Your Favorite Villain, and Why....

[Jethro]

In order to break someone who has any resistance at all, you need to know a bit of that person's background.  What is his/her emotional weak spot?

 

Unless Cadsuanne knows a bit more about Forsaken than the average Aes Sedai, I fail to see how she can break Semirhage by herself.

 

Oh dear. Read my post again please Thor, and then look at your own. For one thing I said it would be good if Cadsuane did break Semirhage, not that she will do. Secondly I do not need to know Semirhages weak spot, because Im not the one trying to break her. And thirdly, just because Cadsuane doesnt know Semirhages weak spot already, it doesnt mean she cant find out. I think between them, Cadsuane and Sorilea could indeed break her, although I would like it if it was mostly Cadsuane, she deserves more on-screen thunder of her own. As for knowing Semirhages background, in the same scene she was captured in she told Cadsuane and co about Rands connection to Lews therin, that Rand knows things only Lews Therin could, so Cadsuane knows where she can get at least something. I think she could break Semirhage, but if Im honest I dont think its going to come about.

 

i can only assume you don't speak english as first language, given your response.

 

What makes you say that? My grammar is decent and the wording is as easy to understand as anyone elses. Oh wait, you said given my RESPONSE. Explain please, because I have just read your post and my response and I cant see anything wrong with it.

 

Dont take offense if people show that you are wrong Thor, we are all human. I myself have had some of my favorite theories smited, and I dont hold any grudges for it.

 

No, your response was the poor one.  You accused me of saying 'you' as in addressing you you, but if you have any idea about english language at all, you would know that 'you' means 'one'.

 

and it is common sense because i say it is, good luck breaking something without any weakness.

 

The reason I took you as literal in your post was because you asked a question-what is semirhages weak spot-as if I was the one who needed to know it. Your posts after that havent done you any favors either since it looks like you resorted to personal attack because I disagreed with something you said. You really arent doing yourself any favors by saying english isnt my first language going off me misunderstanding the context of a single word. Fair enough if you meant it the other way and all that, but that isnt how it looks.

[Mr Ares]

In order to break someone who has any resistance at all, you need to know a bit of that person's background. What is his/her emotional weak spot?

and it is common sense because i say it is, good luck breaking something without any weakness.

Changing your argument. First, they must be known. Second, they must exist. That they exist is known. What they are is unknown, but Cadsuane need not know them in order to break Semi. She doesn't need to know her background, her emotions. Semi broke Cabriana with pain. Lots and lots of pain. She didn't need to know her emoitional weak spots or background. She just needed to hurt her. A lot. Also, because I say so is not a good reason.

[Sab]

One problem with breaking Semi is she isn't a coward like Mogi or Asmo.  I think she is more likely to fear the DO's punishment then she is Cadsuane.  Think Asmo served as a warning to them all what the price for failure/weakness is.  I am surprised Moghi's punishment hasn't been more public to the rest of the Forsaken as another warning.

[Thor]

really? we'll see, enough for empty speculations. rafo. 

 

personally, i think it's a total waste of time to even bother breaking semirhage.

 

she doesn't even know where demandred is, what's the use of getting any information from her?  especially if the one power is going to be blocked after the last battle as many believe.

 

if i were rand, cadsuane and co, i would shield her permanently, break her limbs permanently enough, then leave her on the side of a road to rot.

 

just like perrin threatened to do to someone.

[Dark Justice]

Do you seriously belive that is the only thing they can learn from her?

 

Cads: Where is Demandred?

Sem: I dont know

Cads: Crap, can you teach us to channel please?

Sem: Oh, why bother, the source is being cut off soon.

Cads: Ok. Bye then.

 

I think we could possibly learn some few things from her...

[Thor]

you want her to describe in detail how she slaughtered the seanchan family?

[Kadere]

Learning that she slaughtered the Seanchan royal family before they go and treat with the new Empress of Seanchan might be useful information.

[Thor]

tuon already knows of her family's death and as the heir she would not show any emotions of how it affects her so as to prove to her political rivals that she is strong enough and also to keep the morale of the empire high. 

 

what makes you think that it would help for randland's delegates to attempt to be sympathetic?

[Jethro]

If Rand and Cadsuane learn that Semirhage had killed the royal family, Rand would have a very good opening for his eventual meeting with Tuon. "I have in custody Semirhage, who was responsible for the murder of you're family. Fancy a truce?"

