[s]Goal: 100,000 New Goal: 200,000[/s] New Goal: 250.000

[BFG]

 

How often do they get redrawn?

 

But yeah that sucks :(

I believe every 10 years, following the census. Next census is in 2020. The state governor submits the proposal and the state supreme court has to approve it.

 

Not long enough for population demographics to change enough I'd guess :(

[Leyrann]

Update about Hamburg: 178 million euros damage. For comparision, fifteen times that is the most damaging tornado in history.

 

So yeah, you could compare it to a tornado raging through the city.

[Shad_]

Not long enough for population demographics to change enough I'd guess :(

I don't think that's really relevant though? The whole point of gerrymandering is to artificially realign the demographics. You can live a 20 minute drive from Pittsburgh and be represented by a guy three hours away in central PA. The idea is to take one district and make it like 90% Democrat, then split up the leftovers so the other four districts can all be 55% Republican.

[Leyrann]

And if you look at a random tornado like the fifth most damaging ever, then you're looking at about a fifth of that tornado's damage.

[Leyrann]

 

Not long enough for population demographics to change enough I'd guess :(

I don't think that's really relevant though? The whole point of gerrymandering is to artificially realign the demographics. You can live a 20 minute drive from Pittsburgh and be represented by a guy three hours away in central PA. The idea is to take one district and make it like 90% Democrat, then split up the leftovers so the other four districts can all be 55% Republican.

 

 

You guys (and England too) should honestly do it like the Netherlands.

 

All votes are equal, they all get added together, and those totals are divided over the seats in the house of whatever-the-f-it-was-called. Then, the parties in there (most likely no one got an absolute majority) start talking to one another and they form a coalition where, together, they have a majority. They together put forth the ministers and the president.

[Leyrann]

It's certainly not perfect - believe me - but it's a whole lot better than what you got right now.

[Shad_]

We have four districts that are majority Democrat. (The fifth blue seat was a swing. The small margins they give themselves don't always win out.)

 

On average, the majority Democrat districts hold a 26% margin, e.g. if everyone voted as registered the outcome would be 37% Republican 67% Democrat.

 

The majority Republican districts hold an 8% margin, e.g. if everyone voted as registered the outcome would be 48% Democrat 54% Republican.

 

Do you follow me?

[Shad_]

You guys (and England too) should honestly do it like the Netherlands.

 

All votes are equal, they all get added together, and those totals are divided over the seats in the house of whatever-the-f-it-was-called. Then, the parties in there (most likely no one got an absolute majority) start talking to one another and they form a coalition where, together, they have a majority. They together put forth the ministers and the president.

Yes.

 

Like, that's such an obviously better way to do it.

 

National elections should be determined by the national population. State elections should be determined by the state population. Local elections should be determined by individual districts. Dang, that actually makes sense.

[Lessa Nikia]

 

This boggles my mind still. You should be allowed to vote whoever after registering and not be penalized.

I actually don't think this is a problem. You can vote whoever the heck you want in the general election, as long as you're registered. Party affiliation on your registry simply permits you to vote in their primary: i.e., you get to have a say on which candidate your party puts forth for the general election, but you don't get to have a say in which candidate every party puts forth.

 

It's actually a lot more democratic in the Republican party than in the Democratic party. The Dems have something akin to the electoral college where one person can step in and override x thousands of votes. This is part of why Hillary Clinton got the nomination even though Bernie Sanders was the more popular candidate.

 

I think the problem is more the electoral college and the fact that we're stuck in a 2-party system with no run-off votes.

 

And school placement shouldn't be based on income, that's just wrong. I know here, it's all based on who's school limits you're within.

Legally speaking it's based on which limits you're in here too, the boundaries are just drawn based on income. It's the same reason a region that's 75% Democrat can wind up with 1 Democrat representative and 3 Republicans. It's just classic gerrymandering worked to fine precision via modern technology that can crunch all the numbers and spit out a map where one side always wins regardless of how people vote.

 

Ah I understand now. It's sorta how if you belong to a party here (you donate money) you can vote for the leader of the party when they have to replace one. But we don't have a set time before the election for that to happen.

 

Thank you for explaining Shad. Considering how much you guys effect us it doesn't hurt to know more 

 

How'd we get talking about politics?

