If Amazon does ads and still cancels season 4 of wheel of time that is when I finally cancel my prime subscription 

6 hours ago, Samt said:

For sure.  In addition to the fact that we don't know what Amazon cares about, it's also kind of confusing as to what the numbers actually mean.  

With ads coming, would Amazon really want to get rid of one of their top shows that draws over 400 million minutes a week?  Ads should make the economics that much easier for Amazon to make this a sustainable formula.  If anyone doubts the power of ads and  streaming just look at Roku's latest explosive financial report.  Targeted marketing and original programming is the only way to get  views necessary to make good ad revenue. so I really doubt Amazon will kill season 4.  

That arrow scene with Lan was a real gym.  I am planning on making a thread on all the stupid decisions in season 2 that make no sense and that arrow moment was tops 

That said, I think they do need more time to develop each scene and give each character more life.  But if they can't maximize the time they have, then would that help?

On 10/30/2023 at 4:16 AM, Scarloc99 said:

They have decided to go all out on the shock factor for the Boys spin off, I mean, I can't blame them, the opening scene of season 3 with Termite was, well, both brilliant and gross all at once lol. 

But I agree the spinoff is not as good as the main story. 

Lol, I remember the opener of season 3.  It was  basically what gay antman might do.  I guess explosive penile is the word.....   I watched that and the herogasm  so I can't say I'm a newbie to all the shock factor stuff.  I kind of appreciate that wheel of time didn't go that way 

13 minutes ago, SinisterDeath said:

That's literally not what happed, and is a gross misunderstanding of what went on in that scene.

She accidently killed her mother with her own blood, and then accidently exploded her mother's blood, killing her father...
She did not "poop" blood and gore on the toilet... That's not even where "her" blood was coming from.... 

You could have just said "Gen V was to bloody for me". lol 

I mean she was on the toilet and all this blood starts coming out everywhere.  I kind of had to take a pause after that... I honestly thought it was period gone bad mutant style when I watched it. but I was grossed out so didn't watch that close.  

5 hours ago, Ralph said:

down to similar to first weeks. very surprised

 

seems people really do watch the episodes as soon as they come out or not at all? 

 

In which case next week is the finale's figures

Hey it beat out the gen v show debut which is Amazon's next big show.  I tried watching the show and couldn't get past the first scene yet where girl poops all the blood and gore on the toilet

5 minutes ago, Ralph said:

This week's numbers are higher than equivalent week in s1. 

 

even if you play in the number of minutes per episode they are not far behind. 

 

and I would be astonished if they don't go up more next week

It definitely will go up.  I was just saying the numbers for the first couple weeks are the hardcore fans that will watch no matter what.  Viewership in future seasons will likely never dip below that

. If season 2 is still getting decent numbers (albeit lower than season 1) with no marketing then this viewership is likely the baseline numbers that all future seasons will get.  With more viral moments, word of mouth, and hopefully increasing show quality this show will likely grow to season 3.  I'm optimistic like that.  Season 1 shed some people, but not everyone-- and some of those people may come back over time.  

This is anecdotal but I got 4 friends that didn't like season 1 and to restart and  and make it through season 2.  All of them enjoyed it more.  I know alot of people too that have season 2 on their watchlist (some due to my word of mouth) that will eventually watch.  I don't think wheel of time will die out as fast as other Amazon shows between seasons

I would love to see an unhinged Lanfear take out Liandrin 

8 hours ago, Jaysen Gore said:

I'm not even sure we get Shayol Ghul yet, let alone Shadar Haran. Since the seals have been repurposed to capture the Forsaken, not the DO, the whole approach to the end of the book is up in the air.  Plus, given the massive time constraints, I don't know how much Forsaken on Forsaken action we're really going to get

At this point I still think we are getting max 5 seasons, so who knows.  Shadar Haran would likely be easier to represent on screen than an abstract dark one though.  

Although I honestly don't remember what happened to SH though.  He mind trapped and raped the forsaken, did he even appear after that?  I feel like he disappeared before the last battle

Anyone thinking we are going to get our favorite talking myrddraal in season 3?  With Ishamael seemingly dead for good, who will take over as leader of the forsaken and voice of the dark one?  

I guess the question remains over what is the Dark One's powers of resurrection. and what does it really take to kill a forsaken.  Why did Ishamael turn to ash and can he be brought back?  is there even enough time for him left with all these other forsaken to introduce?  But if balefire is the only thing that can kill a forsaken who knows what could happen.  

It would be cool and creepy to have Shadar Haran though.  I would love to see SH get introduced when a forsaken screws up and have him get the forsaken back in line.  But that may he a season 4 thing more than season 3

It looks like Caemlyn might not be in season 3.  maybe that will be a season 4, unless Morgase was already cast?

https://collider.com/the-wheel-of-time-season-3-storylines-nycc/

Looks like Tanchico will be in season 3, so I already messed up that prediction.  Tanchico and Rhuidean are confirmed.  I guess Moghedien will be in Tanchico.  I wonder if that arc is how Thom is reintroduced. 

