Elayne's Arc

[Cyf]

Elayne is kind of silly, though. She had to say some of that. I don't feel that it's wrong of her, per se. The fact that it's obvious from her earlier thoughts that she -actually- blamed him, that annoyed me. She has a thing about that. She thinks Mat's her subject, too. :)

[MierinWru]

I think I'm just very tired of Elayne thinking about her kingdom and Egwene thinking about the White Tower so much that Tarmon Gaidon seems to be an afterthought for them.

 

So Perrin united the Two Rivers folks under one banner and is marching them into the Last Battle? Well, grats him. More power to Perrin I say. It's the bloody Last Battle. Don't you think petty territorial debates are ridiculous considering both Perrin and Elayne are on the same bloody side and both are very close to Rand?

 

What the hell is going on in those people's heads?

 

And even if Elayne thinks ahead to plan for what happens after the Last Battle (by the way, she always assumes Rand will be dead by then anyhow.), can't she and Perrin talk like grown-ups and actually... friends? Asking them for a reason not to have them beheaded? Does it get any less diplomatic? They're on the same side. Rand would be quite annoyed (putting it mildly) if Elayne and Perrin started killing each other, don't you think? Why even bother with such stupid rhetoric then?

 

It's a shame Faile didn't throw any knives in that scene. 

 

 

[Rootbeer]

Anyone else think Mat blew it with Elayne?

 

I mean, he was the ones with the Dragon Plans. Elayne just had the resources(And so do about every ruler in the story). He was in a superior bargaining position. If the "princess" didn't want to deal, he could go to Tear, Ilidan, or some other nation the Dragon had power. Hell, he could bluff and say he'll give them to the Seanchan! That'll stiffen up her backside!

 

He should have had at least enough money to make one dragon. He could go anywhere else and show what the dragons could do to the rulers, and they'll bend over backwards to accommodate him.

 

Instead, I felt like he got ripped off. 1/4 indeed.

[MierinWru]

Anyone else think Mat blew it with Elayne?

 

I mean, he was the ones with the Dragon Plans. Elayne just had the resources(And so do about every ruler in the story). He was in a superior bargaining position. If the "princess" didn't want to deal, he could go to Tear, Ilidan, or some other nation the Dragon had power. Hell, he could bluff and say he'll give them to the Seanchan! That'll stiffen up her backside!

 

He should have had at least enough money to make one dragon. He could go anywhere else and show what the dragons could do to the rulers, and they'll bend over backwards to accommodate him.

 

Instead, I felt like he got ripped off. 1/4 indeed.

The difference between Mat and Elayne is that Mat doesn't want to sell his plans (or his service) to just anybody but prefers dealing with people he feels close to. Mat's a good guy after all. He proves it again and again.

 

Elayne's reasoning is much colder. Mat wants these cannons for the last battle. I don't think that was what Elayne had in mind above all else. She makes sure that only Andor has these cannons while ideally everybody should have them to be more efficient fighting the Last Battle. 

[Capering Capers]

Anyone else think Mat blew it with Elayne?

 

I mean, he was the ones with the Dragon Plans. Elayne just had the resources(And so do about every ruler in the story). He was in a superior bargaining position. If the "princess" didn't want to deal, he could go to Tear, Ilidan, or some other nation the Dragon had power. Hell, he could bluff and say he'll give them to the Seanchan! That'll stiffen up her backside!

 

He should have had at least enough money to make one dragon. He could go anywhere else and show what the dragons could do to the rulers, and they'll bend over backwards to accommodate him.

 

Instead, I felt like he got ripped off. 1/4 indeed.

 

 

That was definitely my first impression and perhaps also the idea behind Thom's behaviour. On the other hand cannons are (were) really expensive so getting a quarter of a nation's output for you r private army is not bad at all. In the end it may not matter since I expect the band of the red hand to end up as a shared force between Two Rivers, Cairhien and Andor.

[Rootbeer]

Anyone else think Mat blew it with Elayne?

 

I mean, he was the ones with the Dragon Plans. Elayne just had the resources(And so do about every ruler in the story). He was in a superior bargaining position. If the "princess" didn't want to deal, he could go to Tear, Ilidan, or some other nation the Dragon had power. Hell, he could bluff and say he'll give them to the Seanchan! That'll stiffen up her backside!

