[ADVANCED/KITCHEN SINK] The Axe or the Hammer - GAME OVER

[mmeeshal]

Yeah, sorry, I was babysitting and the mom got home, so I had to run while I was in the middle of typing. That post is kind of half-formed thoughts of mine in reaction to BG. And I just really wanted to call BG a snark before I left.

 

I like Wombat's accusations of subtlety on my part--personally, I consider myself incapable of subtlety, but maybe I can stumble upon it occasionally by mistake. Nice to know.

But I'm not really sure what you're saying, Wombat. No lie, when I think of WIFOM I think of "the doc is revealed and so is the cop, who is the doc going to protect tonight? who is the mafia going to try to kill?" That sort of really obvious thing. I see WIFOM thrown around a lot in games but I don't always see exactly how it's applicable. So I'm oblivious here.

 

@BG--honestly, and this is only partially OMGUS, I don't get the nicest feelings from you either. Firstly, you stick a vote on Levity with absolutely no explanation. Then, since I was active and happened to be the one asking you why (which is a legitimate question, by the way--if everyone just cast a vote with no explanation, this game wouldn't get very far; we need discussion to happen), you decide to answer very snarkily and say "well, I'm actually suspicious of both of you, so if you want I can vote you instead." Which is pretty much the most important part of that post, IMO. The rest of it was kinda junk. Nice to know where you stand on D1 play, but I don't feel that's even a major topic of discussion anymore, so why are you bringing it up like it's such a big deal? And then you go out of your way to emphasize how this is all just "feelings" so you don't have to give solid reasons for voting anyone.....

What really got me, though, is "you and Red were in a discussion, didn't want to interrupt, so I just put my say on Levity, but if you don't like that I'll vote you instead."

 

1. What? Why should it matter if I'm in a discussion with Red? You've played more games than this. You know people can carry on multiple discussions and, due to the lovely quote function, even work around interjections. If we were all playing mafia via skype or in person or something, then this would be a valid excuse for not giving a reason for your vote. However, this is forum mafia--your post will still be there, will still be read, and will be taken into consideration, even if the people reading it are at that moment preoccupied by another discussion. The fact you used my discussion with Red as an excuse REEKS to me.

2. Love how BG turns my honest question on its head and shoots it back at me as a projectile. Suddenly, not only does he not have to give solid reasons for voting Levity, but he also sounds reasonable in saying I'm scummy too, just because of how he chose to respond to my inquiry. He makes ME look like the bad guy, when I didn't even do anything, and the upshot is, he doesn't even have to say why I'm scummy. If you notice, he still hasn't.

 

There, my full thoughts on BG's posts at this time. I think he's UBER scummy right now.

[bgrishinko]

Unvote Vote Meeshy

 

 

That's exactly the kind of reaction I was looking for. Large and over blown. Most town woulda shrugged it off I think.

 

Plus I'm on my phone right now, so I can't go get quotes and whatnot.

[mmeeshal]

Aww, and there, you do it again. Superscum, BG. Superscum.

 

No, I don't think most town would have shrugged it off. "Most town" wouldn't do anything, because everyone plays the game their own way, believe it or not.

 

1. I think you don't like the fact that I made valid points about your craptastically scum post/behavior so now you're going aggressive to shove it under the rug. Seen scum do this a lot. Used to piss me off, but now I see it for what it really is--desperation. (for clarification, I'm not applying the term "desperate" to you yet, BG. But I do think I hit some valid points and that scares you.)

 

2. You can't lead someone to a specific reaction and then call them scummy for it. Well, okay, you can, but it's ridiculous. You should know darn well that people in general point out scummy things, and especially react when untruths or uncounterable accusations are made about them. And then, less likely but still very plausible, you should have noticed from this game, if not all the other ones you've played with me, that I HATE it when people misrepresent my actions or twist my words. Of course I'm going to react to it, and loudly. If people twist what I say, then I think everyone else should be aware of it--because intentional twisting is not something town should be doing, IMO. And if it's just a misunderstanding, then great. Also something that should be clarified.

