Chapter 11

[csarmi]

You're in a classical mood. May I suggest some Bach?

[Sid]

So what do we think the chapter title will be?

Boots II

Memories of the Rahad

Filling the Gap

As Close as We'll Get

 

 

less snarkily, I was thinking it would be the name of the inn/tavern like before, which you mentioned already.

[csarmi]

The General Theory of Boots

[Luckers]

where are all the valen luca fans? If Petra is a now a Seachan guard...whats happened to valen luca?

Oh, I only know one, and he's boycotting DM. Either way, this was hardly unexpected; Tuon promised to sponsor Luca, after all.

 

Classic. I remember Dida/Felix telling Luckers he was a bully so he would no longer post here. Doesn't stop him from twittering at DM all day long however....

 

Oh! So that's why he got this thing for Cads! They're bullies both.

 

 

Cadsuane eyed the boy; he was not much taller than she, with pale hair and blue eyes that would have well suited an Aielman, despite the height. His skin though--no Aiel had skin that light, not in places where the sun could touch. He did not look the sort to cause such trouble, but by the way the others all held their breath, something was expected. The boy seemed to sense it as well; a small smile played around his lips as he turned to look at the watchers.

 

"I do believe they expect us to fight," he murmured, tilting his head back toward her but keeping his eyes upon them.

 

"And is that what you expect?" she asked, just as mildly.

 

"For your sake I hope not," his eyes flicked up to meet hers, sparkling with amusement. "I bite."

 

Despite herself, she smiled. "Tell me boy, have you ever considered being a warder?"

 

"No," he replied contemplatively as he turned back to face her fully. "Have you?"

 

"Phaw!" she murmured, shaking her head, feeling her ornaments sway with the force of it. "You're going to be trouble, aren't you?"

 

"Oh I don't know about that," he replied. "Not unless you have bad habits for me to correct."

 

"Well then, why don't we talk about that," she glided forward and slipped her arm through the boy's, and turning him away from their watchers. "Why don't we talk about that at length."

 

"Oh dear," the boy murmured, though he let himself be led easily enough. Yes, this should be very interesting.

[Luckers]

So what do we think the chapter title will be?

Boots II

Memories of the Rahad

Filling the Gap

As Close as We'll Get

 

 

less snarkily, I was thinking it would be the name of the inn/tavern like before, which you mentioned already.

 

 

LOL.

[Alanna]

It makes perfect sense to me that Mat doesn't want to recognized, at least not right away. That's Mat. He has absolutely no idea what kind of situation he's walking into in Ebou Dar. It's only smart to sneak in and get the lay of the land first.

 

I agree that this is probably his current thinking, but why is he even going about it this way at all?

 

1) he is on his own

2) he is travelling by horse (I suppose he could have skipped a chunk by gateway but hey)

3) he doesn't appear to have justice with him (as a bargaining chip or pressie-wessie for wifey)

4) he feels the need to risk showing his face in half the bars in the city to get some good info

5) he doesn't really actually get any good info...

6) whatever he is trying to do would not be helped by the presence of someone who could channel

7) he doesn't feel rushed to find lodgings, just a stable... That's a little unusual.

 

It seems as though he wanted to approach the city in disguise and blend in rather than directly beam to the bridge, which he could have done. He certainly would have had the opportunity to take a channeler along with him and has chosen to go it alone.

 

@yournewdragon

 

You think he doesn't want Tuon to know he is there... What the heck is he doing then?

 

I'm going to address the main general issue, which seems to be why Mat doesn't just go straight up to the palace - or wherever he presumes Tuon to be - to talk to her. Mainly, I would think, because as I said, he has no idea what he's walking into - and by that I mean, he doesn't know how receptive Tuon is going to be to him. Even if his goal in going there is to talk to her, he's really not entirely sure how's going to be received. He still seems half-convinced she'll try to make him da'covale. And when they last parted, they both acknowledged that though they're married, they're also possible enemies on the battlefield. Presumably that will all be put aside, one way or another, for the LB - presumably, that's what Mat is there for. But he doesn't know, intially, how things are going to stand between them.

 

On top of that, he doesn't know how easy it will be for him to just get in to see Tuon. He doesn't know - I don't think we even know - if it's public knowledge yet that Tuon has a husband, or that that husband is Mat (I would think the latter is definitely not public knowledge, considering the wanted posters). Is he just supposed to approach the first Seanchan he can find, or a guard at the palace, and declare that he is Tuon's husband? It might get him in to see her eventually, but he likely wouldn't be believed at first, and it could get him in a lot of trouble. Which he can bypass by sneaking in and getting some info on what's going on there first.