 

He should have had at least enough money to make one dragon. He could go anywhere else and show what the dragons could do to the rulers, and they'll bend over backwards to accommodate him.

 

Instead, I felt like he got ripped off. 1/4 indeed.

The difference between Mat and Elayne is that Mat doesn't want to sell his plans (or his service) to just anybody but prefers dealing with people he feels close to. Mat's a good guy after all. He proves it again and again.

 

Elayne's reasoning is much colder. Mat wants these cannons for the last battle. I don't think that was what Elayne had in mind above all else.

His original plans was to deal with Rand, which he could have done from several other different kingdoms.

 

Again, if Elayne doesn't want to play ball, he had a loooooooot of options. He even said he could afford to make a couple Dragons himself. He could have done that without even asking Elayne to borrow her bellfounders. I think he was just worried about the total cost, not per dragon.

 

Along with his foxhead, he had the option of walking out, selling to another source, or just giving them to the enemy to spite her. He had no loyalties to Andor. He dealt with Elayne because she was closer, she also knows of their importance and she wants those Dragons at any cost.

 

But he made no mention of them at all. Mat himself seem to think that he had no option but to rely on Andor's resources. It seem he really had lost his wits. Instead of a good bargain, BS made Mat look like he was in a weak position, had no other options than relying on Andor, and ended with him barely walking away with any dragons at all. The reunion scene was really disappointing.

[David Selig]

So Perrin united the Two Rivers folks under one banner and is marching them into the Last Battle? Well, grats him. More power to Perrin I say. It's the bloody Last Battle. Don't you think petty territorial debates are ridiculous considering both Perrin and Elayne are on the same bloody side and both are very close to Rand?

 

What the hell is going on in those people's heads?

 

And even if Elayne thinks ahead to plan for what happens after the Last Battle (by the way, she always assumes Rand will be dead by then anyhow.), can't she and Perrin talk like grown-ups and actually... friends? Asking them for a reason not to have them beheaded? Does it get any less diplomatic? They're on the same side. Rand would be quite annoyed (putting it mildly) if Elayne and Perrin started killing each other, don't you think? Why even bother with such stupid rhetoric then?

Even if Elayne wanted to let Perrin's actions go without a reaction from her, she had to think of the reaction of her subjects. Just giving up a part of Andor like that, even if it's not one they actually have much control of, would lead to a lot of discontent among the Andorans and some of those High Seats which still don't like her could use the chance to stir up trouble. She had to make some kind of deal with Perrin to preserve the authority and reputation of the throne and did so. She never seriously intended to execute Perrin or to have a battle. The deal they brokered helped ease the tension in Andor and Two Rivers and thus helps with the Last Battle.

 

BTW, it's worth noting she and Perrin are not friends. She barely knows him. Only time they were together was in Tear in Book 4 where they kept apart and were never shown to have any interaction.

 

I don't understand the criticisms that she's not preparing for the Last Battle. Pretty much everything she does in this book is focused on preparing he country for this. Yes, she also thinks about what will happen after and thinks of preserving the Andoran interests, but never to the detriment of the current preparation. Even taking the Sun Throne helps in a way for the Last Battle - she was the only candidate which could bring long term stability there. Now the Cairhieninans should cut down on the political machinations for the throne and the infighting and concentrate on the incoming Last Battle.

[Capering Capers]

Regardless of how much sense Elayne's actions make, they did grate on me quite a bit in this book.

 

I love Birgitte, so it's really irritating to me to see Elayne constantly dismissing the word of the woman she was essentially responsible for completely screwing over. If she'd just pay Birgitte the common courtesy of actually taking the advice of the immeasurably old and experienced war hero, I might like her more. For example? Impersonating a Forsaken was fine as a plan, but she should have talked to Birgitte or the palace Aes Sedai and gotten backup in place first. No reason not to.

 

It's the fact that she spurns the advice of the people trying to protect her when she charges off, not that she charges off, that irritates me.

 

Think about that situation for a minute.

