Discuss the Epiclogue

[Kaznen]

I felt bad for Mat with the Olver POV. I always thought Olver hero worshipped Mat because Mat was the first person who seemed to give a flaming crap about Olver since his mother died. Then we see he doesn't hero worship Mat and doesn't seem to even like him all that much aside from what Mat could teach him.

 

I don't think Lan is going to die either. Right before Perrin goes to battle to fight shadow spawn, and when I say right before I mean he is about to walk through the gateway, Elyas, an ex-warder and wolf brother who would normally be happy to fight trollocs shows up and says he has to leave right now.

 

I think he learned about Lan going to Tarwins gap and I also think he is a Malkri ex-pat (I also think he was one of the men who brought Lan out of the blight, but that another discussion) so he needed to leave and join Lan post haste. And wolves are already moving north to the Last Hunt and him with stamina that makes the hardiest Aiel look like a asthmatic 13 year old boy he'll get to the gap in time to fight, and he'll bring a lot of wolves.

 

And I think Nyn is going to feel Lan has entered battle and she'll channel with that Nyn, deadliest AS we all saw and LOVED eariler, and, well, that's what I'm looking forward to most in AMoL.

[aynatal2000]

Why would Perrin be called the Fallen Blacksmith?

 

That logic doesn't really ring true to me since he is more of a blacksmith than ever, what with the forging of Power-wrought weapons, and he's finally conquered his inner demons. He's anything but "Fallen".

In the prophecy shown in the epilogue Perrin is the Fallen Blacksmith...he has seen to the rise of Manetherin/Two Rivers - he is now comfortable in his own skin; the Wolf Lord that the Seanchan have mentioned in their prophecies.He is no longer just a blacksmith; that simple title has fallen away - the making of the power wrought weapon could not have been done without the Ashaman/Aes Sedai. The Hammer and its imprint is a sign of the Wolf Lord. Mat is the one eyed fool that is mentioned and I wonder why he will be in the Halls of Mourning - who dies? Olver, his family or Tuon?

Again just supposition,but won't we have fun until the next book is published.

[Lupy]

I really, really hope that what happens with Lan is that Nynaeve realizes what is happening during the meeting of everyone Egwene got together and gives a heartrending speech about how they need to go rescue Lan. Then Rand will gather his armies and go fight Tarmon Gaidon.

[The Desert Pea]

Regarding Lanfear/Cyndane, the first question is what actually happened. As I see it, there are two possibilities: (1) Lanfear and Rand were drawn to each other's dreams via their mutual hatred, or (2) via Rand's soul-merge with Moridin, Rand accessed Lanfear via her Mindtrap.

 

In support of (1), think back to what happened between Egwene and Gawyn in LoC, followed by this explanation in Chpt 15:

 

Egwene chose her words carefully. And went on with her dressing, casually, in the same white algode blouse and bulky wool skirt the Wise Ones wore. "Is it possible to be pulled into someone's dream against your will?"

 

"Of course not," Amys said, "not unless your touch is all thumbs."

 

But right on top of her, Bair said, "Not unless there is strong emotion involved. If you try to watch the dream of someone who loves or hates you, you can be pulled in. Or if you love or hate them. That last is why we do not dare try to watch Sevanna's dreams, or 'even to speak with the Shaido Wise Ones in their dreams."

 

... ...

 

Egwene stifled curiosity, and amusement. She made her voice ever so offhanded. "What if you don't try to look in?" Melaine gave her a grateful look, and she felt a twinge of guilt. Not enough that she would not ask for the whole story later, though. Anything that made Melaine blush so had to be hilarious.

 

"I heard of such a thing," Bair said, "when I was young and just beginning to learn. Mora, the Wise One of Colrada Hold, trained me, and she said that if the emotion was very strong, love or hate so great it left room for nothing else, you could be drawn in merely by letting yourself be aware of the other's dream."

