A Tale of Middle Earth: Game OVER

[Clovdyx]

Friends eat each other.

[Aiel Heart]

When I say I wasn't "there" and that he was seeming more town at the end, I meant the part that I hadn't read yet. I was voting from a behind place, and so I wasn't "there" for all of the recent happenings.

 

If I had been caught up, I would have voted differently, but I wasn't going to be able to catch up any more before the phase ended. I shouldn't have voted at all, and I can see that in hindsight. In the moment, however, I was frustrated by my own lack of participation in the game and felt like I should not miss voting in another phase simply because of my absence up until then. Was kind of a rash angry impulse that I HAD TO VOTE SOMETHING *rage*. It was wrong, and my vote was wrong.

 

I hadn't liked Verbal or Pizza. At the time, Verbal had seemed more scummy to me. After I caught up, Verbal started to seem more towny, and Pizza just got worse, but unfortunately my vote was made with incomplete information--something that will not be happening from here on out

 

 

 

Darthe stop spreading all sorts of nasty rumors about me! I do not eat my friends or choose food over them. He bought my food *pout*

[Gabriel Kross]

Friends eat each other.

friends don't let friends not eat friends?

[Leelou]

 

Friends eat each other.

friends don't let friends not eat friends?

 

 

Fish are friends, not food! 

[Gabriel Kross]

 

 

Friends eat each other.

friends don't let friends not eat friends?

 

 

Fish are friends, not food! 

 

but friends eat friends so friends are food

[dicetosser1]

these have been sitting here since before the gladiator. 

 

 

Do you read him town?

 

I was leaning that way but it was because of verb/leelou interactions. I suck at reading either of them

 

 

i will cause im trying to see the argument thats being made on him

Do you read him town?

I thought this was an easy question to answer.

 

 

Im in OZ and on a totally different time zone. and i was at the kids place friday night so it took a while

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2. Maybe it´s the English but I still don´t get it. You didn´t understand Manbat´s reasons. That I get know. But I still find it weird to ask others on their oppinions on why the posts where different. I don´t know how to explain it - it´s like you are sitting back and letting others do the talking.

 

4. But why do you say that Yates 2.0 need to town it up and that you are worried that he will get lynched again if you liked his game so far? And now you say that you are worried about him. It sounds like a contradiction to me. 

 

And what where you going to do with that information? Try to stop her train. Look at someone on her train? Join it? 

 

 

2 )  I was asking the two people who gave the opposite opinions why they thought they were so different

 

4)  because i am paranoid. im not explaining futher as i am not giving road maps out

 

 

Why would we still auto lynch Verb?
 
What if Pizza claims VT or something?

I hope he *DOES* claim VT. That wouldn't mean he wasn't a PR.

Verb is a known quantity. Pizza is not. And before we go too far down this rabbit hole, Pizza is a Champion level player [as well]. While he has yet to be super involved in this game, I have no doubts that if/when he is allowed the opportunity to he will game solve at an elite level.

 

 

 

That's working under the assumption that he is town Yates.

 

AJ answered for me here. 

[Clovdyx]

 

 

 

 

Friends eat each other.

friends don't let friends not eat friends?

Fish are friends, not food!

I don't see why they can't be both, Memo.

[Eldrick4221]

Ok. I don't like that people are believing Leelou's double vote at face value. It hasn't been proven. Gladiator match ended without an official count. It's likely she's telling the truth, but not 100%

 

As for Pizza being VT, this makes absolutely no sense. If actually was VT, and his competitor was a PR with unknown alignment, why would he throw up a fake claim to kill the PR? He could still be scum, but he is *NOT* VT.

 

@Pizza In regards to role-block. Don't waste it on me. I don't have anything blockable.

[Eldrick4221]

EBWOP

 

If he actually was VT

[Leelou]

Ok. I don't like that people are believing Leelou's double vote at face value. It hasn't been proven. Gladiator match ended without an official count. It's likely she's telling the truth, but not 100%

 

As for Pizza being VT, this makes absolutely no sense. If actually was VT, and his competitor was a PR with unknown alignment, why would he throw up a fake claim to kill the PR? He could still be scum, but he is *NOT* VT.

 

@Pizza In regards to role-block. Don't waste it on me. I don't have anything blockable.