 

It's easy to think that if she'd only taken backup, she would have gotten through just fine.

 

There were already guards outside the cells. The Black Ajah rescuers killed them to spring Mellar/Hanlon and would have killed all or most of any backup Elayne might have brought as well. We'd like to believe that Birgitte would have survived, but there's no guarantee of that. The last time Elayne took backup, they all got captured and some died. Everybody has been moaning about that for two books now.

 

Fact is, the girl can't win. Some readers are simply biased against nobility and will find fault with anything Elayne does simply because she's portrayed as a Queen. Queen or no, pregnant or no, she's still got an active roll to play. She's not real. She's just a character like everybody else. Her fate is pre-ordained by Jordan. So, for gosh sakes, everybody, sit back and watch it play out like the author wanted.

 

I agree that a queen who can channel entering her own 'dungeons' to question a prisoner is not exactly a reckless thing to do. Elayne's behaviour/thoughts did seem somewhat like she was purposefully evading those who would protect her and the whole thing did resemble the debacle with the black sisters.

 

 

I do not like the suggestion that people who disagree are biased against nobles. By stating that people's bias against nobles or women (as put forward by Emily)is the basis of their opinion, you deny them the courtesy of judging their arguments/opinions on merit. Ah well, I do not mean to lecture but it irked...

[DPT24]

Elyane was an alright character until she became queen and got pregnant. I can't see why RJ did that, it's totally destroyed her character, and adding Min's prophecy's made it even worse.

[Bob T Dwarf]

 

That was definitely my first impression and perhaps also the idea behind Thom's behaviour. On the other hand cannons are (were) really expensive so getting a quarter of a nation's output for your private army is not bad at all. In the end it may not matter since I expect the band of the red hand to end up as a shared force between Two Rivers, Cairhien and Andor.

 

It's setting up for Mat to be Napolean and Agelmar, Bashere, Bryne, Damodred, Darlin, Ituralde, and Aybara to be his Marshals.

 

Assuming there is some alliance with Seanchan, Mat could even wind up with an Imperial Guard ( Deathwatch Guard ).

[Cut Strand]

Elayne unifying Andor is preparation for the Last Battle.

 

And I did like that she has finally thought that having the Black Tower in Andor was a good thing. About time (I was wondering why she wasn't pushing for that when she first toured the Black Tower grounds! How far back was that? Crossroads of Twilight?). Upwards of a thousand channelers that are trained to use the One Power as a weapon? Awesome (remember, she just knows Taim is a tool, but not that he is a tool of the Shadow). And all she really needs to do to claim their loyalty is sell food to them at a fair value (or maybe give it and other supplies as payment for reinforcing her armies at need).

 

But it kind of disturbed me that she apparently abandoned the plan to official integrate the Black Tower into Andor as soon as Mat put the Dragon schematics in front of her face. Yeah, the Dragons don't require her to rely on a weapon that thinks (and therefore has to agree with you), but I can't help but think that the Dragons are just going to act as lightning rods for One Power strikes.

 

---------

 

Elayne couldn't bring back up into the dungeon. Her whole interrogation relied on the perception that she was a Forsaken so that the Black Ajah oaths to not betray their "side" wouldn't kick in.

 

Having the kin and guards at her back would've made it really obvious that she wasn't a Forsaken.

 

At the same time, she had no reason to think the prisoners would escape at that precise moment. When you have someone tied over a barrel, you don't expect them to get up and beat your ***.

 

----------

 

The bit about the Two Rivers that bothered me is that I remember Elayne bragging to Rand in The Shadow Rising about Andor's success when Hawkwing's super nation broke up was because Andor didn't try to overextend itself by claiming land it couldn't hold. But now Elayne is doing that with the Two Rivers.

 

And I can't help but believe that if Elayne saw any way to get away with executing Perrin, she would have. Possibly because Perrin was apparently pushed up into his position, while she had to (all but) claw and scrape to be recognized as Queen. Not to mention that he showed up married to the cousin of the Saldean Queen, with the First of Mayene supporting him, her [Elayne's] mother supporting him, and with the Ghealdean Queen as a vassal. And then there are two of Rand's bodyguard Asha'man, the Aiel Wise Ones, and three Aes Sedai.

