You're In Good Hands: The Beau Tomteer Law Firm Mafia GAME THREAD

[Cass]

 

1 hour ago, Clovdyx said:

 

That doesn't sound like me.

 

What's your plan for today?

 

I have plan?? Essentially try and keep up, watch and re-read/ISO all the peoples and hopefully feel enough gut stirring to read some at least almost solidly Town/Scum. I need to solidly read everyone in ISO maybe to get a feel for gut/tone  /shrug Iunno I always get lost on D2.

 

I know what I'm watching for with Dice/Nyn at least, not so much anyone else. 

 

If you mean rest of today today/ tonight... leave the spot I'm currently sitting in so I can stop shivering in the cold and being approached by randoms coming over for a chat/ get home to the fam ❤️ . 

 

Heads up all I'm working day shifts the next 2 days and staying o/n with a friend in between. EoD falls half way through shift 2 so I'll be here when I can but I'll be buggered and availability likely won't be great.

[darc-star]

8 hours ago, Clovdyx said:

 

Why Cass?  I had Darc/Hallia and Dice/Hallia as unlikely teammates, with less confidence on Dice/Hallia.  I'll have to relook on exactly what he said about her, but I do remember the tone thing being brought up.  

 

You think Lenlo looks good because of Hallia's treatment?  I didn't have a pairing for them in my notes (in either direction), but i could see where Mafia!Hallia tries to sneak a read on a teammate for really no reason like that.  Especially someone that's kind of lower volume and might not get a lot of control in the thread.  

 

The only person I thought had overt teammate equity with Hallia was Kat.  I noted that after Kat said she wasn't interested in lynching AJ or me - which I thought was deserved - or Nyn and Hallia.

 

what are your thoughts on kat aside from this?

 

and does scum!chris keep notes like this?

is it bad that i wanna read you town? or am i being pocketed?

 

7 hours ago, dicetosser1 said:

 

red is a good point. However i refuse to clear you on it. First thought i had on trips flip was you darc or pengy. No one else knows her well enuff to pick up on a cop hint  (i didnt remember if shed seer peeked or not at that time)

 

second thought i have is that ure a sneaky so and so and could be doing all this as scum. its definetly in ure range. im leaning town just   being stubborn i guess and not locking you in

 

i think tripped was pretty clear with her seer read (unless ive mixed her up with someone else), iirc she was one of the first, which made me panic because id forgotten that it was a thing, and i had nobody (other than her) that i could try to seer cover with >.<

 

doesnt really take someone who knows her to want to kill the towniest person who had also accused a scum buddy to kill her though, lol

but yea, scum!chris would probably make that kill, i just dont think that hes the only person who would

 

4 hours ago, Clovdyx said:

Does anybody have a reason I shouldn't vote Darcstar today?  

 

*raises hand*

i have many reasons

 

4 hours ago, Clovdyx said:

Nyn being town makes the AJ/Lenlo spat a hell of a lot more interesting to me, and I'll be honest - I don't know how to read either of them.  

 

I'm probably just going to stop doing rabbit hole double pre-flip associative reads and focus more on figuring stuff out based on what I already know/feel.

 

trying to work out alignments based on nyn hurts my head, feels like i could see reasons for both/neither of aj and len being scum if nyn is town or scum

but... based on len and ajs interactions... i can understand where both sides are coming from, so i think i lean t/t based on that alone

 

3 hours ago, Clovdyx said:

 

I'm going to nitpick you saying that it raises the equity a lot by saying it's entirely possible Kat or Penguins weren't around TO vote - as you said - and are still mafia.

 

If I wanted to make a stupid, unfounded guess as to how things broke down, I would guess one teammate bussed and one didn't.  Pure gut feeling I'm not going to put any stock into.  

 

Le'Shrug

 

you read my mind on the first part

 

as for the second part, i want to say that scum wouldnt have bussed on d1, but... tripped made a good argument, and hali... didnt, so... would probably depend more on the players themselves?

this setup makes it more difficult to guess

 

2 hours ago, Nynaeve said:

@darc-star

I expected him to be able to, yeah. As he usually sees right through me. Usually early on. But it is what it is.

 

The good news at least is that it's a good look for him, seeing as I'd expect him to cozy up as scum as well. So being hesitant is not too horrible.

 

i meant more in the way of "have you provided enough?", but i guess this kinda answers that too

 

have you played with him as scum before?

