What you dislike most about the series?

[Mr Ares]

But that was one of my complaints.. why take 3 books to finish any of their storylines? I mean really like you said he could combined most of the books later in the series; CoT coulda been a short story like NS if you cut out the overly done baths, dress descriptions etc. All the story lines were moving along pretty well until ACoS after that moved along like it was stuck in frozen molasses. I'm reading TSR and he's still giving descriptions of characters that he did from the first book..why? No one is going to start the series on book 4, are they?

People might not start reading with book 4 (although at least one person on this forum did), but people are not necessarily going to read straight through. If you read a book, then read another ninety or so before the next one came out, then started on the new one you might want a little bit of a refresher as to how the OP worked, what the characters looked like, etc. Not everyone remembers all these little details. As for why take three books to finish their storylines, I would suggest because it wasn't planned to. He didn't know how long it would take, how many words he would have written before he next got to a convenient stopping point. So he writes PoD, and doesn't know if he could make it one long book or two shorter ones if he carries on with the material for WH. And fans have already waited a few years. They wait a couple more and end up with two books anyway, perhaps? Mistakes were made, undoubtedly, but I don't think it unreasonable given the size of the task, how long it was taking, the amount of work involved, that some mistakes would be made.

 

 

commercial success equals = more sequels, for better OR worse. two words (and a number): butterfly effect 2. if you're going to buy something just because of it's name, then someones going to sell it to you, done deal. and worry about making it (good) later.

So you believe that no-one with any commercial success has any artistic integrity? A pessimistic view, but not one I share.

 

lol @ defense of typos! sorry but there is no excuse for shoddy work. I don't care how stressed the editor(s) are. omg he has a lot of responsibilities? five kids and a night job on the side? then he has my sympathies however a job is still a job and it should still be done right. and if he can't then give that percentage of his salary to me and I will, and it will take less than a week and I will get them all, thats all I'm sayin. it's not that hard. lol @ 'don't buy it' that's your solution?

Yes, not buying something because you deem it to be of poor quality is a perfectly valid solution. By buying it, you are indicating that whatever faults exist, you are willing to buy it now rather than wait for them to be fixed. By continuing to buy the series despite knowledge of the faults, you are indicating you don't care all that much. Mouthing off on the internet won't change anything. Waiting for the problems to be fixed before buying does. As I said, there is more to editing than spotting typos. If you think you can do Harriet's job, I think you should know that. And why should I give you a week? You have a day. A day to read the book, spot all the errors, and send it back to the author with corrections and suggestions. Does this action fit this character? What is the point of this scene? Is this sentence clear enough? And you would be working from the manuscript, with undoubtedly more errors than the finished version you bought.

 

as well as a decline in overall quality after book 7. yes I think we were milked for about 2 extra books, agree. that was nicely said

Clearly you don't agree, as I don't believe we were milked. I'm saying you can claim two books at most. I think the amount that could be trimmed from CoT is often exaggerated, and KoD was one of the longest books in the series - combining the two might not be practical. Further, it was RJ's attmept to experiment with structure that caused many of CoT's problems, and that's a problem that could only be solved by forcing fans to wait several more years.

[Guest Accolan]

One of my biggest pet peeves is the treatment Matt gets from Elayne and Nynaeve, throughout the books he is treated like something they stepped in while in a barn. They treat it as a joke when they find out he is being sexually assaulted by Tylin (could you imagine Matt joking about it if it was a King who was forcing himself on one of them?!?), Nynaeve kicks him when she realizes she cannot touch him withe the OP, and they never give it a second thought when their actions cause the death of several of the Band and abandon Matt and them to whatever fate they get in Altara after the Seanchan attack. I am re-reading the series once again and every time Matt is treated like crap it makes my blood boil.

[ShevyCelebrity]

I have to go with Egwene's great idea of rallying everyone together to tell Rand NOT to break the dark one's seals. Just what was she thinking? Thanks for letting Camelyn fall buddy. Now why don't you just go play in the corner while the grown ups handle the Last Battle.