 

----------

 

I viewed the clouds clearing over the various cities being due to the fact that cities represent order, which is anathema to the Shadow. Especially since the Dragon has finally "organized" himself, now the land which is bound to him can benefit from that order.

[Mystica]

Need to go to bed, but wanted to throw this in the discussion (if it hasn't already). One of the things that literally made me gasp and yell 'NOOOOO!' was how she plotted and planned on 'using the Kin' to make a profit! Using their ability to create gateways for Andor which she would 'sell' to merchants. SELLING THE USE OF THE ONE POWER???? That really pissed me off. That, beyond anything else, made clear to me that she won't hesitate to abuse her position as an Aes Sedai to completely outbalance all other nations and creates a very dangerous precendence.

 

I HOPE that Egwene will slap her down for it and hard. If not, I'm done with that twit and her 'democratic' nation. Capitalising the One Power? I don't think so!

 

Oh and I can't believe Alys actually contemplated it..... grrrrrrr...... That lost her about half the respect I had for her. The One Power SHOULD be used for the benefit of ALL (servants of ALL, remember???). Not any one nation!

 

Bunch of self-centered opportunists.....

[David Selig]

What exactly is so bad about asking money for transportation via Gateways? The Kin has to support themselves in some way, they don't have the funds of the Aes Sedai. Creating gateways is an exhausting work and the traders gain a lot from it, so it makes sense to pay for the service.

 

The "Servants of all" concept worked only in the Age of Legends society where there were no money and no lack of resources. The Third Age Aes Sedai used to rely mostly on tributes from kings in their earlier centuries, Even now the Borderlanders are sending tribute. And even when they are not charging directly for the services, they make sure they get their due in some way.

[Cyf]

Indeed. One thing I have no problem with is charging for a 'Rapid Transport' system. Elayne makes a point of saying she won't charge a cent for Healing. Just Travelling. The Travelling would simply be a way to fund other endeavors. Elayne can annoy me sometimes, but this has no issue.

 

Well, as long as the Kin are paid, and they bargained for a share. :)

[Fel]

Again, if Elayne doesn't want to play ball, he had a loooooooot of options. He even said he could afford to make a couple Dragons himself. He could have done that without even asking Elayne to borrow her bellfounders. I think he was just worried about the total cost, not per dragon.

 

Along with his foxhead, he had the option of walking out, selling to another source, or just giving them to the enemy to spite her. He had no loyalties to Andor. He dealt with Elayne because she was closer, she also knows of their importance and she wants those Dragons at any cost.

 

But he made no mention of them at all. Mat himself seem to think that he had no option but to rely on Andor's resources. It seem he really had lost his wits. Instead of a good bargain, BS made Mat look like he was in a weak position, had no other options than relying on Andor, and ended with him barely walking away with any dragons at all. The reunion scene was really disappointing.

 

Mat did NOT have any other options for his dragons because, unlike Elayne, he is preparing for the Last Battle above all else and needs to do something quickly since the world is ending soon. He is not putting his personal prestige and future prospects above the needs of the world. Elayne, OTOH is focused solely on how she can grow her empire during this time of turmoil.

 

Again, how is Elayne different than the Tairen High Lords in the early books or Colavere who were only looking to grow their personal influence during the chaos?

 

For those saying that people are too hard on Elayne because of her gender, please see how little people complain about Nynaeve or Egwene (in TGS). Those characters are thoughtful and were focused on a key goal, whereas Elayne has her head on backwards and is a selfish little brat who continues to make stupid plans that blow up and get other people killed. Comparing her "plan" to Mat's plans, Perrin's plans or Rand's plans is just night and day. Mat's breaking out of Ebou Dar and the battles he planned to draw out the Molvaine gap were very well thought out. Perrin cracked a very difficult nut in Malden. Rand, despite being crazy at the time, has executed plan after plan to try to bring the world together. Elayne keeps on walking into traps, getting caught, and having other people get hurt/killed rescuing her. It's not her gender, it's her lack of intelligence and wisdom and her selfishness that drive people nuts.

