What would you be in Randland if you had to choose?

[Morsker]

I went with Ogier. I wouldn't want to live in the WoT at all; it's war-torn and almost everyone is going to die violently in the next month, and the cultures are hyperbolically traditional and hate people who think for themselves. If I were stuck in WoT I supposed I'd want to be Asha'aman to help fight the Shadow, but it would not be fun.

[Hael Me]

I voted "other", because I don't really know... But I have a few ideas.

 

Gholam would be cool. I'd travel to Tar Valon instantly, to get my kicks and maybe save the world, too, from the true enemy, the Aes Sedai...

 

Green Man is another good option. You're strong - you can kill the Forsaken - and you're made entirely of herbs. A long life span is also expected - Someshta was well over 3000 years old. Plus you don't ever have to move a lawn again - just use your green magic instead.

 

Spymaster. Well, I'm a curious guy!

[FossMaNo1]

Why would anyone wanna be a Warder?

Hehehehe... some of us like the idea of being strong and respected quietly without having to be in the spotlight. Even Aiel give warders a respect they give to few wetlanders. Warders are given wide berth and left to themselves and are highly regarded by their Aes Sedai, yet they don't have to be "in your face" or grandiose all the time (like Aes Sedai or Asha'man).

 

I guess what is intriguing to me is the quiet strength they represent. They're humble yet dangerous.

[Eichhörnchen]

Liberty or death. I would align myself with the Shadow out of purely philosophical reasoning. The entire concept of the wheel is perverse and offensive to my sensibilities. To be enslaved for eternity in a circle of endless repetition is a farce. Even in my present incarnation I wouldn't know how many previous lives, fates and destinies I had to toil through in my endless stream through the pattern. The destruction of the wheel and the release from an eternal mock slavery seems the most noble, altruistic and magnanimous action that a mere mortal could undertake in that world. After all what is life enslaved to eternal repetition and never being able to advance or be allowed to evolve? Pointless. Life is not profound and utterly lacks in meaning or purpose.

Well, I have to admit that I agree with quite a lot of that.

 

Given however how the world functions there, it's between getting stuck in fate or being devoured by an eldritch abomination. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

 

As for the poll, I would have to roll as an Asha'man.

 

 

However at some point all must come to an end. The question is how long would you want your thread to be recycled, recycled and recycled? Forced to live through the same fates, tragedies and ages again, again and again ad infinitum. There is no linear progression but only a circular retardation. Nothing changes, not even this age is unique or special as stated by RJ. At least if one destroys the wheel the pattern is finally broken and the bliss of chaos that defines nature can finally take hold. The unleashing of the Dark One does not destroy the Creator, merely the rotating hamster wheel of the current plane of existence. The question is does one want to run eternally in the hamster wheel only never to arrive at any destination one has not visited before? Or perhaps destroy what should have never been and is an affront to existence itself, so as to allow for the possibility of a new creation to be formed in the void left behind. There is nothing to prevent the Creator from forming or creating a new plane of existence that finally functions in a linear form. Opting out of fear and selfishness to be trapped in what is essentially the Creators eternally repeating minstrel show seems to be a shallow existence devoid of true meaning anyway.

[coolpool]

i voted other... as there was no bela

[FarShainMael]

Liberty or death. I would align myself with the Shadow out of purely philosophical reasoning. The entire concept of the wheel is perverse and offensive to my sensibilities. To be enslaved for eternity in a circle of endless repetition is a farce. Even in my present incarnation I wouldn't know how many previous lives, fates and destinies I had to toil through in my endless stream through the pattern. The destruction of the wheel and the release from an eternal mock slavery seems the most noble, altruistic and magnanimous action that a mere mortal could undertake in that world. After all what is life enslaved to eternal repetition and never being able to advance or be allowed to evolve? Pointless. Life is not profound and utterly lacks in meaning or purpose.

 

I'm genuinely puzzled. If you dislike the concept so much, why are you reading the books? (I take it you are reading the books?)

 

PS. Are you a red or a grey? Or a black?