Point being, if you were actually looking for a reaction for honest reasons, you would have been much more open and neutral about how you presented your points, and made sure that any reaction was all me, instead of having anything at all to do with what you said. So, I call Bull-Crap on this one. You're reaching.

 

unvote

 

vote BG

[ed2funy]

I know it looks like Meesh over reacted, but I think she just talks to much.

 

XD

 

BG, it does seem like you are twisting and whatnot.

 

I would have asked that same question of why you were voting.

And the whole thing about game play itself isn't a highlight of the game anymore. It is more the reactions (and votes) of people's comments on their game play.

 

 

 

FOS you, barring your elaborated response.

[Nolder]

Unvote Vote Meeshy

 

 

That's exactly the kind of reaction I was looking for. Large and over blown. Most town woulda shrugged it off I think.

I disagree

[bgrishinko]

I also agreed with Levity's statement as quoted by Key. Didn't see it as a softclaim at all.

 

I'm thinking there might be something to Boyo's thought that maybe Amega and Nol are connected somehow. Amega says Boyo jumped out and attacked the first person to try and initiate game play...when he voted Amega...and Amega didn't do anything to initiate game play except attack the idea of joke votes. I hadn't seen any effort to try and scumhunt from Amega, or any thoughts on the game thus far. I think Boyo's vote, and Nol's reaction to it, were what actually got the game rolling.

 

Tying that back into the Nol-Amega thought I started out with, I just notice that Boyo voted Amega and Nol jumped on it, and Boyo responded to Nol and got some discussion going, and now Amega's attacking Boyo's case using Nol's ideas.

 

Thinking on it more, it could just be Amega wanting to OMGUS Boyo without saying so, but I don't know. I could see Amega and Nol on a team, for the time being.

 

@Ed--I see what you did there. I wish I understood you.

 

unvote

 

Umm...lemme see how the votes are distributed, just a sec....

 

 

You are trying REALLY hard to link people together. It was Boyo's thought, but I've found that usually the creator of such ideas isn't scum, but the ones who pick up the flag and wave it. Don't take this as me twisting your words, but to me this says: "Look at what Boyo said! He has a good idea, everybody I'm going to restate what happened in my own words just in case you missed it!"

 

I will note that I'm wary to condemn Amega (and those who are after him right now) so early in the game

like I said in the dead thread for the Naruto game I think sometimes people take advantage of Amega's spelling/grammatical errors and make him out to seem more scummy than he really is

I concur.

 

I see no particularly glaring case on Amega right now. There isn't anything necessarily wrong with refusing to partake in the jokevoting phase. Not everyone does it, and although mafia may tend to shy away from it at times, I really saw nothing wrong with Amega's reasoning. If he merely wants to voice his opinion on jokevoting, he shouldn't be condemned for something so simple. I don't like the train forming on him right now and would rather abstain from joining it.

I can see where Nol is coming from, but I don't get where Levity is. Amega has what, 3 votes on him? 4? I don't think everyone is voting him for the same reason. Boyo is voting him for his refusal to joke vote, yes, but that's not what the train is starting for, I don't think. The fact that you're making it out to be "everyone hates the non-joke-voter," which makes it sound ridiculous and unfounded, is making me want to keep an eye on you.

 

Personally, my vote has nothing to do with his unwillingness to joke-vote. I joined the discussion on it because I don't agree with his opinion, but my vote was already going on him.

 

I think he could do with pressure because, to me, first of all, the post I was responding to initially seems like trying to throw unfounded, inaccurate crap at the person voting for him--Amega asserts he was trying to move the game along, but again, all he did was say "joke voting is stupid, I'm not gonna do it." That itself didn't actually move the game out of joke mode into scumhunt mode; it just got a discussion on game play going, which isn't the same thing. Anyway, so he tries to make Boyo look extra bad by painting himself as a hero and saying that Boyo attacked him for the very thing he would be "heroic" for. That doesn't sit right with me--if you're going to attack someone's vote, don't use stuff that's made up or exaggerated. It doesn't help your case.

