[Advanced] Old West Mischief Mafia - Town Wins!

[DPR]

 

Cuth can you explain where Eldricks 'delayed' results came from? I remember him claiming he'd been offered a choice, but don't recall any time delay thing?

he said something along the lines of "i had to make a choice and i'm worried it might result in me dying target me please doctor"

 

 

@ BFG - Why ask Cuth about this?

 

 

 

 

Here we go - get a load of this:

 

Ok. Had to wait for mod conformation about if I could even talk about it.

 

Last night, presumably at the beginning of night phase, I was to make a choice. I can't go into specifics because of mod communication and whatnot, but suffice to say I'm worried about the result of the choice.

 

Due to the obscure nature of the question, it feels like depending on what I picked, one of us will die. If there's a doc, and they have nothing better to do, I would like protection. I don't trust the outcome of this role, whatever it's doing.

 

If it's result is a kill, I would like to thwart it. It does not feel like a town ability.

 

that's never scum

 

it's also not role-fishing

 

unless the scum team has a watcher or something

 

rolefishing is enticing people to publicly out their roles, which is not the case

 

Cuth, in light of Eldrick flipping scum, what do you think of this now?

 

 

 

I see where liz/clov wanted to ask Cuth about his opinion, but they never followed up with any questions - as has happened all game.

 

Lots and lots of questions, but not a lot of push of the answers...

 

Is anybody else ready to call Eldricks move a botched attempt at role-fishing? The fact that Eldrick launched it, botched it and then tried to wave it away makes me think it was coached as well, which narrows the suspect pool. 

[Cuth]

 

i asked you earlier: why was i on top of your readslist yesterday?

I responded, because you lead the lynch on NB Day 1 - with no other information I'm going to give people who lynch mafia Day 1 at least a days pass

 

sorry, must have missed

 

my second question is why eldrick was second

[Cuth]

dpr i agree that that makes the most sense

 

we can probably assume some sort of alignment role, likely a watcher

[BFG]

 

 

@DPR that's not what I meant, obviously Crusher picked correctly given NB flipped scum. But you've been adamant that Liz/Mrs Clov are scum, and since Day 2ish have been saying they're probably a PR, so why do you think it's good that Crusher switched when iyo if he'd stuck to Liz/Mrs Clov there was a chance they'd flip instead?

 

And ok

 

 

For the sake of accuracy, liz/clov is my #1 pick for scum. They were on D1, D2 and still are. I recognize that there will be other scummers, and I don't want to be a distraction to people spotting that, so I've put my case on the shelf so far today knowing that it ain't going anywhere and I can pick it up anytime needed.

 

I obviously cannot speak for Crusher. I see what I see and he sees what he sees - he moved his vote and hit scum based on logic I understand and agree with.

 

I also factor in all of the movement before that lynch. To me, Cuth, Seph and Edlrick were all more important to look at as I didn't get their logic at all.

 

Also, you have yet to comment on it, but what are your thoughts on that? Why did NB move his vote to even up his own train to liz/clov, putting himself in danger? What makes a player do that?

 

I said I thought it was null and gave 3 or 4 hypothetical situations for why NB would unvote town and vote a scummate in that situation

 

And ok

 

Specifically:

Mafia NB votes teammate Eldrixk over (hypothetical) town Liz/Mrs Clov because:

Distancing from Eldrick

Lack of self pres mode can seem townie and get people to unvote

If Liz/Mrs Clov are lynched and flip town NB looks superficially good

If NB is lynched Liz/Mrs Clov still look bad

 

I don't think the unvote by itself is dawning, and I'm reading through now to see the original cases/points etc

[DPR]

 

Specifically:

Mafia NB votes teammate Eldrixk over (hypothetical) town Liz/Mrs Clov because:

Distancing from Eldrick

Lack of self pres mode can seem townie and get people to unvote

If Liz/Mrs Clov are lynched and flip town NB looks superficially good

If NB is lynched Liz/Mrs Clov still look bad

 

I don't think the unvote by itself is dawning, and I'm reading through now to see the original cases/points etc

 

 

 

Okay - I'm going to give my view to each point because we are seeing it very differently: I'm in blue

 

Specifically:

Mafia NB votes teammate Eldrixk over (hypothetical) town Liz/Mrs Clov because:

Distancing from Eldrick - No mafia goon is going to take a bullet for the sake of distancing, especially on D1.

Lack of self pres mode can seem townie and get people to unvote - No mafia goon is going to value the appearance of self preservation by putting themselves in line to die.