 

WOW...I have seen Eggy blamed for just about everything on this site but putting the Shadow's attack against Caemlyn on her is a definite first. By that rationale the attack on Maradon is Rand's fault because he is the reason the Borderlander's left their post. Both are fairly ridiculous of course.

 

As for being against breaking the seals. Let's see a man that as far as you know has taint induced madness, waltzes into the WT, says he is going to break the seals and set the DO free and then refuses to discuss the situation with you. WHAT was she thinking!!! You can disagree with how she is going about it as the book progresses, but a frist reaction of trying to stop it and questioning if he has a plan(which he refused to discuss and at this point the plan is let's hope Min figures something out from those old books) is a very valid reaction. Not to mention Rand, for whatever reason purposely antagonized her and AS maneuvered her into doing exactly what he wanted her to do.

 

The attack itself was not her fault but with all of this madness going on around the world at this moment would you leave the capitol of the biggest nation basically undefended? and is it not Rand's duty to fight the dark one? It's like she is still hoping that the Last Battle is a far off thing which it is not. It's right around the corner and if Rand believes he is ready then by god I think everyone should support him. Rand has shown a stubborn streak in the past, Egwene especially should have been aware of that, did she really believe they could talk him out of something in which he has dug his heels in on?So because Rand is stubborn, no-one should ever try to change his mind? I hope these words don't come back to haunt you if you ever get into an argument with me. Rand gives every impression of his half-baked plan being utter foolishness - Egwene has damn good reason to oppose. Just because Rand has a duty to fight Shai'tan doesn't mean he should go unquestioned - he is capable of making mistakes and doing the wrong thing. And why is it such a mistake to take troops away from the capital? Aside from the fact we see the Band outside Camelyn in the epilogue anyway (it is Olver and Talmanes who see that Caemlyn is on fire) so the capital is not undefended, why should it be considered a major problem? After all, there is more to Andor than Caemlyn - to get to the capital, an enemy army would have to go through the Waygate (thought secure) or go overland - past the border that had its defences increased following rumours of an invasion. And if sufficient Channelers have been left behind, it should be possible to send a message to the FoM, and therefore bring the army to bear. Calling this Egwene's mistake is senseless. Only the Shadow can be blamed for Caemlyn - those on the side of the Light did all they reasonably could to prevent it.

 

 

So, when is it an ideal time for Rand to break the seals? Tomorrow? The day after? Next year? Or how about now. When he feels he is ready. True, there is plenty more to Andor than Camelyn but now how many thousands will die? I know that in the Last Battle plenty are going to die anyway but how many could have been saved if only Egwene didn't strip the land of soldiers to make a big show to Rand that he shouldn't break the seals. I know perhaps if she went along with Rand's idea the troops probably would have been moved anyway but at least then they could have made a unified attack on the Blight. Instead they are all bundled up in one place. I'm not blaming the attack itself on Egwene. I know the attack would have happened regardless of what she did but I don't understand why she tried to rally everyone against Rand at the time he is going to need them the most.

[Lama Chemist Ho]

The Accepted tests

ohhh yeah... good times! I don't know why I just felt the series start to lose modesty in awkward fashion

 

despite knowledge of the faults, you are indicating you don't care all that much.

yes

 

I mean I know its not a big deal and its easy to figure out what was meant...

Mouthing off on the internet

Title says it all.

don't forget you're on a thread which is entitled "What you dislike most about the series?" I didn't start it, but since its here I will speak truth. so anyways, no. releasing typos to store shelves is totally unprofessional and unnecessary. all you have to do to catch them is proofread! and I'm pretty sure they are given more than one day to do so...lol

 

You have a day.

can I get a babysitter to watch all my kids?

[Ingtar Shinowa]

 

lol @ defense of typos! sorry but there is no excuse for shoddy work. I don't care how stressed the editor(s) are. omg he has a lot of responsibilities? five kids and a night job on the side? then he has my sympathies however a job is still a job and it should still be done right. and if he can't then give that percentage of his salary to me and I will, and it will take less than a week and I will get them all, thats all I'm sayin. it's not that hard. lol @ 'don't buy it' that's your solution?