[smileyman]

But Perrin did raise some good points. For instance, why should the Two Rivers pay taxes to Andor when Andor wasn't in any position to help out the Two Rivers when it needed it? The fight with the Whitecloaks and Trollocs showed that the place isn't actually part of Elayne's country. Her insistence that Perrin was her subject was just kind of silly and the solution that Camelyn only have a token ownership of the place that didn't really hold any power or authority and didn't get any cash was bending over far more backwards than Perrin really needed to.

 

Which is why they came up with that nice bit of legal fiction naming Perrin Steward of Two Rivers. He'll collect taxes from the people there, but none of that money will go to Andor--instead it will go to improvements there. If Andor needs to raise men for an army, Perrin is responsible for providing them. Basically it's a feudal vassal type of situation.

[Emily_Sedai]

Need to go to bed, but wanted to throw this in the discussion (if it hasn't already). One of the things that literally made me gasp and yell 'NOOOOO!' was how she plotted and planned on 'using the Kin' to make a profit! Using their ability to create gateways for Andor which she would 'sell' to merchants. SELLING THE USE OF THE ONE POWER???? That really pissed me off. That, beyond anything else, made clear to me that she won't hesitate to abuse her position as an Aes Sedai to completely outbalance all other nations and creates a very dangerous precendence.

 

I HOPE that Egwene will slap her down for it and hard. If not, I'm done with that twit and her 'democratic' nation. Capitalising the One Power? I don't think so!

 

Oh and I can't believe Alys actually contemplated it..... grrrrrrr...... That lost her about half the respect I had for her. The One Power SHOULD be used for the benefit of ALL (servants of ALL, remember???). Not any one nation!

 

Bunch of self-centered opportunists.....

 

Well, Egwene was selling her power made art during the seige of the White Tower, so not sure she'll have any issues with it *laugh*

[Mr. Micawber]

Well, Bob, I guess that means Ituralde is Davout.

 

I'd say the ratios he faced recently were about as bad as at Auerstadt.

 

Heh, I wonder which one of them becomes Bernadotte?

 

By the way, you realize this kinda makes Tuon Josephine? Which is hilarious, since the girl never had even been kissed, while, uh, Josephine really got around.

[Emily_Sedai]

 

 

Again, how is Elayne different than the Tairen High Lords in the early books or Colavere who were only looking to grow their personal influence during the chaos?

 

For those saying that people are too hard on Elayne because of her gender, please see how little people complain about Nynaeve or Egwene (in TGS). Those characters are thoughtful and were focused on a key goal, whereas Elayne has her head on backwards and is a selfish little brat who continues to make stupid plans that blow up and get other people killed. Comparing her "plan" to Mat's plans, Perrin's plans or Rand's plans is just night and day. Mat's breaking out of Ebou Dar and the battles he planned to draw out the Molvaine gap were very well thought out. Perrin cracked a very difficult nut in Malden. Rand, despite being crazy at the time, has executed plan after plan to try to bring the world together. Elayne keeps on walking into traps, getting caught, and having other people get hurt/killed rescuing her. It's not her gender, it's her lack of intelligence and wisdom and her selfishness that drive people nuts.

 

Well, first off, Mat has how many lives of experience to draw on in terms of battles? Elayne has how many past queen lives inside of her? As far as I know, she is not a Bene Gesserit. Elayne did however, successfully navigate the seige of Caemlyn, negotiated with the borderlanders to prevent a war, and managed to secure the throne in a nasty succession that could have ended with Andor's armies shattered before the last battle if all the houses split three ways. She has the support, and indeed respect of Dyelin, an older, experienced noble that nearly *everyone* seems to respect. In terms of other moments, she, along with Nyn, successfully executed the plan to save the Panarch, and navigated the undercurrents of the Aes Sedai in Salidar. Plus, she had the courage to strip in a room full of people, including fellow nobles and the infamous Taim, to show her dedication to Avi. I still always love the scene after Avi leaves, when the crown of the daughter heir is placed on her head, and she raises her head and does what she has to do despite how she was feeling at the moment. She's definitely tough.

