Forsaken Fates

[mb]

I am about to list deaths of the Forsaken; and also other things that concern their fates.  11 through 15 I am not entirely certain if the respective events are in the right order.

 

1.  Balthamel killed by the Green Man near Eye of the World.

2.  Aginor killed by overusing the One Power at Eye of the World.

3.  Belal killed by Moiraine with balefire in Stone of Tear.

4.  Ishamael killed by Rand with Callandor in Stone of Tear.

5.  Asmodean captured by Rand in Rhuidean.

6.  Moghedien captured by Nynaeve in Tel'aran'rhiod.

7.  Lanfear falling trough the Eelfinn door with Moiraine at Cairhien.

8.  Rahvin killed by Rand with balefire in Caemlyn.

9.  Asmodean killed in Caemlyn, likely by Graendal.

10.  Aginor and Balthamel resurrected as Osangar and Arangar respectively.

11.  Lanfear returning as Cyndane.

12.  Ishamael resurrected as Moridin.

13.  Moghedien rescued by Arangar.

14.  Moridin mindtrapping Moghedien & Cyndane

15.  Sammael killed in Shadar Logoth by Mashadar.

16.  Osangar killed near Shadar Logoth by Elza with Callandor.

17.  Semirhage captured by Rand's companions in Altara; this one comes from the Encyclopaedia site, not from actual reading.

 

Some info about where some of them are::

Graendal: In Arad Doman.

Mesaana: In the White Tower.

 

This thread is to discuss likely fates of each of the alive Forsaken.

 

[stapes2007]

13.  Moghedien rescued by Aginor.

This was actually Balthamel (Aran'gar)

[Arath Faringal]

17.  Semirhage captured by Rand in Altara;

 

Eh ... wouldn't exactly give Rand credit for that capture.  He didn't really do much.  Other than provide a target for Semirhage :P

 

Should add to the list that Mesanna was severly punished by Shadar Haran.

[Cockta]

Can someone make a shor list of the Forsaken that are alive today?

[Jethro]

Moridin

Cyndane

Osan'gar

Aran'gar

Demandred

Mesaana

Moghedien

Graendal

Semirhage

 

Rahvin, Sammael, Bel'al and Asmodean havent been reincarnated so theres only nine left

[Swigaro]

Osan'gar is dead, killed by Elza at the cleansing and unlikely to return at this point.  He shouldn't appear on the list of remaining Forsaken. 

 

One can make an argument that Alviaran, and possibly Taim should be included on this list too.  We see SH put a lesser version of the Mark on Alviaran, and there is a pile of evidance that Taim might be a full fledged Forsaken too...

[GrandpaG]

Has it been confirmed that Sammael was in fact killed?

 

As I remember reading it, Rand glanced away for a split second and when he looked back Sammy was gone...unless my feeble old brain is letting me down once again.  :-[

[Majsju]

Osan'gar died in WH, and since that was the second time he died, I think his chances of a second recycling are pretty small, so make that eight left.

 

Edit: Ninja'd by Swig >:(

 

Taim is a highly likely candidate for being the first 3rd Age chosen. Alviarin is not, the mark SH gave her is not a light version of the Chosen mark, it merely marks her as being "owned" by the DO.

[Mik]

Can someone make a shor list of the Forsaken that are alive today?

Moridin, Cyndane, Osan'gar (buzzer), Aran'gar, Demandred, Mesaana, Moghedien, Graendal, Semirhage

 

Rahvin, Sammael, Bel'al and Asmodean havent been reincarnated so theres only nine left

Osan'gar is already 'kaput' (WH, cleansing), so eight Chosen left, of which seven are truly living in my opinion.

 

Can I state -for the record- that I highly doubt Moridin is truly living, in the sense that humans do.

 

I mean, back when Osan'gar was still picking his nose in the Black Tower & Sammael wasn't 'toast' yet, we have Moridin thinking that "only nine people living even remembered the game [sha'rah]. He had been a master of it."

 

If anyone can know how many people living are around to know the game (Chosen), it's the Nae'Blis (there were 10 Chosen left). If anyone can tell if Moridin is alive or not, it's Moridin -Death- himself...

 

All the other theories about that comment aside, I don't think anyone ever thought about it this way. Oh well..

 

*ducks into the shadows*

 

 

Edit:

What the..!?!? Arrghh.. ninja'd by Maj, Paps & Swiggy!  :o

[Swigaro]

Has it been confirmed that Sammael was in fact killed?

 

As I remember reading it, Rand glanced away for a split second and when he looked back Sammy was gone...unless my feeble old brain is letting me down once again.  :-[

 

I believe RJ was quoted as saying, "Sammael is toast."  It is fairly clear he is gone.

 

Osan'gar died in WH, and since that was the second time he died, I think his chances of a second recycling are pretty small, so make that eight left.

 

Edit: Ninja'd by Swig >:(

 

Taim is a highly likely candidate for being the first 3rd Age chosen. Alviarin is not, the mark SH gave her is not a light version of the Chosen mark, it merely marks her as being "owned" by the DO.

 

Too true, Majsju.  I wondered if perhaps Alviarin might be a sort of Junior Forsaken, but I think your take is much more plausible. 

[Majsju]

Too true, Majsju.  I wondered if perhaps Alviarin might be a sort of Junior Forsaken, but I think your take is much more plausible. 

 

More than plausible, it is a fact, since RJ adressed this directly.