[FarShainMael]

The General Theory of Boots

 

Mat should compare notes with Sam Vimes - sorry, His Grace, His Excellency, The Duke of Ankh; Commander Sir Samuel Vimes (Blackboard Monitor).

 

The reason that the rich were so rich, Vimes reasoned, was because they managed to spend less money.

 

Take boots, for example. He earned 38 dollars a month plus allowances. A really good pair of leather boots cost 50 dollars. But an affordable pair of boots, which were sort of OK for a season or two and then leaked like hell when the cardboard gave out, cost about ten dollars. Those were the kind of boots Vimes always bought, and wore until the soles were so thin that he could tell where he was in Ankh-Morpork on a foggy night by the feel of the cobbles.

 

But the thing was that good boots lasted for years and years. A man who could afford 50 dollars had a pair of boots that'd still be keeping his feet dry in 10 years' time, while a poor man who could only afford cheap boots would have spent 100 dollars on boots in the same time and would still have wet feet.

 

This was the Captain* Samuel Vimes 'Boots' theory of socio-economic** unfairness.

 

Thank you Sir Terry!

 

*He hadn't been promoted yet.

**Sorry, echo-gnomics; the reflected sound of underground spirits.

[yoniy0]

Was this directed at me?

No, Morsker, though in retrospect I probably misunderstood him.

[Terez]

Also "asking for it" analogies are extremely overused...

It's not an analogy. An analogy is when you compare, say, robbery to rape, or Obama to Hitler. This is comparing rape to rape.

The "asking for it" is an analogy to the way we blame victims. In the archetypical case, it's saying the victim should feel ashamed, that the victim shouldn't complain and only increases her shame by complaining. But when Elayne applies it to Mat, it's just a gag. She isn't blaming Mat for anything, just laughing at how funny she thinks the situation is.

 

She said something about 'a dose of his own medicine'.

 

You're in a classical mood. May I suggest some Bach?

 

That's baroque.

[Hyronimus]

Hey, just a thought but given his desire to not be recognised and then his 'unreasonable' anger at tuon being threatened by Galgan, is there any way he could know that Galgan is a DF? Possibly Demandred? Attacking the WT seems something way too much in the shadows favour, quite the move to get the AS with their pants down, just as the final attacks are on.

[yoniy0]

Hey, just a thought but given his desire to not be recognised and then his 'unreasonable' anger at tuon being threatened by Galgan, is there any way he could know that Galgan is a DF? Possibly Demandred? Attacking the WT seems something way too much in the shadows favour, quite the move to get the AS with their pants down, just as the final attacks are on.

Well, as mentioned before, Galgan cannot be Demandred on both meta-data (we know Demandred's alter ego -- if he has one -- wasn't seen on stage in KoD, which Galgan has) and the fact that Semirhage was already operating in Ebou Dar (no need for Demandred to be there as well). As for the attack on the WT, that seems like the most logical step from the Seanchan perspective as well, assuming you don't trust marath'damane to fight on the Light's side in TG. Of course, I'd be both appalled and very surprised if an attack now would catch the WT off guard -- Egwene would have to be a fool not to prepare for it, knowing that the Seanchan have Traveling, and witnessing her AS's performance the last time around.

[FarShainMael]

For all those who are upset about Mat having Pips and not really visiting anywhere when he heads to Ebou Dar, remember it was perrin and his asha'man that sent him to ToG. So, it is very possible that Perrin has Pips. Perrin also planned on having the ashaman open a gateway to the location every day. So, Perrin could have had an ashaman pick him up, get Pips from perrin's army, hear a little about what was going on with the FoM, and then decide/get sent to deal with the Seanchen to establish a peace. No Caemlyn involved.

 

Talmanes is expecting Mat back at the Band camp. He talks to Olver about it:

 

"I hope Mat will be back soon," Olver said.

 

"I'm sure he will be," Talmanes said. "His task for Her Majesty shouldn't take much longer." That was the lie they had told Olver - that Mat, Thom, and Noal had gone off on some secret errand for the Queen.

[MasterAblar]

Hey, just a thought but given his desire to not be recognised and then his 'unreasonable' anger at tuon being threatened by Galgan, is there any way he could know that Galgan is a DF? Possibly Demandred? Attacking the WT seems something way too much in the shadows favour, quite the move to get the AS with their pants down, just as the final attacks are on.

