Kae's [BASIC] X-Men Mafia GAME OVER! TOWN WINS!!!

[Nolder]

There are couple of things that are bugging me right now. I haven't seen anything to support Nolder's mantra of "lynch Red now", but the chant goes on.

did you miss the case I made on her or do you just disagree with it?

 

1) why would BG send out a different role claim to each person if he is trying to get out of being lynched?

dunno!

didn't really think about it I just figured there was a chance he screwed up

 

2) Why is Nolder so anxious to find out who BG trusts besides himself?

I think that would become somewhat evident on thread regardless...

but yeah it wasn't about finding out who those people were

what could I possibly do with this information if I was scum?

 

3) Why would Nolder confirming that everyone received the same message be of any help at all when Nolder's alignment is unknown?

I think you missed the point

it's not about me

it's about making sure BG told everyone the same story

if he didn't we have an obvious problem

just covering all the bases

when you just blindly accept things in mafia you tend to get burned

 

This stinks to high heaven. I can think of a couple of scenarios right off the top of my head that fit this situation. 1) BG is town and trusts Nolder, but Nolder is scum who now wants to find out who BG trusts enough to send out his role. By having these people PM him, he can then start working behind the scenes to lead lynches where he wants them because these people will be less suspicious of him.

wat

why would they be less suspicious of me?

just because BG trusts them doesn't necessarily mean they trust HIM (and by extension me)

 

2) Nolder and BG are both scum. In this scenario, Nolder is being used to lend some credibility to the role claim with the same effect as scenario 1. People trust both Nolder and BG more than they would the other players and can then be influenced to vote for another townie instead of a scum member. All in all, I see no way that Nolder's suggestion is a good idea for the town and I call scum.

please explain to me how someone with an unknown alignment lends credibility to someone else of an unknown alignment

it doesn't make any sense

[Levity]

I see Nolder's case on Red loud and clear, I don't see how people keep missing it /:

I suppose it's a strange one, though, which is why it seems confusing.

[Nolder]

I see Nolder's case on Red loud and clear, I don't see how people keep missing it /:

I suppose it's a strange one, though, which is why it seems confusing.

yeah I dunno

if people disagree that's one thing

a lot of people hate meta cases (although I'd like to say that Red's behavior since I made the case has been extremely dubious) and if it's just being dismissed that's fine...I guess

but it kind of sucks when people act like it doesn't even exist in the first place

[aemonkristen]

This is where I originally responded to your case of Red. You didn't agree with my disagreement then, so I doubt you will now. I simply believe that you are wrong on all three counts of your case. I have played many games with Red and do not recall her as ALWAYS placing a vote right off the bat, so your meta is lost on me right there unless her playstyle changed in the months I have been absent. And as far as the "light-hearted spamming", that was everyone who happened to be on at the time talking about their favorite X-Men characters. Your casing is weak to me.

 

 

@Songstress - One thing that new people to X-men usually get wrong since Wolverine is generally the figurehead... Wolverine's power isn't huge claws, but the power to heal himself instantly. The claws come from expirimentation on him replacing his bones with an indestructable metal.... just sayin.

 

Except didn't he have claws all along, just that they were originally bone claws? I'm going just by the Wolverine prequel movie here, I have very little knowledge of the comic books except for stuff I've heard secondhand. I didn't care much for that installment, while the action scenes were awesome, it kind of dragged otherwise. And it seemed like in all the effort to stay true to the comics, they lost consistency with the existing film continuity. Because someone is bound to say it for their joke vote:

 

Vote: Red

 

OMGUS!!! VOTE: BASEL

 

 

i dunno if Logan started with the claws, but i do know that he ends up getting the antamatium(sp) removed and Gambit kicks his ass some what fierce

 

 

Gambit FTW!

 

 

 

 

Brett Ratner ruined the franchise.