[t.shaleva]

Liberty or death. I would align myself with the Shadow out of purely philosophical reasoning. The entire concept of the wheel is perverse and offensive to my sensibilities. To be enslaved for eternity in a circle of endless repetition is a farce. Even in my present incarnation I wouldn't know how many previous lives, fates and destinies I had to toil through in my endless stream through the pattern. The destruction of the wheel and the release from an eternal mock slavery seems the most noble, altruistic and magnanimous action that a mere mortal could undertake in that world. After all what is life enslaved to eternal repetition and never being able to advance or be allowed to evolve? Pointless. Life is not profound and utterly lacks in meaning or purpose.

Well, I have to admit that I agree with quite a lot of that.

 

Given however how the world functions there, it's between getting stuck in fate or being devoured by an eldritch abomination. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

 

As for the poll, I would have to roll as an Asha'man.

 

 

However at some point all must come to an end. The question is how long would you want your thread to be recycled, recycled and recycled? Forced to live through the same fates, tragedies and ages again, again and again ad infinitum. There is no linear progression but only a circular retardation. Nothing changes, not even this age is unique or special as stated by RJ. At least if one destroys the wheel the pattern is finally broken and the bliss of chaos that defines nature can finally take hold. The unleashing of the Dark One does not destroy the Creator, merely the rotating hamster wheel of the current plane of existence. The question is does one want to run eternally in the hamster wheel only never to arrive at any destination one has not visited before? Or perhaps destroy what should have never been and is an affront to existence itself, so as to allow for the possibility of a new creation to be formed in the void left behind. There is nothing to prevent the Creator from forming or creating a new plane of existence that finally functions in a linear form. Opting out of fear and selfishness to be trapped in what is essentially the Creators eternally repeating minstrel show seems to be a shallow existence devoid of true meaning anyway.

 

You should read Veins of Gold again...I think that was Rand's dilemma: Why save the world when all the suffering would happen again and again and again? And then he realized that all of the love and friendships, etc. would also happen again and again and again...So I guess it depends on what we think the "true meaning" is.

[SylviaDoreen]

I would be a wise one. Not only can they channel, but they're not limited by the 3 oaths like Aes Sedai. Not to mention they're not despised by everyone like the aes sedai either!

 

Maybe a wise one trained to the weaves of the tower, have the best of both worlds...

Not sure how I'd do running around the waste though lol. Probably die horribly.

[Eichhörnchen]

Liberty or death. I would align myself with the Shadow out of purely philosophical reasoning. The entire concept of the wheel is perverse and offensive to my sensibilities. To be enslaved for eternity in a circle of endless repetition is a farce. Even in my present incarnation I wouldn't know how many previous lives, fates and destinies I had to toil through in my endless stream through the pattern. The destruction of the wheel and the release from an eternal mock slavery seems the most noble, altruistic and magnanimous action that a mere mortal could undertake in that world. After all what is life enslaved to eternal repetition and never being able to advance or be allowed to evolve? Pointless. Life is not profound and utterly lacks in meaning or purpose.

 

I'm genuinely puzzled. If you dislike the concept so much, why are you reading the books? (I take it you are reading the books?)

 

PS. Are you a red or a grey? Or a black?

 

 

Because the story is intriguing and entertaining. However that does not mean I would ever want to live in such a universe or if I did I would be akin to my first post in this topic. Especially not if everything is for naught, there is no continuation and existence is more akin to a broken record stuttering the same two seconds over ad infinitum than it is a river of endless possibilities. Even the concept of free will does not truly exist.

 

Also what's with the color scheme?

[Eichhörnchen]

Liberty or death. I would align myself with the Shadow out of purely philosophical reasoning. The entire concept of the wheel is perverse and offensive to my sensibilities. To be enslaved for eternity in a circle of endless repetition is a farce. Even in my present incarnation I wouldn't know how many previous lives, fates and destinies I had to toil through in my endless stream through the pattern. The destruction of the wheel and the release from an eternal mock slavery seems the most noble, altruistic and magnanimous action that a mere mortal could undertake in that world. After all what is life enslaved to eternal repetition and never being able to advance or be allowed to evolve? Pointless. Life is not profound and utterly lacks in meaning or purpose.