 

In support of (2), if Rand could access the Moridin's Mindtraps via their connection, it follows that this could lead to dream invasion by Rand to Lanfear. However, I view this less likely than (1) because (1) already has an established precedent.

 

In either case, the question then becomes whether this occurred by mere happenstance, or whether Moridin manipulated events. I personally think this was a totally random and unpredictable event, probably due to their mutual hatred given the precedent introduced by Egwene/Gawyn in Book 6.

 

Despite Lanfear's hatred of Rand, I have to believe she would do anything at this point to get out of the mindtrap. She's already expressed a desire to betray the Dark One with Rand using the CK in earlier books, and that was when she had a high position among the Shadow. Now that she's a virtual slave, she'd only have more incentive to do so. As mentioned before, she could very well have critical knowledge regarding the Bore --- knowledge that LTT never had, unless Beidomon survived and was questioned after the Bore was made.

 

In conclusion, I think this was for real and was not a trap. Lanfear was never particularly loyal to the Dark One, and now has every reason to ditch him altogether. If Rand can break her free of the Mindtrap he may very well have an ally that can provide him with mission-critical information for sealing the Bore. Of course, since at the end of ToM he plans on going to Shayol Ghul the very next day, could this possibly be accomplished in time?... I don't know.

 

 

The problem with option 1 was that Egwene was pulled into Gawyn's dream while she was floating around in the "dream space" or whatever you want to call it, and Rand was not. He was in his own dream. I think the soul merge is the more likely option because of that.

[Sentinel78]

Yeah I'm not ruling the Rand/Moridin soul-merge out as explaining the Cyndane dream sequence. In truth, while I still think it's less likely, it offers Rand a more obvious solution to 'freeing' Cyndane, if he chose to do so. Basically, Rand would be co-owner with Moridin over the mindtrap, so maybe Rand would be in a position to liberate Cyndane, and perhaps even Moghedien.

 

Could they be trusted if freed though? I mean, they certainly wouldn't go running back to Moridin and Shaidar Haran, but they would exactly be good people worthy of any trust either.

[Mr. Micawber]

Lan:

 

"Hey Shadow! I got your surrender right here!"

 

Rand:

"Oh, shi-"

 

Caemlyn:

"They're heeeere"

[TheTuninator]

Why would Perrin be called the Fallen Blacksmith?

 

That logic doesn't really ring true to me since he is more of a blacksmith than ever, what with the forging of Power-wrought weapons, and he's finally conquered his inner demons. He's anything but "Fallen".

In the prophecy shown in the epilogue Perrin is the Fallen Blacksmith...he has seen to the rise of Manetherin/Two Rivers - he is now comfortable in his own skin; the Wolf Lord that the Seanchan have mentioned in their prophecies.He is no longer just a blacksmith; that simple title has fallen away - the making of the power wrought weapon could not have been done without the Ashaman/Aes Sedai. The Hammer and its imprint is a sign of the Wolf Lord. Mat is the one eyed fool that is mentioned and I wonder why he will be in the Halls of Mourning - who dies? Olver, his family or Tuon?

Again just supposition,but won't we have fun until the next book is published.

 

I really don't see Fallen as fitting in that context, though, that's the thing. Like you said, guess we'll have to wait and see.

[Michelleharper]

OKay, I've seen this several times today and I haven't seen anyone correct the thinking. I may be wrong, as I so often am, but in this one instance, I just don't think so. The Broken Wolf whom Death has known was/is Lan. He's the lone wolf type guy and why would a prophecy give two different names to one person in the same paragraph when it seems to be talking about unrelated events. As far as I can tell, Death has never known Perrin, and their are several times when Lan and death/Death are used together throughout the series. Remember the whole he courts death the way most met court their lover. Also, the part where he comes to Myrelle and she talks about looking into the eyes of Lan and sees Death. Besides, the prophecy talks about the Broken Wolf being consumed by the Midnight Towers which I assumed was a reference to all the doomed watch towers along the Blight border that ended up falling in this book. However, I have seen a few references today where they believe Perrin is the Broken Wolf. I just don't buy that. Lan is the Broken Wolf.