If Liz/Mrs Clov are lynched and flip town NB looks superficially good - He would have looked worse for having tried to drag the vote off of them.

If NB is lynched Liz/Mrs Clov still look bad - There was nothing he could do about that. They did that to themselves. Plus, he wasn't a large enough presence (he barely posted) to make anyone look one way or the other.

 

I don't think the unvote by itself is dawning, and I'm reading through now to see the original cases/points etc

 

His unvote and revote is particularly damning because he was on a train that was liz/clov 6, and NB 4. His move made it 5 and 5. There was a reason to do this - no mafia team ever gives up a player on D1. Puts them at too much of a disadvantage.

[BFG]

@DPR - because I don't remember anything from Eldrick about a delayed response, so I was curious as to where it came from

 

@Cuth - because typically mafia don't try to lynch teammates Day 1, NBs vote switch looked like self pres away from a Liz/Mrs Clov train that had died to Eldrick who people were starting to talk about

 

To save the following conversation:

 

there were some posts of WiFi's that read well for her, but I can't remember specifically what they are, I can probably pull them as I read through if needed

 

You, Liz, Seph all seemed to take a part in NBs lynch, superficially this looks good for you, NB seemed to want to get Eldrick and Liz/Mrs Clov lynched, superficially this looks good for them. It was a starting point.

 

Obviously superficial isn't going to work this game :/

[The Crusher]

 

I'll try to supplement this with reasoning as I go, but atm I have from town to scum

 

Wolfie

Dice

Cass

Tiink

Wifi 

Kizzy Clov

Crusher

BFG

Cuth

DPR

Darthe

 

Main reasoning on Darthe, and why he's trended so far down for me is that I think he knows my play, and I think as Cass said, with the Eldrick stuff it's unlikely.

 

DPR and DARTHE are your best for scum?  I thought that was the small part of the puzzle we solved day 2?  But please explain. I can actually show one post that pretty much ensures DPR is town or has seriously changed up his game.

[DPR]

@DPR - because I don't remember anything from Eldrick about a delayed response, so I was curious as to where it came from

 

@Cuth - because typically mafia don't try to lynch teammates Day 1, NBs vote switch looked like self pres away from a Liz/Mrs Clov train that had died to Eldrick who people were starting to talk about

 

To save the following conversation:

 

there were some posts of WiFi's that read well for her, but I can't remember specifically what they are, I can probably pull them as I read through if needed

 

You, Liz, Seph all seemed to take a part in NBs lynch, superficially this looks good for you, NB seemed to want to get Eldrick and Liz/Mrs Clov lynched, superficially this looks good for them. It was a starting point.

 

Obviously superficial isn't going to work this game :/

 

 

NB's move clearly was not self preservation - he intentionally put himself in harm's way.

 

The bold is a large part of the reason I've felt like liz/clov needed to be sorted above everybody else. 

 

Your laying the evidence out and then acting like it says the opposite of how I see it...

[seph]

 

@DPR that's not what I meant, obviously Crusher picked correctly given NB flipped scum. But you've been adamant that Liz/Mrs Clov are scum, and since Day 2ish have been saying they're probably a PR, so why do you think it's good that Crusher switched when iyo if he'd stuck to Liz/Mrs Clov there was a chance they'd flip instead?

And ok

 

 

 

For the sake of accuracy, liz/clov is my #1 pick for scum. They were on D1, D2 and still are. I recognize that there will be other scummers, and I don't want to be a distraction to people spotting that, so I've put my case on the shelf so far today knowing that it ain't going anywhere and I can pick it up anytime needed.

 

I obviously cannot speak for Crusher. I see what I see and he sees what he sees - he moved his vote and hit scum based on logic I understand and agree with.

 

I also factor in all of the movement before that lynch. To me, Cuth, Seph and Edlrick were all more important to look at as I didn't get their logic at all.

 

Also, you have yet to comment on it, but what are your thoughts on that? Why did NB move his vote to even up his own train to liz/clov, putting himself in danger? What makes a player do that?

This is on mobile so pray with me...

 

The bold doesn't read to me as coming from a Towne mindset. You don't entertain the idea that they could at all be town. You basically just told me you will always have them to try and lynch. I don't get it tbh.

 

I need some clarification in the red. Your saying you understand crushers logic, but in the next sentence say that I need to be looked at present flip. That doesn't make sense if your talking about not Bob as Crusher didn't independently come to that conclusion as he said he liked me and soohs points against him. He never even mentioned not Bob not scum hunting in the vote itself, though I think he did in the previous post on what to watch for.

