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RembrandtQ.Einstein

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  1. This is important- it HASN'T evolved in a bubble. If it had, then the matriarchy would have made less sense. It is a tiny speck surrounded by the expanse of Randland. And as everything surrounding it is, somewhat logically, matriarchal/misandrous, it bears reason that this somewhat insignificant town would NOT buck the trend. While the lessened reliance on physical strength makes Randland more egalitarian gender-wise, it is the extreme stigma in the current age, that is the reason that it is a misandrous society. And those overarching perceptions, backed by the weight of history, could quite easily overrun a place like Far Madding. That is my reasoning as to why it should be less matriarchal; but I don't quite think there is any need to have made it seemingly MORE misandrous than everywhere else. Not just on a political level, but permeating to the social level as well. RJ would not have made Far Madding so different without some reason. Whether these reasons justify the current state is your own opinion. But consider the presence of the Guardian as evidence that the people of Far Madding are prejudiced specifically against male channelers (with good reason). Now, of the four historical False Dragons who could channel, Raolin Darksbane, Yurian Stonebow, Davian, and Guaire Amalasan, Raolin Darksbane and Yurian Stonebow were born in Far Madding (or rather its precursors) and went on to terrorize much of Randland. This may have a caused a general mistrust of men from where they arose. It also didn't help that the most recent of the four, Guaire Amalasan, lay seige to and took Far Madding despite the presence of the Guardian. In other words, male channelers are bad. And any male can potentially be a male channeler. In Far Madding, it's personal. I thought Amalasan hailed from Darmovan?
  2. I thought the Rand obsession was solely Fain? Ever since the weaker Fain body is finally getting occupied by the Ordeth soul there seems to be a distinct lack of interest in Rand. We can see this insofar as the persona starting to call himself "Mordeth" and heading northwards to slaughter all shadowspawn. Ordeth quite possibly was the most acerbic and passionate foe of the Shadow. It would make sense that he would go on rampage against the Shadow and completely ignores Rand who is well south of the Blight.
  3. That's Gareth Bryne speaking to Siuan. Since he said King, he's obviously speaking not just for Andor, but for monarchs in general. I am not saying the monarchs are supposed to obey the Amyrlin, just that she's considered slightly above them them in therms of protocol and they are expected to make gestures showing it like calling her "Mother" and kissing her ring. Which Lord Captain Commander did so? I have my doubts and did that hearsay actually come from a credible source inside the White Cloak establishment? Or is it simply a baseless rumor? It doesn't seem to key in to anything of note. Also I have my doubts that the rather arrogant lords of Tear who do not even tolerate Aes Sedai inside their nation would genuflect much, at best possibly send a diplomatic letter to keep up civilized pretenses. Siuan who was Tairen did go speak lengths of how despised channelers were in Tear and how her relatives, father in particular, instead of being proud of her for becoming an Amyrlin were probably more ashamed than anything else. I mean the Tairens are hostile enough against Aes Sedai that merely the presence of one in neighboring Mayene risks probable cause for armed conflict and war.
  4. That's what Randland protocol demands of all rulers in Randland, not just those who are Aes Sedai. Don't be ridiculous. This is definitely not the case in Tear, Amadicia, Illian or other such nations.