Well, I have to admit that I agree with quite a lot of that.

 

Given however how the world functions there, it's between getting stuck in fate or being devoured by an eldritch abomination. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

 

As for the poll, I would have to roll as an Asha'man.

 

 

However at some point all must come to an end. The question is how long would you want your thread to be recycled, recycled and recycled? Forced to live through the same fates, tragedies and ages again, again and again ad infinitum. There is no linear progression but only a circular retardation. Nothing changes, not even this age is unique or special as stated by RJ. At least if one destroys the wheel the pattern is finally broken and the bliss of chaos that defines nature can finally take hold. The unleashing of the Dark One does not destroy the Creator, merely the rotating hamster wheel of the current plane of existence. The question is does one want to run eternally in the hamster wheel only never to arrive at any destination one has not visited before? Or perhaps destroy what should have never been and is an affront to existence itself, so as to allow for the possibility of a new creation to be formed in the void left behind. There is nothing to prevent the Creator from forming or creating a new plane of existence that finally functions in a linear form. Opting out of fear and selfishness to be trapped in what is essentially the Creators eternally repeating minstrel show seems to be a shallow existence devoid of true meaning anyway.

 

You should read Veins of Gold again...I think that was Rand's dilemma: Why save the world when all the suffering would happen again and again and again? And then he realized that all of the love and friendships, etc. would also happen again and again and again...So I guess it depends on what we think the "true meaning" is.

 

The loves and friendships are rather empty no? There is no finality or even desire to cherish them for one has infinite opportunities to live out the same or similar lives again and again. Take Birgitte and Gaidal Cain, they will hollow out in time and their commitment to each other will evolve less to one of fulfillment and more to solemn duty.

 

In this world I should cherish my love and friends for in but mere decades our fates are sealed by whichever path we tread, whether we're still in contact at that point or a world apart. In Randland there is no finality, no closure and nothing one does carries any consequence besides balefire. However this is only when viewing matters in a severely restricted localized fashion. If we expand our sights to a more encompassing view, you will notice that humanity is castrated. It can never reach any potential or tread down a future that is not predetermined or doomed to repetition.

 

Once this has been fully realized and the enlightenment of the utter cruel cosmic joke behind the wheel sets in,..I suppose the nihilism begins. It is hardly surprising that for the greater good some might feel inclined to seek a destruction of the wheel which loops time into a circle and hope to find a way to create linearity. If it ends up in the utter destruction of the current plane of existence? I suppose all minstrel shows must end some time, it's not as if I have to feel too great a sorrow. Everyone has lived a near uncounted number of lives, they are only spared the realization of their horrible fate of endless limbo through ignorance. The only exception being those who are affected by the taint, in some of whom the walls or blissful ignorance doesn't shield them from their previous lives. At least the void left behind leaves the space for a new creation, a creation which has an actual future, to form.

[Vambram]

In my opinion, it is very clear to me that Eichornchen does NOT understand the Wheel of Time half as well as he believes that he does.

[Zentari]

In my opinion, it is very clear to me that Eichornchen does NOT understand the Wheel of Time half as well as he believes that he does.

Such an interesting opinion that.Is that somehow more valid than his and how so ? Just because there are good things in the wheel, it does not mean that there aren't bad ones too.If your destiny in the grand scheme of things was to be dragged by trolloks to be raped and eaten I'm betting that your philosophical stance would be : **** the creator, time to go black.

[Vambram]

It is clear that the VAST MAJORITY of people in RJ's fictional world do NOT get spun out of the Wheel each and every cycle. Maybe one of the HCFF's around here can search through the database of interviews and book signings to find a quote from RJ to verify this.

[Zentari]

It is clear that the VAST MAJORITY of people in RJ's fictional world do NOT get spun out of the Wheel each and every cycle. Maybe one of the HCFF's around here can search through the database of interviews and book signings to find a quote from RJ to verify this.

