Age of Legends [standard] Mafia - Game Over

[Shad_]

Will move my vote in about 50 minutes. Mildly prefer Nolder to laine, mainly because of my nyn tinfoil (figure out the connection for points), but with shad and thane both on laine will vote there

If it's that Nolder hopped on with it, I didn't get that impression, but I was mildly surprised he still had Nyn wtl over you in the end.

 

Generally in my Nolder ISO I wanted to pull out the wtl order comment as soon as I hit enter, fwiw.  I think it's null.

[Nynaeve]

lol

[BFG]

Official VC 4.10

 

Nolder (3): Thane, Laine, Nyn

 

Kivam (1): Kivam

 

Laine (2): Nolder, Shad

 

Not voting (1): Zander

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Every time I think Nyn or Kiv or whoever goes off the rails they pull it back lol.

 

Ok I think I'm going to lock in my vote now since it's really a toss up anyway. Hopefully this is right.

 

[v]Alanna[/v]

 

 

Official VC 4.8

 

Nolder (1): Thane

 

Kivam (1): Kivam

 

Not voting (5): Layne, Nolder, Nyn, Zander, Shad

 

Why am I not voting yet? lol

 

[v]Nolder[/v]

 

 

[v]Nolder[/v]

 

 

Carai an Caldazar!

 

 

 

 

#Nyngeekingout

 

 

Beginning of my ISO on Laine:

 

#103 -- Skimmed through, feeling town on Clov, no other real thoughts yet.  My first fight with Calder was well under way at this point.

 

#113 -- The AJ FOS.  Here was my take on the whole thing from before:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-snip-

 

1) I'm not actually playing, that's probably what's sketching you out. I'm gonna pull a Crusher and float until endgame on jokes

 

-snip-

 

2) re: 132 on Clov's reaction to me FOSing Andrej.. idk I didn't really expect him to jump in and call out my FOS on Andrej's meta with such a post.

 

 

3)

 

 

 

 

On the note of me being preachy and helpful, I talked early game strat in Belicheat where Laine was a wolf so she definitely knows at the least I would do it as town.

 

Sort of bugged how she threw mud then backed off immediately when the accusation wasn't even an accurate one.

 

You realize I wasn't serious, right?

 

I'm personally a tad bit... idk curious(?) about this post being 30 minutes after your initial post saying I'm "sketching you out". I'm not sure if it's the wording, or the time frame (ie you bringing it back up to keep me in the spotlight) or what. I can't say it's anything I'm overly bothered about and maybe the feeling will pass in the morning.

 

 

1) I wouldn't count on it, chica

 

2) Except your meta on me wasn't even correct. You've seen me do it as both alignments so characterizing it only as part of a scum game isn't accurate. Weren't you joking anyway?

 

3) No, otherwise I wouldn't have brought it up again. What does the timing have to do with anything? I was mulling over what I thought about you and realized I had done so recently in a game as town and thought that you should be aware of that. It's sort of my job to bring stuff to the spotlight that I find inaccurate or false - so I don't see the point there either. Do you expect me to let you falsely represent me and NOT say anything about it?

 

 

 

 

I guess because I didn't take Laine's FOS post seriously I thought it a bit sketchy that AJ did and eventually reached a wtl on her.  Rereading I can't really hate AJ here.  Red crossed my mind too.  And for me it's not a feeling that Laine tried to push AJ and backed away when it failed.  I do believe it was a joke.  It's how Laine dealt with being questioned about it that comes off kind of weird.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The fact he's being helpful means ~nothing towards his alignment. AJ is a very good player so I don't think he's incapable of making that post as mafia at all. I think Mafia!AJ would probably WANT a bunch of early fakepeeks, since they (theoretically) would have a lower likeliness of being accurate and that helps narrow the NK poe, but I don't think he's going to come in and recommend it - especially when a handful of us recently played with him in the same setup when he waited to post a peek for accuracy reasons. He was town, and I'm positive he's smart enough to know the sudden change of heart would stand out.

 

That being said, I don't see how it would ever warrant a FoS. I'm giving him 0 towncred for trying to be helpful, but I don't see a reasonable argument why anybody would suspect him for being mafia for it.

 

 

This. I'm assuming that was a joke post from Laine, because otherwise the thoughtprocess of "only scum AJ tries to be helpful" would make no sense at all.

 

 

ding ding ding! Though I have told Andrej he comes off very helpful townie as mafia before. He's also an overall nice guy.. so not really alignment indicative *shrug* His wolf doesn't show this early anyways lol and I'd be the biggest fool to think I could read, well, pretty much anyone ever.

 

 

 

 

AJ left this part of the post out, but red feels awkward to me.

 

 

 

 

 

Andrej being helpful townie and preaching. Fos

 

I take this back reading in context. Andrej looking good ITT

 

 

 

 

And then this, I don't know what there is to "take back". Laine had been characterizing it as a joke.

 

I'll grant that she made a joke. It didn't come off well. The problem about the whole thing is that once she took some heat for it she started waffling in whether she should continue to treat it as a joke or roll with 'it was a serious suss but I changed my mind'.

 

I don't know if it all should really bother me or if this is just nitpicking.  At any rate I don't feel bad about AJ sussing her at this point.  Laine, thoughts?

