Who else hates Aes Sedai

[Vulgir]

I cant help but ask, cause i hate them with a passion. It seems that throughout the series they started as something to be in Awe of, but just spiral down hill. I cant stand how they think they know everything, and walk around with a sense of entitlement that just keeps being thrown back in there faces as wrong wrong wrong. They just look down on everyone who has a different point of view or another train of thought, it feels like their alot like the Nun's i went to school with when i was younger, and they are just itching to paddle me. There are obvisouly a few exceptions but overall i think the black tower needs needs to smack the white towers butt and tell it to get in the kitchen and make it a pie.

[Muad Cheade]

I cant help but ask, cause i hate them with a passion. It seems that throughout the series they started as something to be in Awe of, but just spiral down hill. I cant stand how they think they know everything, and walk around with a sense of entitlement that just keeps being thrown back in there faces as wrong wrong wrong. They just look down on everyone who has a different point of view or another train of thought, it feels like their alot like the Nun's i went to school with when i was younger, and they are just itching to paddle me. There are obvisouly a few exceptions but overall i think the black tower needs needs to smack the white towers butt and tell it to get in the kitchen and make it a pie.

 

Well, that what the main characters and many of the Aes Sedai realized. They realized Aes Sedai are not omnipotent, omniscient and are prone to mistakes. The White Tower has been the most powerful institution over the past 3,000 years and as a result, the members of that organization seem to take that fact for granted. Also, no one has seriously challenged the White Tower's authority since the time of Artur Hawkwing.

 

Not all Aes Sedai are worthy of anyone's hate. Their situation is very realistic but the majority of the Aes Sedai's motives are for the greater good.

 

And your last sentence was just a teensy bit sexist, fyi.

[OptimusPrime]

Gotta say I cant get enough of Aes Sedai to be honest. Their deviousness is incredibly interesting and I think the Oaths do more to portray that deviousness than anything else. Sure, the intention of the Oaths having so many loopholes was most likely not there, but the fact that those loopholes do exist combined with prolonged life expectancies really make for some great personalities to emerge. They have decades upon decades to learn how to use the lying Oath to their advantage. No wonder Aes Sedai look down their noses at people; none of them can see how false the Three Oaths really are. That might not be at the fore of most Aes Sedais mind, but nobody can deny that Verin loves it every time she misleads someone by manipulating the truth, and when you keep convincing people of things that arent true, eventually you start thinking they are stupid. Carry that on for a couple thousand years and yes, any Aes Sedai is likely to believe herself over any gullible commoner with a basic education, if that.

[Vulgir]

Considering Everyone in the white tower thinks men are second rate thinkers, people ima say good to my last statement!! :o

[magnutz]

I too loathe Aes Sedai, most of them. Self-righteous snooty assinine moronic women.. can't bear tools like that. ;) The only Aes Sedai who is in my good graces is Moiraine. Strange? Perhaps. ;) The rest are gag-material.

[Vulgir]

EXACTLY!!! ;D ;D

[Jemlin]

I dislike the original organization of the group and their methods (before the changes).

 

But, to say you hate it is silly.

 

Unless your a White Cloak

[Vulgir]

Or Rand, Matt, or Perrin, or everyotherman in the book who says not to trust Aes Sedi

[ohaitharguiz]

The Aes Sedai really are the pinnacle of stupidity in this book. Moiraine/elayne/Nynaeve are really the only ones I find enjoyable. I might be forgetting a few, but that really isn't an understatement.

[humanraindelay]

I have to say I despise Elayne but I Do like Suane, Leane and Egwene. Especially since Egwene was kidnapped.

[ohaitharguiz]

I have to say I despise Elayne but I Do like Suane, Leane and Egwene. Especially since Egwene was kidnapped.

 

Go easy on the valley girls, man.

[BKVMC]

"There are obvisouly a few exceptions but overall i think the black tower needs needs to smack the white towers butt and tell it to get in the kitchen and make it a pie."

 

And people say  Misogyny is dead.

[Agitel]

I think this topic is a good place for me to have finally made the connection between White Tower and Ivory Tower. I mean, I knew the similarities, but the obvious symbolism flew over my head until I heard the term "Ivory Tower" today. The Aes Sedai are locked up in their Ivory Tower, thinking they're better than everyone else and extremely attached from the real world.

 

It's this that has me thinking that the White Tower will break... literally. I am WAITING on this moment now.

[Dert]

 

 

Don't hate them as such.  However they live in an Ivory tower, where their belief in their selves and they right to meddle, is supported and encouraged by the whole. Power corrupts, an not always in big meglomanic ways.

