[Standard] 11/10 Top Tier Vanilla+ Game Thread

[Nynaeve]

I'm gonna go eat. I'll be baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaack.

[Barmacral]

 

Disinterested? No, your case came up during the weekend where I was gone - a thing I even stated in thread before I was gone. I'm not disinterested, I haven't been available to respond. You should know this though, you are the one who did the ISO on me and presumably read all of my posts.

 

 

Presumably. Maybe I didn't. Who knows?!  MYSTERY

 

 

Oh so you were cherry-picking the posts that sound bad to you and ignoring the ones that don't?

[Cass]

Wow, that was a good response, dude.

 

Nyn, you're exaggerating on many of those points.  And you know as well as anybody how I engage Leelou to get a read on her.  I've gotten reads fast once in a while, but it is usually a process.

 

Actually, it's pretty crap that you're just deciding to call that BS.  I've been reading Leelou (mostly accurately, by the way) the same damn way for over 5 years.  I don't give 2 buckets of monkey piss if you think I'm BSing by saying I expect different answers from her.  I've said it in many past games - feel free to go digging to prove yourself wrong.

 

Except this time you were hinting that she was scum - and you did it more than once ... and you were wrong...

[Barmacral]

 

Wow, that was a good response, dude.

 

Nyn, you're exaggerating on many of those points.  And you know as well as anybody how I engage Leelou to get a read on her.  I've gotten reads fast once in a while, but it is usually a process.

 

Actually, it's pretty crap that you're just deciding to call that BS.  I've been reading Leelou (mostly accurately, by the way) the same damn way for over 5 years.  I don't give 2 buckets of monkey piss if you think I'm BSing by saying I expect different answers from her.  I've said it in many past games - feel free to go digging to prove yourself wrong.

 

Except this time you were hinting that she was scum - and you did it more than once ... and you were wrong...

 

 

Indeed he was wrong. But her responses to him were poor, so it makes sense that he would get it wrong, especially so early in day 1.

[dicetosser1]

 

 

My gut says Kivam is scum.

 

I think he's focusing on the wrong sort of things and pushing arguments that aren't alignment indicative but dressing them up as if they are.

Ditto.  Womby says I may be reading into it too much and that's how he plays but I can't shake the sense that he isn't town. 

 

 

 

 

Okay, so, all of the SK talk so far revolves around the fact that several players believe Wombat to be the SK.

 

I'm obviously one of those that suspect he is.

 

What do y'all think about this possibility?

 

 

I think Wombat is town. Said this before but I dont think he does the whole "Follow Me!!" thing as anything else.

 

One thing im not interested in... trying to individualise the SK as opposed to the mafia. To me they are all scum and need to go. Dont care which is which as long as that happens

[Nynaeve]

 

 

Disinterested? No, your case came up during the weekend where I was gone - a thing I even stated in thread before I was gone. I'm not disinterested, I haven't been available to respond. You should know this though, you are the one who did the ISO on me and presumably read all of my posts.

 

 

Presumably. Maybe I didn't. Who knows?!  MYSTERY

 

 

Oh so you were cherry-picking the posts that sound bad to you and ignoring the ones that don't?

 

 

I'm pretty sure I referred to most of your content, if not all of it. Next time I'll be sure to mark down your availability in my calender 

[WWWwombat]

Vote Count D2.12:

Verbarm (4): Nyn [#2192], Saladtosser [#2202], Darthe [#2224], Pral [#2500]
Kivam (2): Wombat [#2198], AJ [#2373]
Pral (1): Thane [#1931]
Deslami (1): DPR [#2316]
AJ (1): Kivam [#2365]
DPR (1): Deslami [#2527]

Unvote (1): Cass [#2187]

Not Voting (5): Hallia, Krak, Rags, Tress, Verbarm

At the gallows: Verbarm

Reminder: players not voting at EOD will be voting for themselves.

[Nynaeve]

You posted a reply to me, which fell considerably short, said you weren't gonna comment about anything Verbal did..... and didn't engage any of the other people that were voting for you as well. So yes. That seems disinterested to me.

[Barmacral]

 

 

 

Disinterested? No, your case came up during the weekend where I was gone - a thing I even stated in thread before I was gone. I'm not disinterested, I haven't been available to respond. You should know this though, you are the one who did the ISO on me and presumably read all of my posts.