 

 

 

 

~~Overall it doesn't bother me.  Felt maaaaybe a little too nervous about being sussed early, but at the same time I can understand going wtf when you make a joke and all of a sudden people are pointing fingers at you.  "His wolf doesn't show this early anyways lol and I'd be the biggest fool to think I could read, well, pretty much anyone ever." is super awkward.

 

~~It ends with the "I'm going to be a little bothered that it was so easy for mafia to sit back in this exchange and let it happen" statement, condition being if Shad flips town.  I think this really is a bit of a problem.  I don't see how Laine's mind gets there when she's sussing Calder.

 

#174 -- Doesn't want to be a mislynch candidate.  (1)

 

#176 -- Not planning to get mislynched any time soon.  (2)

 

#435 -- Annoyed by Nolder's placeholder vote.  ~~Understandable.  Nolder clarified 'placeholder' for me correctly so it's not a point against either of them.

 

#479 -- Notices she's at the bottom of some POEs.  Needs to fix that.  (3?)

 

#483 -- Worried about Zander's lack of activity ~~understandable

 

#501 -- Not sure if Nolder ever explained his scum read of Kiv.  (He did.)

 

#510 -- big catch-up here:

 

To "Too easy probably, but it crossed my mind." she says "This post really pinged me when I read it and the followup is "meh"...."  ~~Should I be concerned she didn't say anything like "nervous about Shad" in #103?

 

Thinks Calder doesn't make much sense but at the same time she's a little uncomfortable that I would miss something obvious.  Agrees that me "dodging posts" was bad but might not be scummy.

 

Thinks I'm being defensive.

 

Worried that Clov is town reading Calder already, agrees that Shad doesn't look great.

 

Asks me and Calder productive questions.

 

"interesting from Zander: this would destroy the credibility that Shad just missed the Calder-talk" and "from Shad... I think I would like this post better if you straight up answered the accusation instead of brushing it off again. You're a little sloppy this game" irt Zander noting I'd made 7 posts in the sign-up thread so I should have known about Calder.  ~~I'm a little bugged by this one.  I said I hadn't caught up before I started posting in sign-up (Calder's posts came well before mine if anyone bothered to check) and went on to give Zander a town lean for his actions.  Laine's sort of ignoring that and sussing me for dodging posts again.

 

Concludes Zander, Clov, AJ town, Calder and Shad questionable, notes that in PF her gut on me said scum but my content indicated town, here it's the opposite.

 

~~Overall I think this is a pretty solid catch-up.  Laine missed some things, but I know from PF that when she's really tired/pressed for time that can happen.  I know from Belichick that Laine can ask some pretty intelligent questions as scum.

 

#600 -- Thinks my push on Calder is defensive.  Wants to know who I'm sussing besides Calder.  ~~I don't get it at all but AJ thought the same thing.  Bit bewildering but if one town who knows my meta thought that then I suppose two could.  

 

#615 -- Mentions how obv town Thane was in PF

 

#624 -- Tries to engage Calder

 

#637 -- "I don't know how to play this stupid game anyways" ~~another one of these goofy tack-ons at the end of her post, similar to "I'd be the biggest fool to think I could read, well, pretty much anyone ever."  I don't know, they strike me as forced.

 

#640 -- "Calder... there's only like 13 players. And you only really have to keep up with 12 apart from yourself. Who did you think I was, some random posting on the thread? I feel so unloved. Thanks."  ~~A little forced maybe?

 

#826 -- Working on her read of me, seems to be drawing town conclusions, disagrees with AJ's argument that I know Crusher is town.  ~~Can't hate this.  I thought before she made a hard switch from scum to town on me, but this looks like she's developing it more carefully.

 

#833 -- Reads list, has Hallia and Crusher near the bottom with Calder, Nolder, and Thane.  She doesn't explain everything but what she says makes sense.  ~~Both scum in her D1 scum pile?  Looking like town!Laine here.

 

#840 -- Responds to my TMI callout saying there are three scum in the game, so at least some of them were sitting back and letting the Shad/Calder fight do its thing.  ~~umm... ok, don't know if that leaves me feeling any better.

 

#845 -- Talks about Calder.  She's consistant with previous statements here.

 

 

 

Looking good where I left off.  Things of note are possible TMI, defensiveness (I was going to count all the I'm not getting lynched style posts.  A few of them came as overreactions), and lack of activity today.  Because let's face it, if Laine or Nolder are scum they have zero motivation to keep trying (more town points for Nolder, that).  I was also really bothered by EoD1 when she was acting like she couldn't make up her mind between me and Crusher.  It felt like she was digging for an excuse to vote me and only jumped on Crush when she couldn't find one.  Because based on her reads and statements pre-Clov test, Crush was very, very obviously the correct person for her to vote between us.  I hated her sussing Thane D2 for not voting when Thane accomplished two consecutive no lynch days in PF as town.  HATED IT.  And it really irritated me that she was AtEing at me during the D1 showdown.  The whole "AND I WAS TOWN IN THAT GAME, WASN'T I SHAD" as if anyone was sussing her.  It was overreactive.

 

Unfortunately I didn't get to any of that yet in my ISO.

 

[v]Laine[/v]

 

Kivam second.  Nolder third.  He's town.

 

 

[BFG]

If I've missed any changes in votes please let me know <3

[Nynaeve]

 

Kiv are you doing anything special for Rosh Ashana?