  5. So...you're basically saying the same thing I said? My point was that he cannot be seen as a conqueror as he only held a small portion of Andor and didn't have the allegiance of the nobility or their forces. How so? There were still plots in Andor. And yes, the rebels' forces were up in arms in Tear but they were very docile. They merely just assembled in Haddon Mirk. Why do you think Rand let them be for so long? They remained there for until CoT when they besieged the Stone, which is a very symbolic yet militarily ineffective move. Actually, Colavere (the noble you were talking about) had nothing to do with Rand's actual kidnapping. She only received assurance that the Tower would back her if she took the Sun Throne. The Seanchan undoubtedly controlled their lands. There was no rebellion, enemy armies were crushed or repelled and nobles swore fealty to the throne. Umm...what nobles waged war against them? King Ailron and the Amadacian nobility? They were killed in battle a long time ago. King Beslan? Yes, he plotted against Tuon. Now he is one of her staunchest allies. The Whitecloaks? They were the lapdogs of the Seanchan until Galad killed Valda. Ituralde? He's a general of an enemy nation, so he would not count. That's it I think. How is it hypothetical? Dyelin told (more specifically threatened) Rand if that she would attack if his stay became an extended one. It is unlikely she wouldn't have allies in that endeavor. They didn't rebel against Gaebril because Morgase was still ruler in name although she was a puppet in reality. To rebel against Queen Morgase would be treason. By the time word had fully spread that Morgase was "dead," Rand had made his move for Caemlyn. I was addressing when you claimed that Portugal could not surrender as they were in the "sphere of influence" of Great Britain, which makes no sense as Portugal was an ally not a client state. Hanover was ruled directly by the King of Britain, yet when Napoleon took the province and created a kingdom of it, there was barely any resistance from the people or nobility as they were now allied with their previous enemies the French. Your reasoning implied they should have continued to fight as the United Kingdom was still engaged with the French. I will note, the Hanoverian did retreat to England. It was off-topic and neither here nor there. The Portuguese couldn't surrender due to their position. The British would not have tolerated it and were fighting tooth and nail in the Peninsular War. Considering they were a faction State in the British sphere it would have been treasonous. There was no resistance amongst the population?`What? I was under the impression that along with Ruhr-Germans that people from Hanover made up a sizable bulk of units such as the Lützow Free Corps, which led to further antagonizing circumstances between Prussia and Great Britain due to the latter seeing Hanoverians as their subjects. Not to mention the near constant need for martial law to be kept in place due to the irked feelings in regards to Napoleonic conscription. Or how upon the Russian arrival there was quite the walk over towards the Allied forces. Or how in the Russian campaign many conscripted Hanoverians walked/deserted over to the Prussian Army given the opportunity, a fact which was well known enough that Cossacks/Russians who captured conscripted Germans (including Hanoverians) in the Grande Armée did not execute them immediately such as they did with Frenchman, instead they gave them over to the Prussians because of the formers strong desire to often take up arms against the French. Not to mention organizations such as the Russian–German Legion which also constituted again more Germans out of French lines who walked over, deserted or were captured who fought for Imperial Russia and were payrolled by Great Britain. etc.. etc..
  6. It is never wise to put all your eggs in one basket. Also, the Seanchan could match those numbers with the damane they have in Ebou Dar. Yes, because jumping into a city in which hundreds of thousands of Seanchan just recently landed is strategic genius. Rand was whipping the Seanchan and Damane until Ebou Dar when the Seanchan were up to 200 - 500 damane and 50 thousand soldiers (all fresh from being sitting around Ebou Dar) against Rand's battle weary remaining < 50 Asha'man and 5000 odd remaining troops. I.e. it took the Seanchan 4 - 10 times odds to force the Asha'man onto the back foot. Rand made many mistakes around Ebou Dar. First and foremost was on deciding to attack Ebou Dar not adjusting his forces for facing a large army rather then hit and run raids. If Rand had sent for reinforcements (another 100 - 150 Asha'man) from the Black Tower AND the 200 strongest Wise Ones (you know the one's that other then 100 odd at Dumai's Wells have been several thousand channelers sitting on their arses doing nothing whilst the world is in peril) plus 30 - 50k of the Aiel spear carriers and he could have easily wiped the Seanchan out. Pair Wise Ones with Asha'man with spear carriers to protect them. A small group of 2 -3 channelers plus 2 - 3 bodyguards. Wise Ones to block incoming Damane weaves, Asha'man to attack. Split the force in two. Half to engage the Seanchan army (still enough Asha'man to force a standstill). Then once they 'come out to play' the other half to Travel into Ebou Dar whilst the army is in the field and capture the palace and damane kennels (with 10 Asha'man dressed like Ebou Dari to blow the Seanchan ships to bits, without any Aes Sedai handwaving to shout 'It's me! Attack me out of 100's of random people on the docks watching the ships sink!'