[Basic] Supernatural Mafia ~ Game Over ~ Town Wins!!!

[alannalynn]

 

=Ok I just tried MQing with the posts from overnight and it broke, and I don't have time to fix it now.

The read on Nyn stood out, but is similar in substance to what he was saying overnight about Nyn pushing Nolder's lynch through. There's possibly a tone change, the tone above is more aggressive

 

Turin, ok so every vote is bad on Nolder.s train which are most likely mafia?

 

 

It's not just the tone. I provided my case + the quotes to articulate my suspicion on Nolder prior to my vote, which was all conveniently left out. Instead he just acknowledges my actual vote post as if there was no substance to it. And this whole tune of me goading Nolder is BS. I was suspicious of Nolder, I nudged him to interact with him and all he did was react in a manner that confirmed my read. Trying to paint my vote on Nolder as not legit is laughable at best. 

lol I think I remember some of that? And maybe it helped my read along? I don't know. I really just dropped my vote and left it there. lolol

[Clovdyx]

Vote Count!

 

Turin(4): Zander, Nynaeve, alannalynn, Pralaya

bgrishinko(1): Lily

Eldrick(1): Thane

Thane(3): Eldrick, bgrishinko, Turin

 

Not Voting: BFG 

 

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

[BFG]

@Turin: why does it matter why you were night killed. Who are you trying to frame by continually bringing up this line of thought? Please explain with examples.

 

General thoughts, I'm mostly trying to not comment on stuff that's already been commented on

 

Nyn says pretty much everything I thought about Pral

 

Zander - given I've subbed in for Sooh twice as town I'm going to ignore that aspect of it. Can you point me to games in which she builds cases as mafia? I don't recall that from Star Wars or American Gods, she seemed more passive and added to other peoples case rather than started her own

 

Lily - would you still have voted Nolder if it you'd realised it was hybrid hammer?

 

I'm unsure as to why Laine is so angry/annoyed at being asked to explain her vote on her at that point third strongest read as to 'if it matters' well, yes, the same way Sooh voting Nolder over Zander 'matters' /shrug

What is this in reference to?

 

In response to BFG and others saying "Nolder always confused and weird blah blah blah." Let me make a few things clear. You people ACT like he's an easy mislynch and that he's always scummy and we're terrible people for pushing a lynch on him. Well, I'm sorry that I made a mistake in my vote and went with what my gut and the evidence was telling me, which is that Nolder was mafia. Sure, Nolder is a hard read sometimes but he made NO effort to defend himself or PROVE that he was a townie, so sit down and suck it up, blaming other people for a majority lynch, JFC this game is really getting on my nerves

It's in response to why you're so irritated with me. Prior to your response Saturday I'd said I needed to ISO you, then said I was out of time. I asked you to elaborate on a vote (along with Sooh and Lily) on your third strongest read over your strongest at that point (your response followed this). I got annoyed with your 'townreading Turin because his reads are bad' the same way I was annoyed with Sooh for saying the same thing about Zander (albeit different alignment conclusions).

 

And what?

 

I have NEVER said or implied that Nolder is an easy mislynch. I have NOT blamed anyone for his mislynch, nor have I said that any of you are terrible people.

 

can you show me where I have?

 

I HAVE asked people to explain votes, but that's NOT the same thing

 

 

Also your bolded is wrong. Pretty sure Nolder tried to engage you, he tried to get Zander to explain his initial point of 'weird' and neither of you responded. Yes, I know Zander argued with Nolder, but I didn't see him expanding his initial explanation of 'weird' and went with Nolders case on him. The only time Nolder stopped arguing was when Zander/he started arguing subjectivity regarding tone and hostility. Prior to that he'd responded to pretty much everything said about him.

[Zander?]

 

 

You are wrong about Thane. He never left my wtl. There have been others I am currently thinking are more likely mafia including you. I asked for a competing train, but you and the gang are unwilling to even consider other options. This flaw is the worst thing town can do.I doubt you.make this mistake as town.

 

I'm not mafia as I have said again and again. And please do not call me stupid even in jest. It really is rude and upsetting to people that care about me. Please just don't.

 

 

 

I don't know what I have done to take away your enjoyment of this game but I am sorry for whatever it may have been.

