Rereading the books can give you a whole new perspective.

[Suttree]

Dashiva was OG in disguise?

 

Yeah he was Aginor. So great on re-reads knowing that in advance. It's amazing how many hints RJ sprinkles in...

[jedman67]

 

Dashiva was OG in disguise?

 

Yeah he was Aginor. So great on re-reads knowing that in advance. It's amazing how many hints RJ sprinkles in...

 

So he wasn't "acting" insane; he WAS insane. Just not from the taint. 

[DaoineSidhe]

I don't necessarily know if Osan'gar was insane, but he was under immense pressures.  Rand uncovered and trapped or caused the death of every other Forsaken to try and stay hidden near him.  When you think of how Rand chose Dashiva right after Dumai's Wells, it would be enough to make anyone become a little paranoid and start muttering to themselves.  Once you start looking for it, RJ left little hints in almost every scene where Dashiva is present as to who he really was.  For me, his death at the Cleansing of the Taint was one of the saddest moments in the book, because I had grown to really like his character during re-reads.  Although, to be fair, he had already rebelled against Rand, so future little comic hints as to his true personality wouldn't have been very feasible, so I guess I'm OK with it.

[Suttree]

But he was insane. Aginor was the classic "mad scientist" type.

[szilard]

Hey Tranovious,

 

 thanks for sharing your journey with us, and I really hope that you will not put away the books for another five-year hiatus. (You know, we are talking about the crowned king of epic fantasy.)

[Pokeriser]

Hey Tranovious,

 

 thanks for sharing your journey with us, and I really hope that you will not put away the books for another five-year hiatus. (You know, we are talking about the crowned king of epic fantasy.)

 

Is the crown exclusively for authors who write a series so large it breaks shelves?

[EmperorAllspice]

Why do people call Balthamel and Aginor Aran'gar and Oran'gar?

 

Yes, it's the name that the DO gave them, but they're still the same people underneath, so I don't know why the fandom does it

[jedman67]

Why do people call Balthamel and Aginor Aran'gar and Oran'gar?

 

Yes, it's the name that the DO gave them, but they're still the same people underneath, so I don't know why the fandom does it

The DO gave them those names. Their old names "died" when they did. You shouldn't be so flippant about disobeying a directive from the Great Lord of the Dark 

[Leopoled Boothe]

Why do people call Balthamel and Aginor Aran'gar and Oran'gar?

 

Yes, it's the name that the DO gave them, but they're still the same people underneath, so I don't know why the fandom does it

 

Because within the scope of the books they were Osan'gar and Aran'gar for much longer than they were Aginor and Balthamel, and frankly they were more interesting in those forms.  Especially Balthamel, I mean all he did was show up and get killed by a tree.  He didn't even have any lines.

[EmperorAllspice]

Aginor showed up and killed himself. Not much better.

 

But Aginor is one of my favourites because of his amazing work on creating shadowspawn. Especially the Gholam.

[Leopoled Boothe]

Aginor showed up and killed himself. Not much better.

 

But Aginor is one of my favourites because of his amazing work on creating shadowspawn. Especially the Gholam.

 

Yeah, I had kind of hoped that at some point they would put Osan'gar to work making new and more dangerous shadowspawn.  His talents seemed wasted as a spy in the Black Tower but he was great as Dashiva so all is forgiven.  

[Suttree]

 

Aginor showed up and killed himself. Not much better.

 

But Aginor is one of my favourites because of his amazing work on creating shadowspawn. Especially the Gholam.

 

Yeah, I had kind of hoped that at some point they would put Osan'gar to work making new and more dangerous shadowspawn. 

That would be impossible given the 3rd age tech level.

[EmperorAllspice]

 

 

Aginor showed up and killed himself. Not much better.

 

But Aginor is one of my favourites because of his amazing work on creating shadowspawn. Especially the Gholam.

 

Yeah, I had kind of hoped that at some point they would put Osan'gar to work making new and more dangerous shadowspawn.

That would be impossible given the 3rd age tech level.

 

Stasis boxes. I could imagine him storing some of his lab tech in there

[jedman67]

Stasis boxes. I could imagine him storing some of his lab tech in there

None of them thought they would lose, or that the world would change so much if they did.

[Suttree]

 

 

 

Aginor showed up and killed himself. Not much better.

 

But Aginor is one of my favourites because of his amazing work on creating shadowspawn. Especially the Gholam.

Yeah, I had kind of hoped that at some point they would put Osan'gar to work making new and more dangerous shadowspawn.

