[Game thread]Magic The Gathering

[Shad_]

My brain's burning out. I need to sleep soon.

[Adella]

 

@Shad - why switch instead of encouraging others to vote Alf if you seriously thought he was more scummy?

I did.  I mean not sirens blazing god guys follow my lead here but I made it pretty clear that I'd rather go there and then waited until the final minute to switch.

 

If Alf does turn out to be scum wouldn't be a bad idea to reread what was said in that block, but that's getting ahead of myself.

 

Literally the final minute too!! LMAO!

[Killashandra]

The kids have been a major distraction today which is why I haven't given my full reads list. I plan on doing it in the morning after I get up.

@dice- if you addressed my post about the Alf convo then I missed it. If you did will you please direct me to it?

@killa- I don't like this foreboding from you. Its not a good look for you.

I really am sorry I've been gone most of the day but will make up for it tomorrow.

Foreboding?

[Shanti]

Got here. Was handed a drink and then another and then another and possibly a few more.... Read through, giggled quite a bit, will re-read tomorrow and respond to everything. Me+drinking+mafia= bad.

[Cass]

 

@Shad - why switch instead of encouraging others to vote Alf if you seriously thought he was more scummy?

I did.  I mean not sirens blazing god guys follow my lead here but I made it pretty clear that I'd rather go there and then waited until the final minute to switch.

 

If Alf does turn out to be scum wouldn't be a bad idea to reread what was said in that block, but that's getting ahead of myself.

 

 

 

Why's it getting ahead/unnecessary now if you still think he's scum?

 

 

youuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu wait for tomorrooooooooooooooooooooowwww

 

#OldschoolChair:wub:

 

And now I have this stuck in my head.

[Shad_]

Because if I spent my time hunting down secondary reads my head would explode. I note connections when I see potential for them and reassess interactions when wolves die.

[Cass]

Because if I spent my time hunting down secondary reads my head would explode. I note connections when I see potential for them and reassess interactions when wolves die.

 

Is Alf still your top scum?

[Shad_]

I've got a day and change to figure that out yet. He obviously will need to be resolved one way or another at this rate.

[Shad_]

For real now sleepsleepselelspefakspfsjf

[Cass]

Re: EoD

 

The idea that has been setting in on DM lately that D1 is a crap shoot is garbage and for the sake of my win % villagers need to start understanding that it's garbage.

 

We lynch wolves on D1 here.

 

Often.  Extremely often.  I really piss people off by posting the stats of how often we lynch wolves on D1 here.

 

A three way tie with 2 votes each at EoD is as good as a concession.  You will never have a phase where all wolves are alive and less willing to bus than D1.   If you actually string people up, you can study the reaction patterns, look for people tossing out excuses to move the train, weak justification for counterwagons, weak justification to jump on board an easy lynch, etc.  If you successfully hunt villagers, you can force wolves into making awkward concessions that stand out for lack of reasoning.  People talk about needing flips to have information to work with.  No.  D1 is the information phase, if you use it appropriately.

 

What on earth does a 3 way tie of 2 votes buy you?  A 3 scum team literally has 100% control of that lynch.  No one gets properly cleared if a wolf dies because you know for a fact that they were mechanically capable of preventing it.  Everyone looks bad if a villager dies.  It's a conceded phase.

 

I thought LZM had a better chance of flipping scum than Darthe by a hair, so I took a stand and locked in a proper lynch.  And guess what?  If he flipped scum then BFG and Cass and Dice and everyone else who knows me would tell you I am never a wolf in this game and they would be right.  A villager's first job is to do the most they can to prove they are a villager.  People not voting and complacently letting it randomize between three players are basically saying "I think I'll just try to blend in with the wolves this phase."

 

 

My take on it is that with a three way tie, and two of them now confirmed villagers, the scenario's could be

 

Alf is a villager - Scum didn't need to do a thing. They could be anywhere on the board, voting or not.

 

Alf is scum - Scum need to either chance a teammate going out, or make it so he's not in the running.