. Of course that would have ended the Seanchan threat back in book 8, but then this thread is at least in part about how bloody awful Rand has been at using the forces at his disposal. As in all these things, story telling wins over the reality of the situation. At the time of books 9 to 11, Rand would have just killed any Seanchan if he really wanted to, then felt bad about it later. As with lots of stories, a few morals from the author get in the way of the obvious things: like (a) The Foresaken could have ganged up on Rand once it was certain he was the Dragon Reborn and kill him off. also (b) Rand could have just gone to Seanchan and start burning out and killing Damane if he'd wanted. or © Elaida could have just had Egwene killed off quietly and claimed it was a mamber of the Black Ajah, then killed a few of her enemies so saying she'd rooted them out. There are lots of things that happen in books that might not happen in real-life. For instance, Bomber Harris destroying German cities in WW2 would not happen in Fantasy books, because he is on the "Good Guys" side. No kidding. I lost 2 maternal great-grandparents to the relentlessly bloodthirsty Allied terror bombings of civilian homes. Yet it is conveniently ignored in nigh all films or entertainment that such a thing could ever have taken place. Quite disgusting actually.
  7. ROFL. Great point. Not exactly, this is addressed when Rand is speaking with Elenia. It's still exactly what he said. The prize goes to the most inbred of the lot. What you posted there is rather immaterial and doesn't detract in the least from the validity of his statement.
  8. Interesting. I am not too versed in US politics however that is interesting. Albeit it's not the same as the US President (Andoran Queen equivalent) being a priest it's intriguing nonetheless.
  9. That doesn't exactly make sense. Portugal could have surrendered regardless. By your reasoning, no nation during the Napoleonic Era should have sued for peace as the British Empire still always fought (they were the dominant political and economic power). There are also the examples of the rulers of Saxony and Bavaria who broke with Prussia and Austria to become kings under Napoleon. Also, the Electorate of Hanover (which was in a personal union with the United Kingdom) was conquered and then made into the Kingdom of Westphalia ruled by Napoleon's brother. This was accepted by the nobility. The army was pretty much the only group that actually did something and they just retreated to England. I'm not sure how you got that from me saying "Rand taking Caemlyn did not mean he had Andor, let alone the nation's allegiance. If he had remained long enough, a rebellion would have occurred as it did in Tear and Cairhien. And yes, it was necessary that Elayne win the throne by her own. Rand saying he was "giving the throne to her didn't help."" Haha. I do love that series. It's been a while though. This has gotten way off topic, but the main point is that it was necessary for Elayne to attain the throne by herself in order to have legitimacy. Merely showing up and using the troops Rand had left would just show her as being his puppet. Uhhhhh. I fail to see your point with the Electorate. So far as I am aware the House of Hanover never surrendered. However the territory being overrun by the French, the Oberbefehlshaber (Lieutenant-General) Johann Ludwig von Wallmoden-Gimborn merely surrendered his army at the Convention of Artlenburg after his cause was lost. So far as I am aware George III King of Britain and head of House Hanover never surrendered to Napoleon nor did he recognize the French annexation of his lands in Germany. Especially considering how after Napoleon was defeated King George gave Hanover to his fifth son Ernest Augustus I. ;p
