Seanchan = USA? (another question, not just their accent)

[RembrandtQ.Einstein]

lol @ america haters.  jealous much?....   XD

 

Jealous of what?

[mossman87]

lol @ america haters.  jealous much?....   XD

 

Jealous of what?

 

Our religious fanatics.

[cortezthekiller]

Black Tower = Waffen SS

 

???  Yikes!

 

Is there more to that analogy than the black uniforms?  I suppose the Asha'man swear to one man, much like the SS swore to Hitler, but I would have a very hard time believing that RJ intended a connection between the Black Tower/Asha'man and Schutzstaffel/The Nazi Party.

 

I could be wrong, but that one just seems like quite a stretch.

 

I agree with you on the loose analogies of some of the other nations though.

 

I always like to pretend that Ebou Dar was loosely based on New Orleans because the of "any reason to celebrate" that Mat noted in one of the books, and the general atmosphere of the place.  But I'm from New Orleans, so it's likely I placed that analogy myself.

[Majsju]

Ebou Dar mostly draws from Venice, but also a bit from Rome.

http://www.darkfriends.net/wheel/3_sources/3.14_countries.html

[cortezthekiller]

Yeah, I've seen that.

 

Like I said, I just like to pretend that it's loosely based on New Orleans.  :P

 

Nola is, after all, pretty European compared to the rest of the US.

[Manetheren Lord]

 

 

And yes, the Seanchan (as well as the Aiel) reminds me of japanese samurai,  who makes seppuku when dishonored, have a great deal of customs related with honor, duty, and so.

 

The Aiel are based off of many Native Americans; most noteably they are based off of the Pueblo Indians. However the Gai'shain (to defeat an opponent without killing them is much more honorable and taking them for a year and a day) and safety within a Wise One's tent is bases off of I believe the Iroquois Indians.

[Red Hand Man]

I see america as the Whitecloaks, their use of torture, and murder of innocent civilians in the name of the light(democracy) and their war on the shadow(terrorism), they are both generaly hated or at least disliked by the population of the world, and they think they know best and their system is best and they invade countries to assert their power(whitecloak war/south america, vietnam, iraq)

 

I always saw the Whitecloaks as the Catholic Church and Inquisition. It isn't a nation or state so much as an ideology that happens to be stationed in a particular area. Not the modern day Catholic Church, though.

 

I don't really think there is any analogue of the United States in the Wheel of Time verse.

 

There most certainly is!  Have you not heard the tale of Mosc and Merc?  :)

[aunt_pol]

Sorry, I know I'm prolonging the thing here, but I kind of have to correct Demiandre. The Union Jack has no cross to represent Ireland: it's England, Scotland and Wales. Only. Grrr... ;)

[Maclir]

One of the strong points in favour of RJ and his writing of the WoT series is that unlike some other writers in the genre, he has never used the books as a thinly veiled vehicle for pushing his political views.  The only possible current theme that can really be drawn from the storyline is the danger of religious fanaticism, and even that is drawing a very long bow.

 

If you consider that one of the prime motivators of the Seanchan is "the return" - that is, returning to what they consider their historical homelands that they left centuries ago, the only people in recent history with that as part of their cultural ethos would be the Jews returning to Palestine - and that's pretty much where any comparisons start and stop.

 

Now, it's possible that RJ used that concept - a country and it's people who had been dispersed from their lands, and now capable of returning and trying to reclaim what they believe to be theirs centuries later - and extrapolated that to a completely different environment.  Just as there are inspirations drawn from other countries, other cultures, other historical examples in many areas of the story.  But thankfully, they are just that - a starting point, a jumping off inspiration for a far more complex world than propaganda for the writer's personal political views.

 

[Demiandre]

Sorry, I know I'm prolonging the thing here, but I kind of have to correct Demiandre. The Union Jack has no cross to represent Ireland: it's England, Scotland and Wales. Only. Grrr... ;)

 

No need to get angry for the moment, just wait a few seconds ;D

 

 

I couldn't find anything else than a french image, but then, it works the same... I'm really sorry aunt Pol ;)...

(As the Wales were/are a celtic people, I think they used celtic crosses, not as Ireland, England and Scotland...)

 

There most certainly is!  Have you not heard the tale of Mosc and Merc?

Yeah and Lenn who went to the moon too, no?