Is that the correct way to spell that? I've always wondered...

 

 

I dunno. I just wrote it the way you say it in hebrew.

[Thane Vakarian]

so, Kivam, what if Zander doesn't show?

[Nolder]

 

 

Kiv are you doing anything special for Rosh Ashana?

Is that the correct way to spell that? I've always wondered...

 

 

I dunno. I just wrote it the way you say it in hebrew.

 

Oh ok.

[Kivam]

so, Kivam, what if Zander doesn't show?

[unvote][v]Nolder[/v].

 

Will go with my gut over Shad's read, given you are balancing him out.  Got to start prepping for Shabbos (I've got asparagus soup, roasted potatoes, and rice with sauteed mushrooms and onions to make), so I'm not sure I'll be back before deadline, but will try to be and will vote with Zander if he shows up and breaks the tie by voting Laine.

[Kivam]

 

 

 

Kiv are you doing anything special for Rosh Ashana?

Is that the correct way to spell that? I've always wondered...

 

 

I dunno. I just wrote it the way you say it in hebrew.

 

Oh ok.

 

Rosh Hashana would be the correct english spelling.  Also, Chanukkah, not Hanukkah (pet peeve)

[BFG]

Official VC 4.11

 

Nolder (4): Thane, Laine, Nyn, Kivam

 

Laine (2): Nolder, Shad

 

Not voting (1): Zander

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Every time I think Nyn or Kiv or whoever goes off the rails they pull it back lol.

 

Ok I think I'm going to lock in my vote now since it's really a toss up anyway. Hopefully this is right.

 

[v]Alanna[/v]

 

 

Official VC 4.8

 

Nolder (1): Thane

 

Kivam (1): Kivam

 

Not voting (5): Layne, Nolder, Nyn, Zander, Shad

 

Why am I not voting yet? lol

 

[v]Nolder[/v]

 

 

[v]Nolder[/v]

 

 

Carai an Caldazar!

 

 

 

 

#Nyngeekingout

 

 

Beginning of my ISO on Laine:

 

#103 -- Skimmed through, feeling town on Clov, no other real thoughts yet.  My first fight with Calder was well under way at this point.

 

#113 -- The AJ FOS.  Here was my take on the whole thing from before:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-snip-

 

1) I'm not actually playing, that's probably what's sketching you out. I'm gonna pull a Crusher and float until endgame on jokes

 

-snip-

 

2) re: 132 on Clov's reaction to me FOSing Andrej.. idk I didn't really expect him to jump in and call out my FOS on Andrej's meta with such a post.

 

 

3)

 

 

 

 

 

On the note of me being preachy and helpful, I talked early game strat in Belicheat where Laine was a wolf so she definitely knows at the least I would do it as town.

 

Sort of bugged how she threw mud then backed off immediately when the accusation wasn't even an accurate one.

 

You realize I wasn't serious, right?

 

I'm personally a tad bit... idk curious(?) about this post being 30 minutes after your initial post saying I'm "sketching you out". I'm not sure if it's the wording, or the time frame (ie you bringing it back up to keep me in the spotlight) or what. I can't say it's anything I'm overly bothered about and maybe the feeling will pass in the morning.

 

 

1) I wouldn't count on it, chica

 

2) Except your meta on me wasn't even correct. You've seen me do it as both alignments so characterizing it only as part of a scum game isn't accurate. Weren't you joking anyway?

 

3) No, otherwise I wouldn't have brought it up again. What does the timing have to do with anything? I was mulling over what I thought about you and realized I had done so recently in a game as town and thought that you should be aware of that. It's sort of my job to bring stuff to the spotlight that I find inaccurate or false - so I don't see the point there either. Do you expect me to let you falsely represent me and NOT say anything about it?

 

 

 

 

I guess because I didn't take Laine's FOS post seriously I thought it a bit sketchy that AJ did and eventually reached a wtl on her.  Rereading I can't really hate AJ here.  Red crossed my mind too.  And for me it's not a feeling that Laine tried to push AJ and backed away when it failed.  I do believe it was a joke.  It's how Laine dealt with being questioned about it that comes off kind of weird.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The fact he's being helpful means ~nothing towards his alignment. AJ is a very good player so I don't think he's incapable of making that post as mafia at all. I think Mafia!AJ would probably WANT a bunch of early fakepeeks, since they (theoretically) would have a lower likeliness of being accurate and that helps narrow the NK poe, but I don't think he's going to come in and recommend it - especially when a handful of us recently played with him in the same setup when he waited to post a peek for accuracy reasons. He was town, and I'm positive he's smart enough to know the sudden change of heart would stand out.

 

That being said, I don't see how it would ever warrant a FoS. I'm giving him 0 towncred for trying to be helpful, but I don't see a reasonable argument why anybody would suspect him for being mafia for it.

 

 

This. I'm assuming that was a joke post from Laine, because otherwise the thoughtprocess of "only scum AJ tries to be helpful" would make no sense at all.

 

 

ding ding ding! Though I have told Andrej he comes off very helpful townie as mafia before. He's also an overall nice guy.. so not really alignment indicative *shrug* His wolf doesn't show this early anyways lol and I'd be the biggest fool to think I could read, well, pretty much anyone ever.

 

 

 

 

AJ left this part of the post out, but red feels awkward to me.

