How Rand Dies And Comes Back To Life

[Terez]

Edit: sorry, I don't know how to divide the quote in order to reply separately to each paragraph so you will have to find my answers...

 

For future reference, add [ /quote ] to the end of what you want to quote, without the spaces. You have to put [ quote ] (without the spaces) at the beginning of the quoted text, but I usually copy/paste the automatic code so that it comes with name and timestamp and link. If you want just a name (or chapter name) you can do [ quote name='name' ][ /quote] (without spaces). And yes, I am generally ignorant about mythology.

[pamela]

Edit: sorry, I don't know how to divide the quote in order to reply separately to each paragraph so you will have to find my answers...

 

For future reference, add [ /quote ] to the end of what you want to quote, without the spaces. You have to put [ quote ] (without the spaces) at the beginning of the quoted text, but I usually copy/paste the automatic code so that it comes with name and timestamp and link. If you want just a name (or chapter name) you can do [ quote name='name' ][ /quote] (without spaces). And yes, I am generally ignorant about mythology.

 

Oh, so the spaces are to be blamed! Thanks

[Wool-headed lummox]

Perhaps Rand will decide to allow himself to be killed, after he figures out his connection with Moridin, in order to take Moridin with him before it's too late (for something).

 

Or, perhaps, Rand and Moridin will merge in some way, and end up swapping bodies, with Moridin's soul dying in Rand's body, and Rand's soul remaining alive in Moridin's body. Well, in the body of whatever Borderlander youth that was abducted by the Trollocks. Then it would take Rand three days to reach his friends, in which they will mourn him and think him dead. That way Rand would end up a different-looking handsome young man, with two hands.

[Lisa Campbell]

Why would it take Rand 3 days to travel to his friends then? Even if he knocked himself out taking Moridin's body, I don't think he'd be out for 3 days...

[Vardar]

Why would it take Rand 3 days to travel to his friends then? Even if he knocked himself out taking Moridin's body, I don't think he'd be out for 3 days...

 

Cause he had to find a boat? I still don't get the boat part myself, and it always bothered me.

 

That being said, I sitll can't fin the Min viewing that siad Rand WILL die. Or where she said she knew it meant he will die.

 

NM found it. Alivia would help rand Die. Hmm.

[b3arz3rg3r]

Why would it take Rand 3 days to travel to his friends then? Even if he knocked himself out taking Moridin's body, I don't think he'd be out for 3 days...

 

Depends on what sort of state the body is in. What if say Moridin's body is mortally wounded when Rand takes it. Only an inch from death, too far gone to withstand Healing, even worse than when Samitsu healed Dobraine. I could see Nynaeve struggle for 3 days to keep Rand alive.

 

Cause he had to find a boat? I still don't get the boat part myself, and it always bothered me.

 

 

Well, Shayol Ghul was once an idyllic island I believe, if it reverts back to an island after Rand has first gone to close the Bore there might be need for a boat. Don't ask me why there would be a boat even if that happened.

[Vardar]

Why would it take Rand 3 days to travel to his friends then? Even if he knocked himself out taking Moridin's body, I don't think he'd be out for 3 days...

 

Depends on what sort of state the body is in. What if say Moridin's body is mortally wounded when Rand takes it. Only an inch from death, too far gone to withstand Healing, even worse than when Samitsu healed Dobraine. I could see Nynaeve struggle for 3 days to keep Rand alive.

 

She used the old healing, Ny's healing doesn't work like that, if there's a spark, she can fan it back to life with no threat.

[Wool-headed lummox]

Why would it take Rand 3 days to travel to his friends then? Even if he knocked himself out taking Moridin's body, I don't think he'd be out for 3 days...

Because the body swap temporarily interferes with his channeling?

Because he'd be busy fighting the Dark One?

Because in a fit of true WoT-ian heroic lunacy, he'd decide his friends are better off thinking he's dead, and would never recognize him in a different body regardless?

Because he'd be out for 3 days?

The possibilities are endless when we know so little of what's going to happen.