 

I guess my requests will be denied and you insist on lynching me so I will give you at present my want to lynch list And I will go to enjoy the rest of my evening.

 

Alanna: I think I have covered this ad nauseam but here it is again- begging to be town read. Attempts to just dismiss without refuting any claims against her.Voted Nol for pressure. Not liking the interaction with Z. All of today's posts feel like lolcatting or AtE. I'm all the scenarios in my head Alanna is mafia every time.

 

Lily: this is a change. There were warning signs of mafia!Lily D1. The immediate backing off of every case. The questions about how to find mafia. It reminded.me of the one time we were on a mafia team together. BG's wheel of time book game. I think BG ran it anyway. The unneeded vote to L-1 made Nol lynch.inevitable(cwidt?)

 

Nyn: she drove the Nol lynch and her justification is that he is a bad selfish player. Now I'm gonna be treated badly too. Hopefully people will see the truth upon my death.

 

Z: I am really starting to think he is just off the raild and pocketed by Alanna but I could be wrong. Go back and look for all of Turins posts on him.

 

Eldrick: going with the flow. Look at his postings today.

 

Lynch from this list now and profit. Probably not gonna happen but at Least look at it after I'm dead.

 

Good night and good luck. If I'm still alive in the morning maybe I will look at the thread.

 

 

Can you show me where on this list you have Thane?

 

I mean to put "being" in there to quote you so thats my bad. But if you are gonna take a pot shot at me expect one in return.

 

 

Turin you ignored this question.

 

 

 

zander,

 

Lemme axe you sumthin... Turin 1.0 was pretty much solid town read but killed. What do you think that means?

If you and anyone else would care to answer this as fully as possible I would appreciate it. Lily, I can see BG shooting me just because I probably remember his game more than most in this one but I can also see how it could be a frame shot. My follow up is how do you think it worked out that the most solidly town read person on a N1 where no claims got outed ended up getting killed? I see pretty much 3. I wonder wHo might end up with the same ones and who believes which.

 

With that I'm back to bed. later.

 

 

I have no idea why you were NK'd.  Im not Scum.

 

 

 

I am both stupid and stubborn so I dont know what to tell you.  And on the very unlikely off chance you flip Town. It wont be oh whelp. Itll be your slot should have played better.  I mean come on man.  Sooh was super scummy.  Youre super scummy tho slightly less.  Your reads on people have change since you subbed back in.  Your voting Thane who wasnt on your scum list iirc,  So if your Town as you claim and you think Thane is Town then having 2 Townys as competing trains is the biggest Town tool that we refuse to subscribe to?

 

I really hope your Mafia and not just stupidly....stupid.  lolololololol

 

That's a cop out statement. That is like the second or third time this game that you are trying to push yourself off the limelight if Turin/sooh ends up flipping town. Trying to preempt the heat on you. Which is really suspicious when you read the game. This, like others, is a perfect example why or how you have been scummy this game.

 

 

Its not a cop out at all.  Town players need to take responsibility for playing badly its as simple as that.  Nolder self hammered ffs.  Sooh made stuff up and completely contradicted herself.  I find it funny tho that you think I'm Scum and following me on my vote on Turin tho.  You believe Im bussing him?  But early you backed off of Sooh to go after me and Nol saying it couldnt be v/v which it is because im Town.  SO first Sooh was Scum, then she want and now Turin is....thats a tad strange imo.

 

 

 

Can someone with more experience playing with Turin give me their two cents? Because I've hardly played with.

 

Can Turin play this badly (and scummy) as a townie?  Because the difference between his play in his first incarnation and what I'm seeing now is like night and day.

Turin typically doesn't go with the consensus and has scum read on minor reasons which otherwise wouldn't stand out. For example, in D1, he focused a lot on Zander's soft-claim in order to find him scummy. It is something that others don't find bad but Turin would latch on those reasons. It isn't bad, per se, because he is really good at finding deep-wolf because of this. Which is why he ends up dying early a lot of the games.

 

 

Like he was right about me and my claim in Clov's game....lolololololol

[alannalynn]

Nevermind BFG.

