[Advanced] Once Upon a Time Mafia- Game Over, Town Wins!!!

[Nikonis]

I'll start off with a fresh look at day two then go back and merge with my day one thoughts to see if my feels for anyone have changed.

 

AJ - Started Day 2 off with a good recap and new set of OP's based on it and has been exploring possible leads as D2 progresses

 

Dawn - Replied that AJ missed her but no comments or new OP's based from the two night deaths.

 

RTE - "Night was only 26 minutes?" Lynch announced on 5/2 at 4:38PM  |  NK announced on 5/3 at 5:16PM so there was 24 hours, 38 minutes between the two (10 minutes less if from the RP Lynch post)

When RTE had a stable connection he added his top 3 suspects.

 

BFG - Asked for explanations on a few of RTE's statements.

 

Directed Towards Thane: I notice YOU moved your vote to Basel AFTER Ithi called Chels out for the "helpful" consolidation...

I brought this up before, didn't I?

He voted Basel then changed to Ithi at 12:54pm on 5/1 (because ithi "opertunisticly" voted him) and then went back to Basel the following day.

[Tsukibana]

Nikon, Nikon... sigh. You are being SO helpful, trying to vet other people... I have been fingering Thane and Dawn since Day One... why are you trying to clear him??

He was scummy before that... I'm really started to think I misunderstood casing people, if everyone else is gonna jump to their defense.

YOU are calling Thane's move to Ithit opportunistic, But you miss the fact that Ithi only voted Thane because he was sheeping on AJ's case against her...

Newscum vote switch often. I have spoken.

[BFG]

 

So you think Hallia is the vig?

Not necessarily but one route I need to explore...

 

 

Why would you point out someone that you think may have a Town PR?

 

Vote Nikon

Also, from what I read about them Vig is often Town so why should I limit my ideas to those I think look scummy?

 

POE (process of elimination - eliminating townies from the pool of players) is a very important tool, but it's better to keep power role hints/ideas to yourself as it helps mafia make their NK choice.

 

It's difficult to see a townie mindset for doing so.

 

 

BFG's question and vote are for you pointing in the direction of who you might think the PR is - which generally isn't a good idea to do as town. Mafia reads the thread as well, so if they hadn't done their own hunting you are basically doing it for them. Not a good idea - Town PRs are prime NK targets, so we need to protect them. Looking back to see who you think it might be on your own is fine, as it limits your suspect pool, but posting it on thread wasn't a good idea.

 

This, and better explained than I can.

 

 

BFG's question and vote are for you pointing in the direction of who you might think the PR is - which generally isn't a good idea to do as town. Mafia reads the thread as well, so if they hadn't done their own hunting you are basically doing it for them. Not a good idea - Town PRs are prime NK targets, so we need to protect them. Looking back to see who you think it might be on your own is fine, as it limits your suspect pool, but posting it on thread wasn't a good idea.

Sorry, didn't even think of that... Would it even be worth my time then or should I just focus on finding clues to who scum team is?

 

 

Worth doing, but keep it private.

 

We have like 30 hours to DL lol

 

I feel a random coming.

 

 

 

 

This is very interesting.

If Dawn is lynched and flips scum, this vets Andrej. No way that is a bus move. Nikon's PR comment... Hrm. He is still new to Mafia but I do like AJ's comment that scum would have posted that on thread. Generally have a town lean on Nikon.

 

Right now scummier reads would have to be Dawn and Thane. I agree with AJ's reasoning on Tsuki. I also found it interesting so many people popped up and posted after I did. BFG I will get to answering your questions. I do remember my train of thought on those actions and will get to that.

 

Right now going with Vote Dawn

 

We're getting close to deadline and I think her lynch will be quite informative. And more importantly will be one mafia down.

 

Waiting.

 

Also can add to my questions, why is it interesting that people post after you, would also like an elaboration on your reads on Thane and Dawn, and why you're clearing AJ by association with Dawn before she flips?

