Egwene, Adelorna Bastine, and those blasted Greens

[aross]

I'm trying to understand why the Green Sitters are so very anti-Egwene after the events of the Gathering Storm. Adelorna Bastine respected Egwene enough to nominate her for Amyrlin. Rubinde saw her resist Elaida's torture. You would think she had won the Green Ajah's support.

 

Why are the Green Sitters against Egwene given all of these circumstances?

 

The more I look, the more I think that it's just literary - needing enemies to move plot. I can't see any reason in the books to explain the diametric change of stance.

 

Does anyone see something I've failed to note? Because I must admit, the Egwene parts of Towers of Midnight became a bit frustrating; and this was much of the reason.

[Duneflayer]

I don't have the books on me this second, but it is my experience that R.J. doesn't do anything for nothing.

[spoke]

I'm trying to understand why the Green Sitters are so very anti-Egwene after the events of the Gathering Storm. Adelorna Bastine respected Egwene enough to nominate her for Amyrlin. Rubinde saw her resist Elaida's torture. You would think she had won the Green Ajah's support.

 

Why are the Green Sitters against Egwene given all of these circumstances?

 

The more I look, the more I think that it's just literary - needing enemies to move plot. I can't see any reason in the books to explain the diametric change of stance.

 

Does anyone see something I've failed to note? Because I must admit, the Egwene parts of Towers of Midnight became a bit frustrating; and this was much of the reason.

 

I didn't read it that way. It seemed more that they were just frustrating not enemies. Further, it may just be that certain ajahs have animosity against each other. An example of this is Moraine in New Spring comments on the politics along the lines of yellows tend to support the blues, but will oppose the blues if the greens support. (I can't remember the exact lines, and I don't have the book available, but it was shortly after being raised).

 

But either way, I think you were blowing the 'conflict' out of proportion.

[Val Mickey]

They're probably pissed about Silviana. BTW, who are the new Green Sitters?

[randsc]

Mary-Sue needs to have enemies, but not very dangerous ones, to demonstrate her all-around awesomeness.

 

I'm not kidding, and this isn't just a shot at Egwene. That really is why. Jordan needs to set up these sorts of minor battles is order for his Mary Sue to keep winning them.

[aross]

Val Mickey, the Sitters are:

 

Red: Barasine, Raechin and Viria Connoral

Blue: Lelaine, Lyrelle, ? (Moria was Black, and executed. Can't find her replacement. Not sure if it was ever mentioned.)

Brown: Takima, Janya, Saerin

White: Saroiya, Ferane, Seaine

Yellow: Romanda, Doesine, Magla

Gray: Varilin, Andaya, Yukiri

Green: Rubinde, Faiselle, Farnah

[David Selig]

They are Aes Sedai, they have to scheme and plot all the time, they can't help themselves.

[Val Mickey]

Thanx, aross.

 

I think now that Romanda and Lelaine have pooled their resources, it's possible they've influenced all the Green Sitters. After all, Green = Blue + Yellow . I'm not sure, but IIRC, Rubinde was in Romanda's faction.

[aross]

Thank you Val Mickey.

 

I think you might be onto something... If we imagine that the Hall is divided in two right now, pro-Egwene vs. anti-Egwene, the whole thing makes sense.

 

The pro-Egwene group is outnumbered of course, but does have the Amyrlin on its side and a very loyal and effective keeper.

 

Plus Egwene appears to have most of the Tower on her side despite the machinations of the Hall. Although someone will someday have to explain to me how she went from having three ajah heads absolutely in her corner (Ferane, Suana, Adelorna) to none at all.

 

I guess the pro-Egwene group is Janya, Saerin, Seaine, Doesine, Yukiri. In other words, only the Black Ajah hunters and Janya. Ouch! Jeez, where are Teslyn and Pevara when you need a little help?????

[chuckievi]

Unless I have the names mixed up, there could be some embarrassment that leads to conflict seeing as how Egwene pretty much saved Adelorna, one of the people who should have been the best at repelling the Seanchan. Sometimes embarrassment can lead to tension etc in those types of situations.

[idiostock]

Unless I have the names mixed up, there could be some embarrassment that leads to conflict seeing as how Egwene pretty much saved Adelorna, one of the people who should have been the best at repelling the Seanchan. Sometimes embarrassment can lead to tension etc in those types of situations.

 

You're correct, Adelorna gets a PoV and thinks about how unprepared she is. Additionally, she's the first person to suggest Egwene for Amyrlin when the Ajah heads gather near the end of tGS.

[Durinax]

I think its because it is common knowledge that egwene would have chosen the green ajah. So the green take it upon themselves to make sure 'their' amyrlin isnt a total disaster by being opposition and making egwene think more. It isnt formal opposition its just a sort of opposition to inspire insight into her actions

[Guest]

Val Mickey, the Sitters are:

 

Red: Barasine, Raechin and Viria Connoral

Blue: Lelaine, Lyrelle, ? (Moria was Black, and executed. Can't find her replacement. Not sure if it was ever mentioned.)

Brown: Takima, Janya, Saerin

White: Saroiya, Ferane, Seaine

Yellow: Romanda, Doesine, Magla

Gray: Varilin, Andaya, Yukiri

Green: Rubinde, Faiselle, Farnah

 

Wouldnt Moiraine be the perfect candidate for a blue sitter?

