Discuss Rand

[babuada]

One thing to note. He is using Light now. He used it before without knowing in FoH when he fought DarkHounds in Rhuidian. But this time he used it conciously.

"He stopped in the center of the Flame on the floor"

[Ltsegarra]

On Rand dying...

When prophecy says someone is "meant" to die we shouldn't invest a lot in it. I'm predicting that if Rand wants a "normal" life the part of him that is the "Dragon Reborn" must be split of. Namely, Lews Therin and as I'm predicting the "shaitan" parts. I think the sealing of both the light side with the dark side is what needs to be "sealed" together..or healed.

Rands "Last battle" isnt going to be about power or how many Trollcs, fades, and dread lords he can kill. That battle is going to be left to the human armies, Aes Sedai, and Ashaman. Rands "last battle" is all about reclaiming his humanity.

 

That being said I still find it hard for Rand to "survive" as he is now..he seems too godly, not to mention 3 women running around with babies. Min will probably be pregnant soon. Rand can't go back to being just a farmer, or even being just a king of Tear. Nations could never just let him be. I see him slinking off with Min and disappearing in the mists of time.

 

On the True Source...the Dark One is the father of lies. The Dark One pretends to be the only source of True Source but I think much like "The Force" in Star Wars and said in and saidar, they reflect opposite sides of the same coin. Rand has the capabilities to tap into the Source because as he infers about the apples...it's about looking at the world in a different way(i m paraphrasing). The True Source "coloring" is how Rand sees it at a given time. Prior to his awakening in the last novels, Rand viewed it negatively cause he believed the lies that the Dark One was the gateway to the True Source. Therefore Rands imagination colored the source black. Up to this point Rand was weak in strength relying on saidin only and not trusting the True Source. I think Rands true epiphany is that the True Source is both "light and dark" and since it's the force that drives the turning of the Wheel of Time, it's potential is unimGinable. Hence, Rands staggering show of power after the awakening. Rand also realizes that his "mood" affected reality around him, creating a dark reality in one span of time and creating it's opposite the next. I think now what frightened him wasn't just the sheer amount of power he was throwing around, but the less human he becomes while doing so.

[babuada]

The cloud to sunlight feature is probably for all the bonds of Rand. But it does not follow the bond. It just happened once at the time of his VoG. Elayne was in Caemlyn, Min and Alanna in Tear, Aviendha in Rhudian. All has clearsky immediately. But when Min went to Bandar Eban or Elayne to Cairhien, it did not follow them. It only follows Rand consistently everywhere.

[Ltsegarra]

Rand tells the farmer that the effects he's having on the "apples" will nor last once he's left. Therefore, the clouds over Andor or Camelyn is due to his babies reacting to Rands "Goodmood". Also, Mat and Perrins share in the good fortune, in part cause of their tavern nature and the hidden bonds between the three.

[f3llyn]

On Rand dying...

When prophecy says someone is "meant" to die we shouldn't invest a lot in it. I'm predicting that if Rand wants a "normal" life the part of him that is the "Dragon Reborn" must be split of. Namely, Lews Therin and as I'm predicting the "shaitan" parts. I think the sealing of both the light side with the dark side is what needs to be "sealed" together..or healed.

Rands "Last battle" isnt going to be about power or how many Trollcs, fades, and dread lords he can kill. That battle is going to be left to the human armies, Aes Sedai, and Ashaman. Rands "last battle" is all about reclaiming his humanity.

 

That being said I still find it hard for Rand to "survive" as he is now..he seems too godly, not to mention 3 women running around with babies. Min will probably be pregnant soon. Rand can't go back to being just a farmer, or even being just a king of Tear. Nations could never just let him be. I see him slinking off with Min and disappearing in the mists of time.

 

On the True Source...the Dark One is the father of lies. The Dark One pretends to be the only source of True Source but I think much like "The Force" in Star Wars and said in and saidar, they reflect opposite sides of the same coin. Rand has the capabilities to tap into the Source because as he infers about the apples...it's about looking at the world in a different way(i m paraphrasing). The True Source "coloring" is how Rand sees it at a given time. Prior to his awakening in the last novels, Rand viewed it negatively cause he believed the lies that the Dark One was the gateway to the True Source. Therefore Rands imagination colored the source black. Up to this point Rand was weak in strength relying on saidin only and not trusting the True Source. I think Rands true epiphany is that the True Source is both "light and dark" and since it's the force that drives the turning of the Wheel of Time, it's potential is unimGinable. Hence, Rands staggering show of power after the awakening. Rand also realizes that his "mood" affected reality around him, creating a dark reality in one span of time and creating it's opposite the next. I think now what frightened him wasn't just the sheer amount of power he was throwing around, but the less human he becomes while doing so.