 

 

 

 

 

Andrej being helpful townie and preaching. Fos

 

I take this back reading in context. Andrej looking good ITT

 

 

 

 

And then this, I don't know what there is to "take back". Laine had been characterizing it as a joke.

 

I'll grant that she made a joke. It didn't come off well. The problem about the whole thing is that once she took some heat for it she started waffling in whether she should continue to treat it as a joke or roll with 'it was a serious suss but I changed my mind'.

 

I don't know if it all should really bother me or if this is just nitpicking.  At any rate I don't feel bad about AJ sussing her at this point.  Laine, thoughts?

 

 

 

 

~~Overall it doesn't bother me.  Felt maaaaybe a little too nervous about being sussed early, but at the same time I can understand going wtf when you make a joke and all of a sudden people are pointing fingers at you.  "His wolf doesn't show this early anyways lol and I'd be the biggest fool to think I could read, well, pretty much anyone ever." is super awkward.

 

~~It ends with the "I'm going to be a little bothered that it was so easy for mafia to sit back in this exchange and let it happen" statement, condition being if Shad flips town.  I think this really is a bit of a problem.  I don't see how Laine's mind gets there when she's sussing Calder.

 

#174 -- Doesn't want to be a mislynch candidate.  (1)

 

#176 -- Not planning to get mislynched any time soon.  (2)

 

#435 -- Annoyed by Nolder's placeholder vote.  ~~Understandable.  Nolder clarified 'placeholder' for me correctly so it's not a point against either of them.

 

#479 -- Notices she's at the bottom of some POEs.  Needs to fix that.  (3?)

 

#483 -- Worried about Zander's lack of activity ~~understandable

 

#501 -- Not sure if Nolder ever explained his scum read of Kiv.  (He did.)

 

#510 -- big catch-up here:

 

To "Too easy probably, but it crossed my mind." she says "This post really pinged me when I read it and the followup is "meh"...."  ~~Should I be concerned she didn't say anything like "nervous about Shad" in #103?

 

Thinks Calder doesn't make much sense but at the same time she's a little uncomfortable that I would miss something obvious.  Agrees that me "dodging posts" was bad but might not be scummy.

 

Thinks I'm being defensive.

 

Worried that Clov is town reading Calder already, agrees that Shad doesn't look great.

 

Asks me and Calder productive questions.

 

"interesting from Zander: this would destroy the credibility that Shad just missed the Calder-talk" and "from Shad... I think I would like this post better if you straight up answered the accusation instead of brushing it off again. You're a little sloppy this game" irt Zander noting I'd made 7 posts in the sign-up thread so I should have known about Calder.  ~~I'm a little bugged by this one.  I said I hadn't caught up before I started posting in sign-up (Calder's posts came well before mine if anyone bothered to check) and went on to give Zander a town lean for his actions.  Laine's sort of ignoring that and sussing me for dodging posts again.

 

Concludes Zander, Clov, AJ town, Calder and Shad questionable, notes that in PF her gut on me said scum but my content indicated town, here it's the opposite.

 

~~Overall I think this is a pretty solid catch-up.  Laine missed some things, but I know from PF that when she's really tired/pressed for time that can happen.  I know from Belichick that Laine can ask some pretty intelligent questions as scum.

 

#600 -- Thinks my push on Calder is defensive.  Wants to know who I'm sussing besides Calder.  ~~I don't get it at all but AJ thought the same thing.  Bit bewildering but if one town who knows my meta thought that then I suppose two could.  

 

#615 -- Mentions how obv town Thane was in PF

 

#624 -- Tries to engage Calder

 

#637 -- "I don't know how to play this stupid game anyways" ~~another one of these goofy tack-ons at the end of her post, similar to "I'd be the biggest fool to think I could read, well, pretty much anyone ever."  I don't know, they strike me as forced.

 

#640 -- "Calder... there's only like 13 players. And you only really have to keep up with 12 apart from yourself. Who did you think I was, some random posting on the thread? I feel so unloved. Thanks."  ~~A little forced maybe?

 

#826 -- Working on her read of me, seems to be drawing town conclusions, disagrees with AJ's argument that I know Crusher is town.  ~~Can't hate this.  I thought before she made a hard switch from scum to town on me, but this looks like she's developing it more carefully.

 

#833 -- Reads list, has Hallia and Crusher near the bottom with Calder, Nolder, and Thane.  She doesn't explain everything but what she says makes sense.  ~~Both scum in her D1 scum pile?  Looking like town!Laine here.

 

#840 -- Responds to my TMI callout saying there are three scum in the game, so at least some of them were sitting back and letting the Shad/Calder fight do its thing.  ~~umm... ok, don't know if that leaves me feeling any better.

 

#845 -- Talks about Calder.  She's consistant with previous statements here.

 

 

 

Looking good where I left off.  Things of note are possible TMI, defensiveness (I was going to count all the I'm not getting lynched style posts.  A few of them came as overreactions), and lack of activity today.  Because let's face it, if Laine or Nolder are scum they have zero motivation to keep trying (more town points for Nolder, that).  I was also really bothered by EoD1 when she was acting like she couldn't make up her mind between me and Crusher.  It felt like she was digging for an excuse to vote me and only jumped on Crush when she couldn't find one.  Because based on her reads and statements pre-Clov test, Crush was very, very obviously the correct person for her to vote between us.  I hated her sussing Thane D2 for not voting when Thane accomplished two consecutive no lynch days in PF as town.  HATED IT.  And it really irritated me that she was AtEing at me during the D1 showdown.  The whole "AND I WAS TOWN IN THAT GAME, WASN'T I SHAD" as if anyone was sussing her.  It was overreactive.

