Season 1 Discussion (Full Book Spoilers) v2.1

[Mailman]

3 hours ago, DigificWriter said:

I already wanted the show to get 8 seasons because I really like it, but now I perversely want it to get 8 seasons purely to spite all of the 'disappointed darkfriends' out there who are acting like Rafe and his team killed their grandmother.

For someone who brought up a meme and said that it might trigger people you seem to want to throw around the disappointed darkfriend insult repeatedly. And yes you are using it in order to try and get a rise out of people.

[Lethira the second]

For those who are angry/disappointed -can I offer a piece of advice.  Don't set your picnic up next to a giant dog turd.

 

If you don't like the adaptation don't give it energy.  Don't watch it, don't argue about it on a forum (you won't change anyones mind).  Unsubscribe from the content creators who are praising it, don't interact with their videos even if you feel like venting.  If you're angry at Brandon Sanderson for liking the adaptation (I've not seen his comments on the latest one, so I don't know) then buy his books second hand and enjoy them that way, if you feel the need to make a stand.

 

Feel betrayed that you were promised an adaptation and didn't get one.  That's fine, I'm grieving too for the characters I loved.  For your own mental wellbeing, just pretend it didn't happen.  That is the biggest way you can show your anger/disappointment.  If the show loses traction and presence; well Amazon are the ones holding the purse strings and they will want a return for their money.

[fra85uk]

I cannot forgive them for Having ruined my most beloved books and characters.

 

All male characters have been made dirty beyond belief

 

BUT

 

on a second thought what they did to Nyn and Eg is even worse: they have transformed them in these unbearable onedimensional Marysues which is sooo opposite from the books in which they had to work hard, suffer, adapt and overcome their limitations...but now "you are Dying? No problem, untrained Marysues god-tier healing will save the day".

[Hobo]

3 minutes ago, fra85uk said:

I cannot forgive them for Having ruined my most beloved books and characters.

 

All male characters have been made dirty beyond belief

 

BUT

 

on a second thought what they did to Nyn and Eg is even worse: they have transformed them in these unbearable onedimensional Marysues which is sooo opposite from the books in which they had to work hard, suffer, adapt and overcome their limitations...but now "you are Dying? No problem, untrained Marysues god-tier healing will save the day".

At this point i think id honestly prefer that terrible Billy Zane Winter Dragon over what I've seen of this season

[Ralph]

Something I have found interesting, and trying to analyse for myself why it is - 

 

The few times they have taken lines straight from the books, or used book expressions, I have found them very clunky and badly performed. 

 

That includes the Lan/Nynaeve convo in Ep8, and the few times they have referred to the Light or Blood and Ashes, and even Uno

 

Valda is the only one I think has delivered those lines well, and Moiraine not so bad, but all the younger actors seem disturbed by saying them? 

 

 

Edited December 24, 2021 by Ralph

[Hobo]

1 hour ago, Lethira the second said:

For those who are angry/disappointed -can I offer a piece of advice.  Don't set your picnic up next to a giant dog turd.

My picnic has been set up for a VERY long time. The dog came and shat in my picnic basket.

[Gothic Flame]

15 minutes ago, Hobo said:

My picnic has been set up for a VERY long time. The dog came and shat in my picnic basket.

As bad as that is, you've other trying to shine it up.

[Gothic Flame]

2 hours ago, Lethira the second said:

For those who are angry/disappointed -can I offer a piece of advice.  Don't set your picnic up next to a giant dog turd.

 

If you don't like the adaptation don't give it energy.  Don't watch it, don't argue about it on a forum (you won't change anyones mind).  Unsubscribe from the content creators who are praising it, don't interact with their videos even if you feel like venting.  If you're angry at Brandon Sanderson for liking the adaptation (I've not seen his comments on the latest one, so I don't know) then buy his books second hand and enjoy them that way, if you feel the need to make a stand.

 

Feel betrayed that you were promised an adaptation and didn't get one.  That's fine, I'm grieving too for the characters I loved.  For your own mental wellbeing, just pretend it didn't happen.  That is the biggest way you can show your anger/disappointment.  If the show loses traction and presence; well Amazon are the ones holding the purse strings and they will want a return for their money.