2 minutes ago, fra85uk said:

Yes, he never trashed the show but clearly many things he likes and many are not satisfactory for him (and for a part of the fan-base).

 

The arguments Sanderson made are all valid and I don't know why Rafe ignored so much of his feedback.  The internal logic of the tv show is still pretty non existent for channeling and some other things if not contradicting itself in various places.  

7 hours ago, SinisterDeath said:

Yes.

They have 26k followers.
Season 1 they were the official Amazon "WoT" after show.
Their lives routinely get 10k+ viewers.
(The Brandon Sanderson secrets one got 84k)

In terms of "WoT" Content creators, they have one of the largest followings.
Greene is larger, but I don't think he's a "WoT" content creator?

 

Ok, I mainly follow wotup and unraveling the pattern and they both have similar follower numbers. Dusty Wheel would probably do well to take some of the interesting clips from those long videos and make some shorts.  

from the numbers above it looks like wot has a better completion rate than Rings of power which was 37%.  

Pretty sure Amazon won't cut ROP so I doubt they will cut WOT either, but they could make it 5 seasons.  but what is 2 more seasons at this point?

Do people actually watch the Dusty Wheel?   I've looked at the archive and their shows are usually like 4 hours long.  Hard pass for me.  It is cool Sanderson is on, but that is so long too.

26 minutes ago, Jaysen Gore said:

Really good post and I agree with most of it; just a couple of pushbacks...

 

I don't think they can use Camelyn to replace Tanchico; if nothing else, the Tanchico plot is needed for Mat and Tuon. And and has been discussed elsewhere, we're speculating that the Bowl of the Winds / Male A'dam / Callandor get conflated into it somewhere. Plus the Tanchico story arc is critical in getting the girls out of the Tower before the collapse.  I don't see them moving right to the Camelyn civil war story arc when Nyn and Elayne leave the tower since that's the end of Elayne's arc, so they need something to do in the middle.

 

And I don't know if we get Mat in Rhuidean. I want him confronting the boys, but aside from escorting the girls back to Tar Valon while Rand goes with the Aiel, I don't know how that happens.  I think we get Mat building to Couladin, since that's the formation of the Band, but I don't know the order

Everything is possible, but how many sets does the show use per season?  Season 1 had Two Rivers, Tar Valon, Shadar Logoth, Tarwin's gap, and some small towns between.  Season 2 had 3 main sets:  Cairhien, Falme, Tar Valon and some travel between.  Season 3 is already set to have Two Rivers, Caemlyn, Tar Valon, Aiel Waste, and who knows what else.  Will they really have enough time to split the characters that much and have that many different sets?  

16 minutes ago, Elder_Haman said:

I think Mat will get to Rhuidean via the Finn and independently of, but fortuitously at the same time as, Rand. 

That is a possibility.  Nobody can really predict everything as this show changes too many things around, adds new characters, etc.  Matt will have to have a reason to go Rhuidean and I'm not sure what that would be if he doesn't first go into the 3 questions Finn ter'angreal.  But it is quite possible that he has a conflict with the Finn there and they throw him out a different exit.... with a rope around his neck.  And I 100% agree that we need a build up between Matt and Couladin.

1.  The whole Tanchico plotline is going to get cut.  That means Moghedien will have a different role, plus the Nynaeve and Elayne will have a different role.  I like Caemlyn to replace much of Tanchico.  I also think Juilan Sandar will be cut from the show.  they don't want men protecting women here, and Juilan didn't end up doing much anyway towards the end of the books.

2.  This show desperately needs more interactions between Rand and Matt and Perrin.  For this reason, I think Matt still goes to Rhuidean.  We did see an image of Matt hanging in Ishamael hallucination scene.  I'm still hoping they keep the red stone doorway for Matt in Rhuidean, even if they significantly change some details.  Matt will still need an impetus to go to Rhuidean, and I doubt they will do the 3 question doorway from Tear at this point.  Matt will hang at some point... although they could change everything around.  But I still think they will build on Mat's memories and I think he may still feel like his memories are disjointed after remembering he was a hero of the horn.  So Matt will be exploring all the holes in his memories in season 3.  

3.  Lanfear will definitely be in this show and she might be planting seeds and pushing some of the characters to the Aiel waste.  Her role will have to be different as I don't think they will use mask of mirrors and take away from her acting abilities.  

4.  We will get a meeting of Forsaken, but it will only be 3 or 4 of them as the show isn't ready to introduce all of them yet.  Asmodean, Moghedien, Lanfear, and maybe Sammael will meet.  It's quite possible Sammael becomes the new Rahvin and takes residence in Caemlyn instead of Ilian.  Moghedien is a spider so she will be laying traps, but won't be as directly visible.  I think Moghedien will be installed in the White Tower so she can move the tower coup forward.  Mesaana is not going to be in this show as there will be 4 female forsaken and the other 2 will be Semirhage and Graendal who will show up in later seasons.