 

Unfortunately I didn't get to any of that yet in my ISO.

 

[v]Laine[/v]

 

Kivam second.  Nolder third.  He's town.

 

 

 

so, Kivam, what if Zander doesn't show?

[unvote][v]Nolder[/v].

 

Will go with my gut over Shad's read, given you are balancing him out.  Got to start prepping for Shabbos (I've got asparagus soup, roasted potatoes, and rice with sauteed mushrooms and onions to make), so I'm not sure I'll be back before deadline, but will try to be and will vote with Zander if he shows up and breaks the tie by voting Laine.

 

 

[Thane Vakarian]

sounds like you have a lot of prepping to do. Good luck with all that

[Kivam]

 

Will move my vote in about 50 minutes. Mildly prefer Nolder to laine, mainly because of my nyn tinfoil (figure out the connection for points), but with shad and thane both on laine will vote there

If it's that Nolder hopped on with it, I didn't get that impression, but I was mildly surprised he still had Nyn wtl over you in the end.

 

Generally in my Nolder ISO I wanted to pull out the wtl order comment as soon as I hit enter, fwiw.  I think it's null.

 

 

No.  I think it's likelier that you vote me tomorrow over Nolder than you vote me over Laine, and I'd like to avoid a Nolder-Nyn F3, since I think that's the worst available option if Nyn is scum

[Kivam]

OK, now I really have to go.

 

(and not crazy amounts ... the asparagus soup is pretty easy.  Saute chopped onion + garlic, add chopped asparagus & saute, season with salt and pepper, add some chicken boullion (about 6 cups) and puree with an immersion blender when it's boiled.  Comes out great, and you can use the same basic recipe for almost any vegetable you want to swap with the asparagus)

[Nolder]

Well it looks like I'm the lynch today so I'm going to go out to lunch instead of stick around lol.

I'm still pretty convinced it's Alanna so I'd say lynch her tomorrow. 

Leave the tinfoil for after Alanna flips town, if she does.

 

GG GL

[Shad_]

I'm a little busy and we're at under an hour.  Here's where I got to on Nyn, probably won't get around to more.

 

#204 -- first serious post, takes Calder's side right away but doesn't immediately condemn me.  Instead starts questioning me pretty hard

#213 -- bothered by Laine irt the AJ FOS

#218 -- agrees with Clov on AJ's actions being null and Shad looking scummy, doesn't get my points irt Calder

#223/4 -- Challenges my opinion on Calder's OP but doesn't condemn me for it, more of a null conclusion

Me and Nyn get into it a bit, conversation is a good bit more civil than between me and Calder, like she's actually trying to give me the benefit of the doubt and I keep coming back with the wrong answer.  There's a clear disconnect between what we're thinking here, but I never felt like she was twisting what I say the way I did with Calder.  More just a misunderstanding, and it was the build-up to her vote on me that really had me reading her strong town.
 

Here's the difference. Your knee jerk reaction does not make sense because it was an overreaction over basically nothing. Where's I haven't liked much of your content and said as much since I caught up.... you putting a stop to our exchange by basically calling my post BS.....  means we have nothing further to discuss.
 
This is my point.

~~I didn't respond to this one at the time because I kind of felt like "oh shit that's a good point" and irt Nyn I was in self-defense mode.
 

I think what bugs me most right now is that you're not owning up to what you're doing. If you've been transparent about the whole thing and went like... my bad.... I did overreact... or, my bad... the sequence of events is not how I thought...... but you keep digging and you're reaching. This new 'He called me a liar, boo hoo'.... is particularly mind numbing.

~~This one on the other hand was pretty bad.  It pulls the liar thing out of context.  I didn't like why Calder was sussing me, not the general fact of the matter.  I called her out for it and think her response in #290 is decent.

#293 -- Doesn't understand Kivam's read list, explains what doesn't make sense about it.  ~~I like this post.  It proves she's paying attention to things beyond the Shad/Calder scuffle and when she sees a disconnect between that and Kivam's reads she asks him about them.

#309 -- Kiv had said Nyn's jump into the Shad Calder discussion looked opportunistic.  She calls out BS, explains how she got to scum reading me independent of Calder.  ~~I remember siding with her in my head here at the time.

#318 -- Kiv had explained most of his reads.  Nyn notices he didn't explain one of them and asks for me.  ~~Another really towny thing to do imo.  Trying to get as big a picture of Kivam as she can.

#324 -- Kiv calls #309 highly defensive, says she might call it a misread but why a misrep?  Nyn corrects him, says it's a misrep in her eyes.  ~~The misread vs misrep thing is kind of huh? to me.  Nyn's response is correct but null in so far as Kiv was wrong and she's stating what actually happened.

#325 -- Follows up unpromted by clarifying that a misrep can go either way--could be a misunderstanding or could be intentional.  ~~I like that she clarified this, made it very clear where she stands with Kivam

#328 -- Concludes she hates Kivam's read list and is generally annoyed by him but he did explain his reasons  ~~Again no jumping to conclusions here or being ambiguous so she can adapt her story later.  She's being very direct about where she stands on everything.