 

vote

 

Brett Ratner

 

ah, now theres a wagon i can get behind

 

UNVOTE

 

VOTE: BRETT RATNER

 

I cut out the spam in this quote to avoid a WoT, but it clearly shows that she did vote Basel (though it was not bolded or in red) then switch to Brett Ratner for crimes against humanity. My point is that, even though it was a 2 second joke vote, she did indeed vote Basel.

 

 

I voted Red for three reasons

 

1. Her unnecessary role hinting (I don't believe she actually claimed gambit did she?)

2. Distracting the town with lighthearted spamming

3. Meta

 

A hint is as good as a claim. If you believe she is hinting at being Gambit, why would you say she is not claiming?

 

Nolder, where do you get role hinting? All she said was that she really liked Gambit. She didn't claim anyone, and I think you're reading waaaaay too much into what she had to say about the X-Men theme here. And if you think she hadn't voted anyone, you really may wish to go back and read her posts, as well as take a look at the vote total. She voted me with an OMGUS right off before switching her vote.

what? I didn't say she claimed

Mynd did

 

and she did not vote you

 

And then, after reinforcing the idea that she is "hinting" at her role and using it to vote for her, you throw the blame on Mynd. As the first quote demonstrates, Red did vote for Basel. Thoroughly scummy behavior, Nolder.

 

 

Also, I fail to see how everyone telling you what they were PMed would resolve as you could then say whatever you like about it. Can you explain why they should trust you to verify the PM? The only way to verify would be to mass message or set up a QT with the people involved so it comes straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak.

 

If you believed the people who received a PM would become evident on the thread, why did you ask them to PM you?

 

You say things should not be accepted blindly, yet you ask everyone who received the message to PM you, thereby accepting blindly that you have their best intentions at heart. Contradictory.

 

Songstress claims that BG's claim is pretty big, so people would probably trust him if he is not counterclaimed. because he appears to trust you, you could play off that trust to lead the group of people that were PMed in a direction that is counterproductive to the town. You of all people know how easy it is to gain credibility through association. it's one of the scum hunter's tools to try and ferret out those people that attach themselves to others for threat credibility.

[amegakure]

I dont really think i want to get on the bg. I dont really know what to think about this last effort bg has managed to pull out of his magical hat. I think im going to vote Basel gill mostly because of how eager he is for this lynch. He also never came back and really made a case besides inactivity?

[Nolder]

You didn't agree with my disagreement then, so I doubt you will now.

all about the words you use

it seemed to me like you were saying I didn't POST a case not that you disagree with the case I posted

if that's how it is then fine whatever I guess

 

I have played many games with Red and do not recall her as ALWAYS placing a vote right off the bat

well I do

every time I've played with Red she's done this

she even votes herself if it's allowed just so she can have her vote on somebody

 

And as far as the "light-hearted spamming", that was everyone who happened to be on at the time talking about their favorite X-Men characters.

missing the point

it wasn't about everyone spamming it was about RED

she usually comes into a game and cases people hardcore

especially if the game is already underway when she gets there (which it was)

she didn't do that which says to me she's being really cautious and doesn't want to step on any toes...as I already explained

 

Also, I fail to see how everyone telling you what they were PMed would resolve as you could then say whatever you like about it.

like I said the point of it is to make sure we all got the same claim

if I lied to someone, be it BG or one of the people PMing me or anyone else, what purpose would that serve?

if there is any inconsistency it'll end up being brought up on the thread

 

Can you explain why they should trust you to verify the PM? The only way to verify would be to mass message or set up a QT with the people involved so it comes straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak.

I don't understand what you mean by that

you can ask BG if you want confirmation that I got a PM from him in the first place if you don't believe me

like I said before if BG claimed X to someone and I say he claimed Y (or visa versa) it's obviously going to spillover in the thread

I just don't get what it is you're afraid of

 

If you believed the people who received a PM would become evident on the thread, why did you ask them to PM you?

because my goal wasn't to identify them in the first place?