[Sventity]

Why would Perrin be called the Fallen Blacksmith?

 

That logic doesn't really ring true to me since he is more of a blacksmith than ever, what with the forging of Power-wrought weapons, and he's finally conquered his inner demons. He's anything but "Fallen".

In the prophecy shown in the epilogue Perrin is the Fallen Blacksmith...he has seen to the rise of Manetherin/Two Rivers - he is now comfortable in his own skin; the Wolf Lord that the Seanchan have mentioned in their prophecies.He is no longer just a blacksmith; that simple title has fallen away - the making of the power wrought weapon could not have been done without the Ashaman/Aes Sedai. The Hammer and its imprint is a sign of the Wolf Lord. Mat is the one eyed fool that is mentioned and I wonder why he will be in the Halls of Mourning - who dies? Olver, his family or Tuon?

Again just supposition,but won't we have fun until the next book is published.

 

I really don't see Fallen as fitting in that context, though, that's the thing. Like you said, guess we'll have to wait and see.

 

I honestly don't think the "Fallen" bit is consequential. The prophecy belittles each of the three in turn, Mat - One-Eyed Fool, Rand - First Among Vermin, and Perrin - Fallen Blacksmith. And besides, didn't Slayer all Perrin a Fallen blacksmith at one point during their tussle?

[Sventity]

OKay, I've seen this several times today and I haven't seen anyone correct the thinking. I may be wrong, as I so often am, but in this one instance, I just don't think so. The Broken Wolf whom Death has known was/is Lan. He's the lone wolf type guy and why would a prophecy give two different names to one person in the same paragraph when it seems to be talking about unrelated events. As far as I can tell, Death has never known Perrin, and their are several times when Lan and death/Death are used together throughout the series. Remember the whole he courts death the way most met court their lover. Also, the part where he comes to Myrelle and she talks about looking into the eyes of Lan and sees Death. Besides, the prophecy talks about the Broken Wolf being consumed by the Midnight Towers which I assumed was a reference to all the doomed watch towers along the Blight border that ended up falling in this book. However, I have seen a few references today where they believe Perrin is the Broken Wolf. I just don't buy that. Lan is the Broken Wolf.

 

/agree

That's exactly what I think and posted in the Prophecy thread, though I also thought the Midnight Towers could be referring to the towers of Malkier, but that's neither here nor there.

[Tsnake]

OKay, I've seen this several times today and I haven't seen anyone correct the thinking. I may be wrong, as I so often am, but in this one instance, I just don't think so. The Broken Wolf whom Death has known was/is Lan. He's the lone wolf type guy and why would a prophecy give two different names to one person in the same paragraph when it seems to be talking about unrelated events. As far as I can tell, Death has never known Perrin, and their are several times when Lan and death/Death are used together throughout the series. Remember the whole he courts death the way most met court their lover. Also, the part where he comes to Myrelle and she talks about looking into the eyes of Lan and sees Death. Besides, the prophecy talks about the Broken Wolf being consumed by the Midnight Towers which I assumed was a reference to all the doomed watch towers along the Blight border that ended up falling in this book. However, I have seen a few references today where they believe Perrin is the Broken Wolf. I just don't buy that. Lan is the Broken Wolf.

 

Could the Broken Wolf be Iturlde?

[Loophole]

For 4:

 

My first impression was that they are Ayyad males from Shara. I also think that Demandred has solidified his rule in Shara, and having the Ayyad destroy Kandor is his way of showing the GL that he is ready to 'move his armies'.

 

The Ayyad men are used as breeding stock, they are never educated and are killed the moment they begin to channel or reach the age of 21--which ever is first. There wouldn't be very many of them--I don't think. But I guess if Demandred solidified his rule in (part of) Shara fast enough and began training the ones who were old enough to channel he could have a Black Tower of his own. Who knows how many channelers he would have though, since the Ayyad have--until his theoretical domination, strictly adhered to their laws to kill their males.