Does that make this somehow better ? By the wheel's mechanics isn't your future predetermined ? And even if it isn't , the general flow of things is.Enjoy being devoured by the eldritch abomination you just unleashed on the wheel.

 

Someone can understand the system , including the part about the creator not interfering because in doing so it would mean that his creation is imperfect, and yet still find the whole thing abhorrent.

[FarShainMael]

what's with the color scheme?

 

Unless my German dictionary has badly let me down, it's three possible variants of your forum name.

[WhiskyJack]

It is clear that the VAST MAJORITY of people in RJ's fictional world do NOT get spun out of the Wheel each and every cycle. Maybe one of the HCFF's around here can search through the database of interviews and book signings to find a quote from RJ to verify this.

 

 

Wheel forcing souls in Randworld depends more on people reproducing (or the population) and less to do with wheel's desire. In AoL, there were billions of people in world, not a fraction is alive.

[UncleButcher1980]

I'd be Faile's Warder.

[Vambram]

It is clear that the VAST MAJORITY of people in RJ's fictional world do NOT get spun out of the Wheel each and every cycle. Maybe one of the HCFF's around here can search through the database of interviews and book signings to find a quote from RJ to verify this.

Does that make this somehow better ?

 

Yes

 

By the wheel's mechanics isn't your future predetermined ?

 

No. There is something called free will, and choices that Randlanders get to make. I am not talking about the named characters in the WOT books, but instead, I am talking about the unnamed people and citizens in the various towns, villages, and cities who live their lives with the freedom of choice and free will. The vast majority of those folks are do not get reincarnated from one Age to another in the Wheel of Time. Nor, do they get reincarnated, reborn, or spun out by the Wheel in a future Age many thousands of years in the future.... or the past, depending upon how you look at the cycle of the Wheel and the Pattern.

 

 

 

And even if it isn't , the general flow of things is.Enjoy being devoured by the eldritch abomination you just unleashed on the wheel.

 

Someone can understand the system , including the part about the creator not interfering because in doing so it would mean that his creation is imperfect, and yet still find the whole thing abhorrent.

 

If so, then why would such a person be a fan of Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time series?

 

 

 

[sandoz12]

I'd be Faile's Warder.

I take it you are just kidding? Otherwise I am guessing you must have some serious masochistic tendencies. Of course we are both overlooking the fact that Faile can't channel.

[quick ben]

Soletaken Eleint. You know, an actual Dragon!

 

Love it!!!

 

GOLD

[Zentari]

Yes

So, it's somehow better since they only get one shot.Except for the poor suckers that get incarnated while the DO is on a rampage and the trolloc feedings that are all the rage.Those are just screwed.

 

 

 

No. There is something called free will, and choices that Randlanders get to make. I am not talking about the named characters in the WOT books, but instead, I am talking about the unnamed people and citizens in the various towns, villages, and cities who live their lives with the freedom of choice and free will. The vast majority of those folks are do not get reincarnated from one Age to another in the Wheel of Time. Nor, do they get reincarnated, reborn, or spun out by the Wheel in a future Age many thousands of years in the future.... or the past, depending upon how you look at the cycle of the Wheel and the Pattern.

Yeah, that is going to be SO reassuring to all the people that get the shaft because it's that time of the ages when the DO runs free.

 

 

 

 

If so, then why would such a person be a fan of Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time series?

Why not ? One can find the books to be enjoyable despite flaws or disagreements.If that weren't the case with WoT, you can bet that it would have a hell of a lot fans with all the overbearing women running rampart,for example.

[Eichhörnchen]

It is clear that the VAST MAJORITY of people in RJ's fictional world do NOT get spun out of the Wheel each and every cycle. Maybe one of the HCFF's around here can search through the database of interviews and book signings to find a quote from RJ to verify this.

Does that make this somehow better ?

 

Yes

 

By the wheel's mechanics isn't your future predetermined ?

