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DRAGONMOUNT

A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY

Morden

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  1. The thing to keep in mind is that this is a society where as a whole Females are considered equal to if not Superior to men. If you could see the way women are generally treated in a feudal society then you would probably think the men in WoT have it fairly easily. But yeah I agree that it is just too much and the women generally seem to have deep psychological issues and or perversions which make them somewhat unlikable, not to mention the amount of outright sadism in this book, theres a lot of abusive personalities. In a way a lot of the womens problems are because of the breaking though, they look down on men because it was male channellers who broke the world. And as 3000 years have passed they dont understand that it was the better of the available options. They just think "stupid men have been doing stupid things for thousands of years..."
  2. I think they will deal with rogue channellers, any rogues male or female. Essentially an Aes Sedai Police type of group. The real question is what will the Greens do without shadow spawn to fight.
  3. I find it more interesting to not have the scene in the book. At least we know the dialogue did happen. I thought Hawkwing would tell her to stop leashing channelers. Which she'd have to obey right? I mean some of Hawkwings BFF(and I mean _F_)s are channelers... That'd be pretty huge... Wouldnt surprise me if he pointed out to her that his original hatred and distrust of the Aes Sedai was caused by Ishamaels compulsion. Which means she is essentially the plans of one of the Forsaken by leashing channellers, but as we never saw what was said and its doubtful we will have any sort of conclusion all we can do is speculate.
  4. Morden