 

Why is it that in the beginning, most people thought I was town and now they've switched? Because I led the Basel lynch and he ended up being town?

 

Reads change throughout the game, you've been in a few games now so should know this.

 

the only downside to that reasoning would be that, for D1, in the worst case, you would kill 5 town before you reach scum (if there are 4). Plus, i doubt scum would all go on one single train, wouldn't make sense (if they play well).

 

we're focussing too much on the D1 train and not on what happened after.

 

 

 

 

(for Ithi: good luck with your son, i hope he'll be ok soon)

I don't understand what you mean here. So what should we be looking at, specifically?

 

 

Hope your son feels better Ithi!

 

Dawn, you aren't getting the benefit of the doubt anymore.

Still waiting...

 

Unvote Vote RTE

[BFG]

Nikon, Nikon... sigh. You are being SO helpful, trying to vet other people... I have been fingering Thane and Dawn since Day One... why are you trying to clear him??

He was scummy before that... I'm really started to think I misunderstood casing people, if everyone else is gonna jump to their defense.

YOU are calling Thane's move to Ithit opportunistic, But you miss the fact that Ithi only voted Thane because he was sheeping on AJ's case against her...

Newscum vote switch often. I have spoken.

Who are you calling newscum here?

[Nikonis]

So adding my ideas from today in with my previous opinions I'd say that

 

SCUM

Thane - Leaning scum.

 

UNSURE

Ed - Neutral, bordering towards scum because of low value I have found in his posts.

RTE - Neutral, bordering towards scum

BFG - Neutral

Hallia - Neutral and still needing more reads to form a valid opinion

Ice/Turin - Neutral because of lack of posts to draw info from, hopefully now that Turin is taking over I can get a feel on their role.

Dawnflower8 - Neutral, still bordering towards town

Talmanes - Neutral, would be town except for the "is also closest majority" thing I mentioned towards the end of day 1.

TGlems - Not a lot to go on, not sure if sticking to the background or, like many in this game, just busy with RL

 

TOWN
Basel - Lynched, flipped town

Chael - Died Night1, Flipped Town

Dicetosser1 - Died Night1, Flipped Town

AJ - Leaning town

Tina/Ithi/??? - Leaning town

Tsuki - Leaning towards town because there are a lot of posts to go through but seems to be pointing out decent opinions and asking good questions.

[Andrej]

Nikon, BFG, Tsuki - All look pretty Town to me.

 

I would like to hear Turin's thoughts before I really start to go in that direction. Vote feels retaliatory for my interaction with Ithi earlier, if that's the case then - meh

 

RTE is looking a bit better.

 

Thane is quickly trending down.

 

Dawn/Thane lynches are fine by me for today.

[Andrej]

Hallia - did you just claim Vig?

[Tsukibana]

 

Nikon, Nikon... sigh. You are being SO helpful, trying to vet other people... I have been fingering Thane and Dawn since Day One... why are you trying to clear him??

He was scummy before that... I'm really started to think I misunderstood casing people, if everyone else is gonna jump to their defense.

YOU are calling Thane's move to Ithit opportunistic, But you miss the fact that Ithi only voted Thane because he was sheeping on AJ's case against her...

Newscum vote switch often. I have spoken.

Who are you calling newscum here?

 

Thane - with his switching back and forth from Basel to Ithi to Basel to Me, with minimum explanations and a desire to jump on bandwagons (see: case on basel, case on Ithi, back to basel)

[Nikonis]

i think that even inexperienced players should know that discussing/talking about PR's openly in the thread would only help mafia. So it could be: 1) a really bad townmove or 2) a way to distract the doc to protect that player, and leave other players open for NK (like Tsuki mentioned)

 

..many options *nods*

Thane, I can understand why you might find this suspicious though going right to a VOTE without asking questions or reading my explanations to others who asked seems a bit off to me as well. I'm town but don't expect you to believe me and I still think you are the most likely suspect on my list. I did promise myself I'd take another look and try to see your side of things but if you still look scummy to me at the end of the day I won't fall for the trick again.