 

 

Let's not forget that Tam al'Thor was referred to several times as Master al'Vere and Mistress al'Vere was referred to as Mistress Luhhan in tSR. Now that is just poor.

[senaat1]

agree with all those who said repetitive descriptions, characters' lack of communication, the series being stretched out to sell more units (especially between #8-10)

 

and I would add the all-too-contrived elements of nudity / sexuality that seemed to appear after the first 3 books (most likely at the behest of tor, again in order to sell more units). sex and violence sells and unfortunately making money is always the bottom line, and I mean RJ originally struck me as a fairly modest author otherwise, who would have stayed away from those topics for classiness' sake if left to his own devices, and to me it just seemed like the suits / corporate stepped in and said "here's what we want" which jordan replied "(sigh) ok I'll try. 'nynaeve folded her arms beneath her breasts.....'"

 

(I mean its not that I don't love hearing about breasts but is it REALLY necessary to put it that way? several times per book?)

 

also agree with 'lack of editor' I mean...did anyone else feel like there were up to a dozen or more typos per book, at some point? even in the gathering storm I'm pretty sure I found at least four, including at one point bryne's name being spelled "byrne" and a few others, many missing words etc. 'though' instead of 'through' also happens multiple times. I mean I know its not a big deal and its easy to figure out what was meant...it just seems to me like if someone (or ones) are being PAID to catch those, and they're failing and I'm sitting in my house doing a better job of it? thats not right, right? so where does one apply to be an editor for tor? my resume will be a complete list of every typo

 

another example of male-female friendship: how bout lan and moiraine?

 

That's a much-used way of standing when lecturing someone.

 

How else should RJ put it? "Nynaeve folds her arms beneath her chesticles?" "Nynaeve folds her arms beneath her bossom?

[senaat1]

 

lol @ defense of typos! sorry but there is no excuse for shoddy work. I don't care how stressed the editor(s) are. omg he has a lot of responsibilities? five kids and a night job on the side? then he has my sympathies however a job is still a job and it should still be done right. and if he can't then give that percentage of his salary to me and I will, and it will take less than a week and I will get them all, thats all I'm sayin. it's not that hard. lol @ 'don't buy it' that's your solution?

 

 

Let's not forget that Tam al'Thor was referred to several times as Master al'Vere and Mistress al'Vere was referred to as Mistress Luhhan in tSR. Now that is just poor.

 

Seriously? They called Tam "Master al'Vere"?

Wow.

Now that's good editing.

[Ingtar Shinowa]

 

lol @ defense of typos! sorry but there is no excuse for shoddy work. I don't care how stressed the editor(s) are. omg he has a lot of responsibilities? five kids and a night job on the side? then he has my sympathies however a job is still a job and it should still be done right. and if he can't then give that percentage of his salary to me and I will, and it will take less than a week and I will get them all, thats all I'm sayin. it's not that hard. lol @ 'don't buy it' that's your solution?

 

 

Let's not forget that Tam al'Thor was referred to several times as Master al'Vere and Mistress al'Vere was referred to as Mistress Luhhan in tSR. Now that is just poor.

 

Seriously? They called Tam "Master al'Vere"?

Wow.

Now that's good editing.

 

Yeah, it's pretty craptastic.

[Mr Ares]

I have to go with Egwene's great idea of rallying everyone together to tell Rand NOT to break the dark one's seals. Just what was she thinking? Thanks for letting Camelyn fall buddy. Now why don't you just go play in the corner while the grown ups handle the Last Battle.

 

WOW...I have seen Eggy blamed for just about everything on this site but putting the Shadow's attack against Caemlyn on her is a definite first. By that rationale the attack on Maradon is Rand's fault because he is the reason the Borderlander's left their post. Both are fairly ridiculous of course.

