Callandor question

[athrian]

I think this might have been answered somewhere else, but I wasn't able to find the thread, so I'm hoping that someone here might be able to help me.

 

I know there have been several theories about what Callandor's purpose is, other than being a powerful sa'angreal. Some of these theories revolve around Callandor's flaw of not having a buffer against drawing too much of the OP, and how that might tie in to resealing the DO or defeating Moridin. However, didn't RJ say in an interview that the buffering flaw was just a simple manufacturing flaw and wasn't intended?

 

If that's the case, then wouldn't it mean that Callandor either has some other special property we don't know about yet? There's obviously something special about it, since it's mentioned several times (directly or indirectly) in prophecies. If the flaw wasn't something intentional though, then that would mean that particular aspect isn't tied to how it needs to be used in the Last Battle, correct?

[Morden]

Its essentially Excalibur + Merlins lucky jock strap.

 

When someone channels through it, it turns into a sword of Light, brighter than balefire. Fits well with it being the Sword of the Lord of the Morning.

 

The only thing I can think of that would make Callendor truly special would be is somehow it can forge Saidar and Saidin into the True Source, not merely a derivative of the True Source, but true union the real deal, the power of creation. I dont see how it could work with True Power, something very few knew existed(So how would they add it to Callandor) and something which neither LTT or Rand would wish to touch.

 

Thats assuming that it isnt more simple than that, and that Callandor trust into the Bore wont somehow seal it.

[Ishkur]

I have always wondered about it being "The sword that isn't a sword"... Like you athrian, I have wondered if it has some property that has been missed by everyone, something that can't be used to destroy other things. Maybe create, maybe heal, but not a weapon. The buffer thing I think will play into this, maybe Rand will burn himself out or someone else... But I think there might be a bit more to this.

[XoMeltdownoX]

I have always wondered about it being "The sword that isn't a sword"... Like you athrian, I have wondered if it has some property that has been missed by everyone, something that can't be used to destroy other things. Maybe create, maybe heal, but not a weapon. The buffer thing I think will play into this, maybe Rand will burn himself out or someone else... But I think there might be a bit more to this.

Actually it is used as a weapon. In the Stone, Rand uses it to create a Shadowspawn killing ball of lightning weave.

[Ishkur]

I have always wondered about it being "The sword that isn't a sword"... Like you athrian, I have wondered if it has some property that has been missed by everyone, something that can't be used to destroy other things. Maybe create, maybe heal, but not a weapon. The buffer thing I think will play into this, maybe Rand will burn himself out or someone else... But I think there might be a bit more to this.

Actually it is used as a weapon. In the Stone, Rand uses it to create a Shadowspawn killing ball of lightning weave.

I'm not saying it can't be used as a weapon or a sword, rather it can do something beyond those things, or maybe in addition to those things.

[athrian]

Its essentially Excalibur + Merlins lucky jock strap.

 

When someone channels through it, it turns into a sword of Light, brighter than balefire. Fits well with it being the Sword of the Lord of the Morning.

 

The only thing I can think of that would make Callendor truly special would be is somehow it can forge Saidar and Saidin into the True Source, not merely a derivative of the True Source, but true union the real deal, the power of creation. I dont see how it could work with True Power, something very few knew existed(So how would they add it to Callandor) and something which neither LTT or Rand would wish to touch.

 

Thats assuming that it isnt more simple than that, and that Callandor trust into the Bore wont somehow seal it.

 

I had thought for awhile that Callandor was merely symbolic, that it was just a really powerful sa'angreal and the sword shape was meant for it to be used in a battle by a leader like LTT. With the scrutiny though that Min has been giving the prophecies, and the fact the buffer issue was brought up several times and theories have built up, I thought maybe I missed something. Thanks.

[Vassili]

Just because the "flaw" was not intended by Callandor's original manufacturers does not mean it wasn't intended by the Pattern.

 

That being said, the flaw alone may not be what makes Callandor special. In the begin of tDR Rand has a dream about Callandor where it speaks to him. Paraphrasing as best I can, it says, "Whoever wields me, wields destiny. Take me, and begin the final journey." I think an interesting question is, where did that voice come from? Was it speaking symbolically, or does Callandor really weave destiny? Did Rand begin the final journey the moment he laid hands on Callandor's hilt, or is the "final journey" something to come? Maybe I'm reading too much into it.

[shortkut]

I thought Ishy influenced his dreams then

[Pinzarn]

I thought Ishy influenced his dreams then

 

I might be off on the timing, but I thought that was post-Ishy and pre-Moridin.

[Rubberninja]

I've been convinced for a while now, that callandors extra properties tie in with the power of ta'veren, and the "bind him by twain" does not reffer to two women linked with Rand, but the vicinity of Mat and Perrin.