 

 

Presumably. Maybe I didn't. Who knows?!  MYSTERY

 

 

Oh so you were cherry-picking the posts that sound bad to you and ignoring the ones that don't?

 

 

I'm pretty sure I referred to most of your content, if not all of it. Next time I'll be sure to mark down your availability in my calender 

 

 

Note it if you're going to complain about it.

 

You posted a reply to me, which fell considerably short, said you weren't gonna comment about anything Verbal did..... and didn't engage any of the other people that were voting for you as well. So yes. That seems disinterested to me.

 

Time factor, as stated. I've been here when I can today, and except for Darthe all the votes have been "Lets follow Nyn's bandwagon"

[Cass]

 

 

Wow, that was a good response, dude.

 

Nyn, you're exaggerating on many of those points.  And you know as well as anybody how I engage Leelou to get a read on her.  I've gotten reads fast once in a while, but it is usually a process.

 

Actually, it's pretty crap that you're just deciding to call that BS.  I've been reading Leelou (mostly accurately, by the way) the same damn way for over 5 years.  I don't give 2 buckets of monkey piss if you think I'm BSing by saying I expect different answers from her.  I've said it in many past games - feel free to go digging to prove yourself wrong.

 

Except this time you were hinting that she was scum - and you did it more than once ... and you were wrong...

 

 

Indeed he was wrong. But her responses to him were poor, so it makes sense that he would get it wrong, especially so early in day 1.

 

 

Barm and Verb - this was all at the same time as instigating a mislynch against Sili  ... gotta admit that's sus.

 

 

 

@Des - I don't understand this backflip on your vote - please explain why you're not feeling it the same.

The stakes etc re DPR and Kiv have not changed at all, but you were fine with voting Verbarm over either of them yesterday. I agree with you that they both need further investigation - I just don't think we've analysed them enough/or that they would have made enough mistakes at this point if they were scum. I have a strong wolf feel from Kiv, and only slightly less on DPR, but neither of them are as developed as the one I have for Verbarm now. Please explain what you think has changed - on THEM, not other players who may/may not also be wolf.

[Verbal32]

Me in red.

 

I've only managed to do Verbal's ISO so far. I will try to do Barm's a bit later but no promises. Got a bit of a migrane. 
 
 
Verbal ISO
 

 
So his OP as far as I can see is quoting Salami and calling him scum.  In these quotes it's basically Salami calling Lee's 'sup' a townie post and him asking Thane if he's scum. First of all his lack of humorous entrance to the game kinda sticks out to me. I haven't gone into the trouble of searching through all of his games to verify, but from memory, he usually does come in with a jokey manner and builds up to seriousness. So this should be noted.
 
He got his humourous entrance in our QT. Might be why he didn't do it in game.  True, but not entering the game with a joke is quite a big stretch.  Quite.
 
Secondly, we just came out of the Firefly game where I built a case on Salami and pointed him doing the exact same thing (he ended up being town). Ie starting off the game throwing town reads for stupid reasons and asking people if they’re scum as if they’d actually tell him if they were. Is it redundant play? Sure. But Salami does this as town. Verbal is aware of it and it feels a tad opportunistic that he’s trying to use salami’s typical bad play to push him right off the bat.
 
Or Verb could be treating it as a new game where Salami's actions don't necessarily reflect what his alignment/role were in another game. Obviously I can't comment on Verb's meta knowledge.  Too much meta, Nyn.  You rely too much.
 
Salami of course says he is not scum. And Verb nudges him again with… okay, so SK? Lectures Thane about reading the rules after he shows amazement at Yates’ claim.
 
Verbal engages Yaetes about the 3 amigo thing and doesn’t get how it’s crossing a line if one of them could just fib on it if they rolled scum. Keeps on the convo with him saying that if he can’t lie to AJ and Dice with this shtick then they prolly can’t be friends. I am getting a bad feeling from the exchange. I feel like Verbal gave him the opening to say that he was incapable of lying to them , polishing his image of being a great humanitarian lol  Then they sort of diss each other a bit. Meh.
 
You got a bad  feeling means nothing here. Verb wasn't "giving" yates a chance to say anything though, the questioning was quite legitimate.  Nyn, you make no sense here.  How am I giving Yates an opening?  I have no idea what you're trying to portray here.....
 