    Ravens

    Or to Ta'veren in general, as it was the three of them who were targetted
  5. Personally as much as I would love to have more WoT books, without RJ atleast outlining them they would not be in the same world. It would be based on WoT and probably loosely at that. I'd rather that anyone who was good enough to write in this universe develop their own works than try to emulate the un-emulatable. It would be a bit like Driving on Tarmac roads for years and then suddenly realising that if you want to continue driving you've got no choice but to drive on cobblestones, yeah you can still do it, but it will be a bumpy ride and no where near as smooth or comfortable. So I really do hope the stick to their morals and RJ's wishes and not make any more. Not unless they do some sort of seance and speak to RJ's spirit and get him to dictate the book to them.
  6. Egwene's Parallel from a previous turning of the wheel, wouldnt be that much of a stretch. She wasnt bound as a Hero of the Horn, could there be a reason for that? Could be that it will be Egwene rather than Nakomi in the next turning talking to the next Dragon Reborn. I dont think Nakomi is the creator because quite frankly why would she involve herself with the Aiel. A previous age Egwene equivalent would involve herself though and she would tell the last vestiges of her former friend that he did well.
  7. I did kinda wonder at that myself. I Would have thought that Noises/explosions or even blinding lights aimed at him would have been effective. This is something which all Aes Sedai are taught as basic weaves. I say again Basic weaves because they are far easier and take far less than moving objects about using the OP. Many full blown AS in the WT can barely channel an object around, yet they can all make flashing lights, noises/explosions. These things would be utterly more confusing than mere rocks. However it is obvious that Demandred wanted a small distraction, one aimed at LTT, I think he had practiced until the point which it was almost natural for him to channel whilst fighting so it took a small amount of concentration. His aim was not to distract LTT with the rocks, but to try and get LTT to mimic his own actions and thus because he was not prepared in advance to put himself at a severe disadvantage. That might have been what surprised him about Lan, he probably couldnt understand why LTT(Lan) didnt take the bait and then decided to drop the act and beat him on merit alone. Thats my take on it anyway. Which even if I think he was an idiot for even bothering is one that makes a great deal of sense.
  8. The men would have to completely rehabilitated from animals in less than a year. Plus his selection would have been scarce given the ages left alive. That's a small group. Full blown compulsion could do it, totally strip their minds and then create a new one. Sort of like Graendal does with her pets and servants. So we know it is possible to varying degrees. Whether Demandred is good enough with compulsion is another matter, Graendal was an artist at it. But yeah I think your right about the scarcety. If he had access to 1000 of the right ages to try and force them it would be pretty miraculous, but that would only cover those who come from Natural Sparker Bloodlines, not those which can be taught. With travelling parties he could gather them quickly like the BT did. But it requires a core to begin with. We have too little information about the state of affairs in Shara. I still think the numbers are unnaturally low in comparisson to previous books but what's done is done and we'll never know what happened to those armies and channellers. Though I hope for BS's sake he's more consistent with his own work or has editors which pick up on that sort of thing without dropping the ball, because dropping stupid amounts of people off the map like this is not a good thing, it shows a profound lack of planning and foresight
  9. Gaidal is reincarnated as Jur Grady's son. The timing works out (baby in LoC) and Jur said that he was unusually ugly. I'm pretty sure Grady's son is also too old by a couple of years. It gives their ages at some point. grady son was like 5 in LoC strange, when Grady was discussing him with Perrin I got the impression that he was very young. i.e months not years old
  10. It didn't make any sense actually. Half the BT was sent out in KoD. That should have been around 400 Asha'man, every one of them loyal to Rand. And as for those at the BT, I don't recall it ever being said that a huge amount of Asha'man died there. Taim had 100 with him later on, which is probably slightly less than he should have had, but still fairly close. I don't see any evidence that "good" Asha'man were slaughtered at the BT. It seems to me that after Androl and Logain broke free, Taim took his men and got the hell out of there. So, unless there were a bunch Asha'man running around in all the battles and BS just didn't bother mentioning it, there's a whole lot of Asha'man who fell off the map at some point. There actually should have been more Asha'man than Egwene had Aes Sedai, considering how many AS have been lost throughout the books. Thats actually a superb point about the ones from KoD. Not actually sure what happened to those who went to the Borderlands to stem the trollocs either. But it does say in the book somewhere that Logain and the surviving loyal Asha'man would be no use until they recovered and that most had perished in the battle, so it might well be that the ones who got slaughtered were the weaker/less well trained Asha'man who were still training. i.e the two rivers guys etc. Either that or someone here said it and made it look convincing haha. I'll probably do a re-read soon but to be honest I dont think I can quite stomach dissecting the book if I read it too fresh. If the KoD ones werent at the BT. then they were probably with the Wise Ones/Kin that were heating the water for the Grand Aiel Bath Appreciation week. Not sure where a lake big enough would be, but it must have been spectacular. Afterall Aiel are more afraid of water than the DO so their version of TG would be a big bath.
  11. I don't necessarily disagree but the solution is very easy. Shara is as big as the Randland. They have been breeding channellers for the Light knows how long and they are battle-ready. They could easily counter however many channellers the Light had. The answer was not to make the existing channellers disappear, it was to balance the numbers. 400 was a ridiculuous number for Shara, and that is not even counting the Town. Not without men. Remember they'd have virtually no male channelers. And they would have lost a lot of the females to the battle to take over their land. At most they'd counter the Seachan or the Aiel. At best. That still leaves White Tower, Black Tower, WindFinders, and The Kin, and one of those two aforementioned factions since they can't counter both. The shadow took roughly 20% or less from the WT and the BT and that's about it. Even if they didnt fully counter the Lights Channeller forces it would have been a bit better to explain the sudden change of the battle. If say 2000 fresh faced Ayyad popped up, then damned straight they would pound the hell out of a load of tired Light Channellers(AS/Damane/WO/Kin) who were using a rotating schedule to counter fatigue so didnt have everyone active and none were fresh nor at the same battlefield. The Black Tower was explained away in a true to the previous books fashion... Unfortunately that was one of the few explanations that fits within the WoT. When channellers fight it is a massacre which is why most of the Asha'man didnt survive it, so they werent really a strategic asset overall so it would have been women vs women overall. It made sense for the 400 Ayyad to trash the weakened White Tower forces when you add them with Sharan/Trolloc Armies. But surely when the army gathered