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DRAGONMOUNT

A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY

anotherfingolfin

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About anotherfingolfin

  • Birthday 01/01/1
  1. I don't know..maybe Egwene is being set up for a massive fall. Hopefully by Rand but I will take it if anyone teaches her some humility. There is a passage in ToM where she is writing to the Darlin and in her PoV I cannot believe the author would put in something like that and expect you to like the character. or this when finding out that Elayne had bonded Rand or her uneasiness in AM bonding AS even after knowing that the taint is no more present but is fine when AS bond AM No author can write this and hope people like this character. no, i think randsc is correct. i'd put money on it.
  2. you a hipster or something? (and i use that term as mockery. though ironically, i don't mean to offend.)
  3. As has been touched upon earlier, friendships in general are not very well done. In fact, I feel that relationships(romantic/friendship/respect in general) between people, all across the board are fairly poorly done. They were ok- believable/better developed- in the first few books. People might disagree, but for a story so steeped in it's characters, the deeper interactions between them seem pretty hollow to me.
  4. Exactly, everything you have said is on target. The point of argument is that whether Egwene at this point has reason or not to at least entertain the possibility that the world's would-be saviour is worthy of respect/credibility. She assumes he is mad due to preconcieved notions. Apart from intel that he has a crazy temper, what else does she have to go on? Has he done anything outright outright crazy? Does he seem like a raving lunatic? Does Nyn, who has been close to him for a very long time, tell her that he is off his rocker? Do people she should trust not tell her that he's changed for the better? Does she not know that Saidin is cleansed, and shouldn't that count for something? Is she supposed to be an important/respected leader and an intelligent opinion leader who is supposed to consider possibilities and overcome bias? Or is she she a foolish/naive farmgirl who is forgiven giving into prejudices and preconceptions without real evidence? Rand's been talking with a voice in his head for like an year, does that count as crazy enough for you? And she Nynaeve told Egwene that Rand was on the edge of balefiring the best and more experienced at fighting Shadowspawn armies in the Westlands (the Borderlanders) because he felt pissed off at their leaders. I see what you're saying. Fair points. What I guess I was saying is, has his peculiar mental state resulted in any particularly psychotic actions. Has his madness altered his judgment in anyway, so as to make it glaringly the act of a madman. I think of him Balefiring Graendal's palace. Not because I think killing all those compelled husks was bad, just that it was reckless of him to unleash that much balefire on the world. Regarding the Borderlanders, I guess the fact that he DIDN'T end up doing it is vindication enough for me. Both could be passed of as murderous rage, rather than madness in the sense that he obviously doesn't know what he's talking about. The talking to LTT didn't ever bother me much. Probably because in a world where we have knowledge of specific souls being reborn, it didn't strike me as odd. Anyway, I was basically responding to SolarZ's statement "Even Egwene's desire to oppose Rand ultimately stems from the fact that she still thinks Rand is mad." My criticism is that, it's wrong/bad if the ultimate root of her opposition is because she thinks he is mad, rather than an appraisal of his proposal. EDIT: @ David Selig- I realise that response was pretty incoherent, but I hope it comes across.
  5. Exactly, everything you have said is on target. The point of argument is that whether Egwene at this point has reason or not to at least entertain the possibility that the world's would-be saviour is worthy of respect/credibility. She assumes he is mad due to preconcieved notions. Apart from intel that he has a crazy temper, what else does she have to go on? Has he done anything outright outright crazy? Does he seem like a raving lunatic? Does Nyn, who has been close to him for a very long time, tell her that he is off his rocker? Do people she should trust not tell her that he's changed for the better? Does she not know that Saidin is cleansed, and shouldn't that count for something? Is she supposed to be an important/respected leader and an intelligent opinion leader who is supposed to consider possibilities and overcome bias? Or is she she a foolish/naive farmgirl who is forgiven giving into prejudices and preconceptions without real evidence?
  6. Didn't you go to high school... women are nasty to each other, its like a battle ground there, with all the subtle spikes into looks and such, i like the battles guys have to fight, the order of things is how much money you have and if you can hold your own in a fight. other than that there aint much to a guys hierarchy, women have so many issues with them selves that its a destructiveness that happens thoughout all social groups. Maybe I was not clear enough. My point was that there is no commonly held value that I have encountered that women should not harm women, unlike the belief that a man should not harm a woman. Tthat was what i meant by "as in the real world, so in tWot". I have no idea how you interpreted that as something diametrically opposite to what I meant. Incidentally, I have had basic education, though not at a stereotypical high-school straight out of an American movie.