[Thor]

and so we go back to the a dam again, the cycle is complete.

[dlan4327]

Lanfear/Mierin. I just want to be clear when I say Lanfear/Mierin I'm intentionally leaving out Cyndane because I don't like that part of her.

 

As for Lanfear to this day I can think of very few female character's who I have fallen so deeply unabashedly in love with. An amazing creation.

 

She was so vivid throughout the early parts of the series. How often does a character come along who literally makes your mouth run dry?

 

[Mr Ares]

Think Asmo served as a warning to them all what the price for failure/weakness is. I am surprised Moghi's punishment hasn't been more public to the rest of the Forsaken as another warning.

Yes, Asmo serves as an object lesson - disobey Shai'tan then you will die, at some point, probably, even if no-one (but the killer) knows who did it and it wasn't done at Shai'tan's order. And Moghedien, Cyndane, Mesaana, all have been punished with none of their punishments made public. It is a consistent pattern of keeping punishments secret. Why are you surprised?

 

especially if the one power is going to be blocked after the last battle as many believe.

Who in the series believes that? If they don't, then why not try and break her? They won't know what she knows until they do.

 

if i were rand, cadsuane and co, i would shield her permanently, break her limbs permanently enough, then leave her on the side of a road to rot.

So easy for people to say things like that, so much harder to actually do it.

[Thor]

perrin could do it, i have no doubts about that.

 

and if cadsuane if even half as hard as people on this board claims her to be, she can do it too.

[Fjong]

Perrin coulden't do it unless Semirhage threatened his wife.

 

My favorite villain is Fain, he has the guts and skills to toture a fade!, he turns everyone he needs, the whitecloaks is a good example of this, oh and he is completely mad.

[Jethro]

And he is so unique and unpredictable. A wild card, a loose cannon. A renegade Dakfriend touched by the Great Lord, who melded with another type of evil to become a completely new force. Everything about him, even his guise as a peddler and us meeting him as early as we did, it all makes for a brilliant twist the first time you read it. The Great Hunt is one of my favorite books because of Fains importance to the plot at the time.

[Mr Ares]

perrin could do it, i have no doubts about that.

 

and if cadsuane if even half as hard as people on this board claims her to be, she can do it too.

You couldn't, is my point.

[Thor]

last time i checked, i'm not a character in the books.

[Sab]

Yes, Asmo serves as an object lesson - disobey Shai'tan then you will die, at some point, probably, even if no-one (but the killer) knows who did it and it wasn't done at Shai'tan's order. And Moghedien, Cyndane, Mesaana, all have been punished with none of their punishments made public. It is a consistent pattern of keeping punishments secret. Why are you surprised?

 

Quite simply to let all know what happens when you fail.  Think knowing Mogi is mind trapped would serve as a very clear signal to the rest.

[Mr Ares]

last time i checked, i'm not a character in the books.

You said that if you were, you would do it. I sincerely doubt you could. You not being in the books is merely one more reason why you couldn't.

 

Quite simply to let all know what happens when you fail.

They know what happens, they've seen it many times in the AoL. In fact, back then people who did what Moghedien did would likely be dead. Making it known gives the impression that Shai'tan is losing His touch, more forgiving of failure.

[Sab]

last time i checked, i'm not a character in the books.

You said that if you were, you would do it. I sincerely doubt you could. You not being in the books is merely one more reason why you couldn't.

 

Quite simply to let all know what happens when you fail.

They know what happens, they've seen it many times in the AoL. In fact, back then people who did what Moghedien did would likely be dead. Making it known gives the impression that Shai'tan is losing His touch, more forgiving of failure.

 

True but the bringing back Aginor and Balthamel already shows the DO is forced to change ways in this time.  In AOL he wouldn't be forced to bring back a dead Choosen.  To me knowing you could be mind trapped and be at the whims of a partially insane Ishy would be a worse fear then death.

[bmazz1008]

Demandred is definitely my favorite.

 

I think the fact that he is always so shrouded in mystery, and even after 11 books, we still have no definitive idea where he is or what his endgame is makes me look forward to every appearance he has in the series (few and far between that they are)

 

Ishamael/Moridin runs a close second.

[Thor]

last time i checked, i'm not a character in the books.