 

In addition to that part of his post, which already set me on edge, he did do the "Nol is right, your case was weak" thing and has been tying himself to Nolder seemingly at every turn. "Me and Nol tried to get the game going." "I agree with Nol." That sort of thing. Now, at first I took that to be maybe Nol and Amega are on a team--and I'm not totally dismissing that possibility. But I've seen scum attach themselves to a townie who is garnering a lot of attention, and I also think that this could be something Amega's doing.

 

Hence my vote on Amega. To me, he looks scummy.

 

Tied Nol to scummy Amega, then you say you understand where Nol is coming from. Do you think they are on a team or not? Cause that colors Nols reaction in a different light there if you think they are connected... not an "I understand Nol" light either. Oh, I suppose you changed your mind. Still linking their actions though.

 

Also, is it wrong to agree with Nolder?

 

Fair ladies and gallant gentlemen, I must apologise for not having been here; skyrim and dinner parties have derailed me. I will try to be better.

 

Sir Nolder: Why, having ripped into the good Mr. Soy Boyo for voting amegakure without explicitly wishing to lynch him, did thee then park your vote on Leelou simply because it was a train? (I see that the good Song has already raised this point.) Could you please tell me how voting randomly at the start of day one is better than voting with reason at the start of day one? I don't understand your back-and-forth with Song, especially given that Boyo hardly raised a convincing case on ameg in the first place. Did you want to lynch Leelou?

 

Gentle Blackhoof: Why did you answer for ameg when I asked him why joke-voting was bad? I wanted to know what he thought, not what you thought. Are you scumbuddies?

 

Dangerous Des: If we no-lynch on day one, do we also no-lynch on day two? When do we start lynching? It's normal not to lynch scum on day one, as the odds are stacked against the town, but the process of lynching makes people take sides, which generates important information for later in the game.

 

Meesha: You seem to be posting a lot about the issues, without really giving your opinion on anything relating to the people in the game. Am I right?

No, you're not. Reread the thread.

 

@ Meesh: There's other ways that a No Lynch vote can become useful on first days, besides just when everyone wastes it joke-voting. Most of the time people are content with only applying pressure to one or two people, and will try to set up competing trains on em to achieve info through pressure. This is a good thing, although it's better to pressure as many people as possible day 1. However, if I become convinced that both of the main targets of our lynch trains are town, and it's unlikely to get a lynch going on anyone else at that point, I still think a No Lynch is useful. Lynches aren't the only way to get info day 1, simple pressure is good enough and if you prevent everyone from lynching someone who ends up being town you actually can end up helping assure a town victory later.

 

Incidentally, it feels a little like you might be putting words into Soy's mouth by saying "I'm willing to lynch anyone" means "right now, everyone's game, because we don't have any solid info yet and everyone is just as likely to be scum at this point." First of all, if that's what he meant he could have come forth himself and stated something along those lines, and second of all I'm still not in agreement with that philosophy and I think it's an easy smokescreen to use for actually being EAGER to lynch anyone because a townie being lynched day 1 helps assure a mafia victory.

Going to openly state now that I cannot concentrate enough right now to thoroughly read this post, so I skimmed it (did the same with Pandy's, too, except the part about me) and will read again later.... But I did catch the drift, and yes, you're right, maybe I'm putting words in Boyo's mouth. That's what I got from him, but that may not be what he meant. But anyway, differing day 1 philosophy isn't of itself a reason to lynch someone. People who have played mafia far longer than yourself (myself included) can testify that the no lynch on day 1 philosophy you spout isn't inherently better than the one being argued right now. I've never played a game where we achieved a "No Lynch" vote on Day 1, and the games went just fine. Sometimes town won, sometimes scum did. It doesn't give anyone a fairer chance either way. It's just a different point of view. Get over it.

 

 

I kinda agree with Panda. Seems like you are restating everything that is happening. Feels like redundant re-statements for the most part to me. I disagree about not giving opinions, but the opinions feel muddled and hard to follow.

 

Also the last part here sounds a bit haughty. Words like the "philosophy you spout" aren't kind words.