All in all I am looking forward to reading when Rand decides to have Aviendha be the second female to link with him when using it along with Nynaeve. (Rand mentions Aviendtha as one of two options when asking Nynaeve to be there with him at Shayol Ghul).. Mix in Aviendtha's Talent for reading ter'angreal, I'm sure Rand will pick her, and said Talent will work on Callandor aswell... only, Callandor is a _sword_ even if it's not a sword.. Mark my words, there's good reading ahead.

 

PS. there's a passage read aloud that goes something like: Light is held before the maw of darkness, and all that he is can be seized. Wether this reffers to the dark side seizing controll of the fisher (Rand) again, or the true powers of the lights champion can be seized by Rand, who knows?

Ideally I expect Moiraine to start preaching ta'veren powers to Rand again after her Return, just as she did all the way to the Eye of the World back in the first book, along with whatever answers she got in Finnhol.

 

Edit for Pinzarn: Book 3 and Rands dreams about Callandor was still the Era of Ishamael, after Rand poked him with the sword and got poked with the stick, but before Ishamaels first actual death and reincarnation as Moridin. (his body was the one found after the battle of the Stone.)

[Pinzarn]

All in all I am looking forward to reading when Rand decides to have Aviendha be the second female to link with him when using it along with Nynaeve. (Rand mentions Aviendtha as one of two options when asking Nynaeve to be there with him at Shayol Ghul).. Mix in Aviendtha's Talent for reading ter'angreal, I'm sure Rand will pick her, and said Talent will work on Callandor aswell... only, Callandor is a _sword_ even if it's not a sword.. Mark my words, there's good reading ahead.

 

Thanks for the timing aspect.

 

Your quote above just gave me a lightbulb moment. Min is still trying to figure out Callandor. Rand, Min, and Avi are all at FoM, and Avi is looking for Rand. I think she is going to find Rand with Min and Callandor. Even though Callandor is a sword (ie anti-Aiel weapon), Avi will pick it up and receive a reading off of it. While it won't be the exact answer, it will be the trigger for Min to complete her answer and how Rand can best use Callandor.

 

I always thought Avi's talent for identifying the use of ter'angrel a bit of a throw-away talent, but I can see this use as being the reason for the talent.

 

My other thought is that Rand and Avi will be getting "familiar" again and Avi will accidently touch Rand's "sword that isn't a sword" and receive the reading that way.

[mockeryjones]

My guess. Callandor can also serve as a saangreal for channelling the TP. Through it, the three powers (Saidar, Saidin, and the TP) become one.

 

Also, In the TDR final battle between Ishmael and Rand, Callandor fends off balefire. Not sure how it that is managed, could be an inconsistency in the rules of the world, but still there it is.

[hjustinpace]

My guess. Callandor can also serve as a saangreal for channelling the TP. Through it, the three powers (Saidar, Saidin, and the TP) become one.

 

Also, In the TDR final battle between Ishmael and Rand, Callandor fends off balefire. Not sure how it that is managed, could be an inconsistency in the rules of the world, but still there it is.

 

IIRC, that happened in TAR, so it was consistent with what Perrin did in ToM.

[Vassili]

Ehh, we don't really know what Callandor is made of. We already know one material that resists Balefire. Its not a stretch to assume there are other exotic materials that can do the same thing.

[Barid Bel Medar]

My guess. Callandor can also serve as a saangreal for channelling the TP. Through it, the three powers (Saidar, Saidin, and the TP) become one.

 

Also, In the TDR final battle between Ishmael and Rand, Callandor fends off balefire. Not sure how it that is managed, could be an inconsistency in the rules of the world, but still there it is.

 

IIRC, that happened in TAR, so it was consistent with what Perrin did in ToM.

 

This is a great point. I agree. Rand didn't know what Balefire was at the time, so he had no problems "splitting" it in TAR. His belief that he would stop the weave is what did it IMO, not anything to do with Callandor.

 

Although I can very easily see myself being wrong and it being something about Callandor.

[Guest Cabadrin]

It should be safe to assume that what makes Callandor special is its flaw. So what is the flaw, exactly?

 

Narishma, having brought Callandor to Rand in Illian, complains that the wards differed from what Rand had told him (odd in itself, it should not take Rand longer to Travel himself than to explain the wards) : Callandor interferes with nearby weaves. Unless you think Rand just happend to make a mistake.

 

On that flimsy evidence, I suggest: There is a buffer, but it is turned towards the weave, not towards the saidin source. Even when not in use, a few threads from a nearby weave might seep into the buffer, causing minor changes to the weave.

 

This makes Callandor the perfect sa'angreal to use for unweaving a powerful and dangerous weave. The buffer might even protect from the DO:s touch.