That would be impossible given the 3rd age tech level.

Stasis boxes. I could imagine him storing some of his lab tech in there

The shadow was winning and had no idea the breaking was coming. Plus we have this from RJ:

 

RJ

Some of their skills are absolutely useless in the society they are forced to live in. Aginor was a genius in biology and genetics, but in this world, he had no way to make the tools to make the tools to make the tools.... Well, you get the idea. Pity the poor chip designer dropped into the seventeenth century.

[EmperorAllspice]

problem is it doesn't work both ways. he rendered some of the villains useless but not any of the  heroes

[BFG]

problem is it doesn't work both ways. he rendered some of the villains useless but not any of the  heroes

 

Different situation - the heroes grew up in the current Age, so none of the have had a chance to learn skills that would be useless now, except maybe Rand and Mat and we don't know that they don't have 'useless' skills, it's just never come up.

[EmperorAllspice]

 

problem is it doesn't work both ways. he rendered some of the villains useless but not any of the  heroes

 

Different situation - the heroes grew up in the current Age, so none of the have had a chance to learn skills that would be useless now, except maybe Rand and Mat and we don't know that they don't have 'useless' skills, it's just never come up.

 

Sigh. Yes it's justified. But since when have justifications ever made me feel better about a villain being screwed over a chance to look awesome while the heroes get to be badass?

[BFG]

 

 

problem is it doesn't work both ways. he rendered some of the villains useless but not any of the  heroes

 

Different situation - the heroes grew up in the current Age, so none of the have had a chance to learn skills that would be useless now, except maybe Rand and Mat and we don't know that they don't have 'useless' skills, it's just never come up.

 

Sigh. Yes it's justified. But since when have justifications ever made me feel better about a villain being screwed over a chance to look awesome while the heroes get to be badass?

 

 

Fair point.

[jedman67]

Different situation - the heroes grew up in the current Age, so none of the have had a chance to learn skills that would be useless now, except maybe Rand and Mat and we don't know that they don't have 'useless' skills, it's just never come up.

Sigh. Yes it's justified. But since when have justifications ever made me feel better about a villain being screwed over a chance to look awesome while the heroes get to be badass?

 

Semhirage and Graendal did a fair job for themselves. Semi was a healer-turned sadistic torturer; and was as skilled a manipulator as anyone alive. Aginor's really the only one who has to start from scratch.

[EmperorAllspice]

Mogheiden decided to ignore her skillset and go all "It's personal"
 

thanks RJ. You have the shadow's best spy and you don't even bother to let her use that skill. You're like GRRM in not letting characters use their skills. Only you only do it to the villains.

[Leopoled Boothe]

 

 

Aginor showed up and killed himself. Not much better.

 

But Aginor is one of my favourites because of his amazing work on creating shadowspawn. Especially the Gholam.

 

Yeah, I had kind of hoped that at some point they would put Osan'gar to work making new and more dangerous shadowspawn.

That would be impossible given the 3rd age tech level.

 

 

Good point.  Very good point in fact.

 

 

 

 

Aginor showed up and killed himself. Not much better.

 

But Aginor is one of my favourites because of his amazing work on creating shadowspawn. Especially the Gholam.

 

Yeah, I had kind of hoped that at some point they would put Osan'gar to work making new and more dangerous shadowspawn.

That would be impossible given the 3rd age tech level.

 

Stasis boxes. I could imagine him storing some of his lab tech in there

 

 

I don't imagine he anticipated being sealed in The Dark One's Prison for thousands of years.

[EmperorAllspice]

Then why put a Gholam in one?

[Leopoled Boothe]

Then why put a Gholam in one?

 

I don't know but he wasn't preparing for a 3000 year sleep. I think the most logical explanation would be that he was experimenting with the Gholam, possibly finding out if it could survive a stay in the stasis box.  And I guess it really would not be too far fetched if he had but some lab tech in a stasis box as well.

[Barid Bel Medar]

 

Then why put a Gholam in one?

 

I don't know but he wasn't preparing for a 3000 year sleep. I think the most logical explanation would be that he was experimenting with the Gholam, possibly finding out if it could survive a stay in the stasis box.  And I guess it really would not be too far fetched if he had but some lab tech in a stasis box as well.

 

 

I would put a Gholam in one too. Those bastards are dangerous and nasty. 

 

They likely only took them out of the stasis box for assassinations. I wouldn't let them roam around free.