 

You say things should not be accepted blindly, yet you ask everyone who received the message to PM you, thereby accepting blindly that you have their best intentions at heart. Contradictory.

again I don't see what they're blindly trusting here

they know I also received a PM from BG

 

Songstress claims that BG's claim is pretty big, so people would probably trust him if he is not counterclaimed. because he appears to trust you, you could play off that trust to lead the group of people that were PMed in a direction that is counterproductive to the town. You of all people know how easy it is to gain credibility through association. it's one of the scum hunter's tools to try and ferret out those people that attach themselves to others for threat credibility.

ok that's ridiculous but if it makes you feel better I promise I will not in any way try to influence anyone who got a PM from BG via private messages to do anything or think a certain way

those were never my intentions in the first place so that doesn't bother me

I do my manipulating out in the open thanks

now go vote Red please

[aemonkristen]

My first thought when you started this was that you had some kind of day finder ability and I didn't want to mention it in case that was true. I now doubt that first conclusion because of your recent actions to me, you seem a very good candidate for a day 1 lynch. We still have close to 2 days till deadline, so I'm comfortable where I am.

[Sakaea]

OFFICIAL VOTE COUNT

 

Red (1) -- Nolder

 

BG (3) -- Turin, Basel, Hoof

 

Mynd (2) -- Ama, Red

 

Basel (4) -- BG, Mynd, Ishy, Amega

 

Nolder (1) -- Aemon

 

With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

 

 

THERE IS NOW A DEADLINE. http://www.timeandda...0&sec=00&p0=234

 

Not Voting: Song

[Basel Gill]

He will be a much better lynch candidate because he tried to be a stealthy bandwagon hopper but failed to explain why, even to the point of getting cross.

 

Well, I was cross because I don't see a need for typing out a whole big explanation that I have already typed out once. My opinion on BG hasn't changed, but the whole PM issue which rose up has only helped to bolster it. I might as well pull out a claim now and say that I am vanilla, not that I expect to be fully believed.

[Turin Turambar]

Unvote:BG

 

I got the PM too and for now will take my vote off. I was out when all this craziness happened and just got home lately. I saw the PM and thought why is BG sending me something about roles in his game? I haven't played an OC game before except that last day of Lily's game, (which I totally won) and as I haven't gotten any others I wasn't thinking about the process.

 

LMAO at Nol and his suspicions of me. I voted BG initially cause he got me deaded in 3 straight games. 2 on the same day. He even threatened to modkill me in his game so I hid behind Mynd(sorry Mynd it is just a joke). I stated that I was keeping my vote on him when he was being quiet cause in my experience with him he is either real active or real quiet and I wanted to see him be active. Then the "cases" started coming out and the case on him was just as sound as any of the others. I was being lazy and wanted to hear his claim come out. BG is good at making up some good stuff. That he sent out a minimal PM instead has struck me as different and I am leaning toward it being truth at this time. You want to link everyone together is very much like the Nolder that is trying to push forward as mafia (or cult) trying to look town.

 

Nolder how about you send me what he told you and I'll confirm if it was the same or not. Oh no, now you'll have to link us together too.

[Nolder]

Nolder how about you send me what he told you and I'll confirm if it was the same or not. Oh no, now you'll have to link us together too.

nah whatever

from the responses I got it appears that BG told everyone the same thing and apparently I'm scummy for even bothering to double check

[Myndrunner]

He will be a much better lynch candidate because he tried to be a stealthy bandwagon hopper but failed to explain why, even to the point of getting cross.

 

Well, I was cross because I don't see a need for typing out a whole big explanation that I have already typed out once. My opinion on BG hasn't changed, but the whole PM issue which rose up has only helped to bolster it. I might as well pull out a claim now and say that I am vanilla, not that I expect to be fully believed.

 

Vanilla....in X-MEN MAFIA?!?!?!?! BWAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!

[Basel Gill]

When I give an explanation once, I shouldn't HAVE to give it again. IS IT SO FAR-FETCHED THAT I JUST DON'T WANT TO WASTE TIME REPEATING MYSELF? I'd love to know how whether or not I am scum depends on whether or not other people are capable of reading the thread before they post.

