The Black Tower

[Luckers]

Discuss.

[nwash_10]

Well, we've speculated about channelers being turned to the shadow for a long time now...looks like we know where a lot of that is going down.

[Luckers]

Poor Tarna. She was one of my favourite characters. That scene literally made my skin crawl with horror.

[Sharaman]

Poor Tarna. She was one of my favourite characters. That scene literally made my skin crawl with horror.

Are we sure it's 13x13 and not just some form of unusually crude compulsion?

Can male channelers link with Fades or does it require 13 female channelers to do. If it requires females, the BA is presumably holed up in the BT and that was supposed to be the TAR killing ground for the WT attack. Makes sense actually - entice the AS out of the WT, take them to the BT and then trap them in an unfamiliar place with male channeler backup by using the second Dreamspike.

 

And what's with the Taim acolytes gaining in strength? Is Moridin distributing saidin angreals?

[Luckers]

I'm certain, but it's not WoTcertain. I imagine you get the distinction.

[KefkaPalazzo]

Poor Tarna. She was one of my favourite characters. That scene literally made my skin crawl with horror.

Are we sure it's 13x13 and not just some form of unusually crude compulsion?

Can male channelers link with Fades or does it require 13 female channelers to do. If it requires females, the BA is presumably holed up in the BT and that was supposed to be the TAR killing ground for the WT attack. Makes sense actually - entice the AS out of the WT, take them to the BT and then trap them in an unfamiliar place with male channeler backup by using the second Dreamspike.

 

And what's with the Taim acolytes gaining in strength? Is Moridin distributing saidin angreals?

 

The 13x13 trick needs 13 fades, and 13 Dreadlords. All Dreadlords are just DF channelers. Why we took it to mean BA, was it was mentioned in book 2, by Sheriam. At that point there was no BT, no Taim, none of that.

[WhiskyJack]

Poor Tarna. She was one of my favourite characters. That scene literally made my skin crawl with horror.

Are we sure it's 13x13 and not just some form of unusually crude compulsion?

Can male channelers link with Fades or does it require 13 female channelers to do. If it requires females, the BA is presumably holed up in the BT and that was supposed to be the TAR killing ground for the WT attack. Makes sense actually - entice the AS out of the WT, take them to the BT and then trap them in an unfamiliar place with male channeler backup by using the second Dreamspike.

 

And what's with the Taim acolytes gaining in strength? Is Moridin distributing saidin angreals?

 

The 13x13 trick needs 13 fades, and 13 Dreadlords. All Dreadlords are just DF channelers. Why we took it to mean BA, was it was mentioned in book 2, by Sheriam. At that point there was no BT, no Taim, none of that.

He/she meant if they had to link..Men cannot link..

[Sharaman]

I'm certain, but it's not WoTcertain. I imagine you get the distinction.

Yes :) - I'm on the same page.

@WhiskyJack indeed I was referring to the link problem.

We have no clue whether men can link with fades, in which case, it would be possible I suppose. However, Fades are always male and gender is important in WoT.

[KefkaPalazzo]

Poor Tarna. She was one of my favourite characters. That scene literally made my skin crawl with horror.

Are we sure it's 13x13 and not just some form of unusually crude compulsion?

Can male channelers link with Fades or does it require 13 female channelers to do. If it requires females, the BA is presumably holed up in the BT and that was supposed to be the TAR killing ground for the WT attack. Makes sense actually - entice the AS out of the WT, take them to the BT and then trap them in an unfamiliar place with male channeler backup by using the second Dreamspike.

 

And what's with the Taim acolytes gaining in strength? Is Moridin distributing saidin angreals?

 

The 13x13 trick needs 13 fades, and 13 Dreadlords. All Dreadlords are just DF channelers. Why we took it to mean BA, was it was mentioned in book 2, by Sheriam. At that point there was no BT, no Taim, none of that.

He/she meant if they had to link..Men cannot link..

 

Wow. I forgot that little detail. Could it be that the escaped BA are at the tower then? I know some of them got killed in TAR, but not all of them.

[WhiskyJack]

It doesn't look like that 13 number has any significance besides the fact that a link of 13 can shield any channeler. 13 fades I think are the key to conversion precess.