 

@Thane: You admit this could be a bad town-move but then vote me... Because you see me as a threat from my seeing through most of your shenanigans and actions towards you on day one or or do you actually see me as scum?

[dawnflower8]

Hope your son feels better Ithi!

 

Dawn, you aren't getting the benefit of the doubt anymore.

Giving me "the benefit of the doubt" on what? Me being new? I haven't once used that as an excuse in this game, and have been playing less newbie-ish than any other games I've played before. 

 

Also, you all followed me on the Basel lynch, so clearly you don't think I'm stupid. 

[Hallia]

No, I'm not, but that sounds like role fishing to me AJ

[Turin Turambar]

Hallia - did you just claim Vig?

Weren't you the one that dug into Nikon for pointing at Hallia earlier as the possible Vig? Why you demanding a claim from her now? 

 

 

Oh and I don't think that you really want to see me lay out my case but nice attempt to nullify my vote. I will get to it later today. 

[Nikonis]

And who/what is yates?

[Tsukibana]

 

i think that even inexperienced players should know that discussing/talking about PR's openly in the thread would only help mafia. So it could be: 1) a really bad townmove or 2) a way to distract the doc to protect that player, and leave other players open for NK (like Tsuki mentioned)

 

..many options *nods*

Thane, I can understand why you might find this suspicious though going right to a VOTE without asking questions or reading my explanations to others who asked seems a bit off to me as well. I'm town but don't expect you to believe me and I still think you are the most likely suspect on my list. I did promise myself I'd take another look and try to see your side of things but if you still look scummy to me at the end of the day I won't fall for the trick again.

 

@Thane: You admit this could be a bad town-move but then vote me... Because you see me as a threat from my seeing through most of your shenanigans and actions towards you on day one or or do you actually see me as scum?

 

And AGAIN - Thane switches like a pissed off catholic mother...

[Andrej]

Lol - no one is nullifying your vote Turin. If you've got something to say, then say it. I'm innocent, which will be proven one way or the other.

 

@ Hallia - you mention Yates and his strategy in the Red Wedding game of shooting from the lynch wagon of Townies. Chae was on the lynch wagon of a townie flip. How else am I supposed to read that?

 

Could easily put my vote back on Hallia. Pops in, gives no real commentary, then throws some dirt in my direction for asking her a direct question. SMH.

[BFG]

Ed, Um, sorry about the army.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So Ed was sort of present yesterday then disappeared since the Night. Think this is his thoughts and cases.

 

 

 

 

Thane: I like to poke, prod, and get answers.

Thane: I'm new, and these people are pouncing on newbies. Ha

 

 

Nikon, I said Niko. Not you.

But glad to know you're okay.

 

Nikon, post what you think is relevant. Or if you're scum, post what you think will confuse. Don't post useless crap.

 

Hey RTE! Good to be back. How ya doing?

 

 

You're trying hard to play innocent thane. Good enough? Ya. You saw my spot

About saying yore newbie but also like to poke and rode.

If you like to prod, you must know the reactions felmg it

 

 

 

No, I'm not on a team with anyone. I'm just saying that we are probably the ones with the most posts.

Soooo, third party?

 

 

 

 

Ed - Entered with a joke vote then talked to other members of the game. All of his posts were relatively short and no useful information or opinions were offered. After "drunk posting" last night I tend to lean more towards scum but will add to my watch list for now.

 

@ Thane, Ed & Dice: Care to explain any of the above things I mentioned about you/your posts?

Pfft. The opinions are there if you look. I just don't do em like you.

Nikon, is your watch list a hit list?

 

 

 

Today. Sucked.

I'm getting medically discharged out of the Army guys! Yay me. *sigh*

 

Coming back later on my computer to compose thoughts. Ya I know I missed the lynch. Would have voted Basel or pushed for Thane or Dawn most likely.