 

 

Thinking about this/the logic of the bold more, 

 

If noone gets properly cleared if a Wolf dies; and

Everyone looks bad/phase is conceded if a Villager dies;

 

Then results are the same, except option A is better for Town.

 

 

If iyo nobody gets properly cleared/the phase is conceded either way

 

AND you really felt stronger about Alf, but were willing to vote LZM and he only looked better than Darthe by a hair, you shifting your vote when you did doesn't make sense/achieves nothing?

 

 

[v]Alf[/v] for now

[Cass]

I can understand all of that, I'm just stating that a town person did for, you were the hammer on said town person, and it just as easily could be turned around and said that you switched from Alf to LZM or even Darthe id you went that route TO prevent his lynch because many didn't vote and anyone could have come in with a last minute vote to lynch him.

 

I will admit, your fighting me is making you look better. I do understand the logic you're speaking. Just giving my pov. I didn't expect to be able to talk this much tbh, so I wanted to at least get a list and some thoughts out before I had to go silent.

 

@Shanti, the bold argument only stands IF you think Alf is Scum?

 

 

Yesterday you had him null/not ringing any bells/needing more content - which could just have likely been avoiding giving a team-mate a Scum read.

 

 

 

My d1 reads up to post #484

 

Shad- 5 pages of content, started out a big rocky for me on page 1, we had a misunderstanding but it seemed to be cleared up alright enough by page 2.

Sorry if you've answered this, but what brought you to this sudden conclusion? You had one small interaction with BFG (from what I could tell in your ISO with lacking some quotes) and then suddenly, BFG is town.

[Game thread]Magic The Gathering

 Posted by Shad_ on Today, 12:55 AM in DM Mafia Games

At any rate BFG is town, so there's that.

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Even BFG agrees it isn't your norm.

 

[Game thread]Magic The Gathering

 Posted by Shad_ on Today, 01:01 AM in DM Mafia Games

BFG, on 06 Jun 2017 - 7:57 PM, said:

 

Shad_, on 06 Jun 2017 - 7:55 PM, said:

At any rate BFG is town, so there's that.

You're normally far more hesitant to read me 

 

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

With that being said, you do seem to be poking and prodding which reads well for you. I'm going with null for now.

 

 

 

Darthe- Only game I've played with him he was scum, and he was absent for most of the game leading up to his lynch. But iirc his posting leading up to all of that was similar (may be wrong and need to go back and check). AARN leaning scum just because I don't have enough to go on. Barely fills one page with posts thus far. Not liking content of posts either.

 

Shanti- town

 

Tigraine- I'm actually liking content so far. Remembering your last two games, you were hot and heavy on defenses and reads, like you were trying too hard to seem town...this time your reads and reasoning seem natural and innocent. Would like to see more from you but for now, and I can't believe I'm going to say this, I think you are town.

 

LedZepMan- Not really sitting right with me. Content seems...off. He lacks substance, and not only asked if hydra had their own chat (after he was previously in a game where it was mentioned, I was in said game) but then he also talked about no night talk being new to him, there was no night talk in that game either. I really need more but right now he is seeming extremely scummy to me.

 

DreadPirateRoberts- Not enough to really get a read, but GTH, I'd lean scum. BUT as it isn't really GTH, I'll go with null until I get more.

 

Adella- One of the first to give slight reads....for now seems pretty... Adellaish to me. Leaning town, need to see more.

 

CuthaNyn- Really kind of hitting a wrong button for me. Cuth could almost lean town for me, but seems extremely noncommittal, however put both iso together and read as one, comes off very scummy to me. *Shrug* I need to see more substance but I want to lean null right now. Only reason for that is Cuth's questioning peoples' reads and thoughts.

 

 

Alfred Jodocus- Not really ringing any alarms yet. But I need more content. So far just seems newb...maybe on purpose? null

 

 

Killanos- Coming off townie to me so far. Asking questions, elaborating, poking. Its a good look. Even if Kronos and the gut feeling towards me is wrong. I also disagree about being defensive in the quotes he made towards me. I was simply answering questions, but oh well. I'll say town for now. 