In any case, like I said, its a feeling. None of this stuff is essentially wrong or bad, just seems off for you somehow. Your usually quite pleasant and I'm getting a lot of blaming and negative feelings around the board.

 

Your reactions to such a small post (kind of tongue in cheek) about moving my vote to you provoked such a strong reaction that it made me willing to place a vote for now.

To answer some of your questions, I brought up the Day 1 stuff cause I missed that whole conversation and seemed like a good way to segway to my thoughts.

 

Also, how am I being desperate? And I didn't twist your words or even really quote anything you said before this post. Now, I could understand you thinking I'm twisting your words in my posts above, but I'm just giving my honest reactions to certain things and maybe you are inadvertently giving weird vibes to me because of it. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you.

 

Also, I misspoke about shrugging it off. My meaning was more that most people wouldn't get all hopped up about it. Your reaction felt quite upset for so little words from me.

[mmeeshal]

I'm going to break this up into separate posts for ease.

 

I also agreed with Levity's statement as quoted by Key. Didn't see it as a softclaim at all.

 

I'm thinking there might be something to Boyo's thought that maybe Amega and Nol are connected somehow. Amega says Boyo jumped out and attacked the first person to try and initiate game play...when he voted Amega...and Amega didn't do anything to initiate game play except attack the idea of joke votes. I hadn't seen any effort to try and scumhunt from Amega, or any thoughts on the game thus far. I think Boyo's vote, and Nol's reaction to it, were what actually got the game rolling.

 

Tying that back into the Nol-Amega thought I started out with, I just notice that Boyo voted Amega and Nol jumped on it, and Boyo responded to Nol and got some discussion going, and now Amega's attacking Boyo's case using Nol's ideas.

 

Thinking on it more, it could just be Amega wanting to OMGUS Boyo without saying so, but I don't know. I could see Amega and Nol on a team, for the time being.

 

@Ed--I see what you did there. I wish I understood you.

 

unvote

 

Umm...lemme see how the votes are distributed, just a sec....

 

You are trying REALLY hard to link people together. It was Boyo's thought, but I've found that usually the creator of such ideas isn't scum, but the ones who pick up the flag and wave it. Don't take this as me twisting your words, but to me this says: "Look at what Boyo said! He has a good idea, everybody I'm going to restate what happened in my own words just in case you missed it!"

 

I disagree that I'm trying "really" hard to link people together here. (I fleshed it out more later because of Levity's statement that the "train" on Amega was all about the joke-vote thing, which wasn't true in my case.)

 

The post you quoted was my thoughts as I had them. Boyo said it first, so I gave credit where it was due, but looking at Amega's and Nol's posts I could totally see it being the case, and there were things I noticed that happened after Boyo threw it out as a suggestion, so they weren't anything Boyo could have talked about already.

 

Also, I think if something someone says comes off as being a good point, or maybe a likely suggestion, then it's good to discuss and explore it. No one else was at that point; honestly I think no one gave it any credence because Boyo was being "attacked" by Nol, and it might have sounded like an OMGUS-type guess more than an actual thought on the game.

[mmeeshal]

I will note that I'm wary to condemn Amega (and those who are after him right now) so early in the game

like I said in the dead thread for the Naruto game I think sometimes people take advantage of Amega's spelling/grammatical errors and make him out to seem more scummy than he really is

I concur.

 

I see no particularly glaring case on Amega right now. There isn't anything necessarily wrong with refusing to partake in the jokevoting phase. Not everyone does it, and although mafia may tend to shy away from it at times, I really saw nothing wrong with Amega's reasoning. If he merely wants to voice his opinion on jokevoting, he shouldn't be condemned for something so simple. I don't like the train forming on him right now and would rather abstain from joining it.

I can see where Nol is coming from, but I don't get where Levity is. Amega has what, 3 votes on him? 4? I don't think everyone is voting him for the same reason. Boyo is voting him for his refusal to joke vote, yes, but that's not what the train is starting for, I don't think. The fact that you're making it out to be "everyone hates the non-joke-voter," which makes it sound ridiculous and unfounded, is making me want to keep an eye on you.