[seph]

 

I'll try to supplement this with reasoning as I go, but atm I have from town to scum

 

Wolfie

Dice

Cass

Tiink

Wifi 

Kizzy Clov

Crusher

BFG

Cuth

DPR

Darthe

 

Main reasoning on Darthe, and why he's trended so far down for me is that I think he knows my play, and I think as Cass said, with the Eldrick stuff it's unlikely.

 

DPR and DARTHE are your best for scum?  I thought that was the small part of the puzzle we solved day 2?  But please explain. I can actually show one post that pretty much ensures DPR is town or has seriously changed up his game.

+1 this list is extremely confusing, and unless she posted some explanations earlier or someone asked for this it is concerning

[seph]

Speculation is bad lol

@dpr didn't want to do this but isn't it possible the scum team was having problems? That not Bob was irritated with his team and him becoming the lynch?? Eldrick did give his lynch more steam.

I say this because of his bag post where he posts go town. It really isn't needed and should have been edited I'm because it talks about the game.

 

Once again don't use this because it was a bag post but it's a possibility not Bob did it out of frustration.

 

Kronos saved us from this rabbit hole once, so. Lets stop.

And sorry for the above spec right or wrong mods. Just trying to get DPR to focus more on facts.

[BFG]

 

Specifically:

Mafia NB votes teammate Eldrixk over (hypothetical) town Liz/Mrs Clov because:

Distancing from Eldrick

Lack of self pres mode can seem townie and get people to unvote

If Liz/Mrs Clov are lynched and flip town NB looks superficially good

If NB is lynched Liz/Mrs Clov still look bad

 

I don't think the unvote by itself is dawning, and I'm reading through now to see the original cases/points etc

 

 

Okay - I'm going to give my view to each point because we are seeing it very differently: I'm in blue

 

Specifically:

 

Mafia NB votes teammate Eldrixk over (hypothetical) town Liz/Mrs Clov because:

Distancing from Eldrick - No mafia goon is going to take a bullet for the sake of distancing, especially on D1.

Lack of self pres mode can seem townie and get people to unvote - No mafia goon is going to value the appearance of self preservation by putting themselves in line to die.

If Liz/Mrs Clov are lynched and flip town NB looks superficially good - He would have looked worse for having tried to drag the vote off of them.

If NB is lynched Liz/Mrs Clov still look bad - There was nothing he could do about that. They did that to themselves. Plus, he wasn't a large enough presence (he barely posted) to make anyone look one way or the other.

 

I don't think the unvote by itself is dawning, and I'm reading through now to see the original cases/points etc

 

His unvote and revote is particularly damning because he was on a train that was liz/clov 6, and NB 4. His move made it 5 and 5. There was a reason to do this - no mafia team ever gives up a player on D1. Puts them at too much of a disadvantage.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Apologies quote is broken and there's too much formatting in DPRs post for me to easily fix, my response is below

 

 

Obviously we do see this differently. The big problem I have with your explanations is that NB is an experienced player who knows that his unvote is going to get scrutinised. If he'd stayed on Liz/Mrs Clov one of them gets lynched and the other potentially gets written off as a town counter wagon, etc. The unvote always keeps attention on the hydra. This is a play that I struggle to see Liz making (meta I know, but Liz values players over roles - they had almost every player suspicious of them Day 1, there is no way that she agrees to a planned 'save' attempt in that situation - which obviously says nothing about NB trying it on his own if teamed)

 

Basically my point is that NBs action to me doesn't make a huge amount of sense regardless of Liz/Mrs Clov alignment and therefore I'm treating that by itself as null

[Darthe]

 

 

 

@DPR that's not what I meant, obviously Crusher picked correctly given NB flipped scum. But you've been adamant that Liz/Mrs Clov are scum, and since Day 2ish have been saying they're probably a PR, so why do you think it's good that Crusher switched when iyo if he'd stuck to Liz/Mrs Clov there was a chance they'd flip instead?

 

And ok

 

For the sake of accuracy, liz/clov is my #1 pick for scum. They were on D1, D2 and still are. I recognize that there will be other scummers, and I don't want to be a distraction to people spotting that, so I've put my case on the shelf so far today knowing that it ain't going anywhere and I can pick it up anytime needed.

 

I obviously cannot speak for Crusher. I see what I see and he sees what he sees - he moved his vote and hit scum based on logic I understand and agree with.