You said that if you were, you would do it. I sincerely doubt you could. You not being in the books is merely one more reason why you couldn't.

 

 

 

you cannot doubt, because you are you, you are not others.

 

if you can doubt, then i can say that you haven't read the series personally and are just standing around here posting using online resources such as wotmania.  why do i say that?  because you have never shown to have any interpretation of your own of various details in the book.

[Mr Ares]

Quite simply to let all know what happens when you fail.

They know what happens, they've seen it many times in the AoL. In fact, back then people who did what Moghedien did would likely be dead. Making it known gives the impression that Shai'tan is losing His touch, more forgiving of failure.

True but the bringing back Aginor and Balthamel already shows the DO is forced to change ways in this time. In AOL he wouldn't be forced to bring back a dead Chosen. To me knowing you could be mind trapped and be at the whims of a partially insane Ishy would be a worse fear then death.

Good point.

 

last time i checked, i'm not a character in the books.

You said that if you were, you would do it. I sincerely doubt you could. You not being in the books is merely one more reason why you couldn't.

you cannot doubt, because you are you, you are not others.

I cannot doubt because I am me? Well, you are not me, so you are hardly in a position to judge whether or not I can doubt. Anyway, I'm fairly certain I can doubt. Not entirely convinced, admittedly, I could be incapable of anything other than absolute certainty, I'm not sure, but on balance of probabilities, I'm going to go with being able to doubt.

 

if you can doubt, then i can say that you haven't read the series personally and are just standing around here posting using online resources such as wotmania. why do i say that? because you have never shown to have any interpretation of your own of various details in the book.

Of course, it makes sense that I never read the books and just decided to sign up to a fan forum for a series I have never read, by an author I've never even heard of (Robert Jordan you say? I'll have to look him up some time). Idiot. What relevance does this even have? I said I doubt you could "shield her permanently, break her limbs permanently enough, then leave her on the side of a road to rot." Now, I stand by that. I don't think you could cripple a woman and leave her by the side of a road to die. Because I doubt that you're a sadistic, borderline socipoath. Forgive me for doubting that you were capable of that sort of thing. To be honest, I don't exactly see this forum overflowing with the sort of people who would be willing and able to do that sort of thing (far easier to say you would on the internet, where you'll never have to follow through on your promise, and can stay far away from the reality of what you're talking about doing. Nice and insulated). You bring up Perrin and Cadsuane as examples of people who could, but they wouldn't. Perrin's entire family was murdered. All he had left was his wife. She was kidnapped. He wanted her back. He was willing to do some pretty nasty things to get her back. But he didn't enjoy them. When he tortured that Aiel, it wasn't revenge, or sadism. It was for information. A means to an end. And after that, he threw his axe away. What would it take to induce him to do that sort of thing against Semi? As it stands now, he wouldn't. He might kill her, he might leave her as Rand's or someone elses problem. But he would not do as you suggest. Same with Cadsuane. She could, but she is not wasteful, she is not sadistic, and she is not vengeful. She might try to extract information. She might consider her a liability and kill her. She wouldn't cripple her and leave her to die. It's not in her nature. I doubt you could do anything like what you suggest in their position unless you had been through a hell of a lot at that persons hands. But maybe I'm wrong. So, how many people have you done similar things to? How many people have you killed in cold blood? What on earth makes you think you have the stomach for that sort of thing? And even if you do, what on earth makes you think that is something to brag about? Killing is necessary sometimes, but it is not big and it is not clever.

[General Cauthon]

True but the bringing back Aginor and Balthamel already shows the DO is forced to change ways in this time. In AOL he wouldn't be forced to bring back a dead Chosen.

 

In the BWB it says

 

Though other Aes Sedai went over to the Shadow, none who equaled or approached in strenght those now called Forsaken was still alive by the last year of the War of Power; yet not one of them is reported to have died by enemy action.

 

I know that the BWB can be inaccurate, but I think it's more likely that the DO didn't have to recycle anyone at that time. I believe that he would have brought back anyone that would be useful to him, if LTT was responcible for their deaths.

[Sab]

True he had many to choose from so if you failed there were others to take your place.  But he killed many of the Choosen himself on suspicions,he didn't care if the Choosen killed each other or if they fell to LTT.  He actually encouraged them to kill each other off.  So if one died he had no need or desire to bring anyone back.  He is now forced to bring back people because he has no other options.