 

Personally, my vote has nothing to do with his unwillingness to joke-vote. I joined the discussion on it because I don't agree with his opinion, but my vote was already going on him.

 

I think he could do with pressure because, to me, first of all, the post I was responding to initially seems like trying to throw unfounded, inaccurate crap at the person voting for him--Amega asserts he was trying to move the game along, but again, all he did was say "joke voting is stupid, I'm not gonna do it." That itself didn't actually move the game out of joke mode into scumhunt mode; it just got a discussion on game play going, which isn't the same thing. Anyway, so he tries to make Boyo look extra bad by painting himself as a hero and saying that Boyo attacked him for the very thing he would be "heroic" for. That doesn't sit right with me--if you're going to attack someone's vote, don't use stuff that's made up or exaggerated. It doesn't help your case.

 

In addition to that part of his post, which already set me on edge, he did do the "Nol is right, your case was weak" thing and has been tying himself to Nolder seemingly at every turn. "Me and Nol tried to get the game going." "I agree with Nol." That sort of thing. Now, at first I took that to be maybe Nol and Amega are on a team--and I'm not totally dismissing that possibility. But I've seen scum attach themselves to a townie who is garnering a lot of attention, and I also think that this could be something Amega's doing.

 

Hence my vote on Amega. To me, he looks scummy.

 

Tied Nol to scummy Amega, then you say you understand where Nol is coming from. Do you think they are on a team or not? Cause that colors Nols reaction in a different light there if you think they are connected... not an "I understand Nol" light either. Oh, I suppose you changed your mind. Still linking their actions though.

 

Also, is it wrong to agree with Nolder?

First bolded/larged part was about what Nol said in the quote I had, since you obviously didn't realize that. Nol says that he thinks sometimes people take advantage of the difficulty in understanding Amega to make him out to be scummy. I say I can see where he's coming from on that. That's the only thing I meant in that particular case. If you're going to read people's posts and respond, then really READ them so you know what they're saying.

I then went on to say I disagreed with Levity, again ABOUT THAT ISSUE, and then the rest of the post, which you point to as a contradiction of the "I see where Nol's coming from" was all in response to Levity's taking Nol's statement way too far as a generalization.

 

To your first question, as I said earlier, I could see it both ways. I'm ambivalent about Nol at the moment, but I definitely feel like Amega is scum. Whether they're together or Amega's attaching himself to Nol, I still think something's going on there. It's D1, I form opinions and revise them as new information comes in; is it so illogical to be willing to consider various options without committing strictly to one?

 

To the second question--no, again, READ. I didn't say Amega was scummy explicitly for "agreeing" with Nolder. It was everything else he did in addition to that.

[Blackhoof]

Unvote Vote Meeshy

 

 

That's exactly the kind of reaction I was looking for. Large and over blown. Most town woulda shrugged it off I think.

 

Plus I'm on my phone right now, so I can't go get quotes and whatnot.

 

i agree completely.

 

Meesh completely blew the entire thing out of proprtion. BG poked, she pulled out a gun and blew his head off.... O.O

 

Unvote, Vote Meesh

[mmeeshal]

Fair ladies and gallant gentlemen, I must apologise for not having been here; skyrim and dinner parties have derailed me. I will try to be better.

 

Sir Nolder: Why, having ripped into the good Mr. Soy Boyo for voting amegakure without explicitly wishing to lynch him, did thee then park your vote on Leelou simply because it was a train? (I see that the good Song has already raised this point.) Could you please tell me how voting randomly at the start of day one is better than voting with reason at the start of day one? I don't understand your back-and-forth with Song, especially given that Boyo hardly raised a convincing case on ameg in the first place. Did you want to lynch Leelou?

 

Gentle Blackhoof: Why did you answer for ameg when I asked him why joke-voting was bad? I wanted to know what he thought, not what you thought. Are you scumbuddies?

 

Dangerous Des: If we no-lynch on day one, do we also no-lynch on day two? When do we start lynching? It's normal not to lynch scum on day one, as the odds are stacked against the town, but the process of lynching makes people take sides, which generates important information for later in the game.