 

No. There is something called free will, and choices that Randlanders get to make. I am not talking about the named characters in the WOT books, but instead, I am talking about the unnamed people and citizens in the various towns, villages, and cities who live their lives with the freedom of choice and free will. The vast majority of those folks are do not get reincarnated from one Age to another in the Wheel of Time. Nor, do they get reincarnated, reborn, or spun out by the Wheel in a future Age many thousands of years in the future.... or the past, depending upon how you look at the cycle of the Wheel and the Pattern.

 

 

 

And even if it isn't , the general flow of things is.Enjoy being devoured by the eldritch abomination you just unleashed on the wheel.

 

Someone can understand the system , including the part about the creator not interfering because in doing so it would mean that his creation is imperfect, and yet still find the whole thing abhorrent.

 

If so, then why would such a person be a fan of Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time series?

 

 

 

You have a differing interpretation as to the nature of the Wheel as I have. The pattern is made of many threads. As with the entire analogy of knitting new threads can be added to the pattern however cannot leave the pattern. Even the nameless unnamed villager #44324 is a reborn being whose thread has perhaps served as soldier #463634 in the previous incarnation. Very few precious threads get to keep their identity such as signified by Birgitte.

 

How do you presume to think that the Dark One recaptures the lives of his underlings who die? Because they will of course all be woven back in come time as a new incarnation. The Dark One merely grabs the thread and forcefully knits it right back into the pattern after it's been plucked away through death. It's also why the Dark One cannot salvage underlings who died through balefire, there is no more thread to brute force back into the pattern.

 

Free Will is rather illusory. You cannot choose to die or eradicate oneself. Perhaps the only form of final peace or rest is death through balefire. You are trapped for eternity in a never ending marionette show which seems a mockery to life itself. You will never progress further than a certain point before the age ending and the entire cosmic drama needs to be repeated.

 

Why should I dislike the Wheel of Time series? You're acting in a rather facetious manner and quite frankly there is no logical reason as to how my opposition to the nature of the Wheel has anything to do with my appreciation of RJ's penmanship. Would you say everyone who rails about how they dislike Egwene hates the entire series?

Or everyone who hates Tuon hates the entire series?

 

All I am stating is that my interpretation of the books seem for me to paint Elan Tedronai/Ishamael/Moridin as the anti-hero of the novels. He seems the singular figure who is aiming at following a course of actions which truly has any consequence in any cosmic nature. He seems to be following the only universally morally commendable course of action in putting an end to a perverse cosmic joke that has been put on rewind far too many times and unleashing the only force into existence capable of cracking the Wheel in two. Perhaps finally allowing the creation of a system allowing a progressive linear flow of time instead of trapping humanity in a hamster wheel of circular enslavement.

[UncleButcher1980]

I'd be Faile's Warder.

I take it you are just kidding? Otherwise I am guessing you must have some serious masochistic tendencies. Of course we are both overlooking the fact that Faile can't channel.

 

No, I'm deadly serious. And I imagine something could be arranged similar to Min and Rand.

[OptimusPrime]

In my opinion, it is very clear to me that Eichornchen does NOT understand the Wheel of Time half as well as he believes that he does.

 

I am inclined to disagree. He is merely looking at it from a different viewpoint, and he makes some very good points.

 

That isnt to say I would be Ishamael if I could. Even though he has become my favorite character (sorry Rand)

 

No Nym?

 

Ive got to go with Ashaman. It doesnt HAVE to be about making heads explode, and it doesnt HAVE to be about strength. Do not try and tell me Androl wont have his moment with Aludras Dragons. I like the idea of channeling saidin because you can provide greater circles; chances are, if there were angreal at the ready (and Moridin wasnt your M'Hael) you would get to use one if you were the Ashaman in such a circle.

[Vambram]

It just boggles my mind that Ishy aka Moridin has become the favorite character for some of the fans. Yes, Moridin is a very interesting and fascinating character. But is there any doubt that Moridin is Robert Jordan's chief villain meant to stop The Dragon Reborn from defeating the Dark One?

Please remember, in some of his interviews and blogs where he was questioned about Ishy/Moridin, Robert Jordan said that

"Ishamael is a lying liar that lies... and you believe him?"