[BFG]

 

Not long enough for population demographics to change enough I'd guess :(

I don't think that's really relevant though? The whole point of gerrymandering is to artificially realign the demographics. You can live a 20 minute drive from Pittsburgh and be represented by a guy three hours away in central PA. The idea is to take one district and make it like 90% Democrat, then split up the leftovers so the other four districts can all be 55% Republican.

 

 

 

That wasn't my point my point was that republicans will always be able to redraw boundaries to 'suit' themselves as the population demographic doesn't have chance to change within a district to allow the representative to change.

 

I'm not saying the current system is fair, I'm trying to figure out if it can be changed

[Leyrann]

 

 

This boggles my mind still. You should be allowed to vote whoever after registering and not be penalized.

I actually don't think this is a problem. You can vote whoever the heck you want in the general election, as long as you're registered. Party affiliation on your registry simply permits you to vote in their primary: i.e., you get to have a say on which candidate your party puts forth for the general election, but you don't get to have a say in which candidate every party puts forth.

 

It's actually a lot more democratic in the Republican party than in the Democratic party. The Dems have something akin to the electoral college where one person can step in and override x thousands of votes. This is part of why Hillary Clinton got the nomination even though Bernie Sanders was the more popular candidate.

 

I think the problem is more the electoral college and the fact that we're stuck in a 2-party system with no run-off votes.

 

And school placement shouldn't be based on income, that's just wrong. I know here, it's all based on who's school limits you're within.

Legally speaking it's based on which limits you're in here too, the boundaries are just drawn based on income. It's the same reason a region that's 75% Democrat can wind up with 1 Democrat representative and 3 Republicans. It's just classic gerrymandering worked to fine precision via modern technology that can crunch all the numbers and spit out a map where one side always wins regardless of how people vote.

 

Ah I understand now. It's sorta how if you belong to a party here (you donate money) you can vote for the leader of the party when they have to replace one. But we don't have a set time before the election for that to happen.

 

Thank you for explaining Shad. Considering how much you guys effect us it doesn't hurt to know more 

 

How'd we get talking about politics?

 

 

It all started when I made a post about the riots in Hamburg (officially) related to G20.

[BFG]

I may be eating one of the most unpleasant Caesar salads I've ever had

[Ithillian Turambar]

D&D BT

[Leyrann]

D&D BT

 

In.

[Shad_]

How'd we get talking about politics?

It's a difficult topic to avoid entirely when the developed world is going through a major crisis/upheaval in power distribution.

 

I think it's important for people outside of America to understand how our process works, because the assumption that this will just fix itself like it did after G.W. is wrong.  Our system is cracking at its foundation and we're beginning to have significantly more in common with Putin's Russia than with western democracy.  The deterioration could potentially reverse, but don't count on it.

 

Ley brought it up blame him.

 

It's nice to be able to chat about this on DM once in a while and not be harassed into silence by the trolls that police our Debate forum against any sign of non-ultra-right-wing thinking.

 

Banana.

[Shad_]

That wasn't my point my point was that republicans will always be able to redraw boundaries to 'suit' themselves as the population demographic doesn't have chance to change within a district to allow the representative to change.

 

I'm not saying the current system is fair, I'm trying to figure out if it can be changed

Well

 

PA is a swing state.

 

We currently have a Democrat as governor, and we voted for Obama both terms.

 

If that seat can be held when it's up for reelection, remapping is entirely possible.  Our state congress doesn't get to have a say in it, I don't believe.

[Shad_]

D&D BT

 

D&D is really really really really toxic though. 

[Shad_]

Banana!

[Ithillian Turambar]

Oh good grief yes it is. It's amazing how many peoples over there have their generalisms know exactly the state of play over here in th UK and me and Turin just smile and go nah ...

 

But the folks there like to play that way or they wouldn't do it. The interwebs takes all sorts. Much nicer here though.

[Ithillian Turambar]

I raise your banana and bet three crocodiles.

[Leyrann]

*all in*

[Shad_]

Phoebe is starting to walk.

[Shad_]

It's so cute.

[Shad_]

She takes three steps and falls over and starts giggling because she's so proud of herself.

[Shad_]

<3 <3 <3