 

 

At the end of Day 1 would have voted Basel, Thane or Dawn. He hasn't mentioned Basel on thread, but that would presumably have been consolidation. Thane is apparently due to a contradiction in his 'prodding' gamestyle, followed by a 'voting noob' comment? Dawn is apparently because she 'claimed' third party on thread?

 

I like that his reads follow his questions but don't like that his thoughts have apparently remained static, and want to know what he thinks of Day 2 so far.

[BFG]

TG

 

 

 

 

##vote Basel

 

Call me Jack, lol

 

 

Official Vote Count

 

Basel (9/9): TG, dawn, AJ, Chae, Thane, Ithi, Hallia, Nikon, Tsuki

Thane (2/9): Basel, Talmanes

Talmanes (1/9): ed

AJ (2/9): RTE, dice

 

 

 

people not voting (2/16): ice and BFG

Lynch achieved!!! scene coming up...

 

 

TG hasn't been here, he hasn't posted since the joke phase of Day 1, yet his vote was the lead vote on Basel getting lynched.

[Turin Turambar]

Andrej, Andrej, Andrej...

 

 

How did you have TG "closer to town" than BFG when TG had said NOTHING of any real  content?

[Nikonis]

Nikon, Nikon... sigh. You are being SO helpful, trying to vet other people... I have been fingering Thane and Dawn since Day One... why are you trying to clear him??

He was scummy before that... I'm really started to think I misunderstood casing people, if everyone else is gonna jump to their defense.

YOU are calling Thane's move to Ithit opportunistic, But you miss the fact that Ithi only voted Thane because he was sheeping on AJ's case against her...

Newscum vote switch often. I have spoken.

 

If you missed the "s I was quoting his words but let me find the actual post for all of you...

 

 

I knew that, when i posted against Ithi, that it would be considered as defending AJ. Looks bad, i know, but it was (for me) the only way to get my thoughts out there. And that's what i need to do in this game. That said, Ithi, i'm tired of telling you that i'm not here to defend AJ. If the defenders are scum, then maybe we should all vote Tsuki for helping you out, ey?

 

opportunistic voting in my direction brings you unvote vote Ithi

 

[Tsukibana]

Bloody brilliant - so he ADMITS everyone thinks he was defending AJ... so, as I said, he switched his vote in RETALIATION, rather than

because of a cogent arguement. Scum move, Nikon, scum move. He votes with minimal case, blows where the wind goes, and deflects poorly. NOW he's on you, and you want

to try to correct my case against him?? WTH, man?

[Tsukibana]

At least, I think you are. Anywho, are we agreeing he smells like a three-day dead trolloc?

[Nikonis]

Bloody brilliant - so he ADMITS everyone thinks he was defending AJ... so, as I said, he switched his vote in RETALIATION, rather than

because of a cogent arguement. Scum move, Nikon, scum move. He votes with minimal case, blows where the wind goes, and deflects poorly. NOW he's on you, and you want

to try to correct my case against him?? WTH, man?

  Did it sound like I was defending him???

He's been on my most suspected list the whole time... Granted I gave him a chance to redeem himself, which maybe I shouldn't have done since basel ended up flipping town, but even now I still suspect him and even stated earlier that if nothing comes up to make me assume otherwise he is my most likely suspect and I won't be giving him any more chances to prove himself.

[dawnflower8]

Ed, Um, sorry about the army.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So Ed was sort of present yesterday then disappeared since the Night. Think this is his thoughts and cases.

 

 

 

 

Thane: I like to poke, prod, and get answers.

Thane: I'm new, and these people are pouncing on newbies. Ha

 

 

Nikon, I said Niko. Not you.

But glad to know you're okay.

 

Nikon, post what you think is relevant. Or if you're scum, post what you think will confuse. Don't post useless crap.

 

Hey RTE! Good to be back. How ya doing?

 

 

You're trying hard to play innocent thane. Good enough? Ya. You saw my spot

About saying yore newbie but also like to poke and rode.