Darthe questions how come Verbal hasn’t brought him up yet. Verbal says he’s not cool enough. Lol
 
Verbal thought this was a weird comment by Darthe as Verb stated in the QT that he has never focused on Darthe in the first bit of a game like Darthe claimed. Correct - I made note of it.  Not on thread, but in hydrachat.
 
Then more exchange with Yates where he tells him he has honor and won’t lie if he rolled scum. Verbal says he doesn’t wanna spam the thread about it, yet he keeps talking about it. States the whole thing doesn’t make sense to him but that he sees his point. Whaaa? Lol
 
Here let me share the quote so you can read it again. Maybe it'll make sense to you this time. It really isn't a stretch:
 

 

 

 

Wait....you can't lie to Dice with your inside joke to win a mafia game?  You might be too nice for us to be friends.

It's not about being nice. You've met me. I can be called many things but "nice" isn't one of them. It's about having something called HONOR. Get some.

 

 
I don't think this really makes sense, though.  I don't want to spam the thread about it, but you're saying you won't use your inside joke to lie as scum.  I don't equate that with having honor.  But I see your point.

 

 
Then again says, yeah lets not derail…. But keeps going about it not having anything to do with honor. Blab la bla. I tell ya, for someone who’s allegedly trying to drop it, he’s certainly going on and on about it.
 
Oh you mean the very next post Verbal made where he told Yates they could discuss it post game and then left the topic alone? Yeah, that really is going on and on and on and on and on about it.  This is one of those stretches, Nyn.  You are exaggerating big time, here.  I understand Yates' point about honor, but not how it works in a game situation like he described.  Simple.
 
Then Verbal posts ONE spiderman meme. FOUR minutes later Arsis slaps him with a vote with the lame excuse that Lee said once that he’s scum when he posts spiderman memes. Now I admit that me already having a scum read on Pral/Arsis slot might be making me biased but come on. This looks like a blatant set up where Verbal is giving Arsis room for distancing. He posts ONE meme and Arsis posts minutes later, jumping up his throat over it? Please. Ladies and gentleman, this feels like a DUH moment. HUGE ASS FoS.
 
Huge FoS on Verb doing something he does every game for something that Arsis chose to do? The only DUH moment here is when you realise how ridiculous your comment is, regardless of Arsis's alignment. Which btw I'm in agreement with Des and Wombat, I think the Yates flip cleared him pretty well and he is unlikely to be scum.  My God Nyn, I'm going to skip this part.  You have a huge FoS for that?!
 
Verbal responds with… hey didn’t you just see TownVerb post a bunch of spidey memes in a previous game?  He never actually gets a response from Arsis about this, btw. Nor asks for it again.Instead Verb immediately jumps Leelou when she says that him spamming with spidey memes is a red flag. Remember, up until this point Verbal only posted TWO spidey memes. Ie Leelou wasn’t actually FoSing him here. Just stating a FACT.
Anyways. Verbal is claims that what Leelou said is a ping. That she knows the amount of memes posted is proportional to the atmosphere of the thread and NOT alignment indicative. 
 
So Leelou responds with. You’re known to bury the thread with spidey memes when you’re scum. He responds with “Really? Can you help me remember when I did this?”. Lee responds it was a while ago, while Des mentions he did it when they were both scummies. He says Des wins points and Lee lost points. Of course this whole exchange means Verbal is full of it. As Des indicated and Verbal himself confirmed, spamming spidey memes IS alignment indicative. So his earlier responses to Leelou were a lie. He can claim that this was a test reaction to Leelou because he might not have foreseen Des interjecting… but at this point it just looks bad. Leelou’s flip makes it look worse. Anyways, he decides to give Des brownie points that redeem his feelings about Salami.  >.>
 
Verb and Leelou are quite open about being able to read each other in the game, and Verb has a specific style of trying to gauge Leelou and figure out her alignment. You're the meta person here, this is something you should be aware of. Also did you read the context? Leelou's response to him was "it was a while ago", where Des was able to pinpoint which game it happened in. Of course Des would gain points and Leelou would lose some. Scum or town, it was a bad response from her.  I already addressed this.  Nyn knows I treat Leelou differently, and that she does the same for me.  Barm is 100% correct here in his response for me.
 