 

I also factor in all of the movement before that lynch. To me, Cuth, Seph and Edlrick were all more important to look at as I didn't get their logic at all.

 

Also, you have yet to comment on it, but what are your thoughts on that? Why did NB move his vote to even up his own train to liz/clov, putting himself in danger? What makes a player do that?

I said I thought it was null and gave 3 or 4 hypothetical situations for why NB would unvote town and vote a scummate in that situation

 

And ok

Specifically:

Mafia NB votes teammate Eldrixk over (hypothetical) town Liz/Mrs Clov because:

Distancing from Eldrick

Lack of self pres mode can seem townie and get people to unvote

If Liz/Mrs Clov are lynched and flip town NB looks superficially good

If NB is lynched Liz/Mrs Clov still look bad

 

I don't think the unvote by itself is dawning, and I'm reading through now to see the original cases/points etc

Yeah it essentially clears liss clov with both nb and eld flipped wolf.

[seph]

@tink

Your day 1 was really bad imo, so for me to put you above someone like Cass is hard for me. She has had very good posts with not many I find as -ev. I think I generally read her well*shrugs* but I have been out of the mafia game for a bit.

 

Your day 3 was very good but I don't remember your posts very well. I do remember you having some though. Being on els before the eld view is Def some ++'s.

 

I don't think your one I would lynch today just because of recent events and I personally haven't had a chance to reread the last day or night, or even is you for that matter.

[DPR]

 

 

@DPR that's not what I meant, obviously Crusher picked correctly given NB flipped scum. But you've been adamant that Liz/Mrs Clov are scum, and since Day 2ish have been saying they're probably a PR, so why do you think it's good that Crusher switched when iyo if he'd stuck to Liz/Mrs Clov there was a chance they'd flip instead?

And ok

 

 

For the sake of accuracy, liz/clov is my #1 pick for scum. They were on D1, D2 and still are. I recognize that there will be other scummers, and I don't want to be a distraction to people spotting that, so I've put my case on the shelf so far today knowing that it ain't going anywhere and I can pick it up anytime needed.

 

I obviously cannot speak for Crusher. I see what I see and he sees what he sees - he moved his vote and hit scum based on logic I understand and agree with.

 

I also factor in all of the movement before that lynch. To me, Cuth, Seph and Edlrick were all more important to look at as I didn't get their logic at all.

 

Also, you have yet to comment on it, but what are your thoughts on that? Why did NB move his vote to even up his own train to liz/clov, putting himself in danger? What makes a player do that?

This is on mobile so pray with me...

 

The bold doesn't read to me as coming from a Towne mindset. You don't entertain the idea that they could at all be town. You basically just told me you will always have them to try and lynch. I don't get it tbh.

 

I need some clarification in the red. Your saying you understand crushers logic, but in the next sentence say that I need to be looked at present flip. That doesn't make sense if your talking about not Bob as Crusher didn't independently come to that conclusion as he said he liked me and soohs points against him. He never even mentioned not Bob not scum hunting in the vote itself, though I think he did in the previous post on what to watch for.

 

 

 

To me, the bold is the essence of a town move. I've already made my points and have posted what I consider to be evidence to back those points up. The rest of the Town players will either see it the way I do, or they won't. Me going on and on about it doesn't change the evidence - it's not going anywhere. So instead of being a distraction, I'll keep it cool and let other people see what they see. That's the power of having multiple eyes on the case and I don't want to disrupt that. I haven't changed my stance on any of it because nothing has happened to make me do so.

 

I saw Crusher's logic as a linear, straight forward progression. He watched, played and commented and then credited you and Sooh for bringing points to his attention and obviously felt more strongly about NB than liz/clov being scum. 

 

I don't see your logic for voting, unvoting and then re-voting the way that you did. Nothing personal, I just don't see it. Does this answer what you are asking?

[Kaylee]

OFFICIAL VOTE COUNT (Unchanged):

 

Cuthroat Jesse (1): Miss Kizzy Clov

 

Hally (1): Darthe

 

DreadPirateRoberts (1): Seph

 

Not Voting: DPR, Cass, Kronos, WiFi, Hallia, Cuth, Tiinker, Dice, BFG, Crusher

 

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

 

Deadline for Day 3 is Tuesday, 2/21/17 at 9:00 AM MST

 

[seph]

Nah my time is running out. Going to catch up, and then respond to dpr.

Driving again>< then bed.