[lordofsoup]

The question is how is anyone going to get out, and how is the BT going to react to the attack on Camalyn. They can definately see it.

[Alleluia_Cone]

Poor Tarna. She was one of my favourite characters. That scene literally made my skin crawl with horror.

 

Mutual feelings. I was devastated when I read that part. Has the process been said to be irreversible?

[Bob T Dwarf]

Poor Tarna. She was one of my favourite characters. That scene literally made my skin crawl with horror.

 

Mutual feelings. I was devastated when I read that part. Has the process been said to be irreversible?

 

Seems to be the kind of thing, that if it takes, could only do so by squeezing all of the good out of a person. I doubt that there would be anything left of her good qualities to restore.

[Slick Mongoose]

Terrifying.

[Sharaman]

Well we've been told anybody can return to the Light but a turned channeler probably wouldn't want to.

[Jeangray]

The question is how is anyone going to get out, and how is the BT going to react to the attack on Camalyn. They can definately see it.

 

I suspect that at least some of them will be participating - on the side of Shadowspawn. Anyway, I was thinking that maybe Androl, Pevara and Co. they could do something simple, like dig an escape passage. Channelers often forget how much can be accomplished by simple means...

 

In any case, I am glad that the 13x13 gun has been finally fired and that at the same time we got a very satisfactory explanation re: why it wasn't done in the series before. I.e. it is very obvious to other people. As to the circles, the mixed ones will probably do. Gender may be important in Randland, but not in Shadowspawn links like Myrdraal/Trollocs.

I guess that Pevara got hero's battle exemption, since it makes sense to convert non-BA AS as quickly as possible as the women would be the bottle-neck for conversion process at the BT. I do wonder how she can live in the same hut with un-Tarna though.

[graendalzooescapee]

Are the Dreadlords we saw at Maradon coming from the BT, or not? (If not, is the Thing in the Blight an army camp full of Dreadlords and red-veiled Aiel?)

[Second Chance]

Although it was suspected, knowing (well, as good as knowing) that the BT is where the 13/13 conversion process is occuring makes me even more eager for Logain to tear it up. The way everyone is trapped there is, I agree, very creepy and tense. Seems like there is still plenty to heppen in AMoL.

 

EDIT: Surely a Forsaken has to be very directly overseeing this process? It makes no sense that RJ would lie when he crushed Taimandred, but what other explanation is there? The BT seems to be the heart of Dark channeler operations and I can't see it being left to 'high-ranking' darkfriends.

[Sid]

Androl's skill with Gateways was mentioned almost as often as 'peace' in a Catholic mass in as short of a time. I think he'll somehow overcome the dreamspikes with Pevara's help.

 

Where the hell are the other 50 sisters that were sent there with Toviene? Did they all hook up with Logain's crew?

 

The change in Tarna is very creepy, and a shame to happen to any person, much less one that I kinda liked after seeing her PoVs.

So if LIGHT RAND was able to make two darkfriends in Saldea kill themselves at his presence, what would happen if he went to the BT? Can Nyneave heal what Tarna and the others have? Rand wasn't kidding when he said there was so much yet to do. How could he think he'd break the seals in a day or so if he hadn't done anything at all with the BT? :blink:

[Luckers]

I can't believe no one has questioned this yet. What the frack has happened to Logain? The 13x13 Asha'man went looking for him... and came back evil.

[WhiskyJack]

Logain has turned to the Dark Side. He will find great glory under the DO's rule.

[Luckers]

Nah I reckon that's too obvious--if so why have Mezar come back and not Logain himself.

 

Also what's up with Myrelle and the others--camped outside of the BT for several weeks, and not even bothering to send word. Weird.

[Terez]

Yeah, I thought that was odd, too. The non-communication seemed to make it clear that they were being held prisoner. Perhaps their messages were intercepted? Were they brought inside before the dreamspike was activated? It seems unlikely that Taim would let them go.

[bushleague16]

So I think we all agree that this is definitive proof the Taim is a DF/new forsaken?

[Shienara]

Could someone specify more regarding Tarna, and why we think she's been 13x13? Thanks in advance...I have to wait until th 15th before I can buy the book, and I'm living on spoilers until then! lol