 

 

GLADIATOR BATTLE COUNT:

 

VERBAL (0/11):

 

PIZZA (1/11): Thane

 

NOT VOTING (20/20):

Hally, Sooh, Alot, Heart, Dice, Yates, Verbal, Talya, Eldrick, Leelou, Leelou, Krak, Taborline, Andrej, Alannalynn, Seph, EP, Tina, Cass, Pizza

 

VOTES ARE LOCKED

 

[Gabriel Kross]

 

Ok. I don't like that people are believing Leelou's double vote at face value. It hasn't been proven. Gladiator match ended without an official count. It's likely she's telling the truth, but not 100%

 

As for Pizza being VT, this makes absolutely no sense. If actually was VT, and his competitor was a PR with unknown alignment, why would he throw up a fake claim to kill the PR? He could still be scum, but he is *NOT* VT.

 

@Pizza In regards to role-block. Don't waste it on me. I don't have anything blockable.

 

 

GLADIATOR BATTLE COUNT:

 

VERBAL (0/11):

 

PIZZA (1/11): Thane

 

NOT VOTING (20/20):

Hally, Sooh, Alot, Heart, Dice, Yates, Verbal, Talya, Eldrick, Leelou, Leelou, Krak, Taborline, Andrej, Alannalynn, Seph, EP, Tina, Cass, Pizza

 

VOTES ARE LOCKED

 

 

WHY ARE THERE TWO LEELOUS OH GOD WE'RE DOOMED!

[Yates]

There's a double-mint gum joke in here somewhere.

[Leelou]

WHY ARE THERE TWO LEELOUS OH GOD WE'RE DOOMED!

 

 

FEAR the LEELOU

[Eldrick4221]

Fair enough, Leelou. I missed that.

[Andrej]

I seem to have solved the issue with my laptop, which is awesome because I am no longer regulated to playing mobile.

 

I'm done with my assignments (at least for tonight) and since I don't feel like going to bed yet I wanted to dedicate a little time to this game.

 

Anyway - I'm gonna reread over the last few pages and comment on anything I see pertinent and then do some ISOs to find what sort of stuff I find regarding those in my wolf pool.

[Leelou]

Hey scum teams...you are doing a great job on the town, but you guys do need to take each other out too. 

 

Just would like to point this out again. 

[Andrej]

There a few people I want to address so I will make separate posts for each.

 

 

 

 

Verbal, in the time remaining in this game, please assist me in locating Andrej's likely wolf partners, and please analyze the game as best you can.

 

Let us not waste this opportunity to turn a dungheap of a bad lynch into an amazing outcome. Let us out more wolves, now.

 

Since you are so stuck in your read on me I would like to hear your theory on this.

 

 

Anyway - I'm gonna hush and let some of the quieter people come in here and talk for a bit. I'll be leaving for work soon anyway but I'll return tonight to read whatever new stuff there is.

 

Krak, if you're a villager then I am disappointed in you for your level of involvement this game.

 

Thane you too, especially since you were going to self vote and basically quit on your team.

 

This is another post which should make your skin crawl.

 

Shaming villagers is not finding wolves, and I mean that in every sense.

 

What you say is true enough but that doesn't make me scum by any means. Frankly, without your peeks both Krak and Thane could've very likely been mislynched due to their play. Even if it may reflect badly on me, sometimes people just need to get a kick in the ass to get them in gear. Krak STILL hasn't posted anything since the beginning of D2. How is that ever helpful?

 

While I am speaking to you directly, I'd like to take the time to defend myself. I know what your read on me is and that's fine, but you're wrong. With your reveal in the open and your actions on the table, I realize now that my read on you and other players were backwards. Your perspective aligns with what you've claimed but I also need you to consider from my perspective. I was not privy to the information you had regarding your peeks, most notably on Krak, and so your suspicion of me based on that and my read on Tayla (who I now believe to be scum) are logical conclusions but in the end DO NOT MAKE ME A WOLF. If you're thinking of things from my angle, I feel my suspicion for Krak was justified considering the knowledge of my own alignment and the circumstances in which I could be voted for after D1. To be frank, I felt like he was trying to wagon me in the hopes I would be an easy lynch. This also aligns with my suspicion of you being one of Krak's teammates due to your defense on thread of him - which now is cast in a different light after your reveal.