 

EDIT Flawed and unnessesary observation removed END EDIT

[Asmodeanisdemandread]

Since callandor has no buffer doesn't that mean it can be more powerful than the CK? That's what I took from those references. And since the "only safe way" to use it is in a circle would that the male in the circle would be able to draw in as much saidin as he wanted using the females invite link as the buffer? That just crossed my mind. Maybe alivia and Nyn as the most powerful female channellers?

[JonathanEisfeld]

I still think there may end up being something to the similarity between a Callendor Circle and a Circle created by the Dominion Bands.

[pskarnaq]

When Callandor was used to destroy those the Creator had made (Seanchan forces), the Power ricocheted back on Rand and the people he was with. It was only against the unnatural creations of the Dark One that Rand was able to use Callandor as a weapon successfully. Not sure what that portends, but I'm sure there's some meaning there.

[Suttree]

When Callandor was used to destroy those the Creator had made (Seanchan forces), the Power ricocheted back on Rand and the people he was with. It was only against the unnatural creations of the Dark One that Rand was able to use Callandor as a weapon successfully. Not sure what that portends, but I'm sure there's some meaning there.

 

There is no meaning there. The power went wonky(it didn't ricochet back at them) because of the bowl of winds being used far beyond its intended purpose a short time before in the area. The OP was not working right for both sides in that battle(damane had been killing their own on accident to) and Rand had it pointed out to him by Dashiva mid battle. one of the flaws in callandor is that it causes wildness of the mind and that is partially why Rand kept going and had to be knocked down by Bashere even after it was evident he was killin his own troops.

[TristanWebb]

Callandor only works against men. In the stone it was fine against all the male trollocs/fades, but as soon as he tried to heal the dead girl it failed. Against the Seanchan it failed because there were women in the army. Against the forsaken it worked because the female buffer fixed it.

 

Makes just as much sense.

[Asmodeanisdemandread]

When Callandor was used to destroy those the Creator had made (Seanchan forces), the Power ricocheted back on Rand and the people he was with. It was only against the unnatural creations of the Dark One that Rand was able to use Callandor as a weapon successfully. Not sure what that portends, but I'm sure there's some meaning there.

 

There is no meaning there. The power went wonky(it didn't ricochet back at them) because of the bowl of winds being used far beyond its intended purpose a short time before in the area. The OP was not working right for both sides in that battle(damane had been killing their own on accident to) and Rand had it pointed out to him by Dashiva mid battle. one of the flaws in callandor is that it causes wildness of the mind and that is partially why Rand kept going and had to be knocked down by Bashere even after it was evident he was killin his own troops.

I may have missed this before but what IS the intended purpose of the bowl? Just to help the SF with the ocean? I seem to remember someone saying the weather in the aol was controlled by the as. By your statement I assume they didn't use the bowl. Am I right in that assessment?

Sorry if I double posted.

[Suttree]

I may have missed this before but what IS the intended purpose of the bowl? Just to help the SF with the ocean? I seem to remember someone saying the weather in the aol was controlled by the as. By your statement I assume they didn't use the bowl. Am I right in that assessment?

Sorry if I double posted.

Interview: Nov 21st, 1998

TPOD Signing Report - John Novak (Paraphrased)

Question

 

The Bowl: Someone asked him whether, if men had helped the Aes Sedai and Windfinders and Kin channel through the Bowl, the One Power would still have been screwed up.

Robert Jordan

 

His implicit assumption was that the Bowl screwed things up. I expected this to be a sheer RAFO. I was surprised. He went into a relatively detailed explanation to the effect that the Bowl was stressed far, far beyond its original design parameters because of the advanced knowledge of the Windfinders. It was affecting a global pattern, when it was designed for only a small region. Men helping would not have changed anything, and the effects linger most strongly near Ebou Dar, but also along the "spokes" which radiated from that place. (I should have asked if a spoke went out over Tear.)

Footnote

 

The 'relatively detailed explanation' can be found in TPOD 2, Moridin's POV. Moridin noted that the Bowl was originally a ter'angreal designed to control the weather in small areas, and that the Sea Folk were likely capable of stretching its abilities far beyond its intended capacity (since they could do unaided what should have required the Bowl, by Age of Legends standards).

[Asmodeanisdemandread]

Ah thanks again sutt

[Rubberninja]

It might be worth mentioning a phrase from tPoD where Cadsuane comments on Callandors flaw while talking to Rand. When Rand goes to her to ask her to be his advisor, she says Callandor is flawed, it lacks the buffer that makes other angreal/sa'angreal safe to use. It aparently magnifies the taint, indusing wildness of the mind. the only safe way for you (Rand) to use it would be in a cirlce with two women.

I dont have time to quote the text exactly, but I am 100% sure she says 'aparently magnifies the taint, indusing wildness of the mind'. I suppose the word 'aparently' is key here, but to my recollection, Rand hasn't tried using Callandor since saidin was cleansed.