 

As for being against breaking the seals. Let's see a man that as far as you know has taint induced madness, waltzes into the WT, says he is going to break the seals and set the DO free and then refuses to discuss the situation with you. WHAT was she thinking!!! You can disagree with how she is going about it as the book progresses, but a frist reaction of trying to stop it and questioning if he has a plan(which he refused to discuss and at this point the plan is let's hope Min figures something out from those old books) is a very valid reaction. Not to mention Rand, for whatever reason purposely antagonized her and AS maneuvered her into doing exactly what he wanted her to do.

 

The attack itself was not her fault but with all of this madness going on around the world at this moment would you leave the capitol of the biggest nation basically undefended? and is it not Rand's duty to fight the dark one? It's like she is still hoping that the Last Battle is a far off thing which it is not. It's right around the corner and if Rand believes he is ready then by god I think everyone should support him. Rand has shown a stubborn streak in the past, Egwene especially should have been aware of that, did she really believe they could talk him out of something in which he has dug his heels in on?

So because Rand is stubborn, no-one should ever try to change his mind? I hope these words don't come back to haunt you if you ever get into an argument with me. Rand gives every impression of his half-baked plan being utter foolishness - Egwene has damn good reason to oppose. Just because Rand has a duty to fight Shai'tan doesn't mean he should go unquestioned - he is capable of making mistakes and doing the wrong thing. And why is it such a mistake to take troops away from the capital? Aside from the fact we see the Band outside Camelyn in the epilogue anyway (it is Olver and Talmanes who see that Caemlyn is on fire) so the capital is not undefended, why should it be considered a major problem? After all, there is more to Andor than Caemlyn - to get to the capital, an enemy army would have to go through the Waygate (thought secure) or go overland - past the border that had its defences increased following rumours of an invasion. And if sufficient Channelers have been left behind, it should be possible to send a message to the FoM, and therefore bring the army to bear. Calling this Egwene's mistake is senseless. Only the Shadow can be blamed for Caemlyn - those on the side of the Light did all they reasonably could to prevent it.

 

 

So, when is it an ideal time for Rand to break the seals? Tomorrow? The day after? Next year? Or how about now. When he feels he is ready. True, there is plenty more to Andor than Camelyn but now how many thousands will die? I know that in the Last Battle plenty are going to die anyway but how many could have been saved if only Egwene didn't strip the land of soldiers to make a big show to Rand that he shouldn't break the seals. I know perhaps if she went along with Rand's idea the troops probably would have been moved anyway but at least then they could have made a unified attack on the Blight. Instead they are all bundled up in one place. I'm not blaming the attack itself on Egwene. I know the attack would have happened regardless of what she did but I don't understand why she tried to rally everyone against Rand at the time he is going to need them the most.

He has no plan. How is he ready? Surely the fate of the world is sufficiently important that one should try to figure out a plan of action before breaking the Seals? How many thousands would die in Caemlyn if the army hadn't been removed? Remember, the army would not necessarily be bunched up in Caemlyn, and even if they were they would awake in the night to find the city under attack - that leads to confusion. So having them in Merrilor, spread around Andor, on the border, outside Caemlyn, inside Caemlyn, whereever you put them, people still die. How many could be saved? Maybe none at all. Maybe it just to more deaths. As for the troops all being bundled up in one place, surely this is ideal for making a unified attack? And lastly, just because Rand needs the people doesn't mean he is doing the right thing.

 

 

so anyways, no. releasing typos to store shelves is totally unprofessional and unnecessary. all you have to do to catch them is proofread! and I'm pretty sure they are given more than one day to do so...lol

Proofreading is only "all you need to do" if you look at things in a vacuum. Looked at in context, there is much more to publishing a book. And they only have a short space to do it. A large book in little time. People working long hours in order to get it done on time. Various rounds of editing. Yes, the odd little thing will get missed. If you are Tom Doherty, you have the following choices: get the book out, accepting there will be mistakes; delay the book for months, missing Chritmas. Tor is a business. Christmas is a lucrative period. Missing out on all that money would be unprofessional. Further, the fans would be annoyed at the delay. So basically, in trying to remove a mere handful of errors, you cost a company a lot of money and piss everyone off. No-one benefits from doing things your way - everyone loses out.

 

You have a day.

can I get a babysitter to watch all my kids?