It's surprising how many are pointing to moments and little nuggets like our three cabelleros, Rand, Perrin, and, Mat, rubbernecking in Baerlon thinking they're seeing a great city.

[DigificWriter]

3 hours ago, Mailman said:

For someone who brought up a meme and said that it might trigger people you seem to want to throw around the disappointed darkfriend insult repeatedly. And yes you are using it in order to try and get a rise out of people.

 

'Disappointed Darkfriends' isn't an insult; it's a label and a descriptor., and one that was coined by a podcast I listen to.

 

I also already explained that the post you quoted wasn't really a serious response to all of the outrage that Episode 8 has apparently engendered, the over-the-top intensity of which I find amusing.

 

I also objected to that meme because of what it implied about the subject of suicide.

[Pandemonium]

Thankfully season has been pulling in numbers and was not a complete flop from the critics.  Good but not great is definitely an apt description of season 1.

This will likely give amazon the confidence to invest more

If anyone has seen the Witcher season 2 yet, it is large improvement over season 1.  Much more has been invested in the show, and it has been rumored to be getting 15 million per episode as compared to 10 million in season 1.

 

Let's hope wheel of time can also get this treatment and hopefully getting a better system of checks and balances for some of the questionable plot decisions 

[orbops]

9 hours ago, Quiksilver said:

Typical genius Mat move... Recognizes he's accidentally gotten into a dumpster fire, and nimbly jumps out. In 18 months when the show is cancelled, he will be recognized for this move.

That sounds similar to when Denise Crosby left ST:TNG after season 1. She ended up as a recurring character from season 3 onward...

[orbops]

8 hours ago, DigificWriter said:

I already wanted the show to get 8 seasons because I really like it, but now I perversely want it to get 8 seasons purely to spite all of the 'disappointed darkfriends' out there who are acting like Rafe and his team killed their grandmother.

8 seasons is a pipe dream. Look at The Expanse - Amazon is only doing 6 seasons of which 3 are their own. And that's with Bezos actively wanting that show. I think the best we can expect is 4-6 seasons. 

 

For all those ripping Rafe for his adaptation, then consider how you would pace the show with only 4-6 seasons at 8 episodes/season? 14 books is impossible to mimic as a TV show. 

 

Here's an example of even 14 books being too unwieldly. I was at Barnes & Noble a week ago in the Fantasy section. An older couple was looking for The Wheel of Time books, so I pointed out book 1 EofW for them. They were ready to buy it as a gift for their grandson until I told him that it is a 14 book series.  They immediately put it back and decided to buy the 6 book Dune gift set instead.

[orbops]

1 hour ago, mogi68 said:

This is the worst book adaptation I've ever seen, and as a show itself I think it's dog****

No, the worst one is Legend of the Seeker season 2.

[Gothic Flame]

1 minute ago, orbops said:

For all those ripping Rafe for his adaptation, then consider how you would pace the show with only 4-6 seasons at 8 episodes/season? 14 books is impossible to mimic as a TV show. 

If that's it, then it's impossible. Why would Rafe even try? He claimed to be a fan of the books..?

[DigificWriter]

@orbops Amazon is very happy with the show, so 8 seasons is entirely doable.

[MasterAblar]

10 minutes ago, orbops said:

Here's an example of even 14 books being too unwieldly. I was at Barnes & Noble a week ago in the Fantasy section. An older couple was looking for The Wheel of Time books, so I pointed out book 1 EofW for them. They were ready to buy it as a gift for their grandson until I told him that it is a 14 book series.  They immediately put it back and decided to buy the 6 book Dune gift set instead.

 

Why would you buy all 14 books in the first place? Imagine he doesn't like the 1st book, that's a hell of a lot of wasted money ?

[SingleMort]

Where I stand right now is this

 

• Episodes 3 to 6 were the best episodes of the season in my opinion. I really enjoyed seeing the battle with Logain and the interactions with other Aes Sedia and the introduction of Siuan Sanche and Thom were both very well done IMO. Tar Valon also looked great and just like I imagined it when I read the books.  
• Episodes 2 and 7 were okay. I mostly liked them but a few issues with certain aspects. For example I really liked how Shadar Logoth was portrayed but wish they had played up the ghost town themes and included more detail of Mat finding the dagger. 
• Episodes 1 and 8 I didn't enjoy very much. Not because they changed things from the book but because the things they changed didn't make any sense to me after they changed them. For example I am left scratching my head as to why the horn was in Fal Dara and if it was why the Shienaran would not use it? Seems like it would have been pretty useful in the battle. Also when Rand just walks off... ? 