 

In TGS Demandred tells Moridin that 'My rule is secure. I gather for war. We will be ready." I believe Demandred resides in Shara because of the unlikeliness that he is anywhere else. If he is ready for war by the prologue of TGS, I think it is very possible that he has had enough time to create a Black Tower of his own. And he doesn't need his soldiers to be smart, just to be able to channel. It can be paralleled with how Taim very quickly made Coteren and his croons powerful Asha'man.

 

Unless of course there is a city in the blight, and Damandred is ruling this. Which is what i believe. I think those red veiled chaps are aiel that can channel/their offspring. These fellows need somewhere to live and there have been aiel men going to the blight to die for quite some time, enough for a lot of channelers to build up and their offspring, plus whatever dark friends make their way there. Also fits in with RJ's "blank in the blight".

 

Besides "My rule is secure, I gather for war." What nation is going to fight for the shadow regardless of what their ruler says... They may start off doing it, but they will soon realise that the people they are fighting are trying to hold off hordes of shadowspawn. The army that makes the most sense for him to be gathering is an army of Dreadlords, Darkfriends and shadowspawn, residing in a city in the blight.

 

Edit: forgot to say i think those Aiel men have been being turned 13x13 style.

[Solmyr]

As I was drawing near to the end of the audiobook yesterday evening, I was becomming more and more concerned there wouldn't be enough time for Mat to 'properly' save Moiraine. Then it happened and it was epic. And then the epilogue came and it blew all this away.

 

The only things of interest to me there were the red-veiled men ('Aiel') and Rand's dream.

 

 

Starting with the lesser - we have absolutely no evidence to believe those men were Aiel, besides the ramblings of a nearly-dead caravan-fellow. As I was listening to this part at ~4am and drifting to sleep already, my only connection was to un-Tarna - somehow they seemed brainwashed in the same manner. Let me say tho, I had not reached the 13x13 conclusion then and even now, when everyone seems to believe Tarna was 13x13 I am not certain it's that simple, especially given those men.

 

Now that I think about it, how has nobody mentioned Fain yet? You forgot him already, just because he was in the Prologue only? Shame. He is in the blight, moving to SG on foot ... killing everything in his way and raising it to serve him. He could've stumbled upon some Aiel and converted them. That discounts the Tarna/red-veiled men connection tho, since Fain couldn't have zombied her.

 

Another thing we have no evidence to believe is that those red-veiled cannibals can channel. People are just jumping to conclusions: "Oh that caravan guy says they look like Aiel, so they must be Aiel. Aiel in the blight? Only possibility is they are those men who went north. There, we figured it!". On the contrary we have sufficient evidence to believe they cannot channel. Why kill with their weapons/teeth? Why wander the blight alone? Why bother with a nearly-dead caravan driver? Surely in the eve of TLB the Shadow's channelers have more important things to do than cannibalizing corpses.

 

With that I conclude that we simply do not have enough information for anything, but speculation. And there are probably more possibilities than where D is.

 

Moving to #5 or as I see it, the grandest thing in the entire book. Again people seem quick at jumping to conclusions: "Obviously a trap, Moridin mentioned 1 page ago that 'this chance has been given to another', Rand is a sucker, etc". I don't wanna go into "how Rand got the dream" topic, as this might have to do with Rand-Moridin's connection and thats a vast ocean of possibilities and speculations (one that even Mat's dice might not get right). What interests me more is Mierin's motives/sincerety.

 

Maybe I'm as big a sucker as Rand is, but I think Mierin is honest. When Rand initially sees her he doesn't recognize her (new body). Only when he looks deep into her eyes and sees her soul he knows. With his new powers to see through darkfriends' lies and his ability to recognize souls, I don't think he can be fooled by a simple act.