I don't see why you should.

[Lama Chemist Ho]

the following choices: get the book out, accepting there will be mistakes; delay the book for months, missing Chritmas.

qué? like I said all they have to do is hire additional or more competent proofreaders (me) I could unilaterally get it done in under < one week. lol @ 'months'! what you are describing is a breakdown in management. if they can't get it done by 'Chritmas'.....then they should have started earlier, it really is that simple. again a single work week is all it would take for ONE competent proofreader to fix every typo. "oops mr. jordan we actually need it one week ahead of when we thought (we suck rather badly you see)" <- whats so hard about that. if they really cared about their product they would QC it properly before releasing it. then no one would have to go through with your proposed boycott of the series. sounds to me like the same forces are at work which caused an originally-planned eyeless 3 book series to be milked into 15 eyeless books (corporate greed). anyway I realize you have to have the last word...I'm inclined to let you

 

 

that being said I just loved reading this line in ToM today: (chapter 5 'writings' page 107) "Light! Gawyn thought as Chubain shot him a hostile GLACE."

 

*cringes and shoots you a hostile glace* (btw http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Glace)

 

fire your proofreader or give them more than a single day (lol) to proofread the book. and START EARLIER if you can't make or change your deadline. I think its kind of a stretch the notion that every year on the morning of december 24th RJ drops his typo-ridden manuscript off under the tor Chritmas tree attached with a sticky 'get everything done in under ONE DAY'

 

lol

[Lama Chemist Ho]

How else should RJ put it? "Nynaeve folds her arms beneath her chesticles?"

lol actually ALL you have to say is "she folded her arms" or "she crossed her arms". we KNOW where it was in relation to her breasts! you don't say "he sat down on his buttocks" or "he folded his hands near his penis" do you? I guarantee you you don't! to me it just seemed like a poor way of forcing a contrived sensuality into the writing that didn't really belong

[Kal11]

Was flipping through ACOS and POD the last couple days and one thing came to mind that I always found completely unbelievable and out of character, that being the relationship between Aviendha and Elayne. Given Aiel sensibilities and culture (which Aviendha is as hardcore about as anyone)I always found it ridiculous that she respected and admired Elayne so much given her spoiled, selfish and completely out of touch with reality personality. I shake my head everytime I read a scene about the two of them interacting, much less becoming first sisters.

[anotherfingolfin]

Was flipping through ACOS and POD the last couple days and one thing came to mind that I always found completely unbelievable and out of character, that being the relationship between Aviendha and Elayne. Given Aiel sensibilities and culture (which Aviendha is as hardcore about as anyone)I always found it ridiculous that she respected and admired Elayne so much given her spoiled, selfish and completely out of touch with reality personality. I shake my head everytime I read a scene about the two of them interacting, much less becoming first sisters.

 

As has been touched upon earlier, friendships in general are not very well done. In fact, I feel that relationships(romantic/friendship/respect in general) between people, all across the board are fairly poorly done. They were ok- believable/better developed- in the first few books. People might disagree, but for a story so steeped in it's characters, the deeper interactions between them seem pretty hollow to me.

[Ingtar Shinowa]

Let's see:

 

Seanchan

Mat

Sea folk

Eggy

Aiel

rampant misandry

lack of screen time for the Borderlanders and Ogier

 

All in all, it's still probably the best fantasy series I've ever read.

[Mr Ares]

the following choices: get the book out, accepting there will be mistakes; delay the book for months, missing Chritmas.

qué? like I said all they have to do is hire additional or more competent proofreaders (me) I could unilaterally get it done in under < one week. lol @ 'months'! what you are describing is a breakdown in management. if they can't get it done by 'Chritmas'.....then they should have started earlier, it really is that simple. again a single work week is all it would take for ONE competent proofreader to fix every typo. "oops mr. jordan we actually need it one week ahead of when we thought (we suck rather badly you see)" <- whats so hard about that. if they really cared about their product they would QC it properly before releasing it. then no one would have to go through with your proposed boycott of the series. sounds to me like the same forces are at work which caused an originally-planned eyeless 3 book series to be milked into 15 eyeless books (corporate greed).

