What would you do if you were a male channeler in WoT?

[Azrayne]

look and then five minutes later she have him training in the Warder's yard or whatever thing she think would be good or him with the threat of spanking him if he do not haul ass.

 

This makes me wonder what would happen if you bonded a man after he was severed. It's impossible to say, but interesting to think about, given the various effects bonding has had (including the whole thing with Birgitte).

[Hagazussa]

This makes me wonder what would happen if you bonded a man after he was severed. It's impossible to say, but interesting to think about, given the various effects bonding has had (including the whole thing with Birgitte).

 

The bond itself should work just as with a normal person. I do however think, and I am guessing here, that there is a chance that if he was motivated then the task o keeping and Aes Sedai safe, and knowing that she would grieve extremely and all the things that comes with the bond might help a gentled male channeler survive. I do not think many Aes Sedai would be willing to bond such a man though as even in the best case scenario like with Cadsuane's method the men do not live full life spans, we know one lived for ten years, it is possible some of them lived longer but none lived to become old men, and Aes Sedai do not like loosing Warders more quickly than they have to, and also off course many of the gentled male channelers will have begun to be affected by the taint which might make them not so desirable to bond.

[Ozzie_aiel]

I would guess that the majority of men gentled would stay in the Tower for their own protection. A man who could channel, even if he's gentled, would be attacked and lynched by anyone who knew the truth. They may be given labourer jobs in the Tower or even wander around their own secluded garden until they finally die, but it would be irresponsible if they let the poor man simply leave. Thom's nephew Owen was simply gentled and left in the village he came from, but Moiraine said that what the Red Ajah did there broke Tower Law.

[WhiskyJack]

Another thing to impress women, ofcourse!

[Hagazussa]

I would guess that the majority of men gentled would stay in the Tower for their own protection. A man who could channel, even if he's gentled, would be attacked and lynched by anyone who knew the truth. They may be given labourer jobs in the Tower or even wander around their own secluded garden until they finally die, but it would be irresponsible if they let the poor man simply leave. Thom's nephew Owen was simply gentled and left in the village he came from, but Moiraine said that what the Red Ajah did there broke Tower Law.

 

The reason why it was against Tower Law to gentle Owyn in the field is that they are supposed to be taken to the Tower for trial before gentling. I do however think, though this is guessing, that most gentled men would stay at the Tower as you say for your own protection and also because most of them do not have the drive to leave or do anything unless driven out. I do however think that unless they caused allot of nuisance or where false dragons that they would be allowed to leave if they wished it, or in the rare cases where their family might come for them. I do not think, and again I am guessing that they would be forced to do labor at the Tower but for some of them having some task might be helpful so some of them might. I do not think they have a secluded garden, Logain just wandered around aimlessly in the regular Tower garden and freaked out visitors and novices.But yeah if the neighbors know most would lynch a gentled male channeler or at least shun him and make his life even more miserable than it already is, so yeah former male channelers would probably need to stay at the Tower for their own protection.

 

Another thing to impress women, ofcourse!

 

Channeling ability in a man...yeah that is sure to impress the ladies, especially mage ladies with Red shawls, do invite them home to see your fireballs an you can dazzle them with the size of your connection to the Source as the ram a shield into it, I hope you enjoy being spiritually penetrated. :P

[Ozzie_aiel]

I didn't mean they'd be forced to work but I can see Aes Sedai giving one the job of cutting wood for fires, stuff like that, for drinking money, etc

[Hagazussa]

Yeah, well I think they are given food and drink and a bit of alcohol to if they want it, but I think some gentled male channelers might survive longer if they do not only sit around and think about how much they miss channeling and how much their life sucks so if they are given something to do with themselves they might suffer less. Anything about how male channelers are treated after gentling off course is only speculation as we have only see Logain and he was a former false dragon and he was kept a prisoner, that being said he was treated rather kindly so chances are that they are fairly well looked after, after all most Aes Sedai do not desire to hurt these men, some Reds do but most do so out of necessity and they do pity them their fate.   

[AndyC]

If I was channeling and couldn't deny it, I'd probably head straight for Far Madding.  Hide from the True Source, but remain in a decent city.

The issues that the male Aes Sedai had in the stedding probably shouldn't be as bad for me, as I'd not have become as habituated to the presence of the Source (it would probably scare me).  I could see forcing myself to stay in being as difficult as heroin withdrawal, but probably achievable - and given the options (life in a stedding, gentling, death in the Blight, death by madness, False Dragonhood followed by gentling or death), it'd be the best of a bad set of options.

[Hagazussa]

I do not think that would work, it would not matter if the Source scared you, I think it would scare most male channelers out of their wits, but all channelers are addicted to the Power. If it was so easy as to stay in Far Madding or a Stedding that would be something male channelers would probably choose that options, but I not think it is possible to choose not to channel, or even stay in a place where they can not for to long at a time. Perhaps if you had someone to watch over you and prevent you from leaving.