 

2 hours ago, Cass said:

 

...What would have made me a better accuser than Tripped, iyo

  Hide contents

Not fishing for compliments, but go on...

 AFAICT she was streaks ahead in terms of general game play, confidence, decisiveness etc etc.

 

I'll have to read over again but I'm like 99.9999% sure your initial reasoning was something along the lines of ~I will vote Cass -to break the tie and ensure an accuser~

 

 Followed by -I mean, I wouldn't have an issue with Tripped- etc

 

So the # competition vote seems wobbly?

 

Again, I'll check when I get back, but one main difference I remember was that I had declared Penguins as my likely choice at the point where I was running out of time, and my reads effectively had Halli and Nyn as minor pings/discomforts whereas she was looking more pointedly at Hallia/BWN/Nyn?

 

from the last part, you think he voted you because he wanted penguin lynched more?

 

2 hours ago, Clovdyx said:

If anybody wants to weigh in on Lenlo/AJ, I'd love to hear it.  I don't see a world where they're ever mafia together; I see no reason they can't both be town.  And tbh the more I think about it, the more I'm warming up to the idea that AJ could be mafia.

 

Lenlo's push didn't look bad at me, and I've said it before - I thought it was really damn townie of him to just put it out there and try to make something happen.  He seemed aware that he MIGHT be wrong and was willing to deal with that in exchange for having some progress.  I'm not going to wifom myself on whether Mafia!Lenlo gets stuck in an AJ tunnel, but I don't hate what he's said about it at all.

 

AJ felt like he was stretching with the associative read a bit.  I don't expect Town!AJ to say "Lenlo looks good and I look bad if she's mafia", but I don't know that I'd default to "the person that wanted me to consider lynching mafia is probably her teammate."  Beyond that, that 'no' vote sticks out to me.  I'll re-read AJ's D1 to see if it fits with what he said.  I'm not ready to condemn him for that, but I'd also be lying if I said it didn't stick out like a sore thumb.  Darc's point about it being more townie than abstaining probably has ~some merit, but... meh...

 

think i might have answered this earlier on, so... moving on

 

1 hour ago, Cass said:

 

Do you mean wrt

 

"Darthe could be fun/interesting in either position of the courtroom, if he shows up, I'll leave it up to him.

 

Kat - Isn't so much in my WTL as much as I don't think she's a bad vote for either position in this set-up because I really want to see more. I've worded that terribly."

 

?

 

Darthe was cos he deserved/ deserves pressure (don't care that he's clear!) to contribute more thoughts,  but I also had him posed as my peek so couldn't make it too blunt. At that point I was petrified that with 2 peeks on him he'd possibly coast by on SHC.

 

Kat - like I said,  worded terribly but she isn't/wasn't necessarily Scummy enough for me to be Scum-reading her but I hadnt seen anything that would make me fight anyone for accusing her/I would've liked to hear what she'd say in either position.

 

Neither of them would've been my first preference for either - they were essentially nulls with more advantages to hearing more - if it happened so be it/see what shakes out - IMO it's not so much 'controlling' the vote - a lynch isn't automatic, it depends on the validity and feel of the case put forward. 

 

Hope that makes sense. 

 

thats exactly what i mean, yea

 

and i might argue that saying that your peek is ~ok as somebody to be accused is less than believable, but i guess it is what it is, lol

 

i mean, i got that you were mostly saying that you wanted more from them, and i know that just because they accuse somebody doesnt mean that that person will be lynched, but...

as (i think it was) chris said, on d1 i really cant see most people deciding that a no lynch is the best thing...

and if scum was picked, it would be so easy for them to get away with accusing town, because d1

so, i was mostly wondering how you were reconciling getting information from that over choosing somebody that you were more confident with

but i guess you werent really pushing for them to be in either position, so ill leave it at that

 

1 hour ago, Cass said:

 

Because ?conscience?

 

Eg I _hate_ voting to lynch someone I'm not confident on - just for 'information'/to push someone through - #feelswrong

 

agreed

and i feel like me agreeing here should affect how i feel about abstainers, or voters, but i cant figure out how atm =/

[Kaylee]

Official Vote Count

 

Darc (1) - Clov

 

Not Voting: Darc, Dice, Lenlo, Nyn, Seph, AJ, Cass, Darthe, Kat, Penguins

 

[dicetosser1]

7 hours ago, Clovdyx said:

This means really nothing, but everytime you call Lenlo (who's a he ftr) Lenlou it makes me think of Leelou, who I wish was around more. ?

