Who were the ''Left Hand'' and the ''Right Hand'' that 'Falter' ?

[The Fisher King]

I never quite figured this out. Something is tickling at my memory that - at the time - I had presumed the ''Hands'' were Mat and Perrin and that them ''Faltering'' referenced the significant trials they each endured in that book...however, events in the series since COT have cast massive amounts of doubt on this theory, imo.

 

 

- Fish

[yoniy0]

Must the hands be actual people, rather than a pure metaphor?

[The Fisher King]

Must the hands be actual people, rather than a pure metaphor?

 

Errr, Yon, ol buddy - the fact of the reference alluding to actual people WOULD be a metaphor (in the strictest sense of the word) lol ;-)

 

Like I said, I thought years ago that the 'Hands' were Mat and Perrin but, sadly, that theory is long-since smashed to smithereens :(

 

 

 

- Fish

[yoniy0]

So I'm a science major. Shoot me

You know what I meant, though, right?

[The Fisher King]

So I'm a science major. Shoot me

You know what I meant, though, right?

 

I do. I do know what you meant, lol.

 

And I see your point...What if the Left Hand was referring to the White Tower and the Right Hand was the Black Tower, or something like that?

 

Or, it could have meant Shadar Haran, though he didn't exactly ''Falter'' in COT, plus it would have been a bit obvious for Jordan, who once was aghast at the suggestion that ''DEATH taking Asmodean'' referred to Moridin.

 

 

 

- Fish

[Finnssss22]

The exact line is

And it shall come to pass, in the days when the Dark Hunt rides, when the right hand falters and the left hand strays, that mankind shall come to the Crossroads of Twilight and all that is, all that was, and all that will be shall balance on the point of a sword, while the winds of the Shadow grow.

 

I always took it as Mat and Perrin.

Mat straying, not doing much while he traveled with the show and Perrin faltering by putting Faile's safety ahead of all else.

[Goldstar]

I think Finness is right. Mat strayed, though it could've also been related to Tuon and his relation to the Seanchan. Perrin faltered by failing to do what Rand told him to about Masema and going after Faile.

[Simo]

I think it has more to do with Rands confrontation with Semirhage, Rand didn't seize the chance to stop Semi, he could have zapped her but he couldn't & by trying to protect Min he lost his left hand.

[Luckers]

I also believe that it is Mat and Perrin, though I remember a rather persuasive argument made by someone (RobertAlexWillis???) about it being Osan'gar and Aran'gar--Osan'gar could be said to have just faltered in dying, and Aran'gar was soon to stray in letting herself be driven out.

 

The problem, aside from the faltering and straying happening outside of CoT, is that aran'gar and osen'gar do not mean 'left/right hand' they are the names for blades held in the left or right hands. The hands themselves are the Dark Ones and he neither falter nor strays--that we know of. :)

 

So yes, Mat and Perrin are the go, I think.

[Twitchy]

I always figured it was about Rand's hand themselves. Looking at how little he's in the book, doesn't really help, yeah, but there's already been references with one hand to destroy and the other to build.

[Ashandarei]

Like I said, I thought years ago that the 'Hands' were Mat and Perrin but, sadly, that theory is long-since smashed to smithereens :(

 

Is there a link to the smashing of this theory? I wanted to see the evidence against it. Because as it stands now, I don't really see why it's so certain that it wasn't Perrin/Mat. I'm not saying the Perrin/Mat thing is rock-solid either, just that it's also not conclusively false... at least without whatever evidence the theory you mentioned provides.

[The Fisher King]

A Few Comments:

 

Finesse...Goldstar: You both have a theory I can get behind. I used to think that it had a bigger and broader meaning that just being about Mat and Perrin, but the way you two express the ''Straying'' part and my own recent recollection that somewhere in one of the books they are referred to as the ''legs on the tripod upn which Rand stands'' and that if one of them falls, the whole thing comes tumbling down.

 

Simo: Thats a really cool theory, but I don't think thats it. But, you never know!

 

Luckers: I remember that!!! ... I think it WAS RAW...I think I saw it recently too. Maybe in the ''Structured'' Forum? Can't remember.

 

Twitchy: I like your theory too because it sounds cool. I still think what Finesse and Goldstar were saying is the most logical, but, as I said to Simo, you never know with WOT!

 

Ashandarei: Checkout what i said to Finesse and Goldstar!

 

 

- Fish

[Muad Cheade]

I also believe that it is Mat and Perrin, though I remember a rather persuasive argument made by someone (RobertAlexWillis???) about it being Osan'gar and Aran'gar--Osan'gar could be said to have just faltered in dying, and Aran'gar was soon to stray in letting herself be driven out.

 

The problem, aside from the faltering and straying happening outside of CoT, is that aran'gar and osen'gar do not mean 'left/right hand' they are the names for blades held in the left or right hands. The hands themselves are the Dark Ones and he neither falter nor strays--that we know of. :)

 

So yes, Mat and Perrin are the go, I think.

I do believe that it is a reference to Osan'gar and Aran'gar. It makes the most sense.

[Agitel]

The most logical explanation is Mat and Perrin. Neither were doing what they should have been doing, and the book itself mostly focused on them and the sort of stand-still their dallies caused in the world. Osan'gar is dead by this book and Aran'gar doesn't do anything.

[Sleeper]

Mat and Perrin make the most sense.

[GrandpaG]

Hi, Twitch! Long time no see!

 

When I read the title of this topic, Davram Bashere and Logain immediately popped into my brain for some unknown reason. I didn't remember the quote. I agree that RJ would not have made it direct. He liked to hide stuff. Mat and Perrin are almost too obvious. Could be the Seanchan on the left and the Aiel on the right? Or maybe Nynaeve is Rand's right hand and Min is his left? That, too, is too specific. I just don't know.

 

The prophecy is purposely written to be vague and general. It refers to "mankind in general".

[OptimusPrime]

The exact line is

And it shall come to pass, in the days when the Dark Hunt rides, when the right hand falters and the left hand strays, that mankind shall come to the Crossroads of Twilight and all that is, all that was, and all that will be shall balance on the point of a sword, while the winds of the Shadow grow.

 

I always took it as Mat and Perrin.

Mat straying, not doing much while he traveled with the show and Perrin faltering by putting Faile's safety ahead of all else.

 

This.

 

What exactly has Mat been doing since the Illian assault? Nothing to do with Rands plans.

 

What has Perrin been doing? Not much, sorting out small increases in chaos, and being on the verge of forsaking the Light.

[Gathering Storman Norman]

This is my first post here, but I've lurked for a long time.

 

The Mat and Perrin theory is a good one, but I'm with the post that said it referred to the White and Black Towers.

 

During the time that quote appeared in the series the White Tower was definitely faltering, with it being split and all.

 

The Black Tower was definitely straying, with everything Taime is doing.

 

However, M&P make sense and I guess any number of other things could make sense too!