that. 

 

Not a huge fan of the last funeral scene. It grates seeing Lan so animated even if it there was a logical buildup to it (at least in tv lore), it just goes so strongly against the book Lan. And I have to admit it's getting a bit ridiculous how he ends up the fool in so many scenes. I don't expect him to be infallible but they aren't really making him that impressive either. 

 

I wish the Loial & Rand scene had been longer. It felt kind of rushed. The "red hair is one of the few physical traits that can help you work out where a human is from"-line felt a little heavy-handed and not very subtle. Then Loial suddenly popping up with Nynaeve felt a bit too convenient. Nice touch with the background rambling by Loial. 

 

I liked most of the stuff with Egwene, Perrin & Valda. I thought Egwene had the strongest acting in this episode. The wolf attack was maybe a little clunky but it didn't bother me that much. Curious that they skipped Perrin attacking the Whitecloaks with his axe. 

 

I liked the CGI Tar Valon, except for the tower which looks too squat for my liking. The interior of the tower looked nice to me. 

 

There were a lot of little things stuffed into this episode. Perhaps it was the Stepin arc that just kept me turned off for the most part. I just kept thinking "let's get on with it" for too much of the episode. 

 

 

[Elder_Haman]

8 minutes ago, Meskell said:

I understand that this is an adaptation, so some liberties will be taken, but if nobody had used his name in this series, would you even be aware that this character should be Lan?

The way they've changed Lan is my least favorite thing in the series so far. I don't hate the character, but I agree that he is very different from the Lan in the books.

[Pandemonium]

35 minutes ago, DermidAjala said:

 

Imagine thinking the green man is important ?

I sure hope we do.  the forsaken and aol will be a great reverberation of the age of Legends.  

[Windigo]

14 hours ago, thievingsackofpotatoes said:

This was a bit odd to me. They played this up in the teaser and it was, from my perspective, pretty indecipherable. 
 

Part of me wonders if it’s a painting/picture from Siuan. Not sure what to make of it/was disappointed.

9 hours ago, dwn said:

 

I expect the suggestion that Siuan is Moiraine's enemy is misdirection, which goes with what they were cultivating in the books to keep the search a secret. Perhaps the woman in Moiraine's painting is Siuan?

 

 

I agree, I think is is setting up for Moiraine and Siuan's relationship and their misdirection.

10 hours ago, Blackbyrd said:

 

I'm still puzzled about Lolial finding Nynaeve. Very big 'Let's just leave EF' energy 

 

 

This- It is like a scene was cut,   Liandrin tells Nynaeve the direction of the Library and Gardens,   
Loial mentions he has access to the tower. 
Brought back  Nynaeve, 
Obviously he found her in the Library or Gardens, but this was poorly executed and a shortcut. Makes the entire scene with Liandrin and Nynaeve feel like oh we need someone to tell her where the library is ... 

 

[Harad the White]

8 minutes ago, Windigo said:

Obviously he found her in the Library or Gardens, but this was poorly executed and a shortcut.

Things in the episode bothered, but not that. The melting ring scene did. That was like having Child Valda answer Eg after, "Truly religious people would let us go," with "Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn." It's not inconsistent with the situation, but it kinda takes you out of this story.

[Meskell]

27 minutes ago, TheDreadReader said:

 

Nynaeve may be breaking down his emotional walls already.   Some of what Moiraine says and does can be seen as her realizing that is happening.

 

 

The problem with that is that we haven’t been shown anything of Lan being stoic, emotionally stunted etc. He has pretty much been overtly emotional right from day one, including laughing and joking right through to screaming like something out of Meatloaf music video. 
 

I’m fine with things being brought forward, as the books can drag, but character development needs to have a basis to start from. The character as is, is completely alien to the book chapter. 
 

The rest have been sped along but they are at least recognisable as characters from the book. 

[thievingsackofpotatoes]

Just noticed this on Amazon's breakdown of TV. Sad, like many, that we didn't get Basel Gill but digging the name of the Inn!!!

[Windigo]

6 hours ago, Gothic Flame said:

Relate that to the books.

The fact that they can tell what is being woven, often in the books they mention they can tell what the weaves are, so showing the weaves as opposed to talking about seeing and sensing them fits well in the show. 

Spoiler

like the weave for listening to a conversation  is Air with a touch of Fire.
weave of Earth and Fire for the fire arrows 
 

 

[Windigo]

11 minutes ago, Meskell said:

The problem with that is that we haven’t been shown anything of Lan being stoic,

I agree, there is plenty they have used to set up Lan (and Moiraine), but instead of stoic they are just setting them up as aloof and secretive.    

