RL issues and mafia

[Verbal32]

  On 6/17/2013 at 9:15 PM, WWWwombat said:

If it keeps you from posting unfunny image macros I suppose I could agree to it :P

 

Touche.

 

 

 

  On 6/17/2013 at 9:31 PM, Nolder said:

 

  On 6/17/2013 at 9:11 PM, Verbal32 said:

You just contradicted yourself, lol.  You share his view, and then say lying about RL is taboo.  You can't have it both ways.  I think I know you pretty well as a mafia player by now, and I'd say your 2nd statement reflects the way you feel, and the 1st was simply you being contrary (as you like to be sometimes) ;-)

 

 

If you can't do it in a live game, you can't do it in a forum game.

 

That should be the motto around here.

 

Let me put it this way and maybe it'll make more sense.

I believe people should be able to say or do almost anything in a mafia game to win. That's why most of the time mods will include a rule that you can't screenshot your role PM. It may seem obvious but there are people that can and will find loopholes and...I just don't think that should be discouraged. The entire game is built around outsmarting and manipulating people. Anything said in the game is gameplay. Period.

 

Aside from that I personally feel that manipulating people in that way specifically is low. Not sportsmanlike if you will.

Think of it as taking the knee in football. It may be a good move strategically but no one really wants to see that they want to see people playing the game.

Call me conflicted if you want, I guess that describes how I feel pretty accurately. I definitely believe not stifling gameplay trumps whether or not I feel like a certain tactic is unsportsmanlike though.

 

 

You think it is ok to screenshot your PM if the mod doesn't warn you not to?  C'mon man, you know that's not the way to play.  That isn't even playing - it is cheating.  I find it hard to believe you'd be ok with cheating.

[WWWwombat]

  On 6/17/2013 at 9:31 PM, Nolder said:

 

  On 6/17/2013 at 9:11 PM, Verbal32 said:

You just contradicted yourself, lol.  You share his view, and then say lying about RL is taboo.  You can't have it both ways.  I think I know you pretty well as a mafia player by now, and I'd say your 2nd statement reflects the way you feel, and the 1st was simply you being contrary (as you like to be sometimes) ;-)

 

 

If you can't do it in a live game, you can't do it in a forum game.

 

That should be the motto around here.

 

Let me put it this way and maybe it'll make more sense.

I believe people should be able to say or do almost anything in a mafia game to win. That's why most of the time mods will include a rule that you can't screenshot your role PM. It may seem obvious but there are people that can and will find loopholes and...I just don't think that should be discouraged. The entire game is built around outsmarting and manipulating people. Anything said in the game is gameplay. Period.

 

Aside from that I personally feel that manipulating people in that way specifically is low. Not sportsmanlike if you will.

Think of it as taking the knee in football. It may be a good move strategically but no one really wants to see that they want to see people playing the game.

Call me conflicted if you want, I guess that describes how I feel pretty accurately. I definitely believe not stifling gameplay trumps whether or not I feel like a certain tactic is unsportsmanlike though.

 

 

I'd say it's more equivalent to intentionally putting 12 men on the field or faking injuries than taking a knee:

 

http://www.sbnation.com/2012-super-bowl/2012/2/6/2774785/giants-penalty-polish-goalline-buddy-ryan

[WWWwombat]

Or videotaping your opponents' hand signals:

 

http://www.en.wikipedia.org/2007_National_Football_League_videotaping_controversy

[Darthe]

  On 6/17/2013 at 9:15 PM, Misheru Sedai said:

I can't believe you've done that Darthe. I actually lost quite a bit of respect for you as a player now.

 

cool?  It's no different than saying that you're having troubles and can't be around or lurking when people call your name.  

 

 

Actually, whatever.  I thought I could have an opinion here as well without getting attacked for it.

[peacesells]

I have no issues with what Darthe admitted to.  big whoop. 

 

 

In fact, I don't have any personal issue with whatever tactic people chose to employ IN GAME.  I'll address them in game. 

 

The game of mafia encourages you to act outside of social norms.  To hold someone accountable for their play is a bit silly since everyone one of us is guilty of some abnormal behavior in game.

[michellem]

Well it's my personal opinion that lieing about stuff like that is completly outside the spirit of the game, just like I think signing up for a game and then dropping out after not posting at all on D4 or something is also outside the spirit of the game and rude to the other players. You're free to agree; in fact several doo. But I think it's bad play and that's my view.

[Darthe]

Lol, spirit of the game where your goal is to manipulate people in to killing one another.

[WWWwombat]

Meh. I don't see it as that bad of a transgression. It's too sleazy for my taste, but you could get the same result and be just as dishonest without actually lying. For instance, one could say "hey guys I have a lot of stuff to do this weekend so I don't know if I'll be able to get to the game" when all one really plans on doing that weekend is partying, playing videogames, shopping, etc. I don't use either of those tactics, personally though. I just disappear for a day if I feel like it with no explanation and say some enigmatic nonsense when I get back.

[WWWwombat]

When I have RL issues, they usually keep me from mafia for weeks at a time, so I ask to be replaced if I sense that kind of thing coming.

[_CLOUD]

  On 6/17/2013 at 10:22 PM, Darthe said:

Lol, spirit of the game where your goal is to manipulate people in to killing one another.

 

I think you are taking this out of context. Mafia, even though it's about manipulation and all that good stuff, still remains a game and as with every other game out there people play them to have fun and to keep their mind off other more serious things. I doubt there will be many Mafia players left on DM if they took the theme of the game so seriously. I agree with you that people can play the game the way they want to though as long as it's within the game rules set by the mod, but that doesn't make me approve of some playstyles.