Verbal moves on to nudging Thane. Thane suggested a salami/Verbal scum team as a reactionary test and Verbal questions if he was really testing them and developing reads or doing it for the sake of doing it. Seems like an empty exchange. As in… Thane said it… no one reacted…  Verbal admitted to skimming Thane’s post and missing it. So why is he suddenly turning it around on Thane? Not following him at all. Thane says he might have odd methods but at least he’s trying. Verbal is all woah! Don’t get defensive. I’m just trying to understand! Keeps this seemingly meaningless exchange with Thane. I don’t know, I don’t feel like he’s really trying to pick Thane’s brain. I feel like he’s padding his thread presence. 
 
Then he says, and I quote “Well, I didn't say much about it because I was on your case for "silly stuff" last game and you were town.  Due to me misreading you, I'd rather sit back and observe more.” This is a lie. Earlier he told Thane he didn’t react to the suggestion because he skimmed through his posts and missed it. Now he’s saying he did see it but experience from past games held him back and he rather sit back and observe? I bet he does. FoS!
 

Yeah I got nothing on this one. I have no idea why he did that.  Me neither, lol.  I'd have to re-read this section, maybe there is something not included here that makes sense.  Or maybe I got my wires crossed.  I'm not sure, either.  But seeing as this is the only part of a big ISO I'm not sure on, you think this qualifies the lynch?  Hell no.

 
Then he backs up Barm about having notes as if that means anything. Noted. Then he agrees with Arsis when he says that he’s yet to see a game where Thane doesn't get called scum day 1. And that he votes for him every time and he's town 99% of the time. Okay. Still don’t get what’s the point of that being brought up, as I said at the time. Still remains unclear. Keeps discussing with Salami how to read Thane. Arsis jumps in to soft defend Verbal and says he’s the one who brought up all the Thane talk and Verbal just commented.  Arsis FoSes me and says it looks like scum taking a hard stance on something to seem like they’re doing something. Verbal AGREES with him. Really? Don’t recall him following up on this FoS of me.
 
He agreed on it being scummy, but was still neutral about you on the whole. He didn't follow up because he wasn't looking to lynch you.  Yep.  And I kinda went MIA for my trip.  Taking hard stances early can easily be seen as scum looking like they're doing something - why is this such a leap?
 
Then Krak asks him what is his angle on Thane. Verbal says he has none. So, he spent a handful of posts talking about Thane, his meta, previous games. But when asked about it he says he has no angle. So… what’s the point of this discussion? Is he town reading Thane? Is he scum reading Thane? Oh so he’s reading him as Null? Then why the whole Thane talk? I just don’t follow AT ALL and he obviously didn't infer anything from the conversation so I don't get what gives.
 
Null read.
 
Fluff about vote tags.
 
Dice walks in at some point and says he gets what Yates is talking about (honor bla bla). Verbal replies with: Well at least SOMEBODY does. So trying to look confused? I mean he did have an exchange with Yates. Said he got his point. So shooting for the confused townie isn’t a good look for him. Lee said just nod and smile. And then he asks her if SHE knows what this is all about. 
 
Quote is up above still in case you want to re-read it and finally figure out what Verb actually said instead of just deciding arbitrarily that he's contradicting himself (I promise it isn't that hard to understand).  Wow.
 
Then Darthe questions him about the whole thing with Lee and her response about the memes. Verbal gives the garbage response of how he expects Lee to answer differently than other people. BS, BS and more BS. What she said was either true or false. He confirmed what Des said. Plus we now know she was town.  He’s backtracking. On what universe should he expect Lee to say anything that isn’t the truth? Lol  Like seriously? Wombat nudges Verbal about the same as Darthe did. Verbal directs him to his response to Darthe and says that’s his weird complicated way of accurately reading Leelou. Apparently not. :P
 
I know for a fact you've seen this 'weirdly complicated' method of trying to read Leelou in at least one other game where you were a hydra with her, so you screaming BS is the real BS.  I already addressed this. 
 
When Darthe calls him out about saying he’s going to observe he says that he already posted a bunch and some people haven’t even checked in. So he felt comfortable sitting back an observing.  He did post quite a bit but there wasn’t much content to it aside from the Thane talk, fluff and his thick prod at Lee. He hasn’t really talked about much else. And he didn’t even end up getting a lean on Thane after the whole Thane talk… so like… what content does he feel like he shared with the rest of us that he can now go have a nap? Lol
 
When leelou asks him if he’s gonna address her uneasiness about him he replies with: I hope so and lols. Erm. Okay?  The above is just you typing without saying anything.  I had maybe 50 posts in early D1 - I wanted to slow down a bit.  People hadn't even started up yet - that can't be too hard to understand.
 