at Merrilor then they would have every single Channeller at the FoM linked with every Kin/WO/Novice anyone who can channel a candle flame basically. a Circles members do not have to be present at the battle to give their strength, they could have been sitting in Mayene. Quite frankly reserving channellers for healing is an admirable sentiment assuming the world is guaranteed to live another day. But when you get to the level of problems when the Sharan's turned up with their force it should have been obvious that if they won, then keeping people alive using the Power would be less useful than keeping the world alive. They could have continued to administer herbs and such and care for the sick. Something which the Kin especially are noted for. So that alone would have been dozens of battery packs for the Aes Sedai to bring the pain to the Ayyad. As for Mats tactics. He excelled more at hit and run raids and trickery in earlier books. They dont work when your enemy is reading your mail. Personally I think holding the Seanchan in reserve like he did was a colossal waste almost like he was trying to keep his wife happy by giving her an army she can invade everyone else with later. However the numbers we have accounted for were according to books 1-13. Book 14 did not have the same numbers available apparently the Seanchan had to deploy a lot of their forces to defending their borders against Farmers and Bandits and the hostile armies of nearby realms(Obviously someone other than their neighbours at FoM...). Someone earlier in this thread mentioned that their rule wasnt secure when from everything we saw in books 11-13 said that they were probably more secure than any other realm in many respects even if that security was bought by the sword. They should have easily had a crazy amount troops available if they stripped all their garrisons down to skeleton crews.
  12. Demandred tells Taim he has 400 channellers with him. Which Ironically would have allowed Taim to 13x13 at over 30x the rate which he managed with the pittiful amount of Black Ajah help he had. Gotta love how Forsaken infight you really do, Taim should have pulled him up on it haha. "I would have had over a thousand had you lent me yours for a few months!" which would have been returned with a wave of the hand and "These are not the Ayyad you are looking for, move along."
  13. In many ways I agree, I just wish that BS had upped the shadow rather than nerfing the Light or at least give us a reason they wouldnt be doing anything, it would have made it easier to swallow and then they could have made it much more catastrophic. Its a bit different losing 400k troops out of 800k or whatever was lost in the end. But if the numbers had been true to what it should have been, BS could easily have killed off 1-1.5mil and left a few hundred thousand alive. That would have at least been going with how bad seemed like it was going to be. The Carnage we recieved seemed false somehow because of the lack of the Aiel and the almost none involvement of the seanchan. Overall the battles were however well written. BS has actually written some of my favourite battle scenes in any books(Kaladin in WoK is truly epic at times). Im just having trouble swallowing the "missing elements"
  14. To be fair non of those games really cover the sorts of things which make true Generals. Tacticians study battles, Strategists study Logistics. If we wanted to nit-pick real Strategy then I would point out that with the way Lan was using his Cavalry every horse would have most likely died due to exhaustion within the first couple of days. They are not endurance animals unless you go very easy on them, Repeatedly charging an enemy army would require a Remount with fresh horses repeatedly over and over again, most of the time with those horses not recovering from it fully for a couple of days depending on the distance travelled. If you keep putting them through their paces, they are prone to all manner of problems. This is why Cavalry regiments generally had huge amounts of mounts with them and they rotated them constantly even on a normal journey if they wanted to keep a decent pace. Then theres the minor problem that there were enormous food shortages, one of the largest stockpiles of food was in Caemlyn... So yeah by the time it all went down the Light had lost a staggering amount of food, Rand couldnt swan around and Ta'veren them some more so all the remaining foods would have had to come from Illian, Tear and Arad Doman whilst feeding the populace of those Kingdoms.... Yep they would have been eating all those fine Cavarly mounts long before the battles ended. Sorry Mandarb old pal its into a Tesco Burger for you... So no we arent nit-picking or Arm-chair Generalling. Merely pointing out inconsistencies between books (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13) and the final book
  15. What makes you think Brandon would be any more experienced? RJ was in Vietnam and studied at the Citadel so you can quite clearly see why he was qualified...Brandon not so much. In fact he admitted it was an area he struggled with and consulted Bernard Cornwell in an attempt to get a better understanding. Why would you think the armchair generals in this thread know better? BS writes about battles for his profession, people on this website play warhammer 3d and think that makes them Eisenhower. Erm sorry but the battles Ive seen him write have generally been low key or intentionally inept. Take the Way of Kings. The entire Alethi army is basically the same size as a WoT nation (100,000 troops) and they fight like children in a sandbox using the battles as a constant game of one-up-manship. In Brandons worlds the magic systems are generally a lot more low-key and have very fixed uses. The WoT magic system is probably the most overpowered in all of the fantasy literature in existence... those ideals are diametrically opposite. Simply put there is a reason even RJ didnt go into such massive detail about it, is that used effectively it turns into an absolute slaughter. Had both the Light and Shadow used their channellers to their pre-AMoL effectiveness there would have probably been a few dozen non channellers alive at the end of the battles aside from wounded sent away earlier, and perhaps a few hundred channellers on the winning side. Have you actually read any of the other books? not meaning to be offensive Im really not, but have we been reading the same battles? At Maradon there were channellers on both sides at one point, before Rand turned up and Ituralda gave the trolloc horde attacking him such a royal pasting until the Dreadlords turned up and forced the weakened Asha'man to flee, and he had very low numbers of them. Battles in Randland are not about Man vs Man or Man vs Trolloc UNLESS there are no channellers in the battle at all. As soon as you throw in even semi competant channellers whichever side has them steamrolls the other, it was shown time and time again, which is why the shadow was so desperately trying to make more dreadlords. Note any battle with the Seanchan+Damane in decent numbers in it minus Rand and his 5k troops and a shed load of Asha'man and even then it was only his Asha'man which stemmed the tied of the Seanchan advance. Only counter to a channeller is another one simple as that. Dumies Wells is a prime example of an overwelming display of the One Power. 200 Asha'man destroyed and I say that emphatically They destroyed an army 200x their size and broke them in mere minutes That is why Trollocs and Fades have seemed weaker and weaker over the course of the series. Almost like they were being relegated from being the shadows primary force to merely being its expendable force. Once again I ask you this: What does being an armchair General have to do with plot-holes, Missing Troops, Missing entire civilizations?
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