If you like to prod, you must know the reactions felmg it

 

 

 

No, I'm not on a team with anyone. I'm just saying that we are probably the ones with the most posts.

Soooo, third party?

 

 

 

 

Ed - Entered with a joke vote then talked to other members of the game. All of his posts were relatively short and no useful information or opinions were offered. After "drunk posting" last night I tend to lean more towards scum but will add to my watch list for now.

 

@ Thane, Ed & Dice: Care to explain any of the above things I mentioned about you/your posts?

Pfft. The opinions are there if you look. I just don't do em like you.

Nikon, is your watch list a hit list?

 

 

 

Today. Sucked.

I'm getting medically discharged out of the Army guys! Yay me. *sigh*

 

Coming back later on my computer to compose thoughts. Ya I know I missed the lynch. Would have voted Basel or pushed for Thane or Dawn most likely.

 

 

At the end of Day 1 would have voted Basel, Thane or Dawn. He hasn't mentioned Basel on thread, but that would presumably have been consolidation. Thane is apparently due to a contradiction in his 'prodding' gamestyle, followed by a 'voting noob' comment? Dawn is apparently because she 'claimed' third party on thread?

 

I like that his reads follow his questions but don't like that his thoughts have apparently remained static, and want to know what he thinks of Day 2 so far.

 

I didn't even claim third party, though. I was just getting very confused. 

[BFG]

Hallia

 

 

 

Thane's vote is opportunistic, but teh "Capt. Newb-saver" is suspicious, as well. Dawn has more than 1 game under her belt (3, I believe). She may not know all of the wizard tricks, but she should at least be able

to formulate a defense. However, I believe she is not able to get on during the day (personal local time, as I have no clue of her timezone). Which is why I have not continued that line of attack. Therefore, leaping

to her defense so quickly is smelly... but plausible, if you really dislike people attacking newbs... I am unsure of your meta.

 

 

Thane - a joke vote, followed by an immediate switch, with the vote made PRIOR to any indicitng evidence or response from Dawn... pretty eager to run with my inquiry, weren't you? How many games have YOU

played?

 

 

 

She's on game 5 or 6 actually

 

Hallia chips in to say Dawn has played a few games...

 

 

Basel: Thane is indeed less experienced than Dawn.

 

Now, Tina is voting Thane because of his votes against RTE, saying "he's bandwagoning already". Now at that point, Thane's vote could have been a joke vote or a newbie mistake (same as what Basel thought about Dawn's vote). Also Tina didn't say anything about Dawn's vote. Why was this one better than Thane's?

Tina, can u give some explanations about this?

 

Thane, your switching vote looks bad as it comes right after Tina"s critic about your RTE vote.

 

Nikon, your posts make u look a bit jumpy (and the Day 1 I witnessed were also filled of jokes :winks:)

 

Hallia, seeing you have been in this thread for a while: what are your reads?

 

unvote ; vote Tina

 

 

 

Hrm.

 

I have a good read on you.  

 

AJ's probably town.

 

I never can tell with Dawn.  She is baffling to me

 

Not sure what to make of Basel yet, if he's being his normal awesome helpful self, or being a little....too helpful. DUN DUN DUNNNNN

 

Gives a few town reads when asked, but no mention of mafia reads yet. Also, has a town read on Chae, but keeps her joke vote on her.

 

 

vote Chael

 

<3

 

 

 

Going off of gut, I have good feels on Tina, Chael, Basel and Tsuki.   Haven't seen anything too overtly scummy, with the exception of Thane's voting on RTE early on, but he's newer so I'll throw him a bone.

 

Interesting comment, where she seems to find Thane scummy but is unwilling to vote him as he's new.

 

 

Ice has ONE post so far... if consensus isn't reached, I'm all for a policy lynch, though I'd rather not "waste" it...

 

@Tal - thanks for sharing.