It was definitely not greed that lead this series to expand from three books into 15 (it has only expanded to fourteen, for one thing). RJ's initial plot breakdown was considered too extensive to be completed in three books - that's why his initial contract was for six books. RJ was just bad at estimating how much left he had to write. And they couldn't start earlier, because they hadn't finished writing it. TGS: Sanderson hired, works, finishes book, it is brought out. ToM, the same. Unless they had hired Sanderson a couple of months earlier? Of course, Tor needs to hire psychics! Some of the purely RJ books were rushed through editing - this proved unpopular as it led to a high number of errors, so they abandoned it for KoD. And as I have already pointed out, missing a deadline by mere days could potentially lead to months of delay. Publishers have slots when they release books. If your book isn't handed in in time to be released in that slot, you'll have to wait for another one. Or they just rush it through editing...wait, wasn't rushing it through the cause of the errors to begin with? You have demonstrated no particular knowledge of the publishing industry (neither am I, I've just picked up a couple of things) and despite the arrogance of your assessment I see no compelling evidence that you would be a better proofreader. Remember, just because you could get it done in under a week, doesn't mean they have a spare week to let you make one last pass before it goes to the printers. Because it has to go to the printers to get printed to get sent to the shops. And the printers won't necesarily stop and wait - they have other books to print. That is the point you so singularly failed to grasp about my one day line - I didn't mean all proofreaders have to do their job at the rate of a book a day, I mean that they are pushed for time. They have to edit the book, make the changes, get it sent to the printer in order to get it into the shops. And if the book is handed in close to deadline, then they have less time to prepare it - from what I can gather from reading comments Sanderson has made, he has to work long hours to get things done. I hardly think everyone else has masses of time to spare for nice, leisurely reads. And when you are up against it, timewise, there does exist the possibility that errors will slip past unnoticed. Unfortunate, but unavoidable unless you are prepared to spend much longer with the book in editing - and thus you delay the book by months. So your recourse as a reader is either to buy a book that you know will have errors, or wait until they have had time to fix them. By refusing to do the latter, you send the message that the errors are acceptable.

[Hybrid]

Elayne.

 

Need I explain myself?

 

EDIT: I forgot. Also Darrell K. Sweet.

Edited July 7, 2011 by Hybrid

[David Selig]

Was flipping through ACOS and POD the last couple days and one thing came to mind that I always found completely unbelievable and out of character, that being the relationship between Aviendha and Elayne. Given Aiel sensibilities and culture (which Aviendha is as hardcore about as anyone)I always found it ridiculous that she respected and admired Elayne so much given her spoiled, selfish and completely out of touch with reality personality. I shake my head everytime I read a scene about the two of them interacting, much less becoming first sisters.

Well, good thing then that in fact Elayne is neither of those things makes it a lot more understandable.

[RyanL24]

the following choices: get the book out, accepting there will be mistakes; delay the book for months, missing Chritmas.

qué? like I said all they have to do is hire additional or more competent proofreaders (me) I could unilaterally get it done in under < one week. lol @ 'months'! what you are describing is a breakdown in management. if they can't get it done by 'Chritmas'.....then they should have started earlier, it really is that simple. again a single work week is all it would take for ONE competent proofreader to fix every typo. "oops mr. jordan we actually need it one week ahead of when we thought (we suck rather badly you see)" <- whats so hard about that. if they really cared about their product they would QC it properly before releasing it. then no one would have to go through with your proposed boycott of the series. sounds to me like the same forces are at work which caused an originally-planned eyeless 3 book series to be milked into 15 eyeless books (corporate greed).