 

Now as for Mierin's motives - she drilled the bore and was the first(?) of the Forsaken to declare for the Shadow. Yet, from what we've seen of her agenda, we can conclude it is a bit off from the DO's. 10/13 of the Chosen want to become NB. Demandred wants to kill LTT. Ishamael wants to end all things. Lanfear wants LTT to love her and to have THE power. Back in TSR-TFH when she often visited Rand we saw her fascination with the CK - she wanted to find the access keys more than anything, she suggested that she and Rand can use them to overthrow the GL and the Creator. When she learns that Rand is 'cheating' on her, she is mad enough to kill him (literally, one of Moiraine's 3 possible outcomes was that she killed him), which is directly against the DO's plans at that time.

 

Mierin strikes me as the kind of person who puts her desires above and beyond anything else, even common sense and self-preservation. She is aware what tortures the DO is capable of, but she doesn't shy from speaking of overthrowing him. None of the other Chosen even think about that. We haven't really seen a PoV of hers, but if she dares say such things aloud, what might she be thinking? After ToM I believe the lack of a Lanfear PoV is intentional for other reasons as well.

 

Now imagine this kind of person back in the corner, with one last chance (Cyndane), humbled and tortured by the Shadow and nearly robbed of free will. Do you really believe her final act will be to act as bait for Rand? Can you even consider Mierin allowing to be used for such a lowly plot? Oh, I am not saying such a plot doesn't exist. Moridin might believe he can use her as bait. But he doesn't really understand her and this is why he doesn't see his leverage over her is not as big as it would be over anyone else in the same situation.

 

Last argument before I close my case: it has long been speculated by Ishamael that the DO's true goal is not to 'win', but simply do destroy everything. Shatter reality, break the wheel of time, slay the serpent, tear the pattern. And Ishamael is OK with that, his philosophical views are on the same track, he wants the same thing. Nobody else knows this. But if anyone else were to deduce this, it would be Mierin. She obviously knows more about the Shadow and the DO than anyone but Ishamael. She might have the missing piece on how to seal the Bore, but it is as likely that she helps Rand in figuring out how to slay the DO. It would be the perfect redemption. I've always perceived her as having no choice in joining the Shadow. She isn't evil like Demandred and Semirhage, fond of torture and other atrocities. She isn't without alternatives, like some of the weaker forsaken (Asmodean, Mesaana), who also turned to the Shadow for petty reasons. But most of all, she lacks the most important Chosen attribute - selfishness. With regards to LTT she is as selfless as any woman in love can be. In TSR-TFH when Rand barely had a handful of shared memories with LTT, she was willing to risk everything in helping him. And she did - she ended up mindtrapped for 7+ books, because she cares for Rand. None of the other Chosen are capable of such emotions.

 

The DO made a critical error in his recruitment. Until 11 hours ago I was willing to bet against Mat that Fain will be the DO's undoing. But if Mierin lives until the final battle, I think it might as well be her.

[Bob T Dwarf]

I am not saying Lanfear will necessarily want to turn 100%, I further suggested she may not have a choice, if Rand can keep her mindtrapped and also control it.

 

Are you seriously suggesting that the Rand that came down the mountain would "keep her mindtrapped and also control it?"

[Bob T Dwarf]

 

Another thing we have no evidence to believe is that those red-veiled cannibals can channel. People are just jumping to conclusions: "Oh that caravan guy says they look like Aiel, so they must be Aiel. Aiel in the blight? Only possibility is they are those men who went north. There, we figured it!". On the contrary we have sufficient evidence to believe they cannot channel. Why kill with their weapons/teeth? Why wander the blight alone? Why bother with a nearly-dead caravan driver? Surely in the eve of TLB the Shadow's channelers have more important things to do than cannibalizing corpses.

 

 

It's more world building.

 

We already have werewolves ( Noam, Elyas, Perrin ).

We already have zombies ( Fain's new powers ).

We've had pirates for some time ( Sea Folk ).