 

Also I don't think Aes Sedai would make good pie.

[OptimusPrime]

Cadsuane, Verin, Moiraine. I shall say no more

[deepak_dragonreborn]

i hate all of them...Especially Cadsuane  >:(

[Vulgir]

Cadsuane, Verin, Moiraine. I shall say no more

 

if ur using them as en example of good Aes Sedai, its actually a bad example. Cadusane is condisdered an extreme radical of the tower, think she was said to have bent tower law as far as it would go, Verin is a wild card, and Moriaine would have been stilled like Suiane if she ever came back to the tower. So three examples of Decent Aes Sedai that by Aes Sedai definition, make bad Aes Sedai!

[humanraindelay]

Is there proof that Verin is Black or are you just assuming?

[Mr Ares]

none of them can see how false the Three Oaths really are.

They can, though. That the truth you hear isn't always the truth you think you hear when dealing with AS is well known. Sure, the unwary might still be caught out, you might not see just how this AS is misleading you, but people know that the AS are not to be trusted.

 

The WT is an organisation with a lot of problems. The AS are moribund. They've had 3,000 years of unquestioned dominance. They're secretive, arrogant, isolated from society in general, meddlesome. As a group, it's hard to really like them. However, there are a fair few individuals who are worthy of note.

[crazyfool]

I too dislike Aes Sedai. One of the biggest problems I have with them is that they believe "Might makes Right." They are rigid in their beliefs, demand respect where none is due, believe the worlds problems are theirs to solve and have forgotten what a true Aes Sedai is supposed to be ("Servants of All" I think).

 

Also they remind me of old people.

[Eleint]

You're supposed to dislike the average Aes Sedai.  What Jordan did is reverse societal trends from the past.  For a long period of time in the real world, women were considered second rate citizens and men were in charge and sure of their superiority, especially elite sorts in various institutions.

 

In the Wheel of Time, for over a thousand years, women have had more power than men in general.  Even where things are 'equal', there's a condescending tone to things -- the Women's Council in Two Rivers is incredibly condescending to the men in spite of them being 'equal'.  And there is no male version of the White Tower, a group of people who live a long, long time and have extreme amounts of power.

 

The women of the Wheel of Time are people.  They are not perfect.  It'd be even worse if they were portrayed as perfect considering the cultural ramifications (which is one reason it always annoys me when people say Jordan's sexist for having the Aes Sedai being as they are.)

 

So yeah, I dislike the average Aes Sedai intensely.  But I think that'll change as the Black Tower comes to the fore and things become more 'even' and the Aes Sedai are forced to acknowledge they aren't superior and that they make mistakes.

[Mr Ares]

Also they remind me of old people.

That's a bad thing because...?

[OptimusPrime]

Cadsuane, Verin, Moiraine. I shall say no more

 

if ur using them as en example of good Aes Sedai, its actually a bad example. Cadusane is condisdered an extreme radical of the tower, think she was said to have bent tower law as far as it would go, Verin is a wild card, and Moriaine would have been stilled like Suiane if she ever came back to the tower. So three examples of Decent Aes Sedai that by Aes Sedai definition, make bad Aes Sedai!

 

Im not using them as examples of good Aes Sedai, but interesting characters. The fact that they are so corrupt and arrogant is part of what makes them so good to read about in my opinion. Im one of those people who doesnt care if a character does good or bad things. Its the how and why that interests me, at least with Verin. Cadsuanes force of personality puts her high up for me, and Moiraine, well, she is the one you dont realize how much you like her till shes gone.

[SheaththeSword]

Does anyone else see the connection between the White Tower (up till recent reforms) and the Catholic Church before counter-reformation (thats when they had their big reforms)? Look at the similarities:

 

1. Take people (of one gender) out of society, train them for years in a large gathering of people with the same beliefs.

 

2. Make their initiates belive in their supperiority and authority over everything.

 

3. Abuse their power to their own advantage (this point includes all issues connected to corruption).

 

4. Suppress minority groups that could challenge them in future (eg destroying anyone with other views on Christianity, break up groups of 'non-authorised' channelers)

 

There are probably a few more. I actually forgot one while writting this, will include in new post if it comes to me XD.

 

Anyone see this before, agree/strongly disagree?

 

[Eleint]

It's pretty obvious the White Tower is a parallel for various organizations through history.  I wouldn't say only the Catholic Church, though.  It fits quite a few social structures, including various historical guilds and aristocracies.

 

Note, however, that there actually were females somewhat prominent in the Catholic Church at various points in history.  Not Bishops or Popes (we won't get into 'Pope Joan') but nevertheless.