 

BFG- Your ISO made me raise a brow. You are asking alot of what others think of others, but you aren't really providing any reads, thoughts, or the like about players. You're basically just getting others' thoughts and not providing your own. Not a good look imo. I would like a read from you. Slight scum lean atm.

 

Cass- I actually read Cass as scum in my head quite a bit last game. I went back and forth alot. Actions and tone seem the same this game, so maybe that means town? Not sure. Cass confuses me and I have a hard time reading, so I will say null. But if it came down to it I AM leaning more town than anything.

 

dicetosser1- A couple of rapid beginning votes there, but nothing I really raised a brow at. However, content isn't really saying much. I need more, if I had to, I'd honestly lean scum. Will leave it at null for now.

 

 

 

Today you have him 3rd highest scum, moving him ahead of BFG and Dice (*and DPR) who you were leaning null-scummy on.

 

 

Why, for each of them?

[Cass]

 

Oy. I feel like I just attacked one scum and the buddy is there to back them up. LZM did have much more content than either of those iirc. But you both voted LZM based on him doing nothing. I gave quite a bit of reasoning behind voting LZM, even if I was incorrect. How could you not expect anyone to point fingers at either of you for voting town? Once I saw he flipped scum I knew I would be suspect, yet my first thought was at least one of you if not both HAS to be scum.

 

I refuse to back down, but I am no longer going to go in circles with either of you. My vote on LZM was an honest mistake, I was truly convinced he was scum.. Darthe was actually on my scum list too, so I was surprised when his mod kill flipped town.

 

I feel you're grasping at straws and using my confusion to TRY to trip me up, but I have nothing to hide. Why? Because I'm town. Twist my words, but I am 100% town and i am now 100% confident you (cuth) are scum and my vote will not move.

i voted him because his content, again, which was over 10 posts, again, was super super underwhelming wrt what he said and when and why

 

and, again, because it was more than i had on anyone else, and i've explained what i feel on every player and why as far as i know, might have forgotten a person or two who've barely posted

 

either way

 

look

 

i still think you're town, and this exchange has made me feel even more confident in said read

 

at the same time

 

you're accusing me on false grounds, your points against both me and shad are not legitimate in any way, and you're working yourself into a tunnel in a super unproductive way

 

i was not saying that "oh, you're scum, you're dragging attention on their voters away from yourself and onto the other two zep voters"

 

because that doesn't make sense

 

i was confused why you were making such a big deal of our votes while having voted him yourself for a reason that was not really better in any way

 

and i found it slightly amusing

 

nevertheless

 

can we work together

 

can you not just tunnel me all phase

 

i don't mind, there are worse things that could happen, but it's a waste of everyone's time

 

if you still think i'm scum at the end of the day, be my guest and vote me

 

on your own head be it

 

 

Cuth, you don't mention reading Shanti as Town before here?

 

Can you elaborate about 'liking D1 content'/what made her Town for you before this?

[Cass]

@Dice it felt like you were going on a bit re: Alf mainly because you haven't said much of anything else, which is weird for you in general.  Give me game thoughts or lemme know when it will be about 4am local time plz.

 

 

Mindmeld/waiting to see what he comes up with after work.

 

 

4am local time is 11hrs from now 

 

<.<

[Cass]

P + C having more content in general but lists coming roughly the same point in the games

 

 

The difference for me is straight up D1 last time the game-related posts demonstrated serious concentration/vote-action:

 

 

 

Fail. [v] Alexander7 [/v]

 

 

 

 

 

Confused. Isn't Alexander's vote on me at the moment?

Are you just voting Alex because he voted you, or is there more there?

 

 

I gave my reasoning in my vote comment. He was entirely too defensive when asked why he voted how he voted. 

It didn't sit right with me and his defensiveness seemed scummy.

 

 

 

 

why not?

 

earlier i voted you. why didnt you ask me about it then, but now you are asking me about my new vote?

 

 

there is no motive. it's a random vote. for the purpose of getting people to react to it and push the game forward

 

but saying this outloud kind of defeats the purpose. i feel a bit rustled for answering this

 

These came off as defensive to me, and are hence part of the reasons I voted for Alex.