It was definitely not greed that lead this series to expand from three books into 15 (it has only expanded to fourteen, for one thing). RJ's initial plot breakdown was considered too extensive to be completed in three books - that's why his initial contract was for six books. RJ was just bad at estimating how much left he had to write. And they couldn't start earlier, because they hadn't finished writing it. TGS: Sanderson hired, works, finishes book, it is brought out. ToM, the same. Unless they had hired Sanderson a couple of months earlier? Of course, Tor needs to hire psychics! Some of the purely RJ books were rushed through editing - this proved unpopular as it led to a high number of errors, so they abandoned it for KoD. And as I have already pointed out, missing a deadline by mere days could potentially lead to months of delay. Publishers have slots when they release books. If your book isn't handed in in time to be released in that slot, you'll have to wait for another one. Or they just rush it through editing...wait, wasn't rushing it through the cause of the errors to begin with? You have demonstrated no particular knowledge of the publishing industry (neither am I, I've just picked up a couple of things) and despite the arrogance of your assessment I see no compelling evidence that you would be a better proofreader. Remember, just because you could get it done in under a week, doesn't mean they have a spare week to let you make one last pass before it goes to the printers. Because it has to go to the printers to get printed to get sent to the shops. And the printers won't necesarily stop and wait - they have other books to print. That is the point you so singularly failed to grasp about my one day line - I didn't mean all proofreaders have to do their job at the rate of a book a day, I mean that they are pushed for time. They have to edit the book, make the changes, get it sent to the printer in order to get it into the shops. And if the book is handed in close to deadline, then they have less time to prepare it - from what I can gather from reading comments Sanderson has made, he has to work long hours to get things done. I hardly think everyone else has masses of time to spare for nice, leisurely reads. And when you are up against it, timewise, there does exist the possibility that errors will slip past unnoticed. Unfortunate, but unavoidable unless you are prepared to spend much longer with the book in editing - and thus you delay the book by months. So your recourse as a reader is either to buy a book that you know will have errors, or wait until they have had time to fix them. By refusing to do the latter, you send the message that the errors are acceptable.

 

Interesting stuff. How often do these slots occur? Every 3 years or so? The fans would really be upset about waiting 3 extra months to read a finished story? They would rather buy a book that's full of errors and typos? Personally, I would rather wait the 3 months. What's the Christmas thing about anyway? ToM was released 2 November 2010, I think they could have taken the afformentioned week to fix the (at least) the typos and released it November 9. And people are going to buy the next WOT when it comes out, even if it's not Christmas. It's not really a Christmas gift. The ones that do come out near Christmas, it's more than 2 months before. No WOT fan is going to sit there for over two months waiting to read the next book because they are getting for Christmas. And no gift purchasers are going to buy book 8 of a series for somebody who doesn't read the series. It would make sense for the first book to come out before Christmas, that would get all kinds of new readers into your series. EotW came out 15 January 1990. CoT was released 7 January 2003, which tells me that getting these books out in time for Christmas is not that crucial to TOR. And looking at the release dates of the books of this series, I do not see any apparent slots.

 

I read my friend's copy of ToM and felt real bad for him. I'm cheap so I hate to buy a new book anyway, but to buy one with so many glaring typos? Ouch.

 

 

(it has only expanded to fourteen, for one thing)

 

Which one do you not count? And why not?

[Mrs. Cindy Gill]

i have no opinion to offer on the typo issue. just wanted to say that this thread got me surfing: first, "how does book publishing work," then, "how does book editing work," and then, "how does book proofreading work."

 

turned out to be fairly interesting reading. you know, if you get bored by all this.

 

i've worked at a book publisher's in the past, and i'd wondered if proofreaders were still the poorly paid, over-worked people i recall. in case you were wondering - yup, they are.

 

um, sorry to interrupt the debate. but really, it's a good surf.

[Kal11]

Was flipping through ACOS and POD the last couple days and one thing came to mind that I always found completely unbelievable and out of character, that being the relationship between Aviendha and Elayne. Given Aiel sensibilities and culture (which Aviendha is as hardcore about as anyone)I always found it ridiculous that she respected and admired Elayne so much given her spoiled, selfish and completely out of touch with reality personality. I shake my head everytime I read a scene about the two of them interacting, much less becoming first sisters.

Well, good thing then that in fact Elayne is neither of those things makes it a lot more understandable.