#329 -- irt Crusher calling her antagonistic, she basically says she wasn't and Shad is scum  ~~Response to Crusher is very much in line with her response to everyone else.  At this point she'd been called out a couple times and she seems kind of annoyed about having to keep explaining herself.

#335 -- Kiv pushes the 'opportunistic' line further, Nyn isn't having any of it.  I like her response under pressure:

 

 

Not sure why think any of that is definitionally not opportunistic

 
Because I feel that I've been legitimately scumhunting and making good observations.....and all you gotta say is.... oh that looks opportunistic. There's nothing about Shad's content so far that makes him look even slightly town imo. So I don't understand how you'd get that impression or why you think this is a v/v situation. But, w/e.

 

 

#337

 

 

 

Honestly at this point I kinda hate your read list. But you have elaborated on the reasons, which is fair enough. I don't necessarily agree with your impressions, but that's hardly the point. It'll do for now. I really don't appreciate how you've tried to sort of mute me out. Though it could be my general annoyance at it, because I've tried to stay current and be around for interaction... and I think it's ****ing rude to dismiss me that way, but w/e. Plenty of other players to talk to.

??

 

 
I was around talking..... and you were like.... can we hear from someone else.
 
On one hand, sure, I agree with you that that are way too many players being quiet right now and that should change asap. On the other it was very dismissive cause it sounded like you pretty much wanted me to shut up.

 

 

~~Meh, I disagree and get why Kiv was confused here.  But she's not sussing him for how she interpreted it, not really, so I can't take it as a scummy move from Nyn.

#348 -- Kiv calls Nyn out for being emo ~~reasonable imo~~ then drops his really stupid "wrongly fingered scum's lament" argument.  Nyn says he's either really bad town or he's scum.  ~~Totally with Nyn on the reaction to this.

#349 -- Full emo mode at this point.  ~~I was initially worried that this came right after #348 with no posts in between, then realized Kiv had made another post sussing her since the one she responded to in #348.

Emo-a-go-go from here, especially ticked off that Kiv isn't even humoring the possibility that there really might be scum between Shad and Calder and immediately wants to label the whole thing an opportunistic move by Nyn.  I think it's a good point.
 

Shad goes quiet in the meanwhile.... because why not?  Best best? Scum is between Shad/ Alanna/ Kivam/ Crusher

This post is super-towny in context.  It comes from the perspective of someone who thinks she's just caught scum and suddenly is being strung up for stupid reasons while real scum happily distances himself from the conversation.
 

#365
 

This just makes me feel better with my vote, btw. There's no way scum wouldn't have promoted Sha'd train if he were town, considering all the heat he had on him.

~~I thought this too.  Kind of wifom about Nyn's allignment though--she and Zander are the only living players who scum read me.  Clov explains later why scum might be less likely to hop into the argument in a Deadline game.

#376 -- Agrees with Clov that Crusher's vote looks terrible.  Bases some of Crusher's scum credentials on the assumption that I'm his team mate.  ~~I guess it COULD be prep for a bus that takes me down too, but it's important to note that Nyn doesn't follow through on that later.  I mean, I stay on her scumdar, but iirc she reconsiders me in light of the trains and eventually opts to go for Hallia over me D3.  Dunno if I'll get that far in iso but it looks good.

--This is where Kivam springs the trap.  The more I look at it the more I'm kind of meh about it.

"Nyn isn't a player who's as careful with her words as some others might be, and frankly I was expecting her to respond with something along the lines of "I meant that I felt that I was making good observations", which was the back end of that quote ("I feel that I've been legitimately scumhunting and making good observations").  In fact, I had originally bolded the full clause in her original post, read the back end and went "oh, so that's what she meant", and decided to unbold the remainder and throw the point out there anyway to see what fishies might bite."

~~I mean, I can tell you this Kiv.  Whatever compelled Crusher to jump on board with you, it was not the fact that you failed to bold the words "and making good observations".  Not sure why I didn't think this was slimey at the time.  Maybe I was just releaved that attention was turning off of me for once. 

#386 -- "What did you ask?  I was sorta busy having a melt down. It's a bit time consuming." irt me saying she didn't answer my question.  ~~I like this.  She's happy that people are off of her and she's being a lot more cordial now.  Would her attitude shift so positively if pressure was moving off of her onto a team mate?  I think she'd still be a little irritated then.
 

 

Conclusion:  Nyn is town here like BFG was town in PF and I was town in Belichick.  Scum are really irritated that the game set-up prevented them from night killing her, and she should never, ever, ever be lynched.

[Shad_]

I could switch from Laine to Kivam if anyone wants to, but it looks like you're all set on Nolder.  Hope you're right, think you're wrong.  Never lynch Nyn and we win.

[Thane Vakarian]

We will find out soon enough Shad. Nolder seems to understand, which is good. If he flips town, i'll buy him a drink. Laine, undoubtedly, is next. Then, which i doubt, it'd be Kivam.

 

We should be able to win this game *nods* 

[Zander?]

IM here....sorry!!!!  trying to get caught up

[Shad_]

ZAAAAAAAAAAANDER

[BFG]

[Zander?]

