Inactivity

[LilyElizabeth]

How many of you have had it with the lack of activity in mafia lately on DM? I thought rather than pick up my toys and play elsewhere, I'd try seeing if we could have a discussion on the topic and go from there. This isn't just a bitch session, although you are welcome to vent if you need to. I used to love DM mafia, and I'd rather try to resurrect it than just move on. Anybody else feel the same?

[Krakalakachkn]

ME! ME!

[alannalynn]

Yes, and I've complained about it beyond multiple times and gotten enraged other times when I'm on a mafia team that is especially inactive. I just can't stand it. When people are inactive, it makes me not care anymore because there's no way to JUDGE players if they're not talking. It goes both ways and inactivity loses the game for the town. I recently had to choose between two players at end game. By Day 9, one had posted a TOTAL of 11 times, the other a TOTAL of 18. Unfortunately for me I pick the more "active" one to cast majority vote for a lynch and lose the game. This was WoT mafia. Oops! *sigh*

 

If you know you're not going to be able to contribute (which is posting at LEAST once a day-- and ACTUAL posts, not "oh yeah, whatever, I'm here...") then you shouldn't sign up for it in the first place. And saying you have nothing to say doesn't really cut it: at least agree and TRY to form your own thoughts or admit you are confused. . . just my two cents. I'm fed up with inactive players, makes active players give up on the game too and then you come to a standstill and everyone is screwed.

[LilyElizabeth]

I confess, I have another reason for starting this thread. I'm thinking of changing my rule from players having to post every game day to having to post every RL day. And I mean a content post. Do you guys think that will help?

 

I'm not good at teaching people how to play, what to say, etc. and I think we need some players who are to try to get things going again. I've never been big on knowing what to say day one, and now nobody says much, and it just goes on from there. Anybody good at that and able to help? I can't, not knowing how really myself.

[alannalynn]

I confess, I have another reason for starting this thread. I'm thinking of changing my rule from players having to post every game day to having to post every RL day. And I mean a content post. Do you guys think that will help?

 

I'm not good at teaching people how to play, what to say, etc. and I think we need some players who are to try to get things going again. I've never been big on knowing what to say day one, and now nobody says much, and it just goes on from there. Anybody good at that and able to help? I can't, not knowing how really myself.

Sounds good, but in reality it wouldn't work. Weekends always slow down and some people just can't get online some days. If anything I would suggest stricter modkill rules, though that still screws with both sides, but I don't think having it as a threat is enough. It only takes one game where half the players are modkilled day one for inactivity for people to learn their lesson.

 

I've gotten to the point where, if I'm on a mafia team (haven't been on a good one in a while), if I think they're not posting enough, I'll count their posts for them and let them know the last time they posted. I know it's a bitchy thing to do, but I don't want to put MY self out there when no one else is.

 

As for day one, I'm currently experimenting with stuff... Though I think the stickies in the Organized Games forum could be updated/ explained more thoroughly, definitely.

 

 

[hotpocket2006]

I agree. I'm playing that game at JN and wow it's amazing!! I started playing mafia here on DM, and since I've started it's normally pretty inactive besides DPRs game, but I still get really angry everytime someone get's randomly killed. When I get mad on thread people make excuses and tell me that I haven't given people enough time to respond to my poking and blah blah blah. I know real life happens, but most people make excuses for work and such. You know when you sign up that you have to work, if you can't make the commitment, then don't sign up. I think it's super unfair for the mod and the players who actually want to play.

 

When I see a game in sign up and see the people who sign up, I normally can pick out those I know who will be innactive. *sigh* I like the idea of having people post at least once every RL day. That's super easy to do as I know most people get on DM at least once a day. I don't think I can teach people how to play lol most people don't like my play style so I'd rather not teach anyone my bad habbits

[LilyElizabeth]

I think my complaint isn't with the people who have work and such, although I agree that if you're too busy to play, you're too busy to play. So don't. But really it's the ones who lurk on purpose. That's fine if mostly everyone else is posting, but now it's the norm. I don't like that.

 

I dunno. Maybe I should just stick to fast mafia. Then you kind of have to post every day.

 

I'm really hoping to generate something positive with this thread, although I recognize that we all need to vent. This has been building since last summer.