 

So what selfishness are we talking about? Offering free power healing to all? Saving the refugees trying to flee the Prophet? Willing to follow Nyn and Egween into the unknown to hunt down the black ajah, something that few Aes Sedai were willing to even admit existed?

 

Has she screwed up? Absolutely... pretty sure we all do, including Mat, Rand, Perrin, et all.

 

As for traps... Rand was bailed out by Perrin. Mat was saved by Rand. Egwene, Nyn, and Elayne were saved by Mat. Elayne was saved by Brig. Brig was saved by Elayne. It seems that everyone has been covering for everyone at various points in the story... again, pretty much every character has screwed up something, even Thom with his killing of someone that needed killing *laugh* Elayne has done a lot of good however, and it seems like that is overlooked quite a bit.

[Fains nose]

I actually got chills at the way Elayne was behaving in this book, it just felt really wrong that she is putting herself above the last battle, im just really glad Caemly is burning, Elayne does not deserve to lead, and maybe it will be a wakeup call that the verry fabric of existence is at stake, so stop making people who are way more important than you to the Pattern and to Creation itself ( Mat and Perrin)bow down to you. in the scheme of things, Elaynes throne is nothing,whereas Mat and Perrin are Vital to winning the last battle, Elayne is not, Andor is not, Elayne needs to realise this soon. I hope Talmanes and the band secure all the dragons and keep them for themselves to use at the last battle, seriously, Elayne does not deserve them.

[Mystica]

What exactly is so bad about asking money for transportation via Gateways? The Kin has to support themselves in some way, they don't have the funds of the Aes Sedai. Creating gateways is an exhausting work and the traders gain a lot from it, so it makes sense to pay for the service.

 

The "Servants of all" concept worked only in the Age of Legends society where there were no money and no lack of resources. The Third Age Aes Sedai used to rely mostly on tributes from kings in their earlier centuries, Even now the Borderlanders are sending tribute. And even when they are not charging directly for the services, they make sure they get their due in some way.

 

The Kin have been supporting themselves and surviving without charging for the use of the One Power for over 1000 years. I REALLY doubt they need Elayne's help to survive now that they can channel in the open. IF (and I really do stress the IF with a HUGE amount of reservation) there is to be charged for the use of the One Power, it should come from the White Tower, NOT any one nation.

 

The Servants of all concept may have reached it's ideal in the AOL but it is still the mantra behind which the Aes Sedai operate and the very core of their reason for being. They serve ALL. It's the meaning of their very name, after all. Everything else from the AOL has fallen to the wayside, 'except' that very concept for Aes Sedai. The fact that all have forgotten those ideals (beginning with Aes Sedai forgetting that they are supposed to Serve All instead of themselves) is the core reason the world has been in a constant state of conflict since the AOL.

 

The White Tower, and by extension all channelers and the use of the One Power, mùst stand above that.

 

Tributes are not taxes or charged prizes.

 

 

 

Well, Egwene was selling her power made art during the seige of the White Tower, so not sure she'll have any issues with it *laugh*

 

Egwene was dealing with a internal White Tower threat, not working on a political, economical and strategic advance for her nation against all others. There's a difference. As the Servants of All 'serve all' they must also be supported and protected by all in times of need. This was an internal White Tower issue, not an attempt to overpoweer and outmanoever another nation for political/economical/strategic gain.

 

A threat to the White Tower is a threat to all nations and the world at large. A threat to Andor is not a threat to all other nations and the world (if you take away the Last Battle, which is relevant since Elayne is planning this for àfter the LB).

[Bob T Dwarf]

 

The Servants of all concept may have reached it's ideal in the AOL but it is still the mantra behind which the Aes Sedai operate and the very core of their reason for being. They serve ALL. It's the meaning of their very name, after all. Everything else from the AOL has fallen to the wayside, 'except' that very concept for Aes Sedai. The fact that all have forgotten those ideals (beginning with Aes Sedai forgetting that they are supposed to Serve All instead of themselves) is the core reason the world has been in a constant state of conflict since the AOL.

 

The White Tower, and by extension all channelers and the use of the One Power, mùst stand above that.

 

Tributes are not taxes or charged prizes.