[Whizbang]

We have never heard of anyone staying inside Far Madding or a stedding until they die, but that doesn't mean they didn't. Certainly it would be silly to assume that no males with the spark were born, lived, then died within the Guardian's field of influence. I would imagine that a male channeler, who hasn't done more than a few simple tricks without really knowing it, would be able to survive within Far Madding without too much concern. It is only once you have conscious control over the Source does it become too adictive. Maybe once you realize you can channel it is already too late, but I would guess there is a gap where someone with sufficient motivation could learn they can channel then move to Far Madding then stay there until they die.

[Hagazussa]

Well yes I agree if a male channeler have only done a few tricks and do not have conscious control would probably not be to addicted so if someone recognized those signs and sent them to Far Madding right away they might be able to stay, however once a man have channeled consciously then they are sort of trapped, they will not be able to stand the longing for the One Power for long so I would guess that once you know you can channel, it is already to late, unless someone notice the early stages and send you to Far Madding then before you know what you are doing. I do not think it matter how long you have channeled if you have done so consciously you are addicted.

 

But yes perhaps just like someone with extreme motivation can survive severing, perhaps someone with extreme motivation can manage to stay in a place like Far Madding, but I do not think many can. Channelers need to channel like fish need to swim.

[AndyC]

It's addictive, but the more you use it and the more proficient you are and the longer you have used it, the worse it is.  During the breaking, some male Aes Sedai - some of whom would be of Forsaken-level strength and experience with centuries of use and reliance managed to stay in the steddings for years or decades.

 

Given that, someone who has just sparked, just got to the point where they strongly suspect they are channeling but probably not at will, should be able to survive life in Far Madding cut off from the Source.  It might take some will or motivation - but the fact that you will go insane, decay and die using power you do not know how to control or manage would be pretty good motivation.  Like with any addiction, the longer you have it, the more habituated you are to it.  Someone starting out would have a good chance, if they moved decisively and had a decent level of willpower.  Stedding/Far Madding type cut-off isn't like severing (from the descriptions), so it should be the most survivable.

 

Basically, you have the following choices:

1 - Go to Far Madding or a stedding

2 - Commit suicide by either an insane attack on Shayol Ghul or a straightforward self-killing

3 - Be severed.  This usually leads to the same fate as number 2.

4 - Deny it and go insane and decay and die, possibly taking loved ones with you

5 - Proclaim yourself the Dragon Reborn and fail to one degree or another - either early on or late after conquering and killing.  This leads to either options 2 or 3, usually taking a lot of innocents with you

6 - Be born at the right time and either be the real Dragon Reborn or survive to see the Source cleansed.  Given that the last clause of that choice was unforeseen by most, you can see why hoping that you were actually the Dragon Reborn was such a draw.

 

I can't see any other options.

Another plus for Option 1 is that if it truly does prove unacceptable in the long run, you are free to change your mind and either commit suicide (either directly or indirectly by assaulting Shayol Ghul or falsely proclaiming yourself the Dragon Reborn), get severed and either commit suicide afterwards or fade and die anyway, or go insane, decay and die horribly. 

[BFG]

The problem with Far Madding or steddings are that the male would need to know about them in advance. I appreciate that the 2R was fairly isolated, and thus knew less about the world, but their's a chance that the male wouldn't know about those places, or where to find them.

[AndyC]

The problem with Far Madding or steddings are that the male would need to know about them in advance. I appreciate that the 2R was fairly isolated, and thus knew less about the world, but their's a chance that the male wouldn't know about those places, or where to find them.

 

Very true.  I guess we're talking in an ideal sense - if we were in Randland, were male, found out we had the spark for channelling, and knew what we did now.

[BFG]

 

 

The problem with Far Madding or steddings are that the male would need to know about them in advance. I appreciate that the 2R was fairly isolated, and thus knew less about the world, but their's a chance that the male wouldn't know about those places, or where to find them.

Very true. I guess we're talking in an ideal sense - if we were in Randland, were male, found out we had the spark for channelling, and knew what we did now.

 

Equally, many of the male channelers would know (or at least would know to look). Given Thom's profession, I doubt that his nephew didn't know about the effect of stedding, or Far Madding.

 

In an idealised sense, it would seem to be the best option, I'd guess it would work up until they channel consciously for the first time.

[Whizbang]

Plus there is always denial. "I can go out for a while and not channel. I can resist it." Remember Rand promising never to touch it? After some time in Far Madding or a stedding, you'd convince yourself that you could control yourself long enough to go visit family, or go find a wife, or just see new sights, maybe go earn some money or help a friend.