 

I could see Nynaeve struggle for 3 days to keep Rand alive

I'm pretty sure Min had a viewing of Nynaeve mourning over someone's dead body, which would fit perfectly with Rand's body dying and leaving his friends devastated.

[b3arz3rg3r]

Why would it take Rand 3 days to travel to his friends then? Even if he knocked himself out taking Moridin's body, I don't think he'd be out for 3 days...

 

Depends on what sort of state the body is in. What if say Moridin's body is mortally wounded when Rand takes it. Only an inch from death, too far gone to withstand Healing, even worse than when Samitsu healed Dobraine. I could see Nynaeve struggle for 3 days to keep Rand alive.

 

She used the old healing, Ny's healing doesn't work like that, if there's a spark, she can fan it back to life with no threat.

 

Which is why I said even worse than Dobraine. If say Callandor is sticking out of him or even worse metal touched by the DO or something else. I'm sure there are plenty of ways there could be an injury severe enough that Rand is between life and death for days.

[thisguy]

The people who talk about Elayne's ship for skimming may be on to something.

 

There can also be this:

 

Myrddraal and other servants of the DO don't like water (Why he's on a boat). Maybe, it has something to do with him being Corramoor (spelling?). Aside from the Sea Folk saying he's their messiah, there really hasn't been much going on there.

[Gristle]

I must be incredibly dense, because it was not until I started reading these forums that I even considered him being resurrected in this series. I always interpreted "to live, you must die" as "for your soul to continue, you must sacrifice yourself to contain the DO". I never thought he'd actually be physically resurrected in this series - just that by containing the DO he will preserve the cycle and be available for rebirth when the requisite age comes again.

 

What are the specifics, beyond that quote and the parallels to Jesus and Arthur, that have everyone convinced that this is a foregone conclusion? I missed something major...

 

Edit: I just read Terez's poll question, which pretty well details the thoughts behind this. The hints about Nynaeve and healing death are definitely there - I just didn't take them as being in reference to him specifically.. I interpreted Nicola's foretelling differently. I totally missed the foreshadowing of Nyn ripping him out of T'A'R. Will have to keep all this in mind during the next re-read...

[thisguy]

I must be incredibly dense, because it was not until I started reading these forums that I even considered him being resurrected in this series. I always interpreted "to live, you must die" as "for your soul to continue, you must sacrifice yourself to contain the DO". I never thought he'd actually be physically resurrected in this series - just that by containing the DO he will preserve the cycle and be available for rebirth when the requisite age comes again.

 

What are the specifics, beyond that quote and the parallels to Jesus and Arthur, that have everyone convinced that this is a foregone conclusion? I missed something major...

 

Edit: I just read Terez's poll question, which pretty well details the thoughts behind this. The hints about Nynaeve and healing death are definitely there - I just didn't take them as being in reference to him specifically.. I interpreted Nicola's foretelling differently. I totally missed the foreshadowing of Nyn ripping him out of T'A'R. Will have to keep all this in mind during the next re-read...

 

You may be right. I think he will be resurrected or pulled out of TAR or something else but we're all just speculating.

[Terez]

There is a difference between 'just speculating' and formulating theories based on evidence.

[FarShainMael]

I must be incredibly dense, because it was not until I started reading these forums that I even considered him being resurrected in this series. I always interpreted "to live, you must die" as "for your soul to continue, you must sacrifice yourself to contain the DO". I never thought he'd actually be physically resurrected in this series - just that by containing the DO he will preserve the cycle and be available for rebirth when the requisite age comes again.

 

What are the specifics, beyond that quote and the parallels to Jesus and Arthur, that have everyone convinced that this is a foregone conclusion? I missed something major...

 

Edit: I just read Terez's poll question, which pretty well details the thoughts behind this. The hints about Nynaeve and healing death are definitely there - I just didn't take them as being in reference to him specifically.. I interpreted Nicola's foretelling differently. I totally missed the foreshadowing of Nyn ripping him out of T'A'R. Will have to keep all this in mind during the next re-read...

 

There's a clue to Rand's possible resurrection in this:

"Twice and twice shall he be marked,

twice to live and twice to die."