 

 

Vs here, where there's essentially light pokes/banter/fluff until the actual reads list.

[Nynaeve]

I can't really catch up fully right now, gotta go do errands after sleeping for like 13 hours on and off. Cuth did tell me that he voted lzm and it did not go well. He was pretty much solo at EoD cause i was busy rocking back and forth over rl >.> and being in another game cause apparently

... I'm dumb. I prolly would have gone alf. Just had more good feelz than bad ones in general. Also felt like a really short day phase. So w/e. I dont even know what day I'm at so maybe it's just a me thing.

 

Anyways...

 

I gotta say one thing... loldarthe

[Cass]

Caught up on D2 to here, mindmelding with Shad wrt Killa's popcorn,

 

That said, I feel like I don't know Adella/Killa/Tigs/Shanti/Kronos and they all keep blending/slipping through my thoughts, will try and sort them out tonight.

 

There's not enough from Dice/BFG/Nyn for me to feel like I can get a handle on them.

 

 

@Dice - Why aren't you talking to me? I've asked several times now for your off-the-cuff thoughts. I don't care if you don't have much - throw anything you have, any way you have it.

[BFG]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Sooh]

 

Vote count:

 

CuthaNyn (1): Shanti

 

Alfred (1): Cass

 

Not voting (9):  Tigraine, DreadPirateRoberts, Alfred Jodocus, BFG, Cuthanyn, Shad, Killanos, Dice, Adella

 

 

[BFG]

I'll be back with real thoughts and stuff later

 

For now @Cass I was suspicious of Nyn, 100% snark was not a good look for her, nullified a little by later stuff

 

@Shad it was Nyn talking about hot messes lol, I have kronos as town for general engagement. A little concerned by the content of his early post to Cass, but suspect that the timing of it is more significant than the content!

 

@Shanti how much of your reads list is done via ISO?

[BFG]

I had slight concerns with Adella yesterday, her reads list had Darthe as her strongest suspect, and the reasoning for voting Alf instead was odd (will reread that exchange) but given darthe flipped town I'm not sure that's so important

[BFG]

And finally for whoever proposed a shad/alf team... No

 

Shad doesn't start a wagon on a teammate when there are half a dozen other choices then flip for something short of a smoking gun

 

Lack of interest at eod suggests that Alf was town for lolreasons, and I'd not put huge amounts of faith in it

[BFG]

 

Re: EoD

 

The idea that has been setting in on DM lately that D1 is a crap shoot is garbage and for the sake of my win % villagers need to start understanding that it's garbage.

 

We lynch wolves on D1 here.

 

Often. Extremely often. I really piss people off by posting the stats of how often we lynch wolves on D1 here.

 

A three way tie with 2 votes each at EoD is as good as a concession. You will never have a phase where all wolves are alive and less willing to bus than D1. If you actually string people up, you can study the reaction patterns, look for people tossing out excuses to move the train, weak justification for counterwagons, weak justification to jump on board an easy lynch, etc. If you successfully hunt villagers, you can force wolves into making awkward concessions that stand out for lack of reasoning. People talk about needing flips to have information to work with. No. D1 is the information phase, if you use it appropriately.

 

What on earth does a 3 way tie of 2 votes buy you? A 3 scum team literally has 100% control of that lynch. No one gets properly cleared if a wolf dies because you know for a fact that they were mechanically capable of preventing it. Everyone looks bad if a villager dies. It's a conceded phase.

 

I thought LZM had a better chance of flipping scum than Darthe by a hair, so I took a stand and locked in a proper lynch. And guess what? If he flipped scum then BFG and Cass and Dice and everyone else who knows me would tell you I am never a wolf in this game and they would be right. A villager's first job is to do the most they can to prove they are a villager. People not voting and complacently letting it randomize between three players are basically saying "I think I'll just try to blend in with the wolves this phase."

 

My take on it is that with a three way tie, and two of them now confirmed villagers, the scenario's could be

 

Alf is a villager - Scum didn't need to do a thing. They could be anywhere on the board, voting or not.