[ed2funy]

I can't really speak, having not played in 3 months with my LOA.

But, even on LOLA (only get so much time a day, if any as the days go by), I contribute to the game I just signed up for!

 

It's been a trend for awhile, and seems to have only gotten worse.

 

I'm not so sure as what to do to get them active again. As far as I know, the game hasn't change (in a good way). lol

[Red2111]

if exceptions were made for weekands, i'd be down with a MK rule on posting once every RL day. i agree with AJ that being strict on the "no activity your MK'd or no content post atleast once a day & night will get you MKd" will help. i can understand from a mod POV how this isn't somethign you want to do, all kinds of roles will be lost and it might throw off the balance completely, but a few games with all the mods doing this will keep the inactives past Day 1 from signing up.

 

 

i'm also trying some new stuff for day 1, and i see other poeple trying it as well. i've noticed that just in my month break that activity is at a snails pace in games and i agree thats its agrevating to only have a few people to bounce off cases and it pretty much wins the game for the scum; so theres not much fun in being scum or even much reason for being proud of winning a game. the snese of accomplishment that comes with beign scum & fooling the town is gone, and for me, thats part of the fun.

 

i've seen alot of new players, which is great. but with the low activity level right now i'm scared their goign to think thats how mafia is played which isn't fair to them at all cause it's providing them with a very fulfilling addiction.

 

 

as for teaching players ... if their goign to be inactive, it will go through one ear and out the other ya know. their goign to do it anyway. i guess something else we can do is when were on a scum team start taking out the inactives, as town maybe make a harder pull for pressuring the inactives with votes, and as Mods maybe trying to keep the random lynches from hitting active players and not adding a persons name to the sign up list if we know they'll turn inactive. if they really want to play, maybe have them acknowledge it's a conditional play, that they'll most likey be Vanilla and if their not semi active or give productive posts in the game for even a single phase they'll be MK'd. we could also have the disclaimer that known active players will have preferrance for game roles.

 

 

not to make excuses for lurkers or people who fall behind in games, but i can understand that. it happened to me right before i took a break. i signed up for a game, had forgotten i signed up; life got buisy and took over pushing the game to the back burner. i kept posting when i could, and chuncking through a hand full of pages at a time with my thoughts; but it wasn't until near the end that i finally caught up (the WoT game) and i still feel horrible about that because i know i coudl have stopped two innocents from getting lynched.

 

yes i shoudl have dropped the game, but my pride (i hate to quit things) and feelings for the Mod kept me from droppign the game. i didn't want them to have to deal with finding a replacement in the middle of a game nor put the brnden of catching up on a fairley active game halfway through. i still feel horrible, and theres no excuse for it; but there you have it. i think my only saving grace was that it's only happened in 2 games in the entire time i've playe mafia here no one said anythign to me about it, but still knowing how active players feel about inactives; i cant help but being ashamed of that

[Talya]

The thing is I never understand, is why people want to play the game and then just lurk? To me there is no fun in that. Even if you give them a good role it makes no difference. They are still inactive. And the worst thing is the people that say I haven't got anything to add. Now there are times when we all feel like that, but it seems to the things some people say all the time. And I agree it kills a game. You end up not wanting to get rid of those that are active because you want to play, and it would be no fun left with quiet ones.

 

The only thing I can think of is a black list, maybe that would make people think. Maybe if they were on it they could play some basic games with about 12 people in to build back up and then get their names taken off a list if they are active and can then be accepted for the big games. It's not nice naming and shaming though! So not sure that would be a good way to go.

 

Maybe say that people have to post so many times in a Day or night phase. That way they can't get away with just the one post, and if they can't get on in a RL day then they can make up for it when they can!

[LilyElizabeth]

I don't like the idea of a blacklist, exactly, but maybe if mod were more choosy about who could play in their games....

 

I'm actually thinking of modding a small game with just the people who are posting on this thread and see if it can get fun again.

[Talya]

Yeah, when i wrote it i thought it wouldn't be too nice.

 

I'd play!

 

The best games are those when everyone has things to say, i love them! When I first started playing, there was only ever one on the boards in fiddles. So I guess there was no where else to get your fix. And there was ones that played all the time. They never seemed to get quiet, things were going on all the time!