[Wassup]

2 hours ago, SingleMort said:

• ... For example I am left scratching my head as to why the horn was in Fal Dara and if it was why the Shienaran would not use it? Seems like it would have been pretty useful in the battle. Also when Rand just walks off... ? 

This is a good question in regards to how tempted Agelmar was to use the horn when he had it in the book. Would he not be so tempted with the ever encroaching blight?  I know there was a comment about it being for the dragon, but non-readers have to be confused as to what it even is. 

[Wassup]

I do like how they have been using the different terms for things, like in the books. However, I think the books had it due to different cultures using different terms. Like they call something by one word in the Two Rivers but by another word in Fal Dara. 
I felt like that added to the scope of the world. 

 

I feel like some of it is too much in one moment, though. The end of ep 8 had cuendillar and heartstone mentioned in the same conversation. If you do not already know they are the same thing, you might be confused. 

[TheDreadReader]

10 minutes ago, Wassup said:

This is a good question in regards to how tempted Agelmar was to use the horn when he had it in the book. Would he not be so tempted with the ever encroaching blight?  I know there was a comment about it being for the dragon, but non-readers have to be confused as to what it even is. 

 

 

Based on the reactions that I've seen, the questions about the horn are secondary ones.  In a general sense, viewers are typically okay with an item not being explained as long as they have the belief that it will be explained later.   I think the show has been doing a pretty good job of doing that in season one.   

 

Readers tend to have more questions but they seem to hinge on the potential differences between what they know from the books and what they know from the show.

 

 

 

[Quiksilver]

5 hours ago, Gothic Flame said:

If that's it, then it's impossible. Why would Rafe even try? He claimed to be a fan of the books..?

 

of course he claims to be a book fan ...

 

imagine if he said "well im not really a fan of the books..."

[Hobo]

1 hour ago, Quiksilver said:

 

of course he claims to be a book fan ...

 

imagine if he said "well im not really a fan of the books..."

To me, it feels as though he has only skim read the books then made a show based on a quick skim read. 

[Mailman]

9 hours ago, DigificWriter said:

 

'Disappointed Darkfriends' isn't an insult; it's a label and a descriptor., and one that was coined by a podcast I listen to.

 

I also already explained that the post you quoted wasn't really a serious response to all of the outrage that Episode 8 has apparently engendered, the over-the-top intensity of which I find amusing.

 

I also objected to that meme because of what it implied about the subject of suicide.

Oh so you are using it to equate people to some of the most evil people in the books in a positive light.

 

My bad. (sarcasm)

 

The joke was that you wanted the series to continue to spite the people who dislike the series. 

The joke was not your use of the term disappointed darkfriends which you have used before in other responses.

 

Its clearly a insult and even if the original usage of it was somehow not a negative usage the way you are using it is.

[dwn]

12 hours ago, Ralph said:

Something I have found interesting, and trying to analyse for myself why it is - 

 

The few times they have taken lines straight from the books, or used book expressions, I have found them very clunky and badly performed. 

 

That includes the Lan/Nynaeve convo in Ep8, and the few times they have referred to the Light or Blood and Ashes, and even Uno

 

Valda is the only one I think has delivered those lines well, and Moiraine not so bad, but all the younger actors seem disturbed by saying them? 

 

 

A lot of book dialogue reads well, but doesn't flow properly when spoken in a TV or movie setting. You can get away with it occasionally, depending on the context and actor (typically if he/she has theatre experience), but it often sounds stilted at best. It's like how plays and musicals tend to fall apart when put to film.

[ArrylT]

7 minutes ago, dwn said:

A lot of book dialogue reads well, but doesn't flow properly when spoken in a TV or movie setting. You can get away with it occasionally, depending on the context and actor (typically if he/she has theatre experience), but it often sounds stilted at best. It's like how plays and musicals tend to fall apart when put to film.

I have been wondering if this was why the Winter Dragon set looked liked a theater stage, because that was the impression I got when I tried to watch that pilot.