[EmperorAllspice]

The problem with deciding what I would do as a male chaneler is that I can't comprehend just how addictive Saidin is. Or how being severed could cause such misery. I especially can't comprehend the second one.

 

So I can't really even speculate. because there are such important parts of the situation that I can't adequately wrap my head around. Cuz my instant thought right now would be. Sever me.

[sVieira151]

To put it into perspective, I'm not sure if there has been any men who have been gentled who have lived longer than, what, 10 years? It would probably get super lonely and depressing.

[EmperorAllspice]

what if you had the spark in you but were severed before you ever touched the source? would you die of depression then too?

 

The issue is that I don't get WHY you couldn't EVENTUALLY get used to not being able to channel. Yes, I get it based on what's said in the story, but I can't comprehend it. I can't comprehend something I've never experienced.

 

and I'm inclined to agree with Rand's motto. "You can get used to anything"

[sVieira151]

Well, how would you know you have the spark in you before you've touched it? Unless some other male channeler managed to find you before you did, which would require a lot of luck...

 

Well, we know that women can (Setalle) but I don't think any men have. It is said you need to find something that will take your mind completely away from thinking about it, some motivation or life goal that you can focus on entirely. Setalle found that (in having a family and running an inn and her husband). However, we haven't heard of any man who has overcome the loss of being gentled.

 

And if you can't comprehend something you've never experienced, surely that would mean you couldn't comprehend a lot? How do you think of things in real life you haven't experienced? Do you just have some conceived idea of what it could be like from your own fantasies or from what other people tell you? I do. I don't put much faith it in until I would have experienced it myself, but I always have an impression of what it could be like. Same goes for this. I can't comprehend it, but thanks to things we have been told I can paint a picture of what it could be like. And from what we've been told, I can only imagine it to be a very bleak experience. 

[EmperorAllspice]

I'm sorry. I can't. I can't imagine it being bleak to the point where I would kill myself. I can imagine it sucking. Sucking a LOT. But not any moreso than living without your arms or your legs for instance.

[sVieira151]

Don't be sorry, it's all a matter of perspective. Remember, it is said that when people have seized saidin (and embraced saider) that they feel truly alive, and that once they release it the world feels like a dull copy in comparison. Think of it more so as if it severely increases your 5 senses, so losing it would have the same effect as having severe seeing/hearing/smelling impairments as well feeling like your fingers are numb. At least, that is how I view it. You could view it differently.

 

Also note, that channelers feel a sense of loss upon entering a stedding. I don't recall them knowing they lost the source, but they still felt the loss. Now, imagine if you knew that it was the source you lost, forever. Now, imagine if you knew you would be stuck with severely impaired senses for the rest of your world. The world would seem completely faint and dull compared to what it was, and unless you got over the memory of what it was, do you think you could really forget what it was like? Maybe you could, maybe you couldn't/ I may have got the sense of scale lost a bit in that analogy, but I feel it gets the point across.

[EmperorAllspice]

People live with blindness. People live with deafness. It's kinda a thing that people can live through pretty much anything  without giving into despair. I've also read stories where a character gets addicted to a drug that gives a similar feeling of heightened senses, and she gets over it. (even if she needed a lot of help)

 

The story, (maybe it's the writing, maybe it's just me) didn't do a good enough job establishing WHY Saidin is so 100% intrinsic to a chaneler's life. And honestly, I get annoyed whenever they describe how awesome it is.

 

As I said at the beginning though. It's clearly just a lack of comprehension on my part. That's why I find it nigh impossible to think of anything one can do besides "get over it"

[Suttree]

Ok so there are two different types of losing the source.

 

1. When someone is gentled or stilled they can still sense the source but never touch it. For the rest of your life it will be just out of reach tempting you. This can also be healed as we have seen with Siuan etc. The connection to the source is merely cut and can be reconnected.

 

Also we know that Cadsuane came up with a method for the men she captured in which she was reintegrating them back into society and they could go on to live an almost normal life span. This shows that psychological treatment post stilling can make a huge difference.

 

2. When someone is burned out the connection is simply gone and they can no longer even sense the source. This is what happened to Setalle and is likely why she survived along with finding a purpose in life. It would be much easier to move one if you didn't constantly have the source beckoning. The flip side of that however is it is likely someone burned out can not be healed, much like Rand's missing limb as the source connection is gone.

[sVieira151]

That's true. However, how many people who are deaf and blind (among other things such as not being able to smell or feel or taste) want to stay alive? Also, as you said "she needed a lot of help". In this world you don't. Male channelers are looked down upon, and even hunted. You aren't going to get much help (unless you stumble across Cadsuane).

 

I'm interested in why you get annoyed when they describe how awesome it is. 

 

NINJA'D by Sutt. He makes a good point that I may have been merging/forgetting.