[BFG]

 

@DPR - because I don't remember anything from Eldrick about a delayed response, so I was curious as to where it came from

 

@Cuth - because typically mafia don't try to lynch teammates Day 1, NBs vote switch looked like self pres away from a Liz/Mrs Clov train that had died to Eldrick who people were starting to talk about

 

To save the following conversation:

 

there were some posts of WiFi's that read well for her, but I can't remember specifically what they are, I can probably pull them as I read through if needed

 

You, Liz, Seph all seemed to take a part in NBs lynch, superficially this looks good for you, NB seemed to want to get Eldrick and Liz/Mrs Clov lynched, superficially this looks good for them. It was a starting point.

 

Obviously superficial isn't going to work this game :/

 

 

NB's move clearly was not self preservation - he intentionally put himself in harm's way.

 

The bold is a large part of the reason I've felt like liz/clov needed to be sorted above everybody else. 

 

Your laying the evidence out and then acting like it says the opposite of how I see it...

 

Day 1 there were 3 trains going into end of day, NB, Liz/Clov and Eldrick

 

NB wasn't voting himself and was on Liz/Mrs Clov

 

Most of the people NOT voting Liz/Mrs Clov and were around(?) had already indicated that they weren't voting there that day, so that wagon had stalled

 

Crusher (at the least) had indicated that he was going to look into NB so there was a chance that his train was going to equal/better Liz/Mrs Clov regardless of what NB did with his vote

 

Seph was voting NB but had considered Eldrick if his train was higher, and in general getting people off NB onto Eldrick works best for NB at that point. I think that Eldrick was gathering attention at that point, so was a more likely lynch than Liz/Mrs Clov (whose train had stalled)

 

 

 

Obviously NB/Eldrick both flipped mafia, so the above is wrong, but yes at the time it looked like self pres

 

 

 

 

And yes, we view the game differently XD

[BFG]

Ok, going dark for a bit otherwise I'll never read this game

[Hallia]

 

 

I'll try to supplement this with reasoning as I go, but atm I have from town to scum

 

Wolfie

Dice

Cass

Tiink

Wifi 

Kizzy Clov

Crusher

BFG

Cuth

DPR

Darthe

 

Main reasoning on Darthe, and why he's trended so far down for me is that I think he knows my play, and I think as Cass said, with the Eldrick stuff it's unlikely.

 

DPR and DARTHE are your best for scum?  I thought that was the small part of the puzzle we solved day 2?  But please explain. I can actually show one post that pretty much ensures DPR is town or has seriously changed up his game.

 

Would you say the recent interaction with Dice is simply impatience, then?

[DPR]

Speculation is bad lol

@dpr didn't want to do this but isn't it possible the scum team was having problems? That not Bob was irritated with his team and him becoming the lynch?? Eldrick did give his lynch more steam.

I say this because of his bag post where he posts go town. It really isn't needed and should have been edited I'm because it talks about the game.

 

Once again don't use this because it was a bag post but it's a possibility not Bob did it out of frustration.

 

Kronos saved us from this rabbit hole once, so. Lets stop.

And sorry for the above spec right or wrong mods. Just trying to get DPR to focus more on facts.

 

 

For the sake of clearing it up, I will speculate that it was not ab internal problem - NB would have gone to the Mod for a replacement rather than go against the spirit of the game. 

[DPR]

 

Apologies quote is broken and there's too much formatting in DPRs post for me to easily fix, my response is below

 

 

Obviously we do see this differently. The big problem I have with your explanations is that NB is an experienced player who knows that his unvote is going to get scrutinised. If he'd stayed on Liz/Mrs Clov one of them gets lynched and the other potentially gets written off as a town counter wagon, etc. The unvote always keeps attention on the hydra. This is a play that I struggle to see Liz making (meta I know, but Liz values players over roles - they had almost every player suspicious of them Day 1, there is no way that she agrees to a planned 'save' attempt in that situation - which obviously says nothing about NB trying it on his own if teamed)

 

Basically my point is that NBs action to me doesn't make a huge amount of sense regardless of Liz/Mrs Clov alignment and therefore I'm treating that by itself as null

 

 

We'll have to agree to disagree. But that still doesn't explain why NB put himself up for lynch and liz/clov was the beneficiary. 

[DPR]

 

 

 

 

@DPR that's not what I meant, obviously Crusher picked correctly given NB flipped scum. But you've been adamant that Liz/Mrs Clov are scum, and since Day 2ish have been saying they're probably a PR, so why do you think it's good that Crusher switched when iyo if he'd stuck to Liz/Mrs Clov there was a chance they'd flip instead?