And while he did not state the reason for SH doing this, I think it is a fair guess that the main reason was to keep Mesaana from killing her.

[Cockta]

So the maining Forsaken are, what?

[Majsju]

So the maining Forsaken are, what?

 

The list Jethro made, minus Osan'gar.

Whether or not Taim is a 3rd Age Chosen remains to be 100% confirmed, but he would of course still not be a remaining Chosen, but a new one.

[mb]

13.  Moghedien rescued by Aginor.

This was actually Balthamel (Aran'gar)

 

I did mean Arangar; edited it in the list.

 

 

Should add to the list that Mesanna was severly punished by Shadar Haran.

 

Here is a modified list::

 

1.  Balthamel killed by the Green Man near Eye of the World.

2.  Aginor killed by overusing the One Power at Eye of the World.

3.  Belal killed by Moiraine with balefire in Stone of Tear.

4.  Ishamael killed by Rand with Callandor in Stone of Tear.

5.  Asmodean captured by Rand in Rhuidean.

6.  Moghedien captured by Nynaeve in Tel'aran'rhiod.

7.  Lanfear falling trough the Eelfinn door with Moiraine at Cairhien.

8.  Rahvin killed by Rand with balefire in Caemlyn.

9.  Asmodean killed in Caemlyn, likely by Graendal.

10.  Aginor and Balthamel resurrected as Osangar and Arangar respectively.

11.  Ishamael resurrected as Moridin.

12.  Moghedien rescued by Arangar.

13.  Lanfear returning as Cyndane.

14.  Moridin mindtrapping Moghedien & Cyndane.

15.  Sammael killed in Shadar Logoth by Mashadar.

16.  Osangar killed near Shadar Logoth by Elza with Callandor.

17.  Mesaana punished by Shadar Haran for not participating at the Cleansing.

18.  Semirhage captured by Rand's companions in Altara.

 

Last 2 I found out at the Encyclopaedia site.  Still not sure about the order in 11 through 15.

 

[balefireruinssteaks]

was Graendal punished? (17)

 

I thought she was at the Cleansing.  Didn't she fight Verin's circle?

[Majsju]

Yes, Graendal was at the Cleansing. Mesaana and Moridin were the only two forsaken not present, and Mesaana got punished for it by SH in COT.

[mb]

I modified the step about Shadar Haran punishing; and also re-ordered some of the steps.

 

[mb]

From one of Egwene's dreams (Shadow Rising Chapter 11), I think Perrin would fight Moridin at some point with help from wolves; maybe even kill Moridin.  Moghedien and Cyndane might become involved in this.  This might be the second time Rand would need Perrin around.

 

From Rand's troops in Arad Doman, I guess Graendal would be discovered by them and then either be captured by them or she doing a gateway to some place then be captured anyway likely by Ashaman.

 

Arangar & Mesaana I would guess would become captured by Aes Sedia, maybe by the rebels.

 

[Thor]

I always thought that the second time Rand would need Perrin is to stop the crazy Prophet (in alliance with Seanchan) from putting the male adam on Rand.  Since it is said that Perrin is there to stop female channelers from hurting Rand.

[Jethro]

I assumed Perrins second time would be when Rand battles the Dark One in AMoL. I think Mat and Perrin both have to be with Rand so their Ta'verenism will benefit the most

[Alderthal]

Current Forsaken:-

 

Naeblis - Moridin (most probably Ishmael/Ba'alzamon reincarnated. -Staying at/near Shayol Ghul

Cyndane(Lanfear) - is owned by Moridin. - Probably with Moridin.

Moghedien - is owned by Moridin. - Probably with Moridin.

Graendal - lastly seen in Arad Doman.

Mesaana - Last seen at the WT. Currently in disfavor with Moridin.

Demandred - Alive, whereabouts unknown, little is known about him.

Semirhage - Alive, was recently in Seandar/Ebou Dar, captured by Rand and Co.

Aran'gar(Balthamel) - Alive, was recently with the rebel AS, current whereabouts unknown.

 

Dead Forsaken:-

Sammael - Mashadar ate him.

Asmodean - probably balefired in Caemlyn castle, killer unknown.

Rahvin - Balefired in Caemlyn.

Be'lal - Balefired in Tear by Moiraine.

Osan'gar (Aginor) - Killed by Elza during the cleansing of Saidin.

 

New Forsaken (maybe):-

Taim?

I think Aran'gar commented on there being more seats than there were forsaken during the last forsaken meeting where Moridin tells them to kill Perrin and Mat (book 11). I think he mentioned 2 extra seats. So either Sammael is coming back, or there's another forsaken up and coming.

[mb]

I am not sure if any 3rd age person would be made Forsaken.

The extra chairs I think might have been because of mistaking some of the dead forsaken of being alive.

 

Taim cannot be a Forsaken since Demandred could be the only one that could fit.

Besides Robert Jordan's words, the "Kill Rand" order proves that Taim is not Demandred.

The other male Forsaken cannot fit since they were killed when Taim was elsewhere.  (Ishamel & Belal killed in Tear while Taim was in Saldaea; Taim might have been in Saldaea while Aginor and Balthamel were killed near Eye of the World.  Rahvin and Asmodean killed while Taim was missing.  Sammael killed in Shadar Logoth while Taim was at the Black Tower or while Taim doing recruiting.)

The female Forsaken cannot fit since Taim cannot touch saidar and since Taim does not have a female's body.

 

[Cockta]

Thanks guys, this helped a lot!