[alannalynn]

I had a pretty awesome day out with friends, so I'm just responding to things as I reread the end of day 2 and into the night, gonna see how far I get before I have to sleep... Sorry for the multiquotes in advance, I tried to trim down what I could <3

 

**snip**

 
@Sooh: I'm leaning town on Dice, i haven't seen anything bad from him, but you seem rather convinced that he's scum, the way you keep bringing it back, just wondering if you're seeing something I'm not seeing. I'll go back and ISO just in case.

**snip**

 

It's not that I have seen anything bad. It's more that I haven't seen anything good. I would expect at this point of the game that when he gives his votes or reads he has something else than his gut to base it on. 

 

**snip**

Meh..I don't like any of the trains at the moment.

Vote: Dice

I still don't understand why you jumped on a random person with... 21 minutes left to the day and nobody really following you on that Dice-vote front (except I think maybe Tina? mentioned she was willing to switch over). I think spreading votes at the end of day is a bad idea.

 

**snip**

I would think this post explained why I jumped to a random person. I was not happy with voting neither Thane nor Verbal as I have them both as slight town reads. I was trying to get the town to come with me and vote someone I believe is scum. If you look a little further you'll also see that I did vote on the main trains out of necessity before EOD, but it was not a happy vote.

 

I just.. you could have picked a better candidate to derail the train if that's what you wanted to do? And not seeing much good isn't an excuse to say someone is mafia then get upset when people aren't following your case when you haven't even provided a case against him: I don't really see where you ever built a case against Dice in your posts? He basically makes one comment on how you need to speak to your mentor first about reads, yet your reads haven't changed much. I don't see this as scummy, I see this as questioning an inconsistency. And THEN you say that he "might not be as strong a candidate for scum anyway". So which is it?

 

/snip/

First I wanted to know from Dice why it's such a bad thing that my town reads haven't changed a whole lot. It's like that's the scummiest thing you've ever read.  Really?

/snip/

I still feel like Dice, Seph and Talya are interesting candidates for scum. I'm aware that Seph is for meta reasons, and it's not a strong case really. I need to go back and look more at Dice, because he has been stepping up his game in my opinion, and might not be as strong a candidate for scum anyway... Talya has followed her very own path this game, and might for that reason be very scummy or very villagery. I still feel like she has been defending Seph a lot, and so pending a flip on him I would potentially look at her closer. 

/snip/

 

Next up, you ask for opinions on his playstyle.

/snip

Can you all give me your opinions on Dice?

I think he looks horribly scummy so far this game... 

 

 

 

Mainly the same thing. I have found he has done very little in terms of giving reads, and yes, I felt like his vote on me was off. I just can't seem to shake that he isn't being Town!Dice, which is why I'm reaching out to you who have played with him longer to see if anyone else feel the same way as I do. I find that it's much more compelling to me to go in that direction right now rather than at Thane/Hallia. 

 

Interesting, what's your read on me?

 

You know I <3 you but this is tinfoil Cass... I trust noone when I play and you've said you'll never trust me again so adding in the explanation about 'reaching out' seems strange... Currently I think I'm putting Dice at about the same level as Thane. Scummy to start and now not sure. And I'm still not certain that you're not Scum yourself.

 

Cass, I reached out to EVERYONE... Currently you and your hydra partner are in my null reads because most of all I find it hard to read two players playing the same spot. Fair enough on the tinfoiling. I do that with everyone too, but if enough people independently read Dice as scummy, maybe he really is? Regardless of the two of us and our affiliation.

 

I <3 you too... lol just neutral in mafia

You're just basically saying he's scum because he voted against you once. Yes, I know someone is going to complain about how I'm simplifying this observation, I just want to point out some odd behavior on account of Sooh.

 

Your next mention of Dice is during the Thane/Verbal trains when you're trying to pull people away to vote on Dice. Strangely enough, NOBODY voted Dice day 1 and ONLY YOU voted Dice day 2, so I really don't see how you were attempting to pull votes away from the Thane/Verbal lynch at this point when you hadn't even made a case against him. (For the record, he voted you for your odd behavior about asking about the Sili vote on Yates1.0 lynch and needing to discus with your mentor your reads)

Meh..I don't like any of the trains at the moment.

[v]Dice[/v]

I think Dice only has one vote... mine... 

Seriously? Nobody wants to look at Dice today?

/snip/

Why couldn't you just all not follow me on Dice?