[hotpocket2006]

I don't agree about the blacklist, but maybe mods should pm those that sign up that they know are pretty innactive and warn them that they will get modkilled if they are a productive member of the game and just trying to skate by and also warning if that happens then they are banned from playing in future games they mod.

[Talya]

That would be a good idea. I think because there are quite a few games that are high in numbers we sometimes are grateful on anyone being there. But I suppose you could watrn tham in your games, and if they don't take heed, kindly say that for the time being you don't want them in your games. I would never say anything would be permanent though. It's hard,. because you don't want to seem rude. But when you put a lot of effort into modding a game, then it's bad manners to join up and not really play it!

[LilyElizabeth]

I'd much rather replace than modkill. I have only ever modkilled for breaking a PR.

[Little Miss]

So far I think that they rule of an actual content post would be awesome.

 

The other thing I noticed lately is the new change that if a lynch isn't made ALL members are up for a lynch. I honestly don't agree with that because I have seen a ton of people say "I am with holding a vote since I don't think you are right" and never get around to voting. I think perhaps we need to go back to non voters are up for a mod kill if a lynch isn't reached.

 

I also like the idea of maybe a few invitation only games.. but then again.. I am not really an expert myself.. how ever.. we seem to have a lot of newbs and I feel like a lot of them are getting a lot of conflicting info on how to play.. it is hard to overly explain mid game with out some one possibley targeting you.

 

So instead of playing an certain peoples only game... have requirements.. like the activity one, and maybe a "must have taken a basics of mafia class"

[Verbal32]

I think the problem partly stems from general activity on the site down as a whole. With the switch to 8.0 and all the maintenance mode stuff, people just haven't been online as much. And when they do, they are probably checking in on their Orgs before starting a new mafia game.

 

And there are definitely those that just lurk. I have a private blacklist that I keep in my head of people I won't let into a game I mod. For the rest, I think having strict activity rules will encourage people to be more active, but you'll still run into the problem of MKing people and having it affect your game.

 

All in all, the biggest concern I have is something that we all do and take part in, but I'm going to get flamed for saying. Bring most of the mafia games back into the OG board and off of the Org boards. I'm in 2 games on DM that aren't in OG, so I'm guilty as well. But when you spread out the playerbase across multiple Orgs, it really does cause people to forget where they are playing (coupled with maintenance mode not supplying new content notifications) and makes it easy to fall into a lurky playstyle.

 

I'm not saying that it's bad that mafia games are played in the Orgs - it helps with activity and just a general fun thing to do, but it does make players spread out too much and forget game as opposed to having 1 primary place (here) where most games are played. Right now, there are more games outside of OG than inside, and I'm not sure that's the best way to have it. Just my 2 cents - I'm a filthy hypocrite for even posting this, lol.

[WWWwombat]

I would love to mod a game here but the queue is so long and OG doesn't seem to the numbers some of the orgs do so I think I will have to run my first themed game in an org :(

[hotpocket2006]

Yes I think that's the problem. People want to run multiple games, themed, and here in OG only one themed game is allowed at a time and there's a big line.

[Little Miss]

Yes there is a big line. But I think the addicts a they call them selfs are also guilty for spreading them selves out to thin

[Red2111]

That would be a good idea. I think because there are quite a few games that are high in numbers we sometimes are grateful on anyone being there. But I suppose you could watrn tham in your games, and if they don't take heed, kindly say that for the time being you don't want them in your games. I would never say anything would be permanent though. It's hard,. because you don't want to seem rude. But when you put a lot of effort into modding a game, then it's bad manners to join up and not really play it!

 

^^ what Tal said. i think an open black list will actually have the opposite effect of what were trying to achieve. also another thing i'd be wary of with starting black lists (even private ones) is singling out people in public. if your goign to disclude or warn a person befoer you let them sign up for your game then it's best left in private via PM.

 

that justa personal preferrance for me. i know as a mod i'd feel awkward, and as a player i'd feel embarrased; so it helps pervent a sticky situation. but it is your right as a mod to tell a person you don't want them to play *nods*

 

 

I think the problem partly stems from general activity on the site down as a whole. With the switch to 8.0 and all the maintenance mode stuff, people just haven't been online as much. And when they do, they are probably checking in on their Orgs before starting a new mafia game.