She is young, but she has:

1. Killed a forsaken and is honored for it (be'lal)

2. Saved Rand from Lanfear, and nearly sacrificed herself for that

3. Gained some serious info from the aelfinns

4. She is the closest Aes Sedai to Rand, lets face it - shes the only one he truly trusted until she presumably died. Nyneave and Elayne have proven themselves, but im not sure he counts those as Aes Sedai, yet.

[aross]

Excellent candidate if she were a willing candidate Homasz. Moiraine doesn't like Tower politics and has avoided them assiduously. From the time of Sierin Vayu (New Spring), she has spent very little time in the Tower at all.

 

You're right of course. She is the most accomplished Blue, and one of the most accomplished sisters.

 

Meantime, I'm guessing that the third Blue Sitter is already in place. Might be fun to speculate who that might be.

 

Considering Lelaine's stranglehold on the Blue Ajah, it must be someone loyal to her... maybe Maigan?

[Guest]

as far as i know, she didnt involve herself in tower politics because her task was to secure the dragon reborn.

with the info she has now i think firstly she will meet rand, and while at the field, she will be presented with a seat of the blue ajah.

 

i think this is the way she will influence the tower into siding with rand. egwene who has much respect for moiraine will really have problems

[aross]

After re-reading the end of Towers of Midnight, I satisfied myself that Moiraine is not going to be involved in the Tower.

 

Remember Mat pointing out to Thom that he would end up back in Camelyn or Tar Valon? The two places he claimed to dread most back in The Dragon Reborn when he became Mat's companion?

 

Moiraine said, "I have never spent much of my time in Tar Valon. I think we shall enjoy traveling together Thom Merrilin. Should we survive the months to come."

 

Oh she has a job to do. A big one. I suspect she picked up clues with the Finns that will help Rand seal the Bore, or in some way win the Last Battle.

 

But Tower politics? Never before, and certainly not now.

 

I'd also point out, and I do believe this was purposeful, that Egwene was in on the kingmaking lessons that Moiraine gave to Rand in Tear, the Waste, and Cairhien. Moiraine has known from the start (Min's viewings) that Egwene was to be the Amyrlin. The lessons have been given, and learned. Moiraine would, I think, have no desire or cause to interfere with Egwene now.

 

I also do strongly suspect that the Egwene / Rand opposition will not last long in A Memory of Light. I suspect that the Field of Merrilor will be tense, but after? Teamwork.

[Guest]

After re-reading the end of Towers of Midnight, I satisfied myself that Moiraine is not going to be involved in the Tower.

 

Remember Mat pointing out to Thom that he would end up back in Camelyn or Tar Valon? The two places he claimed to dread most back in The Dragon Reborn when he became Mat's companion?

 

Moiraine said, "I have never spent much of my time in Tar Valon. I think we shall enjoy traveling together Thom Merrilin. Should we survive the months to come."

 

Oh she has a job to do. A big one. I suspect she picked up clues with the Finns that will help Rand seal the Bore, or in some way win the Last Battle.

 

But Tower politics? Never before, and certainly not now.

 

I'd also point out, and I do believe this was purposeful, that Egwene was in on the kingmaking lessons that Moiraine gave to Rand in Tear, the Waste, and Cairhien. Moiraine has known from the start (Min's viewings) that Egwene was to be the Amyrlin. The lessons have been given, and learned. Moiraine would, I think, have no desire or cause to interfere with Egwene now.

 

I also do strongly suspect that the Egwene / Rand opposition will not last long in A Memory of Light. I suspect that the Field of Merrilor will be tense, but after? Teamwork.

 

you do, as a white ajah member would say, make excellent logic. but this whole anti-rand thing egwene is doing atm, could it be due to compulsion? nyneaves skill with delving could figure that out easily. i have read this somewhere posted, possibly theoryland, that egwene might be under compulsion to sever the connection between rand/white tower

 

at the very least, i hope moiraine joins as the last blue sitter :D

[NetSlider]

If Greens are really being influenced by others it's kind of sad. I mean greens were crucial in Suan's fall and now they are also undermining another amerlyn b/c of influences from outside. Plus, the amerlyn that would be green herself if she was raised... I hope that battle ajah are not as stupid as that...and if they are, Cady will straighten them up as soon as she has time to settle them down (never thought that I would actually say these words)

[OptimusPrime]

I got the impression that the Greens might not approve of Egwene because she was willing to use Novices in battle, I think that would kind of be like going against company policy, and if anyone had the right to be pissed off about that Id say it would be the Greens.

[Shalon Casbin]

In my opinion the Green Ajah is probably mad because Egwene has been so insistent that it is their Ajah she would have joined, she implies she's made it clear enough to expect the other Aes Sedai to know. Is it not customary after swearing oaths to ASK to be accepted into the Ajah which you want? Perhaps it's the nerve of her to assume they would welcome her, without testing or asking; it'd be interesting if we got to see Egwene return to regular Aes Sedai and how she would declare an Ajah officially; but either way I think we'll see it conclude quickly in the next book, or it may be Aes Sedai being Aes Sedai and never really be explained.

 

 

As for Moraine becoming a Sitter; as of the latest book, ToM she is too weak in the One Power to become a Sitter. They are among the strongest in the OP of the Ajah, along with being dedicated, known well, and exemplary at their abilities. Aes Sedai measure things by One Power strength, unlike the Age of the Kin, dedication to duty of the Windfinders, or honor of the Wise Ones. She must use a ter'angreal to be able to come near what she used to be in OP strength, and without it she is so weak she may not have ever been given the chance to test for Aes Sedai; given by a quote from Moraine to Thom.