 

You're expecting her to be Aes Sedai first and Queen second. Elayne will always be first and foremost Queen of Andor. Failing to charge caravans to use Gateways just as she would charge them to use roads, ferries, or bridges would make her derelict in her duty as Queen.

[Boundless]

Personally Elayne's character has always bugged me. She puts herself in so many situations that could be done a number of diff ways but just rambos her way into trouble..IE the jail scene with her silly disguise. I did feel pretty bad for her after all the careful maneuvering to properly secure the sun throne without royally P'n everybody off..a bunch of trollocs come up and really muck things up for Caemlyn(sp?).

[Mystica]

 

The Servants of all concept may have reached it's ideal in the AOL but it is still the mantra behind which the Aes Sedai operate and the very core of their reason for being. They serve ALL. It's the meaning of their very name, after all. Everything else from the AOL has fallen to the wayside, 'except' that very concept for Aes Sedai. The fact that all have forgotten those ideals (beginning with Aes Sedai forgetting that they are supposed to Serve All instead of themselves) is the core reason the world has been in a constant state of conflict since the AOL.

 

The White Tower, and by extension all channelers and the use of the One Power, mùst stand above that.

 

Tributes are not taxes or charged prizes.

 

You're expecting her to be Aes Sedai first and Queen second. Elayne will always be first and foremost Queen of Andor. Failing to charge caravans to use Gateways just as she would charge them to use roads, ferries, or bridges would make her derelict in her duty as Queen.

 

 

Using roads, ferries is a mundane matter and available to all nations in their own lands. The making, maintaining and use of those roads and ferries is also available to all nations and not limited to the few that have the ability by genetics. The use of the One Power is a genetically limited ability, not automatically available to all nations, let alone the rulers of those nations.

 

Aes Sedai 'should' be Aes Sedai first. That's the point in becoming a Servant of All. The moment they enter the White Tower they are flooded with the fact that they must break all connection to their other allegiances: families, friends, homes, etc. All of it mùst become second to their wish to become Aes Sedai. It is an integral part in becoming Aes Sedai.

 

Queens/Kings have the duty and obligation to put their nations first.

 

Which is why I am against Aes Sedai becoming Queens or Kings as the two functions are incompatible and contradictory. Where one is focussed on the service of ALL without, the other is focussed on the service of one nation before all others.

[Mr Ares]

It is important that people bear in mind that Elayne is Queen of Andor, and she has a duty to her subjects. She is not neglecting the Last Battle, but nor is she neglecting what will come afterwards, which is what many of you seem to want her to do. She has plans. She is not thinking ahead only as far as TG, which would be exceedingly short sighted. The Kin charging for the use of Gateways? So what? Why is this a bad thing? These women have no obligation to provide their skills to all and sundry free of charge, they have every right to some sort of recompense for their hard work. The Kin do not have the same resources as the AS, such as a city state they rule, or tributes from various monarchs. To date, they have been forced to make ends meet in other ways, and keep off the radar, not use their skills openly. Now they can use their skills with the Power openly, and it is up to them what they do with them. They weren't forced into staying in Andor, they weren't blackmailed into making any deal. They had a choice. If you are a lawyer, it is not unreasonable to be able to charge for legal advice. If you are a carpenter, it is not unreasonable to charge for your carpentry skills. If you are a channeler, why shouldn't you charge for the use of your skills? (And they are giving away the Healing free of charge - free Healthcare! It smacks of that greatest of evils, socialism. Be afraid, America, be very afraid.) No, I can't fault Elayne for wanting to look after her subjects in the future.

 

As for her dealing with Perrin, it was very fair. She can't go around rewarding people for treason, it would destabilise her rule. Her dealing with the BA was hardly stupid, just fell foul of some really bad luck. Her dealing with Cairhien wasn't brilliant, but it was competent. Her dealing with Mat was fair - if he had gone to another ruler, they might well have pressed for the same terms, or worse. What if Rand had insisted on dragons for all, especially the Legion of the Dragon? No, Mat's only advantage was who he sold himself to. Really, it's hard to fault Elayne for any of the decisions she made in this book. Possibly a first for her, but credit where it's due. She did the right thing.