[Myndrunner]

When I give an explanation once, I shouldn't HAVE to give it again. IS IT SO FAR-FETCHED THAT I JUST DON'T WANT TO WASTE TIME REPEATING MYSELF? I'd love to know how whether or not I am scum depends on whether or not other people are capable of reading the thread before they post.

 

Nope, Betty White doesn't believe you either. There are no Vanilla Town roles in X-men Mafia.

[Sakaea]

OFFICIAL VOTE COUNT

 

Red (1) -- Nolder

 

BG (2) -- Basel, Hoof

 

Mynd (2) -- Ama, Red

 

Basel (4) -- BG, Mynd, Ishy, Amega

 

Nolder (1) -- Aemon

 

With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

 

 

THERE IS NOW A DEADLINE. http://www.timeandda...0&sec=00&p0=234

 

Not Voting: Song, Turin

[Basel Gill]

*Is seriously pondering whether I want to come back even if I survive the lynch. Is also pondering whether I want to stick around long enough to see whether I do survive, or if I want to ever bother with Mafia again.*

[John E. Kelley]

Oh, Basel. Oh Basel, no, no, no, NO. Vanilla? Even the lamest of the X-Men, like Banshee or Nightcrawler or that pansy ass Cyclops, can't be Vanilla. Even damn Jubilee. Or Red's hero that spins a stick and tosses playing cards (snicker). Just by being what they are (mutants) all of them have to have some type of action, even if it's really weak ( like spinning a stick or having a mystical Hoyle deck). Vanilla? Nah, don't see it happening.

[Basel Gill]

Well, I can understand if you don't buy that I might be vanilla, or even that I'm not town, but it keeps sticking in my craw the way I post my line of thinking, and then people ask me for my reasoning and claim I voted with no explanation, AFTER I HAVE ALREADY GIVEN ONE!

[Sakaea]

Ok, time out you lot. Basel, while I realize mafia is not for everyone, you have to realize that a lot of people play by poking at people until they go BOOM and drop some kind of tell. It takes some getting used to.

 

Now everyone chill, please, and have fun.

[John E. Kelley]

Very true Basel. Nothing in this game is personal, just that lots of us have aggresive play styles. Some much more than others. But after the games over, we're all still friends and laugh about it all. But yeah, during the game you hafta have a pretty think skin. We may poke and prod, but we do it to our best friends, our bonded, our group leaders, everyone. It's all in good fun, but for people who don't play often it can make you pretty mad. It did for me for quite awhile too until I learned to not take anything said seriously. Just hope it doesn't turn you off to mafia.

[Turin Turambar]

He will be a much better lynch candidate because he tried to be a stealthy bandwagon hopper but failed to explain why, even to the point of getting cross.

 

Well, I was cross because I don't see a need for typing out a whole big explanation that I have already typed out once. My opinion on BG hasn't changed, but the whole PM issue which rose up has only helped to bolster it. I might as well pull out a claim now and say that I am vanilla, not that I expect to be fully believed.

 

Vanilla....in X-MEN MAFIA?!?!?!?! BWAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!

what part of Kae's [bASIC] X-Men Mafia did you not get the memo on?

[Songstress]

After re-reading the last 8 pages or so... In some ways I hate to do this, but I have to agree with the others.

 

In the absence of any hard information on D1, we have to dig around and base our suspicions on people's reactions to that digging. I've been going through post by post and summarizing what's being said, and noting any reactions I have to it, and starting right about here:

 

although there should be no future for Red because we should lynch her today

let's get off BG and do that ok guys? ok cool

 

Except that BG is scum for reasons which have been well-explained already, so I don't feel like bothering with an explanation which would be redundant (lest someone accuse me of dropping the S-word without an explanation), and we alreayd have a good train going for him. If we break down the BG train with just two votes to go. we'd have to take the time to build a whole new one for Red, and then get the BG train going all over again after Day 2 starts. I'd sooner lynch BG now, and worry about Red later.