Then Verbal calls out Kivam’s vote on Silli, says it’s confirmed that he didn’t read the OP and that there are vigs with NK as well. This is prolly the only actual good point he made since the game started. He quotes the setup to Kivam. Then throws a one liner post of Silli is prolly town. He didn’t interact with him or spoke of him at any point. Then he throws that comment and doesn’t explain why. Ironic considering he walked into the game FoSing Salami for doing the very same thing. Lol
 
More fluff.
 
Makes a good point against Kivam’s vote on Sili. That makes two good points and a gazillion pings. Neat.  A gazillion, eh?  Do YOU know townies that play 100% clean games?  I'd love to meet one.  THE CLEANEST PLAYERS ARE THE SCUM, NOT THE ONES MAKING LITTLE MISTAKES.  You should learn that.
 
Then he doesn’t post for about a day and a half and when he does resurface, he cherry picks a post of Krak where he asks dice why did he feel the need to explain his unvote on Cass. He asks him why he felt the need to ask that. Seems like a random post to respond to, personally. At the time it seemed odd to me that he missed a day and a half and chose that as the ONLY thing to respond to. Comes across like… oops I haven’t posted in a while… need to post something so no one would notice me slanking.
 
He's a busy man, not super tons of time available, as evidenced by my responding to this for him.
 
Anyways later he reiterates that he doesn’t like Kivam’s vote on Sili (for like the third time.... we got it) and that he’s not defending Sili, but attacking Kivam’s reasoning behind the vote.
 
Then he stopped posting cause of his business trip.

 

[Barmacral]

I've been trying to scan through the thread as much as I can over the last little while but now I have to head to bed. I'm not a fan of any of the lynch candidates up there but between the Andrej / Kivam spat earlier I definitely see Kivam's logic a lot more than Andrej who just looks like he is desperately attempting to discredit Kivam and OMGUS him. Same as in Day 1 actually.

 

[v]##Andrej[/v]

 

If he has time Verb can come and change it later.

[Nynaeve]

Verbal, paint it how you like. You SAID that amount of memes you post correlated to thread atmosphere and are NOT alignment indicative. Leelou said this wasn't true. You then said she was wrong and asked her for an example of a game where this was exhibited. Then when Des said that as his scummate you drowned the thread with memes.... your confirmed this to be true. IE you LIED.

 

You also lied when you were conversing with Thane. You said you must have missed his suggestion that you could be scum with Des/Salami. And then later on you said you did see it but didn't respond.

 

These are two instances where you blatantly lied.

[Verbal32]

 

Wow, that was a good response, dude.

 

Nyn, you're exaggerating on many of those points.  And you know as well as anybody how I engage Leelou to get a read on her.  I've gotten reads fast once in a while, but it is usually a process.

 

Actually, it's pretty crap that you're just deciding to call that BS.  I've been reading Leelou (mostly accurately, by the way) the same damn way for over 5 years.  I don't give 2 buckets of monkey piss if you think I'm BSing by saying I expect different answers from her.  I've said it in many past games - feel free to go digging to prove yourself wrong.

 

Except this time you were hinting that she was scum - and you did it more than once ... and you were wrong...

 

 

Yes, I was.  I had a couple dozen posts to work with, and my early sense was "suspicious".  That evolves as time goes on - I'm usually solid on her by D2.  We never got there with me leaving and her dying.

[Nynaeve]

I'll read your responses to my ISO when I finish eating. 

[WWWwombat]

[v]AJ[/v]

[WWWwombat]

[v]##AJ[/v]

[hazelkrs1]

Cass - SoC posts just make me think there is EXTREMELY little chance she is ever scum here. Also her paranoia seems genuine.

Nyn - often find myself disagreeing with her suspects, but I think her pushes are still genuine

Pray - liked his recent reads list, and also think Yates wasn't bussing in his push on Pray

Rags - whereas some started wasting time with NA speculation, he went right back into Yates spew and I liked his analysis and WIM overall.