 

Alf is scum - Scum need to either chance a teammate going out, or make it so he's not in the running.

 

 

Thinking about this/the logic of the bold more,

 

If noone gets properly cleared if a Wolf dies; and

Everyone looks bad/phase is conceded if a Villager dies;

 

Then results are the same, except option A is better for Town.

 

 

If iyo nobody gets properly cleared/the phase is conceded either way

 

AND you really felt stronger about Alf, but were willing to vote LZM and he only looked better than Darthe by a hair, you shifting your vote when you did doesn't make sense/achieves nothing?

 

 

[v]Alf[/v] for now

so why are you voting Alf?

[dicetosser1]

saved these earlier so they may look copy and pasted cause   well they are :D

 

 

hope it doesnt double post

 

 

 

 

Shanti, on 09 Jun 2017 - 12:07 PM, said:

I'm sorry to be that person, but I'm not following at this point. If ALF looked worse, then why switch? I really am truly sorry that it isn't clicking for me.

 

without looking back at the trains i have one word for you . 

 

Consolidation.

 

 

 

 

Cuth, on 09 Jun 2017 - 1:10 PM, said:

@dice where are you at on alf

 

what are your other thoughts on gamestate

 

@alf where are you at on dice

 

same question wrt gamestate

 

 alf im actually thinking town. i dont think scum make those responses knowing they may get jumped on for them   especially if theres someone who knows me in that team who can say Dice WILL jump on you.

 

the AFTERMATH of it  with tigs and killa is drawing my focus and im trying really hard not to fall in a tunnel

 

 hopes he doesnt mix these up    killa said a couple of things that seemed ok  but then there was a bit at the end that kinda threw shade at me.

 

tigs  just seems TOO focussed on it   to the point of counting the posts and disputing when i basically shrugged my shoulders and said theres what?? 4??   it doesnt seem to occur to her that thats how u have a convo with someone your asking about something  that u dont really do it in 1 post.  shes bugging me.

 

 

Adella i think is town. That WOT of her reads practically screams it. I caught her in a game on SG but i dont remember her doing anything like that there

 

i need more BFG  she started asking questions but then went quiet.

 

cass ive decided im gonna worry about later  i .dont need that headache right now

 

 

shad should be lynched but im not gonna waste my breath on it

 

 

@Dice it felt like you were going on a bit re: Alf mainly because you haven't said much of anything else, which is weird for you in general.  Give me game thoughts or lemme know when it will be about 4am local time plz.

 

 

 

 

im posting now and here    is it 4am yet?

Shanti, on 09 Jun 2017 - 12:07 PM, said:

I'm sorry to be that person, but I'm not following at this point. If ALF looked worse, then why switch? I really am truly sorry that it isn't clicking for me.

 

 

Cuth, on 09 Jun 2017 - 1:10 PM, said:

@dice where are you at on alf

 

what are your other thoughts on gamestate

 

@alf where are you at on dice

 

same question wrt gamestate

 

 

Shad_, on 09 Jun 2017 - 1:42 PM, said:

@Dice it felt like you were going on a bit re: Alf mainly because you haven't said much of anything else, which is weird for you in general.  Give me game thoughts or lemme know when it will be about 4am local time plz.

 

 

 

[dicetosser1]

glares

[dicetosser1]

Caught up on D2 to here, mindmelding with Shad wrt Killa's popcorn,

 

That said, I feel like I don't know Adella/Killa/Tigs/Shanti/Kronos and they all keep blending/slipping through my thoughts, will try and sort them out tonight.

 

There's not enough from Dice/BFG/Nyn for me to feel like I can get a handle on them.

 

 

@Dice - Why aren't you talking to me? I've asked several times now for your off-the-cuff thoughts. I don't care if you don't have much - throw anything you have, any way you have it.

 

cause ive barely been here thanks to work and cause right now im determined to stay away from you. im not in the mood to bang my head against any walls right now. i do enuff of that at work

 

ive now given thoughts and will hopefully get to reread this weekend  YAY the Queen!