 

 

I made the note there that if BG was actually town, Basel's vehemence here was going to bump him to the top of my list. Well, him and Mynd, who was also leading the bandwagon for a while. Now that BG has an uncontested role claim and I am seriously inclined to believe him (and Mynd has done a whirlwind about face without even allegedly having received said PM), Basel is looking the most suspicious to me, especially with his reactions to pressure.

 

Vote Basel

 

-----

 

All that said... as a side matter...

 

In regards to this post:

*Is seriously pondering whether I want to come back even if I survive the lynch. Is also pondering whether I want to stick around long enough to see whether I do survive, or if I want to ever bother with Mafia again.*

 

I've been lectured already in this thread about things looking like a play for sympathy, and I know how much it must suck to feel like you're not sure you want to keep playing. I was about at that point on Saturday myself, but gave it a good night's sleep and decided I was still interested enough to keep working at it. And I'm pretty tenacious about trying to get better if I think something is fun. I know there are people here who would be happy to give you some pointers, I've had a couple of offers myself already. Take a deep breath, chalk it up to experience, and try not to let it become personal. I don't think anyone here is trying to make it personal, it's all part of the game, and even if you are as upfront and honest as you can be, people are going to doubt everything you say and how you say it.

 

When I give an explanation once, I shouldn't HAVE to give it again. IS IT SO FAR-FETCHED THAT I JUST DON'T WANT TO WASTE TIME REPEATING MYSELF? I'd love to know how whether or not I am scum depends on whether or not other people are capable of reading the thread before they post.

 

In my other game, which I have since dropped out of due to time constraints and lack of sleep, I stayed up late one night in response to someone's request that I provide my thoughts on one of the other players, re-read through several walls of text and even links to other threads on the same site when talking about a meta case on someone... I got about 5 hours of sleep after writing a very thoughtful post concluding that I had good reason to be the 3rd vote on someone to put on some pressure. The very next post was a very annoying individual asking me what exactly my good reason was.

 

I totally identify with you, I was at the point of wanting to whap that person upside the head since I'd already taken the time to type out stuff and quote posts (including one of that same individual's, which I agreed with)... but after I stepped away for a few hours and came back to it I realized what he was driving at, that I may have appeared to be being led around by a couple of forceful personalities who had subbed into the game and switched votes to him, and that the things I'd typed up only really clearly showed that I thought this player's logic was faulty, not why I was fingering him as mafia. The guy who was questioning me was trying to gauge whether I was thinking for myself or following the others, and whether I was voting him for legitimate reasons or not. I thought I'd been clear, but just because I'd said it clearly in my opinion at the time doesn't mean everyone agreed it was clear.

 

Even if you feel like you have said it before, it's worth the time to re-evaluate and re-state your case to make sure other people can tell where you're coming from.

[Songstress]

Side note @Kae - Levity appears to be missing in the vote count - as I recall she currently is among those not voting.

[Basel Gill]

*deep, slow breath* All right. Thanks to everyone for your thoughts. I suppose I will stick around, although from the looks of things that won't be all that long... I seem to be doomed for a lynch here no matter what I do. Since I can't convince you folk that I am town, I may as well enjoy reading the ramifications when you see a reveal. And FWIW, Mynd, I enjoyed the Betty White gif enough to save it to my desktop and hope to find a use for it in posting someday.

[Nolder]

*deep, slow breath* All right. Thanks to everyone for your thoughts. I suppose I will stick around, although from the looks of things that won't be all that long... I seem to be doomed for a lynch here no matter what I do. Since I can't convince you folk that I am town, I may as well enjoy reading the ramifications when you see a reveal. And FWIW, Mynd, I enjoyed the Betty White gif enough to save it to my desktop and hope to find a use for it in posting someday.

don't worry about it man

I rage quit out of a mafia game just the other day (although for reasons that weren't quite related to mafia)

it happens sometimes

certain things'll just get under your skin