AJ - slightly associative but also feel his push on Kivam looks genuine no matter what Kivam's alignment ends up being

 

Krak - town read from yesterday, and in general I find his involvement to be townleaning. Kinda sporadic activity levels tho.

Darthe - like his posts lately. He isn't letting himself get sucked into antitown arguments Kiv and DPR keep pushing. Seems to show genuine interest in lynching actual scum.

VerBarm - might be high for them, but their recent responses don't look bad imo. Think if they were scum Verb would be scrambling in a more desperate manner to clear himself

 

Tress - muddled here since I thought Yates spew pointed to him distancing from Tress, and also thought she might have been buddying me. But eh, Pray's spew analysis makes sense as well

Hallia - wish she was participating more

Dice - what has he been doing this game? Why can't I recall like, anything from him?

 

Wombat - still think his EOD push yesterday was scummy, and also think my point about his tone changing ever since being townread early on is still valid. Have kept something in my pocket irt him as well

Thane - he's like the opposite of Darthe lately in the sense that he does NOT seem that interested in lynching scum today. His defense of Wombat looks disingenuous (town Thane isn't normally that certain of town reads) as does his push on Pray

DPR - hypocrite since he earlier tried to say others were painting this situation as "old gen vs new gen" yet that's exactly what he's been wasting his time talking about as much as possible most the game- that his "old gen" type approach used logic better and thus is more useful (even tho he's mostly wasted time on NA speculation which isn't really as productive at ALL in helping to catch scum)

Kivam - his push on AJ seems entirely disingenuous to me, looks like scum!Kivam trying to sell a bale of bad fish. Trying to cling to one minor point and pretend like it's a much bigger deal than it is. Also has wasted more of town's time talking about dubious and unproductive matters than anyone else in the game, essentially making him the most antitown player in the game

 

Obvious disclaimer here - SK could technically be hiding amongst my clears possibly, but even then it would still just be one misclear. Some of these are kinda on a whim as well, but I feel confident in most of em

[Verbal32]

Verbal, paint it how you like. You SAID that amount of memes you post correlated to thread atmosphere and are NOT alignment indicative. Leelou said this wasn't true. You then said she was wrong and asked her for an example of a game where this was exhibited. Then when Des said that as his scummate you drowned the thread with memes.... your confirmed this to be true. IE you LIED.

 

You also lied when you were conversing with Thane. You said you must have missed his suggestion that you could be scum with Des/Salami. And then later on you said you did see it but didn't respond.

 

These are two instances where you blatantly lied.

 

OMG.  Leelou said I've done it before.  Des recalled a specific time I did do it.  Let me all caps the next sentence to be clear:  THAT DOESN'T MEAN I LIED.  I don't always drown the thread in Spidey memes when I'm scum.  I did it a couple times, ok.  I've been scum a hell of a lot more times than that, and not done it.  That's the point.

 

I'm not lying.

 

 

The thing with Thane is probably me being wrong or making a mistake - big difference from lying.  You are confbiasing that into a lie.  Or just flat out lying yourself.  Take your pick.

 

 

I'll say it again in case it was lost in my ISO responses:  townies are not usually squeaky clean - they have lots of little mistakes in there.  Nothing you've pointed out are huge.  Just a couple small things that in one case is not lying and I stand by me not spamming Spidey when scum - I've done it as town, too..........and the other is probably me just making a mistake.

 

Scum are cleaner than town when you look back.  Always.  You should remember that.

[WWWwombat]

Cass - SoC posts just make me think there is EXTREMELY little chance she is ever scum here. Also her paranoia seems genuine.

Nyn - often find myself disagreeing with her suspects, but I think her pushes are still genuine

Pray - liked his recent reads list, and also think Yates wasn't bussing in his push on Pray

Rags - whereas some started wasting time with NA speculation, he went right back into Yates spew and I liked his analysis and WIM overall.

AJ - slightly associative but also feel his push on Kivam looks genuine no matter what Kivam's alignment ends up being

 

Krak - town read from yesterday, and in general I find his involvement to be townleaning. Kinda sporadic activity levels tho.

Darthe - like his posts lately. He isn't letting himself get sucked into antitown arguments Kiv and DPR keep pushing. Seems to show genuine interest in lynching actual scum.