 

Are you reading the same series as I am? Elayne is the most petulant and immature character I can think of in the story who rarely if ever learns from her mistakes or grows. At this juncture she is the only character I am praying dies. AMOL could be ten pages long and I would give it a thumbs up if it involved her death.

[WhiskyJack]

Food..

[Rose]

like I said all they have to do is hire additional or more competent proofreaders (me) I could unilaterally get it done in under < one week.

Do you have any idea how hard proofreading is? I have worked in editing before, for a small publishing company. In once case, there was a team of four or five people involved in translating a book from one language to another, and then proofreading the translation to make sure there were no mistakes. I was one of the last people who went through it, and by that point the goal was not to check that the translation was good by just to make sure there were no typos. Well, I still found some. And I'm pretty sure the book went through at least another round of proofreading after me. Catching typos is not easy, especially if you've been working on a book for a long time, and have done several rounds of editing on different versions of it. You've read it so many times that it requires a lot of concentration to still see the typos at that point. And when it gets to things even more tricky than that - like having to keep track of the characters and making sure they are all referenced properly, or none disappears from one scene to another, then it's even harder, because you need to really know the book and the world well. Now I'm not saying one person working hard on it couldn't do it within a week. But I'm pretty sure if you were the only one doing it, there would still be typos when you'd be done.

Edited July 8, 2011 by Rose

[XXX]

RJ loses control of the books in the end...things do not move at all. BS's pacing is on a whole different level.ToM was excellent.

[David Selig]

Was flipping through ACOS and POD the last couple days and one thing came to mind that I always found completely unbelievable and out of character, that being the relationship between Aviendha and Elayne. Given Aiel sensibilities and culture (which Aviendha is as hardcore about as anyone)I always found it ridiculous that she respected and admired Elayne so much given her spoiled, selfish and completely out of touch with reality personality. I shake my head everytime I read a scene about the two of them interacting, much less becoming first sisters.

Well, good thing then that in fact Elayne is neither of those things makes it a lot more understandable.

 

Are you reading the same series as I am? Elayne is the most petulant and immature character I can think of in the story who rarely if ever learns from her mistakes or grows. At this juncture she is the only character I am praying dies. AMOL could be ten pages long and I would give it a thumbs up if it involved her death.

I guess then there's not much point in discussing this further, since my position regarding is completely the opposite.

 

Though I just have to note that I don't get how Elayne can be considered spoiled, when that she had no more problems doing all the menial chores required of the novices and Accepted than the other novices, is a better seamstress and cook than Egwene or Nynaeve and didn't mind sewing and cooking plenty of times during their travels, nor did she ever complained not having personal servants while in the Tower or travelling with Nynaeve. Apart from Morgase, she was brought up mostly by Lini and had Gareth Bryne for a main tutor, both of of which were undoubtedly strict and didnt tolerate childish tantrums, Daughter-Heir or not.

[Lama Chemist Ho]

Do you have any idea

uh, no offense but maybe your reading skill is not on a level with mine? I only say this because for me catching typos is EXTREMELY easy...in fact I can't NOT. it is my burden and my curse. for instance when you write things like

 

In once case,

or

 

by just to make sure

I can't help but read what you wrote as you wrote it. ordinarily I would NEVER point it out or care in the least or think less of anyone for it (especially not when its just casual internet posting)...I just don't think it belongs in a WoT book! yes I could easily catch and fix every typo in a week or less...ALL you have to do is read each word, remain focused while doing so and have good spelling. maybe thats beyond most people but proofreaders of a major series should have that.

 

@ cindy I am in complete agreement with you and ares. the proofreaders should be well compensated for their effort (IMO its an important-ish job they do) and given MORE than one day to accomplish their task. if I was treated like crap then yes, I too would probably poison WoT with typo after typo as an act of rebellion. the ultimate fault (as usual) lies with management. "hey there's still all these typos...ok, what's going on with the proofreader(s)?" <- how hard is that

 

the title of the thread is "what you dislike most about the series" well I cringe at all the typos, sorry! its a totally fixable thing for a competent company and you will never convince me otherwise