[Pralaya]

Its not a cop out at all.  Town players need to take responsibility for playing badly its as simple as that.  Nolder self hammered ffs.  Sooh made stuff up and completely contradicted herself.  I find it funny tho that you think I'm Scum and following me on my vote on Turin tho.  You believe Im bussing him?  But early you backed off of Sooh to go after me and Nol saying it couldnt be v/v which it is because im Town.  SO first Sooh was Scum, then she want and now Turin is....thats a tad strange imo.

The first people to take advantage of "bad play" is scum. Excusing yourself saying that "he played a bad game, that's why I voted" is a cop out. That is exactly what a scum would also do.

 

I am saying that if Turin flips scum, you are likely town. But, if he flips town, you are more than likely scum. I did suspect sooh and I am still not fully convinced. But, Turin's flip would clear a lot of things.

[alannalynn]

 

Its not a cop out at all.  Town players need to take responsibility for playing badly its as simple as that.  Nolder self hammered ffs.  Sooh made stuff up and completely contradicted herself.  I find it funny tho that you think I'm Scum and following me on my vote on Turin tho.  You believe Im bussing him?  But early you backed off of Sooh to go after me and Nol saying it couldnt be v/v which it is because im Town.  SO first Sooh was Scum, then she want and now Turin is....thats a tad strange imo.

The first people to take advantage of "bad play" is scum. Excusing yourself saying that "he played a bad game, that's why I voted" is a cop out. That is exactly what a scum would also do.

 

I am saying that if Turin flips scum, you are likely town. But, if he flips town, you are more than likely scum. I did suspect sooh and I am still not fully convinced. But, Turin's flip would clear a lot of things.

He didn't play a BAD game, he played a SCUMMY game. That's not taking advantage of anything ffs

And then he gave up

 

Why don't we just lynch everyone that's on townie lynches. Afterall, they should know who the town are and can't ever make bad decisions

[Zander?]

 

Its not a cop out at all.  Town players need to take responsibility for playing badly its as simple as that.  Nolder self hammered ffs.  Sooh made stuff up and completely contradicted herself.  I find it funny tho that you think I'm Scum and following me on my vote on Turin tho.  You believe Im bussing him?  But early you backed off of Sooh to go after me and Nol saying it couldnt be v/v which it is because im Town.  SO first Sooh was Scum, then she want and now Turin is....thats a tad strange imo.

The first people to take advantage of "bad play" is scum. Excusing yourself saying that "he played a bad game, that's why I voted" is a cop out. That is exactly what a scum would also do.

 

I am saying that if Turin flips scum, you are likely town. But, if he flips town, you are more than likely scum. I did suspect sooh and I am still not fully convinced. But, Turin's flip would clear a lot of things.

 

 

So you think all 7 people who voted him didnt think Nol played bad?  You dont think Nol played bad?  You think self hammering and refusing to give a reads list is something a Towny normally does?

 

Like i already know youre wrong on me and Nol not being v/v so excuse me if I dont feel all that great about your pairing off scenario's.

 

Straight up, dont come after me with nothing cases cause to me THATS scummy.  Neither one could substantiate ANY of the reasoning for voting me.  So ya when I'm Town and you suss me over nothing, stupid stuff and lies, I find that very scummy.  Its not like they are new players or players that dont know me.

[Pralaya]

So you think all 7 people who voted him didnt think Nol played bad?  You dont think Nol played bad?  You think self hammering and refusing to give a reads list is something a Towny normally does?

Did I say that? Stop putting words into my mouth. This is exactly what is called misrep.

[Pralaya]

And one of the reasons why I am saying your play this game has been very scummy.

[Pralaya]

He didn't play a BAD game, he played a SCUMMY game. That's not taking advantage of anything ffs

And then he gave up

 

Why don't we just lynch everyone that's on townie lynches. Afterall, they should know who the town are and can't ever make bad decisions

The whole point of the game is to differentiate between scum taking advantage and townies suspecting and voting someone (whether right or wrong). If you fail to do that, you will lose the game.

 

Look at zander's game and tell me if it is the former or the latter.

[Zander?]

 

So you think all 7 people who voted him didnt think Nol played bad?  You dont think Nol played bad?  You think self hammering and refusing to give a reads list is something a Towny normally does?