Official VC 4.11

 

Nolder (4): Thane, Laine, Nyn, Kivam

 

Laine (2): Nolder, Shad

 

Not voting (1): Zander

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Every time I think Nyn or Kiv or whoever goes off the rails they pull it back lol.

 

Ok I think I'm going to lock in my vote now since it's really a toss up anyway. Hopefully this is right.

 

[v]Alanna[/v]

 

 

Official VC 4.8

 

Nolder (1): Thane

 

Kivam (1): Kivam

 

Not voting (5): Layne, Nolder, Nyn, Zander, Shad

 

Why am I not voting yet? lol

 

[v]Nolder[/v]

 

 

[v]Nolder[/v]

 

 

Carai an Caldazar!

 

 

 

 

#Nyngeekingout

 

 

Beginning of my ISO on Laine:

 

#103 -- Skimmed through, feeling town on Clov, no other real thoughts yet.  My first fight with Calder was well under way at this point.

 

#113 -- The AJ FOS.  Here was my take on the whole thing from before:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-snip-

 

1) I'm not actually playing, that's probably what's sketching you out. I'm gonna pull a Crusher and float until endgame on jokes

 

-snip-

 

2) re: 132 on Clov's reaction to me FOSing Andrej.. idk I didn't really expect him to jump in and call out my FOS on Andrej's meta with such a post.

 

 

3)

 

 

 

 

On the note of me being preachy and helpful, I talked early game strat in Belicheat where Laine was a wolf so she definitely knows at the least I would do it as town.

 

Sort of bugged how she threw mud then backed off immediately when the accusation wasn't even an accurate one.

 

You realize I wasn't serious, right?

 

I'm personally a tad bit... idk curious(?) about this post being 30 minutes after your initial post saying I'm "sketching you out". I'm not sure if it's the wording, or the time frame (ie you bringing it back up to keep me in the spotlight) or what. I can't say it's anything I'm overly bothered about and maybe the feeling will pass in the morning.

 

 

1) I wouldn't count on it, chica

 

2) Except your meta on me wasn't even correct. You've seen me do it as both alignments so characterizing it only as part of a scum game isn't accurate. Weren't you joking anyway?

 

3) No, otherwise I wouldn't have brought it up again. What does the timing have to do with anything? I was mulling over what I thought about you and realized I had done so recently in a game as town and thought that you should be aware of that. It's sort of my job to bring stuff to the spotlight that I find inaccurate or false - so I don't see the point there either. Do you expect me to let you falsely represent me and NOT say anything about it?

 

 

 

 

I guess because I didn't take Laine's FOS post seriously I thought it a bit sketchy that AJ did and eventually reached a wtl on her.  Rereading I can't really hate AJ here.  Red crossed my mind too.  And for me it's not a feeling that Laine tried to push AJ and backed away when it failed.  I do believe it was a joke.  It's how Laine dealt with being questioned about it that comes off kind of weird.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The fact he's being helpful means ~nothing towards his alignment. AJ is a very good player so I don't think he's incapable of making that post as mafia at all. I think Mafia!AJ would probably WANT a bunch of early fakepeeks, since they (theoretically) would have a lower likeliness of being accurate and that helps narrow the NK poe, but I don't think he's going to come in and recommend it - especially when a handful of us recently played with him in the same setup when he waited to post a peek for accuracy reasons. He was town, and I'm positive he's smart enough to know the sudden change of heart would stand out.

 

That being said, I don't see how it would ever warrant a FoS. I'm giving him 0 towncred for trying to be helpful, but I don't see a reasonable argument why anybody would suspect him for being mafia for it.

 

 

This. I'm assuming that was a joke post from Laine, because otherwise the thoughtprocess of "only scum AJ tries to be helpful" would make no sense at all.

 

 

ding ding ding! Though I have told Andrej he comes off very helpful townie as mafia before. He's also an overall nice guy.. so not really alignment indicative *shrug* His wolf doesn't show this early anyways lol and I'd be the biggest fool to think I could read, well, pretty much anyone ever.

 

 

 

 

AJ left this part of the post out, but red feels awkward to me.

 

 

 

 

 

Andrej being helpful townie and preaching. Fos

 

I take this back reading in context. Andrej looking good ITT

 

 

 

 

And then this, I don't know what there is to "take back". Laine had been characterizing it as a joke.

 

I'll grant that she made a joke. It didn't come off well. The problem about the whole thing is that once she took some heat for it she started waffling in whether she should continue to treat it as a joke or roll with 'it was a serious suss but I changed my mind'.

 

I don't know if it all should really bother me or if this is just nitpicking.  At any rate I don't feel bad about AJ sussing her at this point.  Laine, thoughts?

 

 

 

 

~~Overall it doesn't bother me.  Felt maaaaybe a little too nervous about being sussed early, but at the same time I can understand going wtf when you make a joke and all of a sudden people are pointing fingers at you.  "His wolf doesn't show this early anyways lol and I'd be the biggest fool to think I could read, well, pretty much anyone ever." is super awkward.

 

~~It ends with the "I'm going to be a little bothered that it was so easy for mafia to sit back in this exchange and let it happen" statement, condition being if Shad flips town.  I think this really is a bit of a problem.  I don't see how Laine's mind gets there when she's sussing Calder.