 

damn u clov!!  i was purposely not telling him til after the game cause every time i saw it it made me laff!

[dicetosser1]

@darc-star  re Hallia snark.

 

no no further thoughts.  its a fairly new thing   isnt something i consider her town tone when im figuring her out.  ive usually not liked it especially the time i was on the receiving end. 

[DontTrustThePenguins]

10 hours ago, Andrej said:

 

I'm not sure what you mean with the first point. I don't keep track of when you're awake or what. I am speaking strictly from my perception of the event that DL was looming, you missed most of D1, and right at the end you were here and talking to the one person you needed to the most (ironically). I think without that Tripped might've put you up over Hallia.

 

If you posted in the signup thread, then I didn't see it. I kinda stopped paying attention to it once it was almost filled and then took forever to run. But I will acknowledge that if you said it there then fair enough. 

 

I didn't say Hallia doesn't care as Town, not even close. I said in that position, with the noose hovering over her head, I believe she would've taken it more serious as scum vs Town.

I said I'd come back to the last point.

 

I don't remember exactly what I was going to say, but more that both sides should always be making the contribution /shrug

[dicetosser1]

@Andrej    thoughts on nyn now?

[DontTrustThePenguins]

10 hours ago, Andrej said:

 

So the two people who were calling you out (rightfully imo) for focusing on the wrong stuff were Clov, and the flipped Cop? When you talk about how it was getting blown out of proportion, and looking and who was pushing it how, that creates a pretty different narrative for yourself.

Considering the cop's peek was always a V read and she had no more information on me than anyone else in Town, you using the fact that she was looking at me (for basically being null) has nothing to do with the fact that she was the cop. It's kinda lol how you're trying that. 

 

And obviously I did enough to convince her not to put me to trial. Again, I don't get why you're so angry.

[DontTrustThePenguins]

10 hours ago, Cass said:

 

I think it's likely good for Clov, I am ~ok with it for Darc unless she's one to make a small snipe on a partner and follow up with calling it a trash read with nothing else to go on - and Tripped's comment about knowing the (town) call is a pet peeve for Darc is probably a good look?  TBH I especially wondered about Halli's 'Trash read Darc? Harsh' comment and shoulda gone with my gut there. I think she'd do that more as a genuine nod for post-game rather than blatant WW talk ITT.

 

I'm back and forth wrt AJ and Lenlo - she could've been buddying/sewing WIFOM for either. Her and AJ's response to each other seems a little more ?possi-protecting? from both sides, Lenlo could've been the same or it could've just been for WIFOM.

 

And - I don't understand the bold.

 

Do you have thoughts on anybody's play from D1 phase/pre-flip?

Darc isn't one to argue with and buss teammates. 

 

I kinda wanna know about Clov pushing Hallia now. I don't think that unless he believes he has reason too, he'd start suspicion at least on her.

 

Is the bolded her Hallia?

 

And I gave my thoughts based on memory at EoD1. I'd have to reread to remember more.

[Nynaeve]

@darc-star I've played with dice a lot of times. He's gotten pretty good at reading me. I'd like to think I read him well too. I mostly play it by feel and see if he feels forced as he tries to imitate.

[DontTrustThePenguins]

10 hours ago, Clovdyx said:

 

Tripped and I are the same person (Darc and BWN can confirm this).  So any credit one of us gets goes to the other.  Just the way these things go.

 

And it is super unlikely I would bring her up at that point in time.  If I'm mafia, there are plenty of people I can try to sway the accuser - Tripped or otherwise - into lynching.  If I'm completely honest, I don't think there was even the slightest chance somebody puts Hallia on the block before I mentioned her.  She was completely under the radar, and given her availability, I can't fault anyone for not paying much attention to her.  There's basically no universe where she's deliberately avoiding the thread.

You were kinda pushing for me for "avoiding the thread" lets be honest

[Nynaeve]

11 minutes ago, dicetosser1 said:

@Andrej    thoughts on nyn now?

 

He thinks I'm purty ?

[dicetosser1]

Just now, Nynaeve said:

 

He thinks I'm purty ?

 

truth is truth

 

but i want a different kinda thought.