5.  White Tower civil war will be set up.  Elaida and Siuan heavy drama will proceed.  Gawyn and Galad  and Elaida and Morgase will be shown in Caemlyn in the beginning of the show absolutely pissed that Elayne disappeared.  They will travel to Tar Valon after the first couple episodes.  Not sure if Tar Valon civil war will conclude at end of season.  

6.  Two Rivers will feature Padan Fain as a whitecloak.  The showdown will be set.  Lord Luc could also be there, setting up all kinds of showdowns for Perrin.  Not to mention Dain Bornhald being there grumbling under Fain's command.  Two Rivers should be epic.  I don't predict Verin will be in Two Rivers though, but probably Alana and her warders.

7.  Lots of Telaranrhiod scenes will happen, and that will help push Egwene to Rhuidean.  I'm not sure what will push Rand there, but something will be setup.  I predict they use the portal stone this time to get there, but the waygate is an option too.  Perrin will also start showing up in Telaranrhiod and spirit hopper will be there guiding Perrin.

8.  One detail from Season 2 was how Elyas told Perrin that his wife was not part of his tribe.  I'm not sure what that means yet... could it be darkfriend?  That will likely get explored in season 3.  

9.  Tom Merrellin.  He is going to return, but where will his role be?  if Matt doesn't go to Rhuidean, then it will be with Matt, but I still can't place him yet.  

10.  Rand going to Rhuidean and experiencing his Aiel lineage.  this will be a whole episode-- maybe episode 3 or 4, much like the focus on Nyaneve in season 2. This  will definitely be in the show or I will rage quit this show.

11.  We will get Couladin set up as an imposter.  And I do think the Aiel showdown in the echo canyon will happen.  This will lead to rain and then the whole showdown with Asmodean which will be the conclusion of season 3.  Will the Choedan Kal still appear?  I think so because they still need a plot device to clear the taint on saidin.  

12.  What will Nyaneve and Elayne do all season?  I don't know but I suspect they may be at the White Tower and then doing a little black ajah hunting along with Verin to nudge them.  They will probably encounter Liandrin and maybe we even get a Nyaneve showdown with Moghedien.  

I have no predictions other than lots of people will complain because there won't be enough episode screen-time and eventually things will get rushed to the season finale.  

2 hours ago, Jaysen Gore said:

At this point, I'm still assuming 8 seasons. the Ratings are good enough, the budget is moderate, and Bezos is a fan.  And if we get season 4, I bet they commit to finishing it so the writers can plan the rest of it out and make sure it fits.

Exactly.  Amazon isn't netflix or HBO and has different motivations for keeping shows.  Amazon also has deeper pockets.  I'm not sure if we get 5 seasons or 8, but I believe they will try to conclude wheel of time in some way.  Plus, adding ads will give an extra financial cushion for making this all work.

2 minutes ago, mogi68 said:

Really sad we didn't get a good ol melee with Rand vs the Betrayer of Hope. 

 

The fighting scenes fall really flat for me, generally speaking. Too many quick cuts and you can barely tell what's going on. I hope next scenes have directors with more action experience.

Amen to that.  They need to bring a top action director for sure, especially with the Aiel

On 10/5/2023 at 7:31 PM, orbops said:

Here's what Deadline's streaming viewer table for the week of 9/4 to 9/10 says, "Meanwhile, Prime Video’s original The Wheel of Time notched 515 million viewing minutes (same as last week) after releasing another new episode and moved up to No. 3 among originals."

That's a big win if Wheel of Time beat out Ahsoka.  I though Ahsoka was a very good show too

The season 2 finale was pretty solid.  I think season 2 wrapped up about as well as it could have, and we have a nice cliffhanger for season 3.  No spoilers here, but season 2 will have legs and build the audience up before season 3 drops.  

All in all a very solid and satisfying episode.  I'm sure a lot of hardcore fans will hate it, but I thought it was one of the top episodes of season 2 if not the best.  Finally some of the men are allowed to be competent.  I am a big fan of what they are doing with Lanfear and her ambiguous loyalties.  I'm very excited to see season 3, sorry haters!

Intro scene is back

Ingtar-- never was not a darkfriend that we know, but he is definintely dead

Turak is dead--- I guess that is the only way the scene could play out, since Rand doesn't know how to use a sword.

RIP Hopper!  I'm sure that is going to tear alot of people up. 

Egwene is a badass and gets herself out of her predicament

Unhinged Perrin takes out Bornhald-- I guess this will set up the trial scene later in the show.

Ishamael appears to be dead, which is unfortunate.  Will he return later as Moridin, or will they give the reigns to Demandred?  

Matt using the dagger in an unconventional way was pretty resourceful

Heroes of the horn-  Uno, Birgitte, Mat, Lady Amalisa (I think?)

Forsaken are loose!--- Mogehedien and Sammael mentioned

Rand smitten by first sight of Elayne healing him

Moiraine proclaims Rand in the sky with a fire dragon?  I guess the book way could never work on screen, so I can't complain too much.

Masema looks like he is starting to build that dragon dogma.

Aviendha identifies her Car'a'carn

Moghedien looks like she will be the big bad in next season-- time to get ready Nynaeve,

First sight of a gateway