We've had ninjas since nearly the beginning ( Aiel ).

 

All that's left is the Vampires and Chuck Norris. My bet is we gotta wait til A Memory of Light for Chuck Norris to appear, so these guys have to be the Vampires ( or just evil ninjas ).

 

< you could make a good case that Drakhar are vampires >

< Death Watch Guards fill the Samurai niche, nicely >

[nolirion]

Mierin redemption , that would be fun but nearly impossible .

First we have already a "redemption" in the person of Verin and this is highly unlikely an other will turn again .

Second Dear Lanfear goal's was not to serve the do nor access a position in serving him ;but to acces an higher power .

She even was ready to challenge the DO And the creator alike with rand and the access key .

[seasnake]

The contrasts between Rand and Moridin kept multiplying. Rand has bonded to three women through love and mutual consent. Moridin now forcibly controls three women through mindtraps and makes them his chattel. Moridin fights for the Shadow because he only thinks on the end result (Moridin serves the Shadow because believes it's victory is inevitable, since the Light has to win every time for eternity and the Dark One only has to win once), Rand is now fighting for the Light because of the small victories and chances to enjoy things and love. Moridin corrupts the land or at least lives in corrupt land (Blight), Rand heals the land by his presence. Moridin is the soul of Ishamael taken by the Dark One and forced into a new body, Rand is Lews Therin reborn through the natural creative process. Moridin has abandoned the One Power in favor the "better" True Power, Rand has turned is back on the True Power and returned to the one power.

 

And in the middle of it all is Fain, which is the weird amalgamation of motives and personalities.

 

Should be a great last book.

[JDJ]

Mierin redemption , that would be fun but nearly impossible .

First we have already a "redemption" in the person of Verin and this is highly unlikely an other will turn again .

Second Dear Lanfear goal's was not to serve the do nor access a position in serving him ;but to acces an higher power .

She even was ready to challenge the DO And the creator alike with rand and the access key .

 

I agree, no redemption.

 

But that does not preclude her trying to work with /use Rand to get free, and find some way to further use him so that she can "access a higher power".

 

I believe she is not working with anyone on some plot to trap Rand, she is working on her own, for herself - as she always has.

[Arath Faringal]

Starting with the lesser - we have absolutely no evidence to believe those men were Aiel, besides the ramblings of a nearly-dead caravan-fellow.

 

Another thing we have no evidence to believe is that those red-veiled cannibals can channel. People are just jumping to conclusions: "Oh that caravan guy says they look like Aiel, so they must be Aiel. Aiel in the blight? Only possibility is they are those men who went north. There, we figured it!". On the contrary we have sufficient evidence to believe they cannot channel. Why kill with their weapons/teeth? Why wander the blight alone? Why bother with a nearly-dead caravan driver? Surely in the eve of TLB the Shadow's channelers have more important things to do than cannibalizing corpses.

 

With that I conclude that we simply do not have enough information for anything, but speculation. And there are probably more possibilities than where D is.

 

Aiel are usually pretty unmistakable. Remember in the Eye of the World where everyone assumes (corrcectly as it turned out) that Rand was an Aielman? If it's wearing Cadin'sor, wearing a veil ... it's probably a pretty safe assumption.

 

This half daed caravan driver was also escaping from the aftermath of a battle. A fortified borderlander position that should have been able to hold for a long time. Is it a big stretch to assume that, like every other shadow battle in this book, there were shadow channelers present? So these crazy shadow Aiel being nearby doesn't seem so random anymore. As for killing the guy with a knife, why not? They are still Aiel, despite being shadow crazy types. I would think they'd get a perverse amount of pleasure from getting their hands dirty, especially if they didn't take a direct hand in the battle like they did at Maradon and with Perrin.