 

Meesha: You seem to be posting a lot about the issues, without really giving your opinion on anything relating to the people in the game. Am I right?

No, you're not. Reread the thread.

 

@ Meesh: There's other ways that a No Lynch vote can become useful on first days, besides just when everyone wastes it joke-voting. Most of the time people are content with only applying pressure to one or two people, and will try to set up competing trains on em to achieve info through pressure. This is a good thing, although it's better to pressure as many people as possible day 1. However, if I become convinced that both of the main targets of our lynch trains are town, and it's unlikely to get a lynch going on anyone else at that point, I still think a No Lynch is useful. Lynches aren't the only way to get info day 1, simple pressure is good enough and if you prevent everyone from lynching someone who ends up being town you actually can end up helping assure a town victory later.

 

Incidentally, it feels a little like you might be putting words into Soy's mouth by saying "I'm willing to lynch anyone" means "right now, everyone's game, because we don't have any solid info yet and everyone is just as likely to be scum at this point." First of all, if that's what he meant he could have come forth himself and stated something along those lines, and second of all I'm still not in agreement with that philosophy and I think it's an easy smokescreen to use for actually being EAGER to lynch anyone because a townie being lynched day 1 helps assure a mafia victory.

Going to openly state now that I cannot concentrate enough right now to thoroughly read this post, so I skimmed it (did the same with Pandy's, too, except the part about me) and will read again later.... But I did catch the drift, and yes, you're right, maybe I'm putting words in Boyo's mouth. That's what I got from him, but that may not be what he meant. But anyway, differing day 1 philosophy isn't of itself a reason to lynch someone. People who have played mafia far longer than yourself (myself included) can testify that the no lynch on day 1 philosophy you spout isn't inherently better than the one being argued right now. I've never played a game where we achieved a "No Lynch" vote on Day 1, and the games went just fine. Sometimes town won, sometimes scum did. It doesn't give anyone a fairer chance either way. It's just a different point of view. Get over it.

 

 

I kinda agree with Panda. Seems like you are restating everything that is happening. Feels like redundant re-statements for the most part to me. I disagree about not giving opinions, but the opinions feel muddled and hard to follow.

See, this is what is killing me here--I weigh in, add my thoughts, point out and discuss things no one else is bringing up, and yet I'm accused of regurgitation and unoriginality. You have no idea how much this is pissing me off.

 

Also, I'm not sure what's hard to follow. Maybe my organizational skills suck, which I get, but I type things out as I think them. I might try to go back and fix things to make my point clearer, but if you read my posts as thought processes in action, it shouldn't be too "muddled and hard to follow."

 

Also, I don't think I have been muddled anyway; I think that's just you. Notice how you grossly misunderstood/misrepresented the post in my last response. You either can't read or you're intentionally trying to make me look like a blathering idiot who feels the need to talk without saying anything.

 

I do that, incidentally, but usually on unimportant topics.

[Red2111]

reading now to catch up just wanted to post a thought. for having his name center in this arguement Amega sure has been quite

 

*pokes Amega*

[mmeeshal]

Also the last part here sounds a bit haughty. Words like the "philosophy you spout" aren't kind words.

In any case, like I said, its a feeling. None of this stuff is essentially wrong or bad, just seems off for you somehow. Your usually quite pleasant and I'm getting a lot of blaming and negative feelings around the board.

 

Your reactions to such a small post (kind of tongue in cheek) about moving my vote to you provoked such a strong reaction that it made me willing to place a vote for now.

To answer some of your questions, I brought up the Day 1 stuff cause I missed that whole conversation and seemed like a good way to segway to my thoughts.

 

Also, how am I being desperate? And I didn't twist your words or even really quote anything you said before this post. Now, I could understand you thinking I'm twisting your words in my posts above, but I'm just giving my honest reactions to certain things and maybe you are inadvertently giving weird vibes to me because of it. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you.