 

#174 -- Doesn't want to be a mislynch candidate.  (1)

 

#176 -- Not planning to get mislynched any time soon.  (2)

 

#435 -- Annoyed by Nolder's placeholder vote.  ~~Understandable.  Nolder clarified 'placeholder' for me correctly so it's not a point against either of them.

 

#479 -- Notices she's at the bottom of some POEs.  Needs to fix that.  (3?)

 

#483 -- Worried about Zander's lack of activity ~~understandable

 

#501 -- Not sure if Nolder ever explained his scum read of Kiv.  (He did.)

 

#510 -- big catch-up here:

 

To "Too easy probably, but it crossed my mind." she says "This post really pinged me when I read it and the followup is "meh"...."  ~~Should I be concerned she didn't say anything like "nervous about Shad" in #103?

 

Thinks Calder doesn't make much sense but at the same time she's a little uncomfortable that I would miss something obvious.  Agrees that me "dodging posts" was bad but might not be scummy.

 

Thinks I'm being defensive.

 

Worried that Clov is town reading Calder already, agrees that Shad doesn't look great.

 

Asks me and Calder productive questions.

 

"interesting from Zander: this would destroy the credibility that Shad just missed the Calder-talk" and "from Shad... I think I would like this post better if you straight up answered the accusation instead of brushing it off again. You're a little sloppy this game" irt Zander noting I'd made 7 posts in the sign-up thread so I should have known about Calder.  ~~I'm a little bugged by this one.  I said I hadn't caught up before I started posting in sign-up (Calder's posts came well before mine if anyone bothered to check) and went on to give Zander a town lean for his actions.  Laine's sort of ignoring that and sussing me for dodging posts again.

 

Concludes Zander, Clov, AJ town, Calder and Shad questionable, notes that in PF her gut on me said scum but my content indicated town, here it's the opposite.

 

~~Overall I think this is a pretty solid catch-up.  Laine missed some things, but I know from PF that when she's really tired/pressed for time that can happen.  I know from Belichick that Laine can ask some pretty intelligent questions as scum.

 

#600 -- Thinks my push on Calder is defensive.  Wants to know who I'm sussing besides Calder.  ~~I don't get it at all but AJ thought the same thing.  Bit bewildering but if one town who knows my meta thought that then I suppose two could.  

 

#615 -- Mentions how obv town Thane was in PF

 

#624 -- Tries to engage Calder

 

#637 -- "I don't know how to play this stupid game anyways" ~~another one of these goofy tack-ons at the end of her post, similar to "I'd be the biggest fool to think I could read, well, pretty much anyone ever."  I don't know, they strike me as forced.

 

#640 -- "Calder... there's only like 13 players. And you only really have to keep up with 12 apart from yourself. Who did you think I was, some random posting on the thread? I feel so unloved. Thanks."  ~~A little forced maybe?

 

#826 -- Working on her read of me, seems to be drawing town conclusions, disagrees with AJ's argument that I know Crusher is town.  ~~Can't hate this.  I thought before she made a hard switch from scum to town on me, but this looks like she's developing it more carefully.

 

#833 -- Reads list, has Hallia and Crusher near the bottom with Calder, Nolder, and Thane.  She doesn't explain everything but what she says makes sense.  ~~Both scum in her D1 scum pile?  Looking like town!Laine here.

 

#840 -- Responds to my TMI callout saying there are three scum in the game, so at least some of them were sitting back and letting the Shad/Calder fight do its thing.  ~~umm... ok, don't know if that leaves me feeling any better.

 

#845 -- Talks about Calder.  She's consistant with previous statements here.

 

 

 

Looking good where I left off.  Things of note are possible TMI, defensiveness (I was going to count all the I'm not getting lynched style posts.  A few of them came as overreactions), and lack of activity today.  Because let's face it, if Laine or Nolder are scum they have zero motivation to keep trying (more town points for Nolder, that).  I was also really bothered by EoD1 when she was acting like she couldn't make up her mind between me and Crusher.  It felt like she was digging for an excuse to vote me and only jumped on Crush when she couldn't find one.  Because based on her reads and statements pre-Clov test, Crush was very, very obviously the correct person for her to vote between us.  I hated her sussing Thane D2 for not voting when Thane accomplished two consecutive no lynch days in PF as town.  HATED IT.  And it really irritated me that she was AtEing at me during the D1 showdown.  The whole "AND I WAS TOWN IN THAT GAME, WASN'T I SHAD" as if anyone was sussing her.  It was overreactive.

 

Unfortunately I didn't get to any of that yet in my ISO.

 

[v]Laine[/v]

 

Kivam second.  Nolder third.  He's town.

 

 

 

so, Kivam, what if Zander doesn't show?

[unvote][v]Nolder[/v].

 

Will go with my gut over Shad's read, given you are balancing him out.  Got to start prepping for Shabbos (I've got asparagus soup, roasted potatoes, and rice with sauteed mushrooms and onions to make), so I'm not sure I'll be back before deadline, but will try to be and will vote with Zander if he shows up and breaks the tie by voting Laine.

 

 

 

sooooooooooooooooooooo......

[Shad_]

Zander

[Zander?]

Zander

 

Shad

[Zander?]

the 3 of us need on the same page.

[Shad_]

 

Zander

 

Shad

 

 

Promise me you will never vote Nyn.