 

But in the people culture, it seems normal not to use your own. It's hard to make your culture seems weird, funny and/or cool. It won't make much sense for me if a french writer was using french culture for an exotic cultural people... I wouldn't see the point of it.

[Majsju]

Ok, enough with the flags. If you want to continue that discussion, take it to Debates & Discussions.

If I see it mentioned here again I will lock this thread.

[farthammer]

FLAGS

[aunt_pol]

@ Majsju - yes boss.

[DPT24]

If anything, Seanchan are more inspired by China/Soviet Union, with some Imperial Japan.  the US is most like Andor and the Two rivers.

[RembrandtQ.Einstein]

If anything, Seanchan are more inspired by China/Soviet Union, with some Imperial Japan.  the US is most like Andor and the Two rivers.

 

Two Rivers = based on the Shire, I believe.

 

Andor = Mostly based on England.

[Barid Bel Medar]

I dont think US has any place in  a medieval - just before gunpowder era.

 

Not saying that there isnt any similarities in different nations, but thers nothing really old enough (except the Native Americans) just like you cant really have a country based on Australia in a medieval/gunpowder invention era, it wouldnt be realistic.

[Fains nose]

I think a lot of people would see the Two Rivers as the place they come from, due to identifying so heavily with main characters from the Two Rivers. Americans might see the Two Rivers as America, Germans might see the Two Rivers as Germany, as an Australian i see aspects of Australia in the Two Rivers people

[Maclir]

I think a lot of people would see the Two Rivers as the place they come from, due to identifying so heavily with main characters from the Two Rivers. Americans might see the Two Rivers as America, Germans might see the Two Rivers as Germany, as an Australian i see aspects of Australia in the Two Rivers people

 

Well, as an Australian I don't generally see aspects of Australia in the Two Rivers people; that is, examples of many of the Two Rivers people could be found almost anywhere.

 

The exception is Mat -I believe many aspects of Mat's character were based on Australian servicement RJ was associated with in Vietnam. Even the name "Mat" is a contraction of the standard Aussie greeting of "mate".  But that's probably a discussion for another thread.

[aunt_pol]

I always assumed Mat was just RJ's taking Matt and altering it slightly....

[Fains nose]

youve got Mat the larikin, Perrin the tradie, the will to continue after winter night, the will to continue after the Black Saturday fires, im not saying though that there is anything uniquely Australian about the Two Rivers, just that i know i read Two Rivers people in my own accent(Australian), because i identify/care about more with people from the Two Rivers than anyone else, probably because weve been with them from the first chapter, and the main characters are from the Two Rivers.

[MikeRiley]

I was watching some documentary a few years ago on the History Channel that talked about the creating of the Gadsden flag. It's that early American one with the chopped up snake and the words "Don't Tread On Me" and "Join or Die". The idea supposedly (and I can't find this anywhere online) was that people believed a chopped up snake would die if it was not put back together before morning.

 

If anybody can find any confirmation on that myth then I'd say that or the flag itself drew inspiration for the Myrdraal's properties with not dying until morning. It is often described as snake-like too.

[TheAngryDruid]

Silly thread.

 

As others have said, R,W, & B are common colors in many flags:

 

UK (Union Jack), USA (Stars & Stripes), France, Russia, and the Netherlands being the most prominent.

 

Every continent save Africa has a R,W,&B flags.

 

Europe: UK, France, Russia, Netherlands, Serbia, Slovenia, Croatia, Czech Republic, Slovakia, Norway, Iceland, Luxembourg, Faroe Islands

 

North & Central America + Caribbean: USA, Costa Rica, Panama, Cuba, Dominican Republic, Puerto Rico.

 

South America: Chile, Paraguay

 

Asia: Thailand, Cambodia, Laos, Nepal, Philippines

 

Australia/Oceania: Australia, New Zealand

 

 

[Ozzie_aiel]

blue, red and white, drawling accents, a predeliction to warfare and battle, superior firepower and a inbuilt belief their way is better than everyone elses and they should own the world..... yup, the Seanchan are american!

[aunt_pol]

Good man, Ozzie. This thread was dying its natural death but you had to resurrect it!

[MikeRiley]

With a hateful political post that doesn't belong on a fantasy book forum. I guess he hasn't considered how it fits with the far eastern countries, but hey.. We all have an opinion on modern events and we'll tell it wherever. Right?