[Terrel88]

I agree with whoever said Ituralde may be the Fallen Wolf. Mainly because Perrin doesn't look like dying, and mthe hearts of men would surely be shattered by ituralde dying, as opposed to hopper (nobody cares except perrin). Can't wait for a reveal on the red-veiled Aiel. I hope Lanfear turns light-side again, so then Rand has 4 birds :D

[Guest surodat]

 

All that's left is the Vampires and Chuck Norris. My bet is we gotta wait til A Memory of Light for Chuck Norris to appear, so these guys have to be the Vampires ( or just evil ninjas ).

 

< you could make a good case that Drakhar are vampires >

< Death Watch Guards fill the Samurai niche, nicely >

 

I think the Gholam makes for a better Vampire, considering it only eats human blood.

[JDJ]

Starting with the lesser - we have absolutely no evidence to believe those men were Aiel, besides the ramblings of a nearly-dead caravan-fellow.

 

Another thing we have no evidence to believe is that those red-veiled cannibals can channel. People are just jumping to conclusions: "Oh that caravan guy says they look like Aiel, so they must be Aiel. Aiel in the blight? Only possibility is they are those men who went north. There, we figured it!". On the contrary we have sufficient evidence to believe they cannot channel. Why kill with their weapons/teeth? Why wander the blight alone? Why bother with a nearly-dead caravan driver? Surely in the eve of TLB the Shadow's channelers have more important things to do than cannibalizing corpses.

 

With that I conclude that we simply do not have enough information for anything, but speculation. And there are probably more possibilities than where D is.

 

Aiel are usually pretty unmistakable. Remember in the Eye of the World where everyone assumes (corrcectly as it turned out) that Rand was an Aielman? If it's wearing Cadin'sor, wearing a veil ... it's probably a pretty safe assumption.

 

This half daed caravan driver was also escaping from the aftermath of a battle. A fortified borderlander position that should have been able to hold for a long time. Is it a big stretch to assume that, like every other shadow battle in this book, there were shadow channelers present? So these crazy shadow Aiel being nearby doesn't seem so random anymore. As for killing the guy with a knife, why not? They are still Aiel, despite being shadow crazy types. I would think they'd get a perverse amount of pleasure from getting their hands dirty, especially if they didn't take a direct hand in the battle like they did at Maradon and with Perrin.

 

Given we have not really seen where (if any) of the BT Channelers have been positioned / moved for battle, it could easily be them as well using the power in the battle.

 

My initial thought was they were some twisted form of Aiel - perhaps 13X13'd or merged with / by some DO power / minion. I am no longer so sure...

 

Has it been specifically stated that darkfriends / minions cannot use the portal stones? I wonder if they are Aiel from another timeline, brought to the Randland timelines....

[lordofsoup]

Could the red Aiel could be Aiel that Fain has taken over, like he did to those Trollocs in the Blight? Could rand be Chuck Norris?

[JDJ]

I havent read the whole thread, but has anyone thought that the red Aiel could be Aiel that Fain has taken over, like he did to those Trollocs in the Blight?

 

Fain is... getting strange - a portable Mashadar and Zomblie Maker is gonna be interesting.

 

But nowhere does it indicate that Fain has run into any Aiel, and his POV only mentions Trollocs and Fades.

[nolirion]

Mierin redemption , that would be fun but nearly impossible .

First we have already a "redemption" in the person of Verin and this is highly unlikely an other will turn again .

Second Dear Lanfear goal's was not to serve the do nor access a position in serving him ;but to acces an higher power .

She even was ready to challenge the DO And the creator alike with rand and the access key .

 

I agree, no redemption.

 

But that does not preclude her trying to work with /use Rand to get free, and find some way to further use him so that she can "access a higher power".

 

I believe she is not working with anyone on some plot to trap Rand, she is working on her own, for herself - as she always has.

The whole "I-WANT-TO-MAKE-HIM-SUFFER-UNTIL-HE-DIE-AND-THEN-THE-GREAT-LORD-CAN-RESURRECT-HIM-FOR-ME-TO-MAKE-HIM-SUFFER-SOME-MORE" is her new goal i think