Well, as mentioned before, Galgan cannot be Demandred on both meta-data (we know Demandred's alter ego -- if he has one -- wasn't seen on stage in KoD, which Galgan has) and the fact that Semirhage was already operating in Ebou Dar (no need for Demandred to be there as well). As for the attack on the WT, that seems like the most logical step from the Seanchan perspective as well, assuming you don't trust marath'damane to fight on the Light's side in TG. Of course, I'd be both appalled and very surprised if an attack now would catch the WT off guard -- Egwene would have to be a fool not to prepare for it, knowing that the Seanchan have Traveling, and witnessing her AS's performance the last time around.

 

I don't doubt she's prepared for such an eventuality, but depending on the forces she took to the FoM, she's probably weakened it's defences. And now that they have traveling I would be suprised if the Seanchan didn't do a little scouting before attacking. A little scouting would reveal that weakened defence.

[yoniy0]

A little scouting would reveal that weakened defence.

Or the appearance of, in the same way she baited Mesaana.

[Neophyte]

A little scouting would reveal that weakened defence.

Or the appearance of, in the same way she baited Mesaana.

 

Not to downplay Egwene's strength of will in that contest, but her bacon was saved by one Lord Perrin "Goldeneyes" Aybara. Not only did he deal with some balefire (which Egwene might not have been able to avoid, since she regards it as more than "just a weave" and in Tel'aran'rhiod her attitude would make a big difference) but he brought in the dreamspike, unwittingly stopping Mesaana from fully executing her counter-trap.

 

Egwene did not successfully "bait" Mesaana. The Forsaken had Egwene badly outmaneuvered in the planning department. Perrin's unwitting ta'veren interference is the only thing that saved Egwene's forces from being completely worked over.

 

Since at least two (and probably all three) ta'veren will be at the Field of Merrilor, she might get lucky again. But Egwene has benefited from a whole lot of good luck in the last few books. To her credit, she's capitalized on the opportunities presented.

 

Egwene's recent major accomplishments:

Campaign to discredit Elaida - enabled by her somewhat foolish personal participation in the harbor chain sabotage and subsequent unplanned capture

Reuniting the tower without bloodshed - enabled by the Seanchan raid taking Elaida to her much deserved new station

Exposing the Black Ajah - that was pretty much all Verin ...

Killing Mesaana - detailed above

 

Egwene doesn't seem to be super-strong on planning yet - the times when she executes a plan well it seems to either originate from Siuan, or involve some deus-ex-machina-esque timing and stupidity of her opponents (see: tricking the newly formed Hall into adopting new rules and letting her deal with Rand).

 

Egwene's strongest trait is that she is willing to take the hard path without complaining when the hard path will strengthen her personal credibility and make her point more strongly. That's the most necessary quality for her style of leadership, so it works out. But she has gotten pretty lucky more than once.

[yoniy0]

Agreed. However, that hardly differentiates Egwene from the other protagonists (and antagonists, actually, although they seem to be shorter on luck).

[MarkDiLillo]

As much as I want to read the last book...this excerpt is total trash writing. It's not that Sandersons voice is off...its the rather blatant lack of effort to get the voice right. Why does he add his own little personal nuances to an already established character that people love so much? That bit about Tuon...is just strikingly bad. Not to mention, it is unlikely that most people would even know her name. The average person is likely only to know her as Empress Fortuona. It really just feels like the guy cannot control himself and MUST add his own personal quirks to everything he touches because he has personally wanted that character to act that way during his interpretation of the story.

 

This chapter really just disgusts me. It reeks of a bad fan fic. It feels like Sanderson just absolutely rushed through writing this so that he could complete the story and return to writing his own novels. Nothing in this chapter feels practiced, analyzed, or polished.

 

I know a lot of you like Sanderson as a person because he seems like a nice guy that is trying his hardest to finish the series, but frankly this excerpt is pathetic IMO. It shows a total lack of effort to even attempt to match RJs story. This entire reading belonged in a different series.

 

The only character that Sanderson didn't totally screwup so far has been Perrin. Frankly, if RJ didnt write the last sequence I don't even think I'd bother buying the last book at this point. I'd be just as content reading a summary somewhere to see how it all ended.

[yoniy0]

Hey there, I'm sure we can manage to say our piece in a respectful manner, can't we?

[b3arz3rg3r]

A little scouting would reveal that weakened defence.