  10. I disagree with your interpretation. Read her chapters since she was imprisoned in the Tower, and you might find a different Egwene. One that understands true leadership. Before that, yes. She was still a child, though quite skillful at manipulation. But most children eventually grow up, as she did. Again, I disagree. There are pitfalls, I won't go as far as denying that, but they are certainly avoidable. Both women are quite intelligent, and able to differentiate between AS business and Andor's. Where Elayne acts as AS, Egwene's within her rights to command her. But where she acts as Queen, her independence can still be maintained. Since Egwene isn't inviting the entire Tower to the meeting at the Field of Merrilor, one has to deduce that Elayne presence there is as Queen of Andor, hence she's free to side with Rand if she so wishes (that's a different story altogether, naturally. So far she seems as put off by the idea of breaking the Seals as Egwene). What you're saying sounds reasonable. However this is the legal and political realm we are speaking about. If Elayne chooses to become Aes Sedai and not renounce her rule over her lands we end up with Andor-Cairhien effectively becoming puppet States of Tar Valon. Any direct order of Egwene who is Amyrlin must be followed by Elayne. Elayne refusing to follow the order would constitute disobedience towards the White Tower and following the order would mean subjugating the subjects of her nation to servitude towards the whims of the White Tower. The wisest, smartest and politically advantageous decision would be for Elayne to renounce all affiliations to the White Tower and defrock herself form the Aes Sedai order. I thought we finished that business about chains of command, seperation of stations and all that in Perrins thread. That said, there are no legal requirements for an As to obey the amyrlin seat - if there were, there would be absolutely nothing to sniff at with Elaidas suggestion that that be added as a 4th oath - further, we have seen demonstrated, again and again, that AS operate based on their own internal power in their respective ajah's. Elayne will be quite high ranking in whichever Ajah she ends up in (green unless something really weird happens), and the internal leadership of the Ajah is the only one where you really obey - and even then there are very clear limitations on what one As can ask of another. Remember also the tradition stronger than law that you do not interfere in the business of another AS. Lastly, the reason there have not been AS queens for quite a while, this has had nothing to do with becoming puppet states, but because of public mistrust of AS motives. And to return to the priests as politicians - europe does not have such a rule generally at least - Scandinavia I can guarantee does not have it (in both Sweden, Norway and Denmark there are priests elected to the respective parliaments, Denmark even has a priest serving as a minister - though they do not practise as priests that is purely a practical matter as they are too busy tending their jobs as MP's / minister's to be the head of a congregation. Could you please provide sources for your claim? (you have a bad habit of making claims, and asking people that disagree with you for sources, without having provided any of your own) Is Scandinavia Roman Catholic and possesses a central theocratic figure such as an Amyrlin/Pope? If not, it's entirely immaterial. So far as I am aware due to the structure of the RCC there are no priests which can take political positions without recanting their oaths.
  11. Crudely worded, but an amazingly accurate summary of the entire thread.
  12. Lisbon is also a silly example. They, the Portuguese, couldn't legally surrender since they were in the British sphere of influence with Britain being the Great Power serving as the war leader for their faction. It's the same reason why in Napoleon's drive East many German States despite being entirely occupied and overrun could not surrender until Prussia their sphere leader terminated the war. It has as good as no correlation to the situation at hand. Or are you implying that Andor is in fact a client state to a greater power under whose sphere of influence it resides? I was always under the impression that Andor was a powerful autonomous nation serving as a Great Power in terms of diplomatic status. I agree with you on the Andor stuff, mostly, however... You're confusing Europa Universalis with history. Europa what?
  13. Lisbon is also a silly example. They, the Portuguese, couldn't legally surrender since they were in the British sphere of influence with Britain being the Great Power serving as the war leader for their faction. It's the same reason why in Napoleon's drive East many German States despite being entirely occupied and overrun could not surrender until Prussia their sphere leader terminated the war. It has as good as no correlation to the situation at hand. Or are you implying that Andor is in fact a client state to a greater power under whose sphere of influence it resides? I was always under the impression that Andor was a powerful autonomous nation serving as a Great Power in terms of diplomatic status.
  14. So you can channel the TP to an amount that a normal channeler with the OP could only outdue with the Choedan Kal?
  15. Evict lol She kindly asked them borderline begged them to leave. Seeing that she is the lover of their commander they agreed and camped outside the walls inhibiting Elayne's enemies even more by preventing them from doing a complete encirclement without disrupting the Aiel/Dragon camps.
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