[DontTrustThePenguins]

10 hours ago, dicetosser1 said:

 

red is a good point. However i refuse to clear you on it. First thought i had on trips flip was you darc or pengy. No one else knows her well enuff to pick up on a cop hint  (i didnt remember if shed seer peeked or not at that time)

 

second thought i have is that ure a sneaky so and so and could be doing all this as scum. its definetly in ure range. im leaning town just   being stubborn i guess and not locking you in

I think you have me confused with someone who pays attention ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[DontTrustThePenguins]

9 hours ago, Cass said:

 

I wanna ISO and try and get clearer thoughts, but I'm still waiting on TOWNNYN! to appear, I'm not sure on Penguin (my thoughts echo AJ's with the no posts and then last min self-pres-type talk).

 

Kat I can't read, want to hear more from. There were a couple of posts that she made that echoed my mind but ? on how to read her.

 

Seph I feeeeel like he's maybe Town but ?NFI that's just gut based on?/needs re-read.

 

AJ and Len I'm ~

@Lenlo while I'm at it - I thought you were going to vote me to break a tie? Why vote me to create one?

 

You... feel flat - kind of like Nyn, I don't see you sinking in your teeth yet. The one thing is I don't think you'd want me accuser as Scum - I do think you'd vote me/cover me either way though.

 

Clov I really don't think would bus Halli D1 unless she asked for it. My guess is he'd bolster a Scum team with frands but ?

 

 

You? Feels anywhere?

 

 

And Y to VC, I'll call you

I know Clov has no problem with bussing, he's bragged about doing it.

 

However, he's also a player that I think he's confident enough to at least leave it (rather than going straight into buss mode).

 

Was he pushing Hallia should be accused?

[dicetosser1]

8 minutes ago, DontTrustThePenguins said:

I think you have me confused with someone who pays attention ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

oh no i didnt lol  u were last on the list for a rewason pengy  lol

[DontTrustThePenguins]

9 hours ago, Clovdyx said:

 

I'm forcing myself to avoid the discussion between you two about the polygraph stuff and how he responded to people making a big deal of it (which I'm pretty sure was mainly Darc, even though I wouldn't say ANYBODY made a big deal out of it... don't care remotely enough to get into a semantics debate; if he feels it was being turned into a serious issue, I'm fine going with that).  I think he probably thinks it was meaningless and stupid for darc/me/tripped to even bring up and was genuinely annoyed about the issue in general in a way that's NAI.  So I'm giving him no credit for fighting with you, and I won't hold that specific issue against him right now

 

I liked him getting more engaged so far with actual thoughts today.  If he builds off it, I'll reassess him.  Otherwise, I'm fine with him swinging and won't be surprised to see him flip anything.

 

 

I'm not annoyed with AJ. My problem is that he seems annoyed with me basically causing Hallia to be accused. 

[DontTrustThePenguins]

8 hours ago, seph said:

Where my head is atm

Not lynching

Darthe

clov

cass

 

Dice

penguin

Darc-star

Aj-lenlo

kat/ Nynaeve

I don't get why Darc is so low on your list.

 

Also, did you get back to me from your post about asking who you thought the cop was and why?

[DontTrustThePenguins]

8 hours ago, seph said:

Lenlo could be below dice I think. 

 

Im just really having mixed feelings with aj atm ><

Moar plz.

[DontTrustThePenguins]

7 hours ago, Andrej said:

Today I think figuring out Penguins/Nyn would be my priority.

 

if Nyn is a wolf that looks bad for Lenlo for how he attacked me D1 for not wanting to lynch Nyn.

 

Seph might be an outside guy I need to re-evaluate. Seeing how Darc has come out from d1 with Hallia’s flip makes him look kinda bad (albeit could just be wrong). I wanna hear why he has Nyn/Kat where they are.

How does Seph look bad from Darc post flips?

[DontTrustThePenguins]

7 hours ago, Andrej said:

 

Considering who abstained Kat (who never plays on the weekend) Darthe (peeked villa) Cass (already explained) and Penguins (said they were gone) that raises the equity that Hallia was bussed by... a lot.

 

I know Hallia would surely encourage her teammates to vote her down in that situation, which makes Nyn intro toDay more unsettling imo.

 

And I get your POV, but all of that removes the scenario that I know I am Town and thus am evaluating the interactions of players from that perspective. Lenlo's reaction to me is something that sticks out considerably in my mind that I can't reconcile.

 

5 hours ago, darc-star said:

 

Currently 5 pages behind, but wanna move to my laptop

 

Can you explain why there are some people that you'd have been happy in either position?