/snip

 

I don't know what you're getting at here, honestly. It feels like you were trying to play the good townie by LOOKING like you were trying to avoid a lynch in a "t/t" situation but not actually putting in the effort to convince anyone otherwise?

[Eldrick4221]

So I just read over what AJ has said, and my read on him hasn't changed. He is trying to solve the game, and doesn't seem to be tunneling anyone. I have agreed with what he has said. It all makes sense to me. It feels like he's coming from a town perspective.

 

Can the people that feel otherwise please address why they feel this way?

[Andrej]

-snip-

 

He had intimated he had a peek on me. I knew he couldn't have as he would have got town. It is now mute because he has said who had viewed.

 

I'm on phone and tried to snip this so not sure how it will go

 

Wrong.

 

Pizza never said he had peeked you as a wolf. He was basing his suspicion on you based on your vote of Krak.

 

-snip-

 

I don't think it was.

 

The part I liked especially was him saying that it's weird for Seph to focus on him solely for something others are clearly doing or have admitted to be doing. Pretty townie process imo because to me it shows where he's coming from regarding accusations towards him. I don't necessarily agree with his conclusion because from my single game experience with Seph he stuck his foot in his mouth early and often and caught heat for it, but I do think it looks good for EP.

 

Likewise it's something I look forward to seeing progress.

 

The above looks like he is sitting and watching something to see if he can use something later rather than push things himself, I have got that impression through most of the first day.

 

False and a big mischaracterization. This post was one of the first I had expressed of my development of a town read on EP. My comment about wanting to see it develop is because I feel that it's sometimes better not to directly involve myself in every interaction so that they happen naturally without me budding in. This is very helpful for me when it comes time to evaluate those interactions so that I can base reads on the players involved.

 

-snip-

 

I've been reading back from around pg 65 and I think there is some good content there.

 

I like Eldrick, Alot and Tayla's posts specifically.

 

I don't like Krak's posts on pg 66.

 

Come fight me Krak. Don't think I'm going to let you vote me and call me scum and go uncontested with your "tone" read. Make me believe you're actually suspicious or I will assume you are a wolf hoping you'd be able to stream roll me from what happened on D1.

 

he seems to be going for Krak here, but not voting him, he wants a fight with him

 

Correct. As I stated before after Krak's initial vote on me I wasn't going to condemn him for it immediately. I wanted him to engage me and tell me why/how I was scum so then I could try to see things from his angle to better decide whether I thought he was genuine or not.

 

 

For one Eldrick is playing a world's difference than I have seen him before. I wouldn't expect you to know this, but it's an important detail nonetheless. In our last game together I was a villager and he was a wolf and I had him pretty firmly pegged D1. What I like about his posts is that he's being vocal with his ideas but not in a way I feel is intentionally manipulative. I also like that he is showing progression and a willingness to adjust his mindset when someone brings up a valid point contesting his. I didn't see this type of fluidity in his thought process in our last contest together. The interactions between him and Alot are a good example and both strike me as villagery in their discussion.

 

I have actually liked Tayla since her game entrance. I haven't played with her before but I get the sense she conveys her thoughts in a clear and confident manner.

 

Krak is a bit of a volume tell. He came out okay D1 and engaged EP and Sili over some stuff I don't really remember exactly without looking back. Then he goes absent for the entiriety of D1 only to reappear again with some random posts before Day break. I don't see much of contribution on his end and frankly I feel like his case towards me is weak, but I'm willing to concede that could just be me getting my panties in a bunch.

 

Odd post above, he said Krak hasn't been around much and feels Kraks case on him is weak, then concedes it is because he could be getting his panties in a bunch!?

 

I think I was being obviously sarcastic there with the panties comment, but if you think about it, it makes sense. I know my alignment and it's natural for me to be suspicious of those voting me especially given the circumstances of D1.At the time I felt Krak could be pushing me from a wolfy place and I wanted to find out. He's still yet to come back into the game from when he posted last.

 

 

[v]Krak[/v] for now.

 

I definitely don't mind seeing a wagon here and maybe now he'll come in and actually support his stances.

 

I've got to run again but I should have a bit of time when class is done before work this afternoon. See you guys then

 

he didn't vote for him before, but now that someone else has, he jumps on and wants to see a wagon there.

 

This is a bad attempt to put suspicion on me and it's a tactic I see scum use fairly often. In fact, I literally caught a wolf in my last game for using this exact same reasoning to vote someone. At this point others (including yourself) had voted Krak and if he wasn't going to come back and engage me then I was perfectly fine seeing him swing.