 

@dice - have I misunderstood - you say basel is the one with the typo (should have put "not" in his post), and that it is BASEL making an excuse for thane? you are saying THANE is the one who should have been coached (if he is scum), NOT basel? So, your post is not an accusation, but rather attempting to clarify what BASEL meant?

 

 

 

It's a little early for that, don't you think?  D1 can be like that sometimes, not that we shouldn't press for more out of him.

 

But that seems like picking the low hanging fruit

Responds about the possibility of lynching low posters.

 

 

 

My bet: Ithi and AJ are BOTH town and mafia is spread over the two trains, hoping as the deadline gets closer people will scramble.

 

But here thinks Ithi and AJ are likely both Town, and that mafia are spreading votes on the trains... only other votes on AJ or Ithi were Thane and RTE. She's expressed reluctance to vote Thane as he's new, but why not RTE? (although his was before this started)

 

 

 

Official Vote Count

 

Chae (1/9): Hallia

Basel (2/9): TG, dawn

ed (1/9): Talmanes

Thane (2/9): Tina, Basel

Talmanes (1/9): ed

Tina (1/9): chae

AJ (1/9): RTE

 

Tina has asked to be replaced! If you know anybody who might want to replace her, please ask them.

no deadline yet...

 

 

 

Vote AJ

 

 

 

Yeah - you should probably get lynched Ithi. Refusal to explain yourself, shoddy linkage, and then when asked for other suspects you refuse again and then bounce.

 

unvote; vote Ithi

 

 

 

 

opportunistic voting in my direction brings you

 

 

 

Consolidation vote, nothing to say really - with random lynch/no info it's in both Town and Mafia's interest to gain a majority lynch.

 

I see that we get a punishment for not having a majority.  With three hours to go I'll go with

 

Vote Basel

 

I don't see him as particularly scummy, but rather to know then a random kill with no info.

 

 

Day 2

 

A generic 'how to play vig' comment

 

 

Learned a valuable lesson from Yates regarding the Vig kill; if our lynch today flips town, you lynch from the people on their train.  If they flip scum you pick off of it.   It basically puts scum in a bad place, and I think is a brilliant move.

 

And a nudge on AJ.

 

 

No, I'm not, but that sounds like role fishing to me AJ

 

 

 

 

Hallia's being very quiet. Her reads have been in response to a question being asked her, and have pretty much been town reads. She appears to mention Thane being scummy a few times, but is reluctant to vote him. Hasn't commented on the flips, or updated reads/questioned anyone...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Turin Turambar]

No Ithi, I don't think you would pretend that. It's also not something I'm going to debate with you.

 

You were asked for an explanation and other reads, instead you decided to leave. Regardless of whatever reason, it still doesn't look good.

 

 

 

 

Clearly I think your Mafia hence my vote.

 

Clearly I was aiming for reactions and I got them.

 

Suddenly you're not very clear.

 

Come again?

Teaser: Ithi's two statements are NOT mutually exclusive. It is a very good way to look for mafia. You pick a suspect vote them with no reason, and see what happens. There is even a name for it on DM: "Wombatting" 

 

The vote itself is the belief that you are mafia. The manner of the vote and the subsequent questioning of those that came to defend "the suspect" was the look for reactions. When you do this it is better to not give the reasons for the initial vote for as long as possible as once the "case" is made THEN the reactions are no longer valid. 

 

Also it should be noted that the answers given by both Dawn and Thane were very vague and not supported by any real evidence. I believe it was something along the lines of "his posts seemed pro town" but when preseed to explain how the posts were really pro town it got a bit quiet. The closest to a real explanation came from dawn in that she said AJ is giving "town cred" and explaining that something was scummy. That is merely taking charge of the on thread dialogue or "town-leading" and is done by mafia that think they can lead the town sheep. Quite possible in this game full of new people and a few with rust to shake off.

 

 

As far as the entire  "bounce" thing. C'mon mon. You better than that. 

 

 

AJ, what do you think about my take on Tina?