Like, you think they're scummy enough that you're happy to lynch them, but you're also happy for them to control the vote?

 

Like your thoughts on dice

And Chris, lol, i agree that he probably says pretty much the same things as either alignment, which is why i can't read him

I do expect his pushes to be different though, and so far they look good

 

 

Tripped got me

It meant my read was based on a trash reason (so I'm the trash)

 

 

❤️

 

 

That's roughly what i thought, based on her reactions

She does seem to be effected by pressure, so i figured you were hoping to force her to produce some arguments

But in the end, i wanted to vote for someone that i trusted, and wasn't sure I'd be able to change my vote afterwards

 

 

Chris should never be left alive =O

Like, unless you think he's town... I'd rather win than be entertained

 

 

Chris should always be left alive

So... It's tomorrow...

 

 

Can't remember what i was gonna say here

Was probably gonna re-evaluate my read, but...

Any comments on this now, considering?

 

 

This sounds like you think it's his fault for not being able to read you yet?

Do you think he should have a good read on you at this point?

 

 

Can you explain the last section?

 

 

What made you pick tripped as your seer cover?

 

And not liking the "i didn't kill the cop" hint here

 

 

I dunno, considering just the arguments, and hali barely defending herself at all, I'd think that a no vote might be kinda towny

Abstaining less so

I explained what I meant when I was on my break but /whatever

 

I thought if Aj is scum, then if he's the type of person to complain in the scum QT, then Hallia might be more aware of his argument with Lenlo so then be aware that they were at odds with each other.

[DontTrustThePenguins]

Aj quote was me just saying "I explained the abstain and I'm not proud of it but that's what it was" but thought meh whatever no one cares.

 

Then the editor remembered it...

[DontTrustThePenguins]

5 hours ago, Cass said:

 

...What would have made me a better accuser than Tripped, iyo

  Hide contents

Not fishing for compliments, but go on...

 AFAICT she was streaks ahead in terms of general game play, confidence, decisiveness etc etc.

 

I'll have to read over again but I'm like 99.9999% sure your initial reasoning was something along the lines of ~I will vote Cass -to break the tie and ensure an accuser~

 

 Followed by -I mean, I wouldn't have an issue with Tripped- etc

 

So the # competition vote seems wobbly?

 

Again, I'll check when I get back, but one main difference I remember was that I had declared Penguins as my likely choice at the point where I was running out of time, and my reads effectively had Halli and Nyn as minor pings/discomforts whereas she was looking more pointedly at Hallia/BWN/Nyn?

Well I am Bwn lol

[DontTrustThePenguins]

5 hours ago, Cass said:

 

I find this process really awkward but think I can see your case. I disagree that partners wouldn't give each other easy Town leans early on, but you have Len confidently Town, AJ Scum.

 

Tbh I don't think Scum AJ would've been rattled by that interaction,  and Halli would probably have commented/ ignored it either way / shrug. 

 

 

 And I wonder what they'd be like as hydra.

 

This was my initial thought, FWIW  could've been the same with following Len anywhere in his endeavours. 

 

 

 

 

I lol'd, but thought they'd been pretty clear ?

 

Not so much reason, but a question - why her over you?

 

I mean, I still have #FEAROFCHRIS!!!! but your push of Halli was a little more solid. 

 

?

I'm not confident in saying Lenlo is town and Aj is scum. I even had an idea that Aj was town and it was after when it seemed like he was getting annoyed that I saved myself and so Hallia got accused instead.

 

I'm not saying that early town reads are impossible. I could be looking too much through my own eyes at things though (the way I usually play scum is "biatch you have to *earn* your town read just like everyone else here (some way or another)".

 

I will take your point though.

 

Also, I'm not awkward. I just have... unique ways of thinking  

[darc-star]

54 minutes ago, DontTrustThePenguins said:

 

I explained what I meant when I was on my break but /whatever

 

I thought if Aj is scum, then if he's the type of person to complain in the scum QT, then Hallia might be more aware of his argument with Lenlo so then be aware that they were at odds with each other.

 

yea, i got there

did say that i was 5 pages behind

there were other things there that had already been answered too

 

but while we're here, everyone itt was talking about that whole argument, and what do people make of it, etc

i remember a few people who hadnt caught up on it were also trying to piece it together by the later posts, so i dunno as it would even have needed to be in the scum chat

but then id need to check the timing of hali actually appearing itt to see if that even makes sense