  7. because it has nothing to do with logic or rationalising via in-universe history. it is probably a function of the writer's values seeping in. a commonly held belief is that MEN shouldn't harm women, i haven't heard any take on women harming women. as in the real world, so in WoT.
  8. Yes, the repository of knowledge sounds great. Except how many times in the series have we seen that repository made use of? Have we even seen one AS in the tower, even Brown, go around, actively searching for some answer to TG? Since it really hasn't been highlighted enough, I don't think it can be given too much weight at this point. I don't doubt that they are the best placed to help him. The incessant usage of the word 'guide', however, has other connotations. Help, Zen Rand says, would have been nice, and he has been a fool not to seek it out. Guide implies too much of a senior-junior dynamic. Moiraine undoubtedly guided him in the begining. When he was totally green and still had to establish himself. After that his need for a guide eroded. He did stuff his own way. He got certain results. You can argue that you don't agree with all his decisions etc, but he certainly was not floundering by the middle of the series, that he had need of a 'guide'. Advisers yes, which he did have. Later in the series, his capabilities have grown such that it becomes pretty apparent that there isn't anybody even remotely qualified enough to 'guide' him. The Aes Sedai in general have, by the later books, shown to be less than awe-inspiring. One can excuse the AS due to their inherent arrogance/ignorance early on in the series. Admittedly, Rand was an unknown quantity, and for all anybody knew, just a bumpkin. Later on though, Rand has proven himself, and this whole 'guide' thing becomes ridiculous, from Egwene in particular. She knows him and his capabilities better than most AS. She has no reason to think him any more of an ignorant bumpkin than she is. She cannot claim years of experience and accumulated knowledge as some justification to want to guide. Heck, most of all, she has not lived centuries of having the world dance to her tune, so that habit should not have dug in deep. Once again, the key is difference between help and guide. 'Guide' is like Yoda/Obi-wan or Gandalf. 'Help' is a decidedly secondray position.
  9. No one SHOULD follow him? That's a little extreme, don't you think? So Cads/Nyn only follow him becaue of his ta'veren pushing them to? Or am I just misunderstanding you? As to the original question- Yeah, totally agree with David Selig, we don't have enough information on how easily she changed her mind, so you should reserve judgement.
  10. Technically, no. LTT died. Rand is a different person. For all intents and purposes though, they are the same. The soul is the same, the memories are integrated, and though we have little to go on, the personalities seem to have an uncanny similarity. Rand al'Thor has no official claim to anything that is or was Lews Therin Telamon's. Yet it would be silly not to give him/his knowledge/his experiences their due weight.
  11. I dunno.. that's pretty moot, especially after the events of VoG. Though it's a bad logic to say that he should have any control over the the organisation based in Tar Valon, as they only use the name Aes Sedai; there is no other substantial continuity between that organisation and it's namesake in the previous age. Of course, that also means that those Aes Sedai are outright lying when they claim all Angreal/Ter'angreal as their own.
  12. If it's the DR's job to handle the bore/seals/Dark One, then he's going to do it how he see's fit. You can't have it both ways. Fact of the matter is that he is the most qualified to handle it. If by the time we get to FoM, the WT is able to present any alternative to breaking the seals, whether it turns out to be a better plan or not, then this whole opposition is perfetly reasonable. If, on the other hand, the alternative is nothing beyond "no you shouldn't", then the entire exercise would have been proven ridiculously juvenille.
  13. In the context of the WoT universe, he is not overrated as a combatant/swordsman, but he is definitely overrated as a character.
  14. So which point are you trying to make? That she should be taking drastic action because he announced something she doesn't understand and considers dangerous, or because he showed no awe of her "power"? I can sympathise with one (even if I don't agree with it) and not the other. I don't think anybody would even imply that they are remotely on par as motivations, but since you've mentioned them in the same breath twice, I want to make sure.
  15. I don't see how he can be blamed for not wanting to be prodded to 'check his sanity'. Is sounding philosophical really a symptom of being insane? Not when I last checked. Especially when the problem being dealth with is borderline metaphysical, I don't see how sounding philosophical is so off the reservation. Though I agree, sauntering in and saying something that totally goes against conventional wisdom held for millenia is quite a bombshell. The only complaint I have about Egwene in this situation is that she isn't preparing for the possibility or even the probability that Rand might be wrong, but for the certainty of it. At least that's the way I read it.
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