Except for the Ashaman could see his weaves. If he was using the true power they wouldn't have been able to.

 

Rand tells the farmer that the effects he's having on the "apples" will nor last once he's left. Therefore, the clouds over Andor or Camelyn is due to his babies reacting to Rands "Goodmood". Also, Mat and Perrins share in the good fortune, in part cause of their tavern nature and the hidden bonds between the three.

That's not entirely true. The apples they pick will keep, and those that weren't will rot away again after he leaves the area. And I don't really think that has anything to do with the sunshine in the areas.

 

Anyways, it's impossible at this point to say for certain if that's the case because every time Rand is present the sunshine is. And every time the sunshine and Rand are present food suddenly is good when it wasn't before. And it stays good but the sunshine disappears with Rand.

[babuada]

Rand tells the farmer that the effects he's having on the "apples" will nor last once he's left. Therefore, the clouds over Andor or Camelyn is due to his babies reacting to Rands "Goodmood". Also, Mat and Perrins share in the good fortune, in part cause of their tavern nature and the hidden bonds between the three.

Did we see cloud returning when Elayne, Min or Avi left a place? Cloud definitely got removed at Tear (Alanna and Min) and Rhuidian (Aviendha). So, Rand's bond is in play.

[Ogrelin]

Hi

 

First post for me.

 

In the last chapter we get a glimpse of a group of Aiel with pointy filed teeths, my first thought was "Could this bee some of the Aiel males who learned they could channel and went to the blight?" Could the shadow somehow have managed to capture them and turn them with help of fades?

 

If so could this mean Rands father is alive?

 

If this is the case? there is another opportunity for the prophesy about Rands blood (besides Galad) has to spill on the slopes of Shayol Ghul?

[f3llyn]

Hi

 

First post for me.

 

In the last chapter we get a glimpse of a group of Aiel with pointy filed teeths, my first thought was "Could this bee some of the Aiel males who learned they could channel and went to the blight?" Could the shadow somehow have managed to capture them and turn them with help of fades?

 

If so could this mean Rands father is alive?

 

If this is the case? there is another opportunity for the prophesy about Rands blood (besides Galad) has to spill on the slopes of Shayol Ghul?

Nope, there are several reasons why none of them can be his father, unless we've been misled. First, there was never any indication that his father could channel, he went to the blight because of his grief over Shaiel and his unborn childs death. Second Rand was told that his father met a man who had a similar look to Shael/Tigraine and wouldn't lift his spear against him, that was Luc, who is said to have killed him.

[Guest value71]

I believe he can access the true power still because that gives him a connection to the dark one which he will use to destroy him not just seal him up again.

[FarShainMael]

Hi

 

First post for me.

 

In the last chapter we get a glimpse of a group of Aiel with pointy filed teeths, my first thought was "Could this bee some of the Aiel males who learned they could channel and went to the blight?" Could the shadow somehow have managed to capture them and turn them with help of fades?

 

If so could this mean Rands father is alive?

 

If this is the case? there is another opportunity for the prophesy about Rands blood (besides Galad) has to spill on the slopes of Shayol Ghul?

Nope, there are several reasons why none of them can be his father, unless we've been misled. First, there was never any indication that his father could channel, he went to the blight because of his grief over Shaiel and his unborn childs death. Second Rand was told that his father met a man who had a similar look to Shael/Tigraine and wouldn't lift his spear against him, that was Luc, who is said to have killed him.

We don't know whether this group of 'Aiel' are all channellers, do we? Or even, for that matter that they are Aiel at all! They are 'something else. Something terrible'.

 

Also, we hear about Janduin's death from Amys in TSR34, but she may herself have been misled.

 

@Jyxxer: Re Rand's death, 'If you would live, you must die'. It might be said that, in a sense, the 'old' Rand, Dark Rand, 'died' on Dragonmount in VoG, allowing the 'new' Zen Rand to live. Recall that RJ took much of his inspiration from the Bible; which calls sinners to 'die' to sin and to be born again in baptism.

 

Also, Rand was gone for three days.. see ToM12. And there's been much made of Healing someone who was three days dead.

[nolirion]

The DO don't lie about the true power , the true power is the substance of the DO I think .

 

"His blood on the rocks of Shayol Ghul,

washing away the Shadow, sacrifice for man’s salvation. "

It can mean many thing , his death , the death of many aiel , of kin to him ,simply an injuries, and some other thing .