VerBarm - might be high for them, but their recent responses don't look bad imo. Think if they were scum Verb would be scrambling in a more desperate manner to clear himself

 

Tress - muddled here since I thought Yates spew pointed to him distancing from Tress, and also thought she might have been buddying me. But eh, Pray's spew analysis makes sense as well

Hallia - wish she was participating more

Dice - what has he been doing this game? Why can't I recall like, anything from him?

 

Wombat - still think his EOD push yesterday was scummy, and also think my point about his tone changing ever since being townread early on is still valid. Have kept something in my pocket irt him as well

Thane - he's like the opposite of Darthe lately in the sense that he does NOT seem that interested in lynching scum today. His defense of Wombat looks disingenuous (town Thane isn't normally that certain of town reads) as does his push on Pray

DPR - hypocrite since he earlier tried to say others were painting this situation as "old gen vs new gen" yet that's exactly what he's been wasting his time talking about as much as possible most the game- that his "old gen" type approach used logic better and thus is more useful (even tho he's mostly wasted time on NA speculation which isn't really as productive at ALL in helping to catch scum)

Kivam - his push on AJ seems entirely disingenuous to me, looks like scum!Kivam trying to sell a bale of bad fish. Trying to cling to one minor point and pretend like it's a much bigger deal than it is. Also has wasted more of town's time talking about dubious and unproductive matters than anyone else in the game, essentially making him the most antitown player in the game

 

Obvious disclaimer here - SK could technically be hiding amongst my clears possibly, but even then it would still just be one misclear. Some of these are kinda on a whim as well, but I feel confident in most of em

 

50% of your scum reads blow chunks.

[Nynaeve]

So Verbal's official response is that I'm reaching. Noted lol

[WWWwombat]

Yo Verb, who you got for scum?

[hazelkrs1]

@Des - I don't understand this backflip on your vote - please explain why you're not feeling it the same.

The stakes etc re DPR and Kiv have not changed at all, but you were fine with voting Verbarm over either of them yesterday. I agree with you that they both need further investigation - I just don't think we've analysed them enough/or that they would have made enough mistakes at this point if they were scum. I have a strong wolf feel from Kiv, and only slightly less on DPR, but neither of them are as developed as the one I have for Verbarm now. Please explain what you think has changed - on THEM, not other players who may/may not also be wolf.

 

Don't remember being fine with voting VerBarm over either of them yesterday... and I also in general don't get why you think they'd be a better lynch than either Kivam or DPR, two people of which you've expressed doubt over for long stages of the game

 

I've been trying to scan through the thread as much as I can over the last little while but now I have to head to bed. I'm not a fan of any of the lynch candidates up there but between the Andrej / Kivam spat earlier I definitely see Kivam's logic a lot more than Andrej who just looks like he is desperately attempting to discredit Kivam and OMGUS him. Same as in Day 1 actually.

 

[v]##Andrej[/v]

 

If he has time Verb can come and change it later.

 

This lowers my townread of you considerably Barm

 

You think that just because AJ said a SK might have holstered (while in the midst of a discussion he himself said was stupid and continuously tried to detach from), that makes him scum somehow? I agree a SK basically holsters never here without fear of a Tracker or anything, but it was a pointless discussion to begin with and I don't think it's a scumslip and def doesn't have any scum motivation in putting out a weak argument like that

 

All this, and Kivam acting like this makes AJ the best lynch and you don't see anything weird with Kivam there?

 

[v]##Kivam[/v]

[hazelkrs1]

 

Cass - SoC posts just make me think there is EXTREMELY little chance she is ever scum here. Also her paranoia seems genuine.

Nyn - often find myself disagreeing with her suspects, but I think her pushes are still genuine

Pray - liked his recent reads list, and also think Yates wasn't bussing in his push on Pray

Rags - whereas some started wasting time with NA speculation, he went right back into Yates spew and I liked his analysis and WIM overall.

AJ - slightly associative but also feel his push on Kivam looks genuine no matter what Kivam's alignment ends up being

 

Krak - town read from yesterday, and in general I find his involvement to be townleaning. Kinda sporadic activity levels tho.

Darthe - like his posts lately. He isn't letting himself get sucked into antitown arguments Kiv and DPR keep pushing. Seems to show genuine interest in lynching actual scum.