 

And there are definitely those that just lurk. I have a private blacklist that I keep in my head of people I won't let into a game I mod. For the rest, I think having strict activity rules will encourage people to be more active, but you'll still run into the problem of MKing people and having it affect your game.

 

All in all, the biggest concern I have is something that we all do and take part in, but I'm going to get flamed for saying. Bring most of the mafia games back into the OG board and off of the Org boards. I'm in 2 games on DM that aren't in OG, so I'm guilty as well. But when you spread out the playerbase across multiple Orgs, it really does cause people to forget where they are playing (coupled with maintenance mode not supplying new content notifications) and makes it easy to fall into a lurky playstyle.

 

I'm not saying that it's bad that mafia games are played in the Orgs - it helps with activity and just a general fun thing to do, but it does make players spread out too much and forget game as opposed to having 1 primary place (here) where most games are played. Right now, there are more games outside of OG than inside, and I'm not sure that's the best way to have it. Just my 2 cents - I'm a filthy hypocrite for even posting this, lol.

 

 

Verb, i can't agree with you more on this and you aren't a hypocrite for bringing this up. i think i was part of the mods that originally started moving the games over to the Orgs; partly because of the huge Que list and also because it helps attract new members to the Orgs.

 

but you're right. activity all over DM is down; so i certaintly agree that for now it's best to move all the games back to just being in the OG section. atleast until activity picks back up site wide.

 

 

if all the mods can agree on this, the Que list might have to be gone through, like PMing all the mods on there to see if there still active members or going to run their games. alot of those Mods signed up before te switch to DM8. maybe allowing more games to be in sign-ups at once; but not allowing huge games. it makes no sense for us to do huge games until the player base is boosted again. right now, there aren't enough active players to run a 20+ game tbh.

[LilyElizabeth]

No flaming here, Verb. I'd love to mod here. I'd love to play here. I've had a themed game written since May slated for this board. That's how long I've been in the queue, I think. If the queue moved faster, I'd bring my games back here in a heartbeat. I don't mind waiting my turn, but I have waited a long time for it. If you can get that problem fixed, I'll even advertise OG games that I'm involved with.

 

Could we maybe have huge (over 24 players) games be a separate category? Just an idea.

[Talya]

I have to say I'm limiting myself to just 2 games. I can't give my all if I do any more.

 

I think you have a point Verb. It maybe something the Staff can come up with on the Social Group boards. A list of Social Groups who want to run a game and only having a few going at once. That way, we wouldn't be inundated with games, and maybe there would more quality playing.

 

I still think this should be the main place for them.

 

Another reason is that everyone seems to do large games now, gone are the fun 12-15 player games that were straight forward. They can be just as fun!

 

I think each mod will have to work out how they deal with non actives. I like the idea of so many posts in a Day/Night phase, or they get a warning, then modkilled as a last resort!

 

I also don't like Modkilling. because it upsets the game, but I have had to do it. If you write it in the rules then you need to follow what you have said!

[Krakalakachkn]

I would love to mod a game here but the queue is so long and OG doesn't seem to the numbers some of the orgs do so I think I will have to run my first themed game in an org :(

 

I know Corki finally broke down and said we could do one in the Band's boards...something completely different! So that's an option, if you're interested.

 

 

 

As to the blacklist, I was thinking about this earlier. I think it's a great idea. I think, depending on who's modding, selective choice might be a good idea. Meaning, have games that are only open to people who have played 3 or more games and then have separate games open to anyone. Or secretly PM people yo know will be active beforehand and then when you open the signups, those people will have already said yea or nay, and the rest is whomever gets there first.

[Verbal32]

I would love to mod a game here but the queue is so long and OG doesn't seem to the numbers some of the orgs do so I think I will have to run my first themed game in an org :(

 

See below.

 

 

Yes I think that's the problem. People want to run multiple games, themed, and here in OG only one themed game is allowed at a time and there's a big line.

 

See below.

 

 

Yes there is a big line. But I think the addicts a they call them selfs are also guilty for spreading them selves out to thin

 

Agreed.

 

 

 

From above: I'm going to re-do OG a bit. A shake-up, if you will. I will take into mind everything you guys/gals/Krak are saying here and make some changes that should help. I might not get to it today, but definitely by next week.