 

 

Luckily for you guys, I'm off work and have a few hours at school where I can use a desktop versus having to play strictly from my phone.

I'm probably lynching Pizza here barring some sort of claim on his part.

 

Said he is going for Pizza unless he claims something. soft push for a claim, but with the choice between Verb and Pizza, something was bound to happen.

 

What is your point here? The gladiator lynch basically came down to who claimed what. My suspicion on Pizza at this point before his claim was pretty high considering his defense of one of my scum reads, his attacks on me, and the way he voted Verbal who I was town reading. Essentially, without that claim, I would've definitely vouched for his lynch over Verb.

 

Lets try a list

 

Eternal Phoenix

Pizzaguy

Thane

Krak

Verbal

 

Alot

Aiel Heart

Taborline

 

TinaHel

 Dice

Yates 2.0

 

Eldrick

Leelou

Alannalynn

seph - mentored by Kaylee

 

Hally

Sooh - mentored by Corn

Cass/Monstr - Batassery

Andrej

 

Blues - I'm leaning town with EP at the top. 

 

Black - I have a null read, they haven't been around enough to make a call. or I'm just not seeing anything yet either way

 

Green - slightly more town then wolfie so far

 

Orange - leaning more to wolfie than town

 

Red - higher lean towards wolfie

 

 

Yates - Faramir, Town Forensic Investigator Lynched Day One

Tress - Tulkas, Town Vanilla Killed Night One

 Zander - Elu Thingol, Town Mason Killed Night One

Sili - Beren, Town Vanilla Modkilled Day Two

 

The way you've formatted your reads here makes me think that you are only looking for scum outside of your team. For one, your number of actual reds is very few when at this point in the game the number of wolves and villagers are nearly equal. Your town reads are easy, your nulls are probably all teammates imo, the oranges are a mixture of people that that I think are scum with a sprinkle of 'back up' villagers to lynch and your reds are players that I think you think are connected to me somehow; which basically gives away that you're only looking to piece together the other team and not find all the wolves collectively regardless of who they may be partners with.

 

 

 

 

And, Pizza, i know that you're doing your best to appear super town here and now. But here's a thought lingering at the back of my mind:

 

You could also simply know that Krak and I are town and can be confirmed town (by being killed), because you're one of the wolves. Now, i know this is our first game together, but i'm still not losing my suspicion on you for 100%...

 

You'll probably understand that, seeing you're a seasoned player (that's the impression i get from you anyways)

 

He would guess you were town if there was only one team out there, but Darhe has said multiball, which would mean, if he was on one team, he wouldn't know for sure you were town for definite, all he would know is you weren't on his team.

 

Chocolate always solves everything.

 

This reads to me like Tayla is aware that Thane isn't on her team with how she speaks to him here.

[Eldrick4221]

I fully expect Pizza to be protected tonight. Either by himself, or by some other means. Will the scum teams be ballsy enough to kill one of his peeks, and prove that he is telling the truth?

[Andrej]

I'm not sure how that quote box got messed up above, but my comments are below all the listed dead players.

[Eldrick4221]

-snip-

(@ Talya, for reference)

 

 

The way you've formatted your reads here makes me think that you are only looking for scum outside of your team. For one, your number of actual reds is very few when at this point in the game the number of wolves and villagers are nearly equal. Your town reads are easy, your nulls are probably all teammates imo, the oranges are a mixture of people that that I think are scum with a sprinkle of 'back up' villagers to lynch and your reds are players that I think you think are connected to me somehow; which basically gives away that you're only looking to piece together the other team and not find all the wolves collectively regardless of who they may be partners with.

 

I find this very interesting. I was going to look at seph next, but I never did get around to looking into Talya.

[Eldrick4221]

Why do you say the mafia is probably equal to townies now? I'm guessing 6 total mafia between the teams due to 1/4 balance. There are 19 people left. That's 6 maf and 13 non-maf (some of which are probably indy).

[Eldrick4221]

Why do you say the mafia is probably equal to townies now? I'm guessing 6 total mafia between the teams due to 1/4 balance. There are 19 people left. That's 6 maf and 13 non-maf (some of which are probably indy).

I can't remember who said this, but it was stuck in my head. I want to say it was AJ.