A Taint on Saidar?

[Zodd]

So I took a quick lookey to see if this had been brought up and did not find it. It's just something that has been bugging me for some time.

 

At least once per book I believe it's cropped up. Some Aes Sedai will state that their weaves are acting 'strange' or 'resisting'. This started popping up (I believe) after the cleansing of the taint on saidin. I've often wondered if this was some kind of transference, the taint now falling on saidar? As I haven't seen any new developments in the books explaining it, I turn to you guys. Help me out.

 

I think the last (and biggest) example is Semirhages impersonation of Tuon that failed. Her Illusion just disappeared and even she look surprised about it.

[Moogle]

The illusion was disrupted by Cadsuane's ter'angreal, as I recall.

 

The weaves acting strangely were a result of the Windfinders using the Bowl of the Winds far beyond its intended purpose.

[GYLD]

I would imagine the Aes Sedai who linked with Asha'man pre Cleansing and then any Asha'man who linked with an Aes Sedi post Cleansing would have said something if this were true.

[jemron]

+1 for Moogle's answer.

[mb]

The weaves acting strangely was just Ebou Dar.

The use of the Bowl of Winds was what caused it. The participants were these:: Elayne, Nynaeve, Aviendha, 7 Windfinders, and 3 Kin.

Path of Daggers.

 

 

The Cleansing of Saidin did not cause a taint on Saidar.

[Demiandre]

But there are other cases where neither a ter'angreal nor the Bowl of the Wind did that. What about the Wards failing, or the weaves that doesn't quite make it, even when done properly? there are cases where it is clearly stated that saidar isn't behaving as it should.

 

Even Alviarin states it in CoT when she comes back to the Tower (chapter "A Mark" IIRC)

[PhoenixUK]

But there are other cases where neither a ter'angreal nor the Bowl of the Wind did that. What about the Wards failing, or the weaves that doesn't quite make it, even when done properly? there are cases where it is clearly stated that saidar isn't behaving as it should.

 

Even Alviarin states it in CoT when she comes back to the Tower (chapter "A Mark" IIRC)

i think this is just part of the general breakdown in reality caused by the gradual emergence of the dark one. although, i can't recall anyone mentioning saidin breaking down in that way (except for the aforementioned ebou dar resonance).

[Feral]

I believe the wards failing is due to the DO's touch.

[Durinax]

But there are other cases where neither a ter'angreal nor the Bowl of the Wind did that. What about the Wards failing, or the weaves that doesn't quite make it, even when done properly? there are cases where it is clearly stated that saidar isn't behaving as it should.

 

Even Alviarin states it in CoT when she comes back to the Tower (chapter "A Mark" IIRC)

I thoguht that was due to mesaana screwing with them

[jemron]

Pretty sure recent breakdowns of power-wrought wards and such have to do with either (1) the DO's touch (this is what the books have lead us to believe) or (2) Rand's previous insanity (e.g. Dark Rand). He was not right in the head and so things (reality, the Power, etc.) were not right. He is one with the land, and the land is one with the Dragon. Dark Rand was likely causing all kinds of problems. I think now that he seems to better understand his purpose, he's making things right.

[mb]

The other effects are likely due to the Dark One's touch and/or the unraveling of the Pattern.

This page talks about it:: http://wotfaq.dragonmount.com/node/108

[Nightstrike]

CNN Chat 12 December 2000

 

Question from Jonan: Mr. Jordan, is it possible that in another Age, another Turning of the Wheel, that saidar could be tainted instead of saidin? This relates to the Female Dragon Theory.

 

RJ: That is not something I intend to explore.

[jemron]

The other effects are likely due to the Dark One's touch and/or the unraveling of the Pattern.

This page talks about it:: http://wotfaq.dragonmount.com/node/108

 

Good find mb; but I think this one is a bit outdated. While it very likely could be the DO, I think it's more related to Rand's link with the land, and the fact that he was almost overtaken by the DO in earlier books (starting with his balefire incident with Moridin in aCoS and ending with VoG in TGS).

[Terez]

I think the wards in the Tower were failing because of the unraveling Pattern. We haven't seen it with saidin wards because we don't know of any long-term (supposedly permanent) saidin wards, but if you want an example, there were the problems with the wards on Callandor in TPOD. The issue with that, though, is that it's a lot earlier than the failing saidar wards are mentioned. The Pattern falling apart is probably due to balefire being used in large amounts offscreen.

 

The failed Keepings in the rebel Aes Sedai camp, on the other hand, are probably due to Dark Rand and his link with the land.

[mb]

Path of Daggers Callandor, Rand was using it near Ebou Dar. The Bowl of Winds event effected both halves of the Source.

[Terez]

I'm talking about when Narishma retrieved it from the Stone (nowhere near Ebou Dar).

[PhoenixUK]

I'm talking about when Narishma retrieved it from the Stone (nowhere near Ebou Dar).

i remember someone theorising that in fact a forsaken, unable to take callandor, had instead added extra wards in the hope of harming rand when he went to reclaim callandor. But maybe your idea makes more sense. Certainly those wards in Tear shouldn't have been affected by the Ebou Dar instability from the bowl of the winds

[Terez]

I'm talking about when Narishma retrieved it from the Stone (nowhere near Ebou Dar).

i remember someone theorising that in fact a forsaken, unable to take callandor, had instead added extra wards in the hope of harming rand when he went to reclaim callandor.

I doubt any of the Forsaken would have been able to pull that off aside from Moridin (who might be able to manipulate wards attuned to Rand because of their link).

[PhoenixUK]

why? aren't the forsaken supposed to be incredibly skilled with using the Power in ways that current users have never dreamed of? ALthough tbh this sounds more and more like rubbish, they never seem to do anything particularly amazing. They had Travelling and Compulsion, but I can't think of anything else they did which was incredibly different to what others have done.

[Moogle]

why? aren't the forsaken supposed to be incredibly skilled with using the Power in ways that current users have never dreamed of? ALthough tbh this sounds more and more like rubbish, they never seem to do anything particularly amazing. They had Travelling and Compulsion, but I can't think of anything else they did which was incredibly different to what others have done.

 

Sadly, no. The Forsaken have had their reputations puffed up beyond belief. Pretty much only Moridin and Lanfear are worthy of their reputations (and maybe Demandred). Be'lal stood still, screaming, while an Aes Sedai sent some balefire at him, instead of, you know, shielding her, and the rest sort of just dropped dead when Rand arrived. Though, I guess Rahvin gave Rand a fight.

 

In any case, I'm still a fan of the Forsaken adding extra warding to Callandor to mess with Narishma. I doubt he would have complained for no reason that things were harder than Rand mentioned unless there was something up. Heck, a braindead Elza was able to penetrate Cadsuane's wards, don't know why Demandred couldn't have made things a bit more dangerous. Robert Jordan never, as far as I know, mentioned that putting extra wards around other wards was very difficult.