[Zodd]

Rand tells the farmer that the effects he's having on the "apples" will nor last once he's left. Therefore, the clouds over Andor or Camelyn is due to his babies reacting to Rands "Goodmood". Also, Mat and Perrins share in the good fortune, in part cause of their tavern nature and the hidden bonds between the three.

That's not entirely true. The apples they pick will keep, and those that weren't will rot away again after he leaves the area. And I don't really think that has anything to do with the sunshine in the areas.

 

Anyways, it's impossible at this point to say for certain if that's the case because every time Rand is present the sunshine is. And every time the sunshine and Rand are present food suddenly is good when it wasn't before. And it stays good but the sunshine disappears with Rand.

"It's not you who is mad, friend," the strange [Rand] said. "But the entire world. Gather those apples quickly. My presence will hold him off for a time, I think, and whatever you take now should be safe from his touch."

ToM, Apples First

In Bandar Eban, Rand discovers that the open sacks of grain and food he'd sent had all turned out fallow, killing rats. Yet when he opens an unopened set, they're fresh.

Milis gasped. "what did you do to it?"

"Nothing," Rand said. "You merely opened the wrong sacks. The rest are all good."

"Merely..." Iralin said. "We happened to open the exact number of bad sacks without reaching one of the good ones? That's ridiculous."

"Not ridiculous," Rand said, laying his hand [on*] Iralin's shoulder. "Simply implausible..."

ToM, Return to Bandar Eban

The food doesn't just become good, that is impossible. Rand's not the creator, he's ta'veren; he bends chance. The apples didn't just magically turn good, an improbable amount of growth happened. Now that the choice for the Last Battle is made (Rand atop Dragonmount) his presence no longer seems causes chaos as it once did. Now it all seems to be for the good. Unless somewhere else in the world all the food suddenly rots?

 

I agree that Perrin and Mat are getting this benefit because of their own Ta'veren status. However, this was happening before Rand's Man on the Mountain sequence. For each of the ta'veren, I think it has to do more with their acceptance of their place as taveren in the Pattern. During the bubble of evil before Perrin's trial, his hammer did not attack him.

[Asha’man Hall]

What do you think will happen when rand finds out about elayne being pregnant ? And how do you think he will find out ?

[James71]

What do you think will happen when rand finds out about elayne being pregnant ? And how do you think he will find out ?

 

I am wondering when he is supposed to find time to get Avi pregnant. He hasn't seen her in quite some time.

Min could easily be pregnant already and we could find out months later.

 

The final book appears to start with the meeting in the field right before Rand goes to break the seals.

So that doesn't leave much time for a final fling with Avi.

 

Is the Last Battle an event that happens over the course of weeks/months?

If so, there is time for Rand to knock up Avi, then die or become whatever at a later date.

From the future predictions of Avi, Rand doesn't last long after the Last Battle, if he even makes it that far.

 

Or is the Last Battle a quickie event that covers only a few days?

If so, when does Avi get knocked up?

[Ltsegarra]

I'm pretty sure Aviendha is already pregnant at the point she enters the stones... She thinks her pregnancy may be affecting the stones in some ways. I'm not going to look it up and quote it though.

 

I'm also pretty sure that Rand is aware that Elyane is pregnant. I believe It was the last book "the Gathering Storm" that this happened. Elayne is just keeping the fact a secret from the "world" and letting the believe that it was some lord or another that did it.

[wvlr2]

What do you think will happen when rand finds out about elayne being pregnant ? And how do you think he will find out ?

 

Well they are both at Field of M. So I think that he will notice very soon. Hopefully, either Perin or someone will let him know soon so it will not be a surprise.

 

Not a good idea to let his enemies know that he has a potential weakness.

[f3llyn]

I'm pretty sure Aviendha is already pregnant at the point she enters the stones... She thinks her pregnancy may be affecting the stones in some ways. I'm not going to look it up and quote it though.

 

I'm also pretty sure that Rand is aware that Elyane is pregnant. I believe It was the last book "the Gathering Storm" that this happened. Elayne is just keeping the fact a secret from the "world" and letting the believe that it was some lord or another that did it.

When would Rand and Aviendha have gotten together? And Aviendha specifically says she wouldn't go to Rand unless they were equal. Meaning she wouldn't be with him in any way until she was a full fledged Wise One.

 

As for the second, if Rand knows she is pregnant we're never given any indication of it. Although at one point in ToM when Mat discovers she is pregnant he asks her if Rand knows, and she says something like "I would hope so". I'll look it up soon.