Did I say that? Stop putting words into my mouth. This is exactly what is called misrep.

 

 

 

And one of the reasons why I am saying your play this game has been very scummy.

 

? means its a question Pral. 

[alannalynn]

Pral, I'm more confident about Zander being town than pretty much anyone else this game. Pretty much everyone else is earning my suspicion right now.

[Zander?]

 

So you think all 7 people who voted him didnt think Nol played bad?  You dont think Nol played bad?  You think self hammering and refusing to give a reads list is something a Towny normally does?

Did I say that? Stop putting words into my mouth. This is exactly what is called misrep.

 

 

 

Also please dont avoid answering my questions that is exactly what i call suspicious.

[Zander?]

 

 

Which is one of the reasons I am going easy on Sooh. She could have as well voted me and I don't think I would have been a difficult target. It doesn't absolve her but moves her slightly up.

 

 

Explain your response better please.  How the hell does it move her up.

 

 

Can you also answer this Pral, I dont recall you doing so?

[Pralaya]

 

 

So you think all 7 people who voted him didnt think Nol played bad?  You dont think Nol played bad?  You think self hammering and refusing to give a reads list is something a Towny normally does?

Did I say that? Stop putting words into my mouth. This is exactly what is called misrep.

 

 

 

And one of the reasons why I am saying your play this game has been very scummy.

 

? means its a question Pral.

 

What's the point in asking that question when it was never mentioned or referenced? That is exactly what is called putting words into others mouth.

[Pralaya]

Pral, I'm more confident about Zander being town than pretty much anyone else this game. Pretty much everyone else is earning my suspicion right now.

If Turin ends up as town and you don't think has been scummy in the zander/nolder or zander/sooh/turin arguments, I have nothing to say. We might as well give up.

[Zander?]

 

 

 

So you think all 7 people who voted him didnt think Nol played bad?  You dont think Nol played bad?  You think self hammering and refusing to give a reads list is something a Towny normally does?

Did I say that? Stop putting words into my mouth. This is exactly what is called misrep.

 

 

 

And one of the reasons why I am saying your play this game has been very scummy.

 

? means its a question Pral.

 

What's the point in asking that question when it was never mentioned or referenced? That is exactly what is called putting words into others mouth.

 

 

 

So asking questions is putting word in someone's mouth?  .You said I was using it as a cop out.  Im not the only one who said it hence the question. Instead of avoiding them and looking foolish, why dont you just answer the questions

[Pralaya]

Can you also answer this Pral, I dont recall you doing so?

I pretty much answered Nyn for the same question. Sooh, as scum, could have as well voted me and pushed my train as easily than nolder. It wouldn't have been difficult. That she didn't do puts her slightly up

[Pralaya]

So asking questions is putting word in someone's mouth?  .You said I was using it as a cop out.  Im not the only one who said it hence the question. Instead of avoiding them and looking foolish, why dont you just answer the questions

Making stuff up in asking a question is definitely that.

[Zander?]

 

Pral, I'm more confident about Zander being town than pretty much anyone else this game. Pretty much everyone else is earning my suspicion right now.

If Turin ends up as town and you don't think has been scummy in the zander/nolder or zander/sooh/turin arguments, I have nothing to say. We might as well give up.

 

 

Youre either scum or gonna feel pretty silly when you see my flip.

[Zander?]

 

So asking questions is putting word in someone's mouth?  .You said I was using it as a cop out.  Im not the only one who said it hence the question. Instead of avoiding them and looking foolish, why dont you just answer the questions

Making stuff up in asking a question is definitely that.

 

 

YOURE STILL NOT WILLING TO ANSWER MY QUESTIONS?????

 

I didnt make stuff up I asked a question,.

 

Here Ill help you

 

ques·tion

ˈkwesCH(ə)n/

noun

noun: question; plural noun: questions

    1.

    a sentence worded or expressed so as to elicit information.

    "we hope this leaflet has been helpful in answering your questions"

    synonyms: inquiry, query; interrogation

    "please answer my question"

    antonyms: answer, response

        a doubt about the truth or validity of something.