Or the appearance of, in the same way she baited Mesaana.

 

Perhaps if they had a couple of years to prepare. Without those I'd say if the Seanchan make a determined effort I don't see how the WT could resist them. The Damane are simply superior in terms of fighting. Aes Sedai may be better at many things in regard to channelling, but in terms of discipline, coordination and battle experience the Damane have them beaten by miles. If they strike at night with dozens of Gateways opening at strategic locations all over the tower supported by a few thousand soldiers the Tower would fall within hours. The Aes Sedai have to come up with a way to prevent anyone from Travelling within the White Tower or perhaps even within Tar Valon to be secure.

[Sid]

Though it would come nowhere close to fixing the mess, it could mend a noticeable bruise, and it would take about one minute.

 

Step 1: Take the digital copy of the whole series. "Find and Replace" 'bloody ashes' with 'blood and ashes'.

Step 2: "Find and Replace" 'blood and blood and ashes' with 'blood and bloody ashes'.

 

Abacadabra! The first eleven books remain unchanged and the last three are improved a little bit.

[b3arz3rg3r]

The only character that Sanderson didn't totally screwup so far has been Perrin. Frankly, if RJ didnt write the last sequence I don't even think I'd bother buying the last book at this point. I'd be just as content reading a summary somewhere to see how it all ended.

 

Nah, BS did screw Perrin up. Only unlike Mat he made Perrin better.

 

Jokes aside, I don't think BS screwed up with either Nynaeve or Rand so far.

[fionwe1987]

A little scouting would reveal that weakened defence.

Or the appearance of, in the same way she baited Mesaana.

 

Perhaps if they had a couple of years to prepare. Without those I'd say if the Seanchan make a determined effort I don't see how the WT could resist them. The Damane are simply superior in terms of fighting. Aes Sedai may be better at many things in regard to channelling, but in terms of discipline, coordination and battle experience the Damane have them beaten by miles. If they strike at night with dozens of Gateways opening at strategic locations all over the tower supported by a few thousand soldiers the Tower would fall within hours. The Aes Sedai have to come up with a way to prevent anyone from Travelling within the White Tower or perhaps even within Tar Valon to be secure.

No they don't. Look at how the Rebels handled it when they thought Sammael was atatcking (it was actually a bubble of Evil). They quickly formed circles, and took care of things.

 

The Aes Sedai just need to be prepared. If the Seanchan attack at night now, all they need to do is Travel to pre assigned locations and form links, adding Novices and Accepted too. The moment they're in circles, the damane are going to be toast. As Egwene proved in tGS, just give a little organization and circles to anyone opposing the Seanchan, and they do marvelously well. Even Novices were able to hold back the Seanchan with ease once they had links.

 

Frankly, I think its going to be the marvelous efficacy of links that will finally convince the Seanchan they need to remove the a'dam for the LB.

[yoniy0]

Perhaps if they had a couple of years to prepare. Without those I'd say if the Seanchan make a determined effort I don't see how the WT could resist them. The Damane are simply superior in terms of fighting. Aes Sedai may be better at many things in regard to channelling, but in terms of discipline, coordination and battle experience the Damane have them beaten by miles. If they strike at night with dozens of Gateways opening at strategic locations all over the tower supported by a few thousand soldiers the Tower would fall within hours. The Aes Sedai have to come up with a way to prevent anyone from Travelling within the White Tower or perhaps even within Tar Valon to be secure.

I disagree. AS have several advantages, among them being able to weave faster, a better knowledge of severing weaves aimed at you, a foolproof weave that incapacitates damane, superior numbers, and the ability to Link which utilizes that last advantage. If they are prepared, they can counter an attack as long as fewer than 6-8 hundred damane are sent.

 

EDIT: Ninja'ed by fionwe1987

[Terez]

That bit about Tuon...is just strikingly bad. Not to mention, it is unlikely that most people would even know her name. The average person is likely only to know her as Empress Fortuona.

 

Keep in mind that when she first landed at Ebou Dar she was known only as High Lady Tuon, and it seems every Seanchan knew the veil routine and knew her real name.

[davesmith1983]

It's always interesting to hear other people's takes on the same chapter. Personally, I thought Mat read fine. I think Sanderson's take on Mat has gotten better with each book. I didn't notice anything "off" like he was in tGS. I also didn't notice anything out of ordinary with the fanservice. Jame came off as Seanchan to me--and as a more than casual fan who doesn't do much online, nothing seemed off about that scene to me. Just my two cents.