 

Nyn may well have been foreshadowed to rip someone out of T'A'R, but that someone msy not be Rand. It could be Lan (if he dies in his charge and is a HotH, that is).

[Terez]

1. The foreshadowing is connected to Rand.

 

2. There's no reason to resurrect Lan; he isn't the one who has to save the world.

[shortkut]

1. The foreshadowing is connected to Rand.

 

2. There's no reason to resurrect Lan; he isn't the one who has to save the world.

No reason except the woman with the power to bring back the dead is his wife...

[FarShainMael]

1. The foreshadowing is connected to Rand.

 

Not necessarily. If you have definite evidence to establish this point, please provide it.

 

2. There's no reason to resurrect Lan; he isn't the one who has to save the world.

 

No, just Malkier:

 

Seven ruined towers around his head, and a babe in a cradle holding a sword.

[Mik]

There's a clue to Rand's possible resurrection in this:

"Twice and twice shall he be marked,

twice to live and twice to die."

Where? That just means he is marked twice for living and marked twice for dying. How does that alone contain a clue that suggests resurrection?

 

Rephrasing the question:

If he would have been marked five times to live and five times to die, would that be a clue that he'd be resurrected four times?

 

 

Nyn may well have been foreshadowed to rip someone out of T'A'R, but that someone msy not be Rand. It could be Lan (if he dies in his charge and is a HotH, that is).

1. The foreshadowing is connected to Rand.

 

2. There's no reason to resurrect Lan; he isn't the one who has to save the world.

No reason except the woman with the power to bring back the dead is his wife...

I laughed because of the wife bit. Good point and a good laugh. +1 for you!

[Terez]

1. The foreshadowing is connected to Rand.

 

2. There's no reason to resurrect Lan; he isn't the one who has to save the world.

No reason except the woman with the power to bring back the dead is his wife...

 

That's a good reason for Nynaeve, but it's not ethical, and I don't think RJ introduced this resurrection technique so a grieving woman could resurrect her husband. I'm not saying she won't do it - I've even argued as much before - but she won't do it unless she is also doing it for Rand. I'd put money on that.

[Terez]

1. The foreshadowing is connected to Rand.

 

Not necessarily. If you have definite evidence to establish this point, please provide it.

 

We weren't talking about definite evidence in the first place, so why are you changing the subject?

 

2. There's no reason to resurrect Lan; he isn't the one who has to save the world.

 

No, just Malkier:

 

Seven ruined towers around his head, and a babe in a cradle holding a sword.

 

Malkier is dead. Lan probably already fulfilled this viewing by finally proclaiming himself king and fulfilling the oath given to him in his cradle.

[Terez]

There's a clue to Rand's possible resurrection in this:

"Twice and twice shall he be marked,

twice to live and twice to die."

Where? That just means he is marked twice for living and marked twice for dying. How does that alone contain a clue that suggests resurrection?

 

Rephrasing the question:

If he would have been marked five times to live and five times to die, would that be a clue that he'd be resurrected four times?

 

 

Nyn may well have been foreshadowed to rip someone out of T'A'R, but that someone msy not be Rand. It could be Lan (if he dies in his charge and is a HotH, that is).

1. The foreshadowing is connected to Rand.

 

2. There's no reason to resurrect Lan; he isn't the one who has to save the world.

No reason except the woman with the power to bring back the dead is his wife...

I laughed because of the wife bit. Good point and a good laugh. +1 for you!

 

Doesn't take much to impress you does it?

[Mik]

Doesn't take much to impress you does it?

Impress? Something that makes me laugh isn't necessarily something impressive.

Doesn't take much to make me smile. That's true.

 

*smiles*

You should try it sometime. (see...I find that hilarious. Doesn't take much to make me smile)

[Terez]

I have plenty of things to smile about.

[Vardar]

Man, the way some of you guys use the word "Foreshadowing" is a stretch.

 

And I'm with Mik, still not seeing the tie to twice to live and twice to die and being resurrected. Maybe I'm really dense, but I'm not seeing it. We'll know soon enough however.

[Mik]

never mind