 

And ok

 

For the sake of accuracy, liz/clov is my #1 pick for scum. They were on D1, D2 and still are. I recognize that there will be other scummers, and I don't want to be a distraction to people spotting that, so I've put my case on the shelf so far today knowing that it ain't going anywhere and I can pick it up anytime needed.

 

I obviously cannot speak for Crusher. I see what I see and he sees what he sees - he moved his vote and hit scum based on logic I understand and agree with.

 

I also factor in all of the movement before that lynch. To me, Cuth, Seph and Edlrick were all more important to look at as I didn't get their logic at all.

 

Also, you have yet to comment on it, but what are your thoughts on that? Why did NB move his vote to even up his own train to liz/clov, putting himself in danger? What makes a player do that?

I said I thought it was null and gave 3 or 4 hypothetical situations for why NB would unvote town and vote a scummate in that situation

 

And ok

Specifically:

Mafia NB votes teammate Eldrixk over (hypothetical) town Liz/Mrs Clov because:

Distancing from Eldrick

Lack of self pres mode can seem townie and get people to unvote

If Liz/Mrs Clov are lynched and flip town NB looks superficially good

If NB is lynched Liz/Mrs Clov still look bad

 

I don't think the unvote by itself is dawning, and I'm reading through now to see the original cases/points etc

Yeah it essentially clears liss clov with both nb and eld flipped wolf.

 

 

@ Darthe - I have no idea where you get that. I understand that you, Cuth, Seph and BFG see it that way, but I don't see why. Everybody was so sure bout Eldrick too - maybe have another look, eh?

[DPR]

 

 

@DPR - because I don't remember anything from Eldrick about a delayed response, so I was curious as to where it came from

 

@Cuth - because typically mafia don't try to lynch teammates Day 1, NBs vote switch looked like self pres away from a Liz/Mrs Clov train that had died to Eldrick who people were starting to talk about

 

To save the following conversation:

 

there were some posts of WiFi's that read well for her, but I can't remember specifically what they are, I can probably pull them as I read through if needed

 

You, Liz, Seph all seemed to take a part in NBs lynch, superficially this looks good for you, NB seemed to want to get Eldrick and Liz/Mrs Clov lynched, superficially this looks good for them. It was a starting point.

 

Obviously superficial isn't going to work this game :/

 

 

NB's move clearly was not self preservation - he intentionally put himself in harm's way.

 

The bold is a large part of the reason I've felt like liz/clov needed to be sorted above everybody else. 

 

Your laying the evidence out and then acting like it says the opposite of how I see it...

 

Day 1 there were 3 trains going into end of day, NB, Liz/Clov and Eldrick

 

NB wasn't voting himself and was on Liz/Mrs Clov - Yes. She was at 6 and NB was at 4, including the mysterious yolo vote by Seph. NB was not an active train.

 

Most of the people NOT voting Liz/Mrs Clov and were around(?) had already indicated that they weren't voting there that day, so that wagon had stalled - But it was still ahead by 2 votes and the deadline was only 3 hours away at rush hour on a weekday.

 

Crusher (at the least) had indicated that he was going to look into NB so there was a chance that his train was going to equal/better Liz/Mrs Clov regardless of what NB did with his vote - That would have pulled NB to 5 vs. liz/clov at 6 and no guarantee that anyone would make it on before deadline. No reason for NB move.

 

Seph was voting NB but had considered Eldrick if his train was higher, and in general getting people off NB onto Eldrick works best for NB at that point. I think that Eldrick was gathering attention at that point, so was a more likely lynch than Liz/Mrs Clov (whose train had stalled) - Seph laid out a beautiful case on Eldrick. Then he yolo voted NB for no given reason. Nobody questioned it but me. But there was still no reason for NB to move - liz/clov was still ahead by 2 votes.

 

 

 

Obviously NB/Eldrick both flipped mafia, so the above is wrong, but yes at the time it looked like self pres - Under no scenario does NB moving his vote from liz/clov to Eldrick equate into self preservation. None. 

 

 

 

 

And yes, we view the game differently XD

 

 

 

I'm in blue above.

 

I'm also feeling a lot worse about your inability to see what happened.

[seph]

OK I'm caught up finally.. I'm interested in seeing the explanation for hallia reads. I didn't see her saying she would explain as she goes. Nothing looks to crazy on there besides the Darth read.

@hallia why did you leave me off :(