 

Also, I misspoke about shrugging it off. My meaning was more that most people wouldn't get all hopped up about it. Your reaction felt quite upset for so little words from me.

Sorry, should have also grabbed that first bit in the last response.

 

BG, you are still spouting crap. "You're usually pleasant and I'm getting a lot of blaming around the board," wth, it's mafia. First of all, that's not even true. Mafia is probably the most common place for my aggressiveness and yes, anger. I get pissed off more in mafia than anywhere else, since I take it so seriously.

Secondly, this is all meta, so I can respond in kind. I'll point to my interaction with Red in Nol's Locker Room game, or my interaction with Tina in that game. Or even my interaction with Levity when she kept saying my vote was all about Amega's D1 philosophy in this game. When something irritates me, or I'm really certain I'm right, I don't sit around looking pretty and trying not to offend people. I say what I think and I go after them. This isn't new.

 

Also meta, but the past month has been rough on me--I'm never in a good mood anymore. I'm trying not to take anything personally, and to keep it all in the game, but I'm still more likely to be blunt and aggressive about how I say things. Deal with it; it has nothing to do with this game in particular.

 

About the "haughty" comment, it wasn't meant that way. What I was saying was that it's been tested time after time and has been proven that lynching on D1 for information as opposed for strict scum-hunting works just as well as, if not better than, not lynching on D1. For support, I was saying that those of us who have played for a while can attest to that fact. If it didn't work, we wouldn't still be playing that way. I'm not trying to dis anyone, I'm just saying that Des's attitude that No Lynch makes most sense and that the traditional D1 philosophy is flawed is ridiculous, because if he was right, then everyone would have started doing that long ago. So it was pointless for him to continue using that as an excuse to call people scummy. Because it's not scummy to believe something different than yourself related to game philosophy.

 

To the Bold--it seemed really snarky, and also it came across very much like you were trying to make me look scummy for asking you why you had placed a vote. Most of my reaction that I gave to that post was based on what I talked most about--your saying that as I was in a discussion with Red you couldn't say anything....if that was a joke, it didn't come off that way.

 

To the Underlined--Please, please, read. You haven't been, can you start any time soon? I did say VERY CLEARLY that I'm not applying the term "desperate" to you. I went out of my way to say that. Why would you ignore it?

 

Yes, you're misunderstanding me, if that's actually what it is....since I've pointed out at least one glaring misunderstanding in earlier posts. I didn't say you were twisting words, but twisting how everything was seen by your reaction. How you react and what you say can definitely have an effect on how people see what you responded to.... Again, it looked to me like you were reacting as if I'd said "Why are you voting Levity?!?!? Don't do that!!!" and not just asked a simple question. As if I was saying there was something wrong with your vote--there wasn't; I just wanted to know why you placed it. Hence my reaction. Maybe I read you wrong, but that's how it looked to me.

 

Italics--meh, pretty much addressed that above--maybe it was a misunderstanding, or maybe it wasn't but you're doing a good job of backtracking.

 

Also, Hoof, are you EVER going to have any original thoughts in this game?

[mmeeshal]

And again, guys, I HATE HATE HATE it when people misrepresent my actions/words, so when they do, I go out of my way to correct the situation--I don't care if that makes me look scummy for overreaction--as long as people have their facts straight, then that's up to them to use their own judgment.

 

But too many people rely on other people's judgment and opinions without drawing their own conclusions, and I've seen really good arguments totally torn apart and ignored because some vocal people disagreed and decided to say so, and not very nicely. I've been the victim of it--I totally knew someone was scum, there were so many facts to support it, and I argued those points and I cried for the town to lynch her, but she worked very hard to discredit me by attacking my playstyle and by metagaming, and her scumbuddies TOTALLY ignored everything I was saying and acted as if what I was saying was ridiculous and a temper tantrum. No one else even acknowledged my points, someone else was lynched, I was NKed, and the mafia won.

 

Since it's happened to me first hand, and worked, I do my darnedest not to let it happen again, at least not to me.

[amegakure]

Hmmmm all im hearing is blah blah blah...amega.....scum....blah blah im not scum....blah blah blah bg scum....OMGUS VOTE....BLAH BLAH blah.