 

[AdamA]

I was actually relieved at the funeral scene. It felt kind of pointless because the season is almost over and I didn't care about this character since I knew he was a redshirt as soon as he showed up, but people were really up in arms in the trailer at Lan showing grief. The explanation that it isn't actually his grief, but part of a ceremony where he is supposed to show grief on behalf of everyone else works fine for me. You don't get an exemption to sit on the sideline just because you're some super special snowflake borderlander who doesn't experience pain. This actually felt like less of a betrayal of Lan as a character. Lan does his duty, even when that duty is to cry in public.

 

That doesn't seem like a universal interpretation, though. A lot of people here seem to have taken the chest beating as Lan showing his own emotions. I took it as a ceremony where whoever was placed in that position would have had to do the same thing. It even seemed like the room might have been a ter'angreal to channel everyone else's feelings into him. As long as they're aping other IP casting Kerene's ring into the fiery chasm of Fount Doom, it was uncomfortably close to Holy Wayne's "let me take it from you" magic hugs from The Leftovers, though.

[Agitel]

I think Lan was showing his emotions. He would normally bury these emotions and present a stoic face, but as the designated mourner taking on and expressing the grief of everyone present, he let it out.

 

Book Lan isn't emotionless. He just doesn't let other people get a read on them.

[Windigo]

1 hour ago, caemlyncal said:

 its nice that you can watch and enjoy the show with your family and not have to feel overly awkward watching soft core porn like GOT forced on us.

Forget family, that is why I stopped watching it. 

[Meskell]

5 minutes ago, AdamA said:

I was actually relieved at the funeral scene. It felt kind of pointless because the season is almost over and I didn't care about this character since I knew he was a redshirt as soon as he showed up, but people were really up in arms in the trailer at Lan showing grief. The explanation that it isn't actually his grief, but part of a ceremony where he is supposed to show grief on behalf of everyone else works fine for me. You don't get an exemption to sit on the sideline just because you're some super special snowflake borderlander who doesn't experience pain. This actually felt like less of a betrayal of Lan as a character. Lan does his duty, even when that duty is to cry in public.

 

That doesn't seem like a universal interpretation, though. A lot of people here seem to have taken the chest beating as Lan showing his own emotions. I took it as a ceremony where whoever was placed in that position would have had to do the same thing. It even seemed like the room might have been a ter'angreal to channel everyone else's feelings into him. As long as they're aping other IP casting Kerene's ring into the fiery chasm of Fount Doom, it was uncomfortably close to Holy Wayne's "let me take it from you" magic hugs from The Leftovers, though.

They could’ve just any other Warder if they wanted a designated screamer. Then they could’ve shown some close up shots of Lan fighting his emotion, rather than just screaming it out into the world. 

[Meskell]

Just now, Windigo said:

Forget family, that is why I stopped watching it. 

One of the best aspects of the later seasons was the removal of nearly all the pointless nudity from the early seasons. 

[FanofKnotai]

2 hours ago, caemlyncal said:

I felt like a kid on Christmas morning seeing Loial for the first time!! Who cares that he isn't tall enough, he brought me the most joy of the series so far. not saying other parts didn't bring me joy. Unlike the nitpickers I absolutely love everything they have done so far. ONCE AGAIN THIS IS NOT A BOOK IT IS A TV SHOW ADAPTATION!!!

??

[Deviations]

51 minutes ago, Vartija said:

Curious that they skipped Perrin attacking the Whitecloaks with his axe. 

Does he even still have the axe?  I haven't noticed it since he buried it in his wife's chest?

[Windigo]

8 minutes ago, AdamA said:

This actually felt like less of a betrayal of Lan as a character. Lan does his duty, even when that duty is to cry in public.

 

I had not thought of that. 

[Windigo]

3 minutes ago, Deviations said:

Does he even still have the axe?  I haven't noticed it since he buried it in his wife's chest?

He did when leaving Two Rivers,   I would have to watch again, but I think it was lost along with Bela when they fled Shadar Logath.

Edited December 3, 2021 by Windigo

[Katherine]

51 minutes ago, Vartija said:

 

The melting of the ring gave a clear LoTR vibe. They aren't very subtle with borrowing from LoTR, are they? Personally I would be more cautious with that. 

 

 

 

 

Yes initially I thought about LOTR. 

 

However, I also thought it was a lovely metaphor for the pattern and the re-birth of souls. When an AS dies, their ring (like their soul) disintegrates, until it is remade(born) when the pattern needs it. 

 

I might be reading too much into, but the metaphor works nicely. 

[DojoToad]

9 hours ago, DaddyFinn said:

Remember: they adapt the series as a whole. Logain's and Stepin's arc explains a lot of things for future episodes and seasons.

Careful what you wish for - you may not get the payoff you expect.