VerBarm - might be high for them, but their recent responses don't look bad imo. Think if they were scum Verb would be scrambling in a more desperate manner to clear himself

 

Tress - muddled here since I thought Yates spew pointed to him distancing from Tress, and also thought she might have been buddying me. But eh, Pray's spew analysis makes sense as well

Hallia - wish she was participating more

Dice - what has he been doing this game? Why can't I recall like, anything from him?

 

Wombat - still think his EOD push yesterday was scummy, and also think my point about his tone changing ever since being townread early on is still valid. Have kept something in my pocket irt him as well

Thane - he's like the opposite of Darthe lately in the sense that he does NOT seem that interested in lynching scum today. His defense of Wombat looks disingenuous (town Thane isn't normally that certain of town reads) as does his push on Pray

DPR - hypocrite since he earlier tried to say others were painting this situation as "old gen vs new gen" yet that's exactly what he's been wasting his time talking about as much as possible most the game- that his "old gen" type approach used logic better and thus is more useful (even tho he's mostly wasted time on NA speculation which isn't really as productive at ALL in helping to catch scum)

Kivam - his push on AJ seems entirely disingenuous to me, looks like scum!Kivam trying to sell a bale of bad fish. Trying to cling to one minor point and pretend like it's a much bigger deal than it is. Also has wasted more of town's time talking about dubious and unproductive matters than anyone else in the game, essentially making him the most antitown player in the game

 

Obvious disclaimer here - SK could technically be hiding amongst my clears possibly, but even then it would still just be one misclear. Some of these are kinda on a whim as well, but I feel confident in most of em

 

50% of your scum reads blow chunks.

 

 

Which 2?

 

And why are you so generally unhelpful this game? Way I figure it it HAS to be one of two possibilities:

 

1. You're scum

2. You're trying to show off for Kivam and DPR (hence the Cromwell schtick)

 

Which is it Wombat?

[Hallia]

 

 

Cass - SoC posts just make me think there is EXTREMELY little chance she is ever scum here. Also her paranoia seems genuine.

Nyn - often find myself disagreeing with her suspects, but I think her pushes are still genuine

Pray - liked his recent reads list, and also think Yates wasn't bussing in his push on Pray

Rags - whereas some started wasting time with NA speculation, he went right back into Yates spew and I liked his analysis and WIM overall.

AJ - slightly associative but also feel his push on Kivam looks genuine no matter what Kivam's alignment ends up being

 

Krak - town read from yesterday, and in general I find his involvement to be townleaning. Kinda sporadic activity levels tho.

Darthe - like his posts lately. He isn't letting himself get sucked into antitown arguments Kiv and DPR keep pushing. Seems to show genuine interest in lynching actual scum.

VerBarm - might be high for them, but their recent responses don't look bad imo. Think if they were scum Verb would be scrambling in a more desperate manner to clear himself

 

Tress - muddled here since I thought Yates spew pointed to him distancing from Tress, and also thought she might have been buddying me. But eh, Pray's spew analysis makes sense as well

Hallia - wish she was participating more

Dice - what has he been doing this game? Why can't I recall like, anything from him?

 

Wombat - still think his EOD push yesterday was scummy, and also think my point about his tone changing ever since being townread early on is still valid. Have kept something in my pocket irt him as well

Thane - he's like the opposite of Darthe lately in the sense that he does NOT seem that interested in lynching scum today. His defense of Wombat looks disingenuous (town Thane isn't normally that certain of town reads) as does his push on Pray

DPR - hypocrite since he earlier tried to say others were painting this situation as "old gen vs new gen" yet that's exactly what he's been wasting his time talking about as much as possible most the game- that his "old gen" type approach used logic better and thus is more useful (even tho he's mostly wasted time on NA speculation which isn't really as productive at ALL in helping to catch scum)

Kivam - his push on AJ seems entirely disingenuous to me, looks like scum!Kivam trying to sell a bale of bad fish. Trying to cling to one minor point and pretend like it's a much bigger deal than it is. Also has wasted more of town's time talking about dubious and unproductive matters than anyone else in the game, essentially making him the most antitown player in the game

 

Obvious disclaimer here - SK could technically be hiding amongst my clears possibly, but even then it would still just be one misclear. Some of these are kinda on a whim as well, but I feel confident in most of em

50% of your scum reads blow chunks.

NO YOU

 

But seriously, I rather like a lot of these reads. At work, so I'll be continuing my catch up today after work but I'm trying to follow currently on phone