        "there is no question that America faces the threat of Balkanization"

        synonyms: doubt, dispute, argument, debate, uncertainty, dubiousness, reservation

        "there is no question that he is ill"

        antonyms: certainty

        the raising of a doubt about or objection to something.

        "Edward was the only one she obeyed without question"

        synonyms: undoubted, beyond doubt, certain, indubitable, indisputable, incontrovertible, unquestionable, undeniable, clear, patent, manifest More

        "her loyalty is beyond question"

        indisputably, irrefutably, incontestably, incontrovertibly, unquestionably, undeniably, undoubtedly, beyond doubt, without doubt, clearly, patently, obviously

        "the results demonstrated this beyond question"

        a matter forming the basis of a problem requiring resolution.

        "we have kept an eye on the question of political authority"

        a matter or concern depending on or involving a specified condition or thing.

        "it was not simply a question of age and hierarchy"

        synonyms: issue, matter, business, problem, concern, topic, theme, case; More

        debate, argument, dispute, controversy

        "the political questions of the day"

verb

verb: question; 3rd person present: questions; past tense: questioned; past participle: questioned; gerund or present participle: questioning

    1.

    ask questions of (someone), especially in an official context.

    "four men were being questioned about the killings"

    synonyms: interrogate, cross-examine, cross-question, quiz, catechize; More

    interview, debrief, examine, give the third degree to;

    informalgrill, pump

    "the lieutenant questions the suspect"

        feel or express doubt about; raise objections to.

        "members had questioned the cost of the scheme"

        synonyms: query, call into question, challenge, dispute, cast aspersions on, doubt, suspect, have suspicions about, have reservations about

        "she questioned his motives"

Origin

late Middle English: from Old French question (noun), questionner (verb), from Latin quaestio(n-), from quaerere ‘ask, seek.’

Translate question to

Use over time for: question

[Nynaeve]

The first people to take advantage of "bad play" is scum. Excusing yourself saying that "he played a bad game, that's why I voted" is a cop out. That is exactly what a scum would also do.

I am saying that if Turin flips scum, you are likely town. But, if he flips town, you are more than likely scum. I did suspect sooh and I am still not fully convinced. But, Turin's flip would clear a lot of things.

 

 

If a townie plays scummy, it will be noticed by EVERYONE. And if he/she are scummy enough? scum don't even need to drive it or partake. That's being scum MVP. Ftr, I have zero regrets on Nolder's lynch. He wasn't playing ball.

 

I also think you're making a mistake by looking at flips as an absolete indicator. You should basically question whether Zander's pushes are legit or not. If you sense that he is being dirty? that's fine. If you think he's manipulating things to make X person look bad? then show me. But townies mislynch townies sometimes. It happens. We have our good games and bad games. Intent and thought process should always be the bottom line, in my eyes.

[Nynaeve]

Why don't we just lynch everyone that's on townie lynches. Afterall, they should know who the town are and can't ever make bad decisions

 

lol

[Pralaya]

YOURE STILL NOT WILLING TO ANSWER MY QUESTIONS?????

 

I didnt make stuff up I asked a question,.

 

Here Ill help you

Let me actually help you here.

 

It is called Strawman fallacy

 

http://www.logicallyfallacious.com/index.php/logical-fallacies/170-strawman-fallacy

 

 

 

Example #2:

 

Zebedee: What is your view on the Christian God?

Mike: I don’t believe in any gods, including the Christian one.

Zebedee: So you think that we are here by accident, and all this design in nature is pure chance, and the universe just created itself?

Mike: You got all that from me stating that I just don’t believe in any gods?

 

 

Explanation: Mike made one claim: that he does not believe in any gods. From that, we can deduce a few things, like he is not a theist, he is not a practicing Christian, Catholic, Jew, or a member of any other religion that requires the belief in a god, but we cannot deduce that he believes we are all here by accident, nature is chance, and the universe created itself. Mike might have no beliefs about these things whatsoever. Perhaps he distinguishes between “accident” and natural selection, perhaps he thinks the concept of design is something we model after the universe, perhaps he has some detailed explanation based on known physics as to how the universe might have first appeared, or perhaps he believes in some other supernatural explanation. Regardless, this was a gross mischaracterization of Mike’s argument.