[Darthe]

Agreed, actually not participating in a game is bad because that is what we are all here for is to play a game with one another and have fun.

 

But as mafia I will do whatever it takes to win, and if the most effective tactic is for me to lie about what I'm doing with my own time then anyone who has an issue with it can sod off because that is what I will damn well do.

[Darthe]

Ninja'd, and not going to disagree Cloud.  I much prefer to play a smart and strategic game, but I don't allow that to limit me for the sake of being limited and am really not a fan of being judged for it.

[WWWwombat]

Beats getting yourself lynched D1 while implicating multiple teammates :P

[_CLOUD]

  On 6/17/2013 at 10:37 PM, Darthe said:

Ninja'd, and not going to disagree Cloud.  I much prefer to play a smart and strategic game, but I don't allow that to limit me for the sake of being limited and am really not a fan of being judged for it.

 

I apologize if you felt like I was judging you. I didn't mean to take this discussion personally and I understand where you are coming from even though I disagree on a few parts ;) But that's why it remains a playstyle; it's personal. Mafia would be boring if everyone played the same way imo.

[Darthe]

I don't feel as if you were judging me but thank you for the civility.  I agree with a more multicultural perspective as you said and only feel strongly against one thing, being individuals who commit to something and then flake of course.

[Nolder]

  On 6/17/2013 at 9:42 PM, Verbal32 said:

 

  On 6/17/2013 at 9:31 PM, Nolder said:

 

  On 6/17/2013 at 9:11 PM, Verbal32 said:

You just contradicted yourself, lol.  You share his view, and then say lying about RL is taboo.  You can't have it both ways.  I think I know you pretty well as a mafia player by now, and I'd say your 2nd statement reflects the way you feel, and the 1st was simply you being contrary (as you like to be sometimes) ;-)

 

 

If you can't do it in a live game, you can't do it in a forum game.

 

That should be the motto around here.

 

Let me put it this way and maybe it'll make more sense.

I believe people should be able to say or do almost anything in a mafia game to win. That's why most of the time mods will include a rule that you can't screenshot your role PM. It may seem obvious but there are people that can and will find loopholes and...I just don't think that should be discouraged. The entire game is built around outsmarting and manipulating people. Anything said in the game is gameplay. Period.

 

Aside from that I personally feel that manipulating people in that way specifically is low. Not sportsmanlike if you will.

Think of it as taking the knee in football. It may be a good move strategically but no one really wants to see that they want to see people playing the game.

Call me conflicted if you want, I guess that describes how I feel pretty accurately. I definitely believe not stifling gameplay trumps whether or not I feel like a certain tactic is unsportsmanlike though.

 

 

You think it is ok to screenshot your PM if the mod doesn't warn you not to?  C'mon man, you know that's not the way to play.  That isn't even playing - it is cheating.  I find it hard to believe you'd be ok with cheating.

 

See, that's the thing though, is it really cheating? Change the situation to a game that can be broken by character claiming but the mod forgets to put in a rule against it and when people mass claim oops game over. Kind of like lying about RL when people knowingly step into that grey area they are accepting that the tactics they're using are not kosher for the win. We all know when we're that grey area I think and that's why most people DON'T screenshot their PM even if a mod doesn't put the rule in. They know they will get **** on by everyone else after the game. 

 

If a game can be broken it's the mods job to set rules to prevent it.

Like I said before I think that kind of stuff is taboo and it should stay that way but I also don't think it's outright unacceptable.

I don't want to discourage creative and/or cutthroat gameplay is what I'm trying to say and I think that desire at least for me trumps whatever personal misgivings I have when people do actually use those kind of tactics.

[Nolder]

Also I liked Lanth's post too

[John E. Kelley]

It's not a difficult concept.

 

1. Get drunk.

2. Play mafia.

3. Have fun.

 

Why is everyone making this harder than it has to be?

[LilyElizabeth]

Darthe, I'm sorry you felt judged. I was just expressing my feelings, like everyone else. To me, that's unsportsmanlike behavior, but to you it's totally acceptable. We just differ, that's all. 

 

Altough, I will say, reading the various opinions in this thread, I don't think I'm likely to start playing much over here. On the site I normally play at, they think more like I do about sportsmanship.

[Darthe]

  On 6/18/2013 at 12:25 AM, Ishmael Forsaken said:

It's not a difficult concept.

 

1. Get drunk.

2. Play mafia.

3. Have fun.

 

Why is everyone making this harder than it has to be?

 

you gained rep

[peacesells]

Lily. Where do you normally play?

[WWWwombat]

  On 6/18/2013 at 12:25 AM, Ishmael Forsaken said:

It's not a difficult concept.

 

1. Get drunk.

2. Play mafia.

3. Have fun.

 

Why is everyone making this harder than it has to be?

 

I dunno LOL ¯\(°_o)/¯

[LilyElizabeth]

You know where, Peace. You've played over there. 

[Darthe]

The place that D1's me =p

[peacesells]

I thought it might be different cause my Exp there isn't the same as yours.

 

I got constantly insulted/attacked my first game there with juvenile comments. They only stopped when I picked one of the worse ones and made him feel really small.

 

Shouldn't have been neccesary. As a female you get treated differently. But jet nation has no moral superiority over DM.

 

It is a very different environment though. And fun. Just not what many paint it as.

 

There are far fewer insults passed around here...unless jners are playing here.

 

Again that's ok. But let's not put a dress on the pig and call it a princess.