# of gholams currently around

[Olver_is_a_Forsaken]

Since it has been established that gholams are among the Shadowspawn that can travel through gateways (as evidenced by the eternal fall from a skimming gateway of one of the six in Towers of Midnight) so therefore could be moved from place to place quickly - is the one that killed Herid Fel the one that Mat dealt with (confirmed in the books or by RJ/BS) or is it possible there is still another one around? If there is no confirmation, any hints either way?

[michellem]

I don't have direct quotes. But I see to remember that only six was made, and that the one who chased Mat was found in a stasis-box. We don't know if more was put in stasis-boxes, but so far I don't think any more has been found in that case.

 

Here's the wikia on the gholam: http://wot.wikia.com/wiki/Gholam

[Orderofolde]

Only six were ever made, three that look like males and three that look like females. I think it has only been alluded to that there are only 2 currently in play, but we've seen only one. I'm sure that gives Brandon a good topic to write about, the one he dropped into the black void's mate coming after him.

[Sharaman]

We only know about one for sure and that's (probably) destroyed.

There are hints that there may be two --

But post-ToM, the logic of at least one of those hints is weak.

1) Barthanes is torn apart, months before Herid Fel (though in the same locale).

Was that a gholam - if so, he didn't do a thing in-between the two murders but he may have been popped back into the stasis box.

It may also have been a Channeler who was spreading terror by punishing an under-performing servant of Shadow.

 

2) Fel is murdered in Carhein and in a very short span of time (5-6 days) the gholam is in Ebou Dar.

At that point (or rather after KoD) we assumed that like other shadowspawn, it couldn't use Gates.

So you could speculate about whether it was quick enough to make the trip.

Since we know after ToM, that unlike other shadowspawn, a gholam can use Gates, that's hardly a problem anymore.

Sammael transported it.

[Orderofolde]

I might have had the idea somehow that they might have been used in pairs or kept in pairs but that might have been my own doing. Just like my thoughts on there might have only been 6 created, but we don't know if they can reproduce or not. Hopefully not. And I don't believe there is length to address the issue left in the series unless there was something in the outriggers planned. There is just so little known about the stasis boxes, how to find them, who created them, who used them Light vs. Dark, etc. It would be interesting to see if the details from RJ's notes are included in the encyclopedia.

[Orderofolde]

I know this may be a bit off-topic, but what was the item that fell when the bore was drilled initially at the Collam Dan that we see in RJ's short add-on to the story. Has anyone ever figured that out yet? Random, I know, but the G led to stasis boxes, which led to AOL, then the Bore, then the drilling and I remembered I had a question about it. Anyone know?

[yoniy0]

The Sharom, do you mean? It was part of the research facility at the Collam Daan. If you're talking about that little black speck Rand saw, though, I have no idea. Either way, this question should probably go in a different thread (perhaps the 'ask an easy question' topic in the general board).

[dazparra]

Only one gholom has made an appearance in this age and it is not falling through eternity and will soon die as we see from the gholoms perspective that they need fresh blood to survive.

[rand4747]

i think likely both the cairhein gholom and the eboudar/caemlyn one are the same and that he was transported from cairhein to ebou dar ina gateway.

 

They disrupt weaves but they can probably pass through a gateway if they dont touch the weaves themselves so can pass through the center carefully.

[Suttree]

i think likely both the cairhein gholom and the eboudar/caemlyn one are the same and that he was transported from cairhein to ebou dar ina gateway.

 

They disrupt weaves but they can probably pass through a gateway if they dont touch the weaves themselves so can pass through the center carefully.

 

Interview: Oct 21st, 2005

KOD Signing Report - Tim Kington (Paraphrased)

Question

Why can't Shadowspawn pass through gateways?

Robert Jordan

It's because they're artificial constructs. They can't tolerate the passage.

Question

So would a Nym have the same problem?

Robert Jordan

Yes.

Question

How about Ogier?

Robert Jordan

No. Ogier are not artificial constructs.

 

Has it been explained why Gholam's can pass through a gateway? They obvs are an artificial construct.

 

Edit: Never mind, found this...

Interview: Nov 16th, 2010

Paris Signing Report - Jonathan B (Paraphrased)

Jonathan B

We discussed the gholam; if someone had pushed it through a gateway, would it have just died?

Brandon Sanderson

Brandon said that gholam CAN go THROUGH gateways (from one place to another). Gholam are Shadowspawn of a more perfected kind. It would have been way too easy to kill if you just needed to shove it through a gateway (to another place). However, falling through the skimming gateway for a few minutes did kill the gholam and it is really dead and it's not going to show up again. This makes me wonder now if one of Rand/Logain's Deathgates would have killed it but I didn't think to ask at the time.