 

Here it is, ToM page 288. When Mat asks her if Rand knows she replies "I should hope he isn't too surprised." I guess implying that he doesn't know yet?

[Durinax]

Avi will be rushin to find him, I think in the FoM they will get busy and Avi will change the future

[WhiskyJack]

Whole spoiler thread has gone to hell.

[WhiskyJack]

I'm pretty sure Aviendha is already pregnant at the point she enters the stones... She thinks her pregnancy may be affecting the stones in some ways. I'm not going to look it up and quote it though.

 

I'm also pretty sure that Rand is aware that Elyane is pregnant. I believe It was the last book "the Gathering Storm" that this happened. Elayne is just keeping the fact a secret from the "world" and letting the believe that it was some lord or another that did it.

 

No. No. No. No.

[David Selig]

I still don't get why neither Min nor Avi had told Rand that Elayne is pregnant, BTW.

 

Maybe Min got so drunk she forgot about the infamous viewing about Elayne's babies, but why didn't Avi told Rand when they were together in Arad Doman? Even Nynaeve could've told him after she learned about in ToM, yet she didn't. You'd have expected her to berate him for having premarital sex and babies out of wedlock against the Two Rivers customs. ;)

 

I guess Jordan has planned for it to be a major surprise for Rand and to affect the plot in some important way.

[Basalix]

In Bandar Eban, Rand discovers that the open sacks of grain and food he'd sent had all turned out fallow, killing rats. Yet when he opens an unopened set, they're fresh.

 

The food doesn't just become good, that is impossible. Rand's not the creator, he's ta'veren; he bends chance. The apples didn't just magically turn good, an improbable amount of growth happened. Now that the choice for the Last Battle is made (Rand atop Dragonmount) his presence no longer seems causes chaos as it once did. Now it all seems to be for the good. Unless somewhere else in the world all the food suddenly rots?

 

Would it not be that as the DO is the antithesis of the light, then the new "Zen" Rand has the ability to counter the DO's touch on Randland? We have been witnessing his ever increasing strength to disrupt nature for several books (unusually long summer, the bowel of the winds, food spoilage, ect...). Could you not attribute both the grain & apples turning back to good, edible food stuffs again being attributed to his ability to cancel out the powers and effects of the DO?

[johthohar]

Whole spoiler thread has gone to hell.

 

So negative. Bad for the aura.

[johthohar]

In Bandar Eban, Rand discovers that the open sacks of grain and food he'd sent had all turned out fallow, killing rats. Yet when he opens an unopened set, they're fresh.

 

The food doesn't just become good, that is impossible. Rand's not the creator, he's ta'veren; he bends chance. The apples didn't just magically turn good, an improbable amount of growth happened. Now that the choice for the Last Battle is made (Rand atop Dragonmount) his presence no longer seems causes chaos as it once did. Now it all seems to be for the good. Unless somewhere else in the world all the food suddenly rots?

 

There is a big problem with your logic. Improbably is the wrong word. First of all, the farmer stated that apple trees don't blossom twice. I've done a little looking around of my own and as far as I can tell this is true. Second, had the trees not already blossomed once then the amount of growth was as you say "improbable". However, the rate at which it occurred was impossible. An entire orchard of apple trees blossoming and maturing in a matter of minutes? How is that simply "improbable"?

[Dream]

Just finished the book. Love the new Rand. It’s a bit jarring to see him expressing a full range of emotions again after all the anger, angst and more anger.

 

Also good to see evidence for my long held beliefs that: 1) Rand and LTT were always meant to merge and he/they weren’t quite complete until the process was completed. 2) Rand and LTT are the same person.

 

I see theories afloat about Rand gaining a new power (Divine Power/Light Power). I believe Rand is just using a pre-existing power he already has: his Ta’verenism. Ta’verens bend threads around them and I think Rand is learning how to exert some form of control over this effect. He threaten to Cadsuane with it in tGS (“Do you think I could stop your heart by willing it?”) and this is what I think he tried on Tuon. Perrin also seems to acknowledge his Ta’veren effect on other people when he mentions to Elayne(?), “You must be tired. I have that effect on people when I’m Ta’verening them.” (I’m paraphrasing of course.)

 

I also see some theories on Rand’s ability to wield the True Power and how he will use it against the Dark One. So I wonder if I am in the minority in thinking, Yes he still has access to the TP because the DO wants him to have it (even now) but it will be the DO who will use the TP against Rand. You know, sort of like, “Feel you anger, Luke Rand. Use your hatred to make you powerful. Destroy your father Moridin and take his place by my side.”