 

 

I would have to agree i believe that this was blown out of proportion with huge walls of text., although i have to agree that mafia is not a place to be if your feelings get hurt easy.

 

I dont totally believe that either is scum or town but for now i will vote mesh...

 

 

bg will be one to look after though...

 

another point i would like to go back to is leelou's comment on nolders vote...it just keeps popping out at me....

[mmeeshal]

Yeah, that right there is why I get pissed off. People can take everything someone says and totally disregard it just because the person who said it was emotional when saying it.

 

And that's not scummy. Right.

 

It's called being lazy, when it's not malicious. Lazy players are worthless. Just saying.

[amegakure]

im not disregarding anything you said i read your argument before your overreacted...you have given me no reason to believe your argument over his. Also being emotional dosent give you a free pass...take a break and then return to the game when you can rationally post your arguments... Right now calling me worthless and milacious is much worse than anything ive said... and dose not make me incline to listen to you anymore...

 

p.s. just because i said blah blah blah mesh dosent mean i didnt read all of your post...

[Nolder]

is it just me or is blackhoof agreeing with everyone?

[mmeeshal]

im not disregarding anything you said i read your argument before your overreacted...you have given me no reason to believe your argument over his. Also being emotional dosent give you a free pass...take a break and then return to the game when you can rationally post your arguments... Right now calling me worthless and milacious is much worse than anything ive said... and dose not make me incline to listen to you anymore...

 

p.s. just because i said blah blah blah mesh dosent mean i didnt read all of your post...

Fair enough. I'm not asking for a free pass, I'm just asking for people to read what I say and consider it, nothing more and nothing less.

 

And yes, I know it wasn't nice to say lazy players are useless; malicious was just my word to mean mafia in this case just FYI, not a personal attack.

 

Saying lazy players are useless is a bit extreme, but it is a sentiment I hold and I was stating it in regards to both yourself and Hoof, in this particular case. So it was nothing personal, just a statement of frustration.

 

It did feel like you were ignoring what I was saying because of my emotions--I wasn't posting only because I was frustrated, and I am not going to restate anything that I said, because I meant it all. It might have been in extreme terms, it might have come across a little crazy in tone, but I didn't make any points at all that I wouldn't make right now that I've had time to calm down. I meant it all. So the reason it sounded like you were ignoring my points was that you were implying I was only saying things because "my feelings were hurt" (which they weren't, btw) and that my walls of text were because of an overreaction. Not so. I legitimately believe everything I've said. If you don't want to give my posts any credit because of how I said them, that's what I meant by lazy (if town) or malicious (if scum).

 

If you're willing to at least take what I said seriously, then I have absolutely no quarrel with you on this particular issue, whether you believe me or not.

[Spirit1025]

No, this isn't my first game. I think it's my third time playing on here, I've played probably a few dozen games in person. It's completely different strategy-wise. I usually do really badly in person if I'm mafia because I can't keep a straight face if I have to lie and pretend I'm innocent lol. I'm normally a very quiet person in general, I don't talk a lot in person, and on here (or other forums) I read way more than I post. That's just kind of how I am. That doesn't work too well for playing mafia though, I guess, the game won't really go anywhere without talking! Or at the very least, I'll look suspicious for being too quiet...

 

What does FOS mean? I keep seeing it used and I have no idea.

[WWWwombat]

is it just me or is blackhoof agreeing with everyone?

 

Yeah, what a slimy slimeball.

[Nolder]

What does FOS mean? I keep seeing it used and I have no idea.

http://mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Fos

[Nolder]

is it just me or is blackhoof agreeing with everyone?

 

Yeah, what a slimy slimeball.

not what I was saying...

[WWWwombat]

is it just me or is blackhoof agreeing with everyone?

 

Yeah, what a slimy slimeball.

not what I was saying...

 

Then what were you trying to say?

[amegakure]

Haha wombs and hoof.are twins!!

 

 

Point taken mesh will reread tommorow..

[WWWwombat]

What?