[rand4747]

the deathgates wont kill it as they are not the skimming weave, however you probably can use the skimming weave to do so. then they will be gone. a gateway they will just pass through and still be alive the other side

[Sharaman]

They can't be directly killed with OP- the weaves would just dissolve.

The skimming didn't kill it - just pushed it out of normal space-time.

[yoniy0]

Sharaman, you did see Brandon's quote two posts before your own, right?

[BrainFireBob]

i think likely both the cairhein gholom and the eboudar/caemlyn one are the same and that he was transported from cairhein to ebou dar ina gateway.

 

They disrupt weaves but they can probably pass through a gateway if they dont touch the weaves themselves so can pass through the center carefully.

 

Interview: Oct 21st, 2005

KOD Signing Report - Tim Kington (Paraphrased)

Question

Why can't Shadowspawn pass through gateways?

Robert Jordan

It's because they're artificial constructs. They can't tolerate the passage.

Question

So would a Nym have the same problem?

Robert Jordan

Yes.

Question

How about Ogier?

Robert Jordan

No. Ogier are not artificial constructs.

 

Has it been explained why Gholam's can pass through a gateway? They obvs are an artificial construct.

 

Edit: Never mind, found this...

Interview: Nov 16th, 2010

Paris Signing Report - Jonathan B (Paraphrased)

Jonathan B

We discussed the gholam; if someone had pushed it through a gateway, would it have just died?

Brandon Sanderson

Brandon said that gholam CAN go THROUGH gateways (from one place to another). Gholam are Shadowspawn of a more perfected kind. It would have been way too easy to kill if you just needed to shove it through a gateway (to another place). However, falling through the skimming gateway for a few minutes did kill the gholam and it is really dead and it's not going to show up again. This makes me wonder now if one of Rand/Logain's Deathgates would have killed it but I didn't think to ask at the time.

 

 

Gholam hasn't survived passage through a gateway. Gholam survived "half" of passage through a gateway- passage outside of the Pattern (which is where Skimming space has to be). One assumes the Pattern recognizes the re-introduction of matter (will accept construct fleshy bits) but not the artificially chained soul (which would then be screened on re-entry into reality).

 

Assume a gateway is essentially two back-to-back skimming gates, and there's no conflict.

[Sharaman]

Going through the skimmer didn't directly kill it. It's died from starvation or whatever kills normal people falling through a skimmer.

[Suttree]

Going through the skimmer didn't directly kill it. It's died from starvation or whatever kills normal people falling through a skimmer.

 

See BS's quote above. I doubt it dies of starvation after a few minutes...

[Bob T Dwarf]

Going through the skimmer didn't directly kill it. It's died from starvation or whatever kills normal people falling through a skimmer.

 

See BS's quote above. I doubt it dies of starvation after a few minutes...

 

The concept of "falling through a gateway" or "falling endlessly" once inside a skimming gateway implies gravity and thus a great mass somewhere within that space and below the point of origin. There's also air to breathe while skimming. So whatever the area between the originating gate and the terminating gate is, it is not totally outside space/time. Laws of Physics do still hold.

 

Though it's been a hard-and-fast rule that no Channeler can levitate or fly, what is transport via "skimming" except flight? Use of The One Power to create a levitating platform and move from point-to-point at the direction of the conscious mind?

 

For something that is supposed to be based in scientific reality, there is much smoke, many mirrors, and lots of hand waving involved in The One Power.

[yoniy0]

Yes, we better not apply too much physics to the Wheel. It's a work of fantasy. Constructs can't usually Travel, and as per Brandon's 'minutes' comment, it seems the gholam's improved nature doesn't protect it for long in wherever it is one Skims through.

[AltonJakeStorey]

Going through the skimmer didn't directly kill it. It's died from starvation or whatever kills normal people falling through a skimmer.

 

See BS's quote above. I doubt it dies of starvation after a few minutes...

 

The concept of "falling through a gateway" or "falling endlessly" once inside a skimming gateway implies gravity and thus a great mass somewhere within that space and below the point of origin. There's also air to breathe while skimming. So whatever the area between the originating gate and the terminating gate is, it is not totally outside space/time. Laws of Physics do still hold.

 

Though it's been a hard-and-fast rule that no Channeler can levitate or fly, what is transport via "skimming" except flight? Use of The One Power to create a levitating platform and move from point-to-point at the direction of the conscious mind?

 

For something that is supposed to be based in scientific reality, there is much smoke, many mirrors, and lots of hand waving involved in The One Power.

 

You are assuming an alternate world functions the same way ours dose. The world APPEARS to work similar way to ours, but it doesn't mean that it works exactly the same. Mass may not be what causes the force pulling you down, it may be something else. When you are dealing with multiple dimensions, you cannot assume they are the same, even if they appear to be.