Logains Glory

[Apotheosis]

This is my personal theory on what it will be, sorry if it's been thought of before.

 

Basing my thoughts on the idea that Rand will die, and be resurrected after, there is likely going to be a time of disarray while the forces of light try and deal with the loss. During this time, I believe that Logain will step up to the plate and assume control of the armies of the light, or at least rally them. That could possibly explain the crown Min saw while looking at him.

 

Of course, this is also based on the idea that Logain and the non - dark friend Ashaman will defeat Taim's forces.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

 

 

 

 

*edited to fixx general illegibility

[Hotncold]

Could be your idea will come to pass, but I more imagine Logain getting his glory by his heroics during the last battle, be it saving Camelyn, saving Lan, or rallying his Ashmahan after the defeat of Taim at the Black Tower.

[TheAngryDruid]

I think Logain's glory may be post LB. I think he'll be he equivalent of the Amyrlin for the males and help lead to a reconciliation of the Tower. The males will occupy Elaida's Tower, the females the old one.

 

After the battle at the BT, and the presence of Taim and the DF's, asha'man will no longer be welcome in Andor. They'll go back to the WT.

[clu7ch]

I don't often think about Logain for some reason, even though he's quite an amazing character. I am going to say I really enjoy the 'saving Camelyn' idea. It's fun, and would be pretty cool. I really enjoy watching Rand go all 'army of asha'man' on trolloc's, but I'd like to see some other guys kick ass in the final book. We don't get to see a lot of Logain's ass kicking throughout the series.

[MasterAblar]

I think Logain's glory may be post LB. I think he'll be he equivalent of the Amyrlin for the males and help lead to a reconciliation of the Tower. The males will occupy Elaida's Tower, the females the old one.

 

After the battle at the BT, and the presence of Taim and the DF's, asha'man will no longer be welcome in Andor. They'll go back to the WT.

 

The Ashaman weren't welcome in Andor to begin with. Elayne really doesn't have any power to make them move. If they want to stay where they are, they will.

[Luckers]

I think Logain's glory may be post LB. I think he'll be he equivalent of the Amyrlin for the males and help lead to a reconciliation of the Tower. The males will occupy Elaida's Tower, the females the old one.

 

After the battle at the BT, and the presence of Taim and the DF's, asha'man will no longer be welcome in Andor. They'll go back to the WT.

 

The Ashaman weren't welcome in Andor to begin with. Elayne really doesn't have any power to make them move. If they want to stay where they are, they will.

 

Well... she does have hundreds of female channelers, and a bucketload of ter'angreal--not to mention the Dragons, and an actual standing army. If she really wanted to, she could make a pretty serious pest of herself.

 

That being said, she wouldn't do that, though I am a fan of the Asha'men making the Black Tower were Elaida's Tower was to be--but I think it will be Pevara that instigates it. She'll rend the Black Tower in blood and fire, and as was foreshadowed it will ruin the land for miles around. With no reason to stay in a devestated farm, the survivors will follow Pevara back to the Tower. :)

[Suttree]

I think Logain's glory may be post LB. I think he'll be he equivalent of the Amyrlin for the males and help lead to a reconciliation of the Tower. The males will occupy Elaida's Tower, the females the old one.

 

After the battle at the BT, and the presence of Taim and the DF's, asha'man will no longer be welcome in Andor. They'll go back to the WT.

 

The Ashaman weren't welcome in Andor to begin with. Elayne really doesn't have any power to make them move. If they want to stay where they are, they will.

 

Well... she does have hundreds of female channelers, and a bucketload of ter'angreal--not to mention the Dragons, and an actual standing army. If she really wanted to, she could make a pretty serious pest of herself.

 

That being said, she wouldn't do that, though I am a fan of the Asha'men making the Black Tower were Elaida's Tower was to be--but I think it will be Pevara that instigates it. She'll rend the Black Tower in blood and fire, and as was foreshadowed it will ruin the land for miles around. With no reason to stay in a devestated farm, the survivors will follow Pevara back to the Tower. :)

 

As you know I am with you on this Luckers, seriously looking forward to Pevara's moment of awesome. She is one fing cool red!

[MasterAblar]

I think Logain's glory may be post LB. I think he'll be he equivalent of the Amyrlin for the males and help lead to a reconciliation of the Tower. The males will occupy Elaida's Tower, the females the old one.

 

After the battle at the BT, and the presence of Taim and the DF's, asha'man will no longer be welcome in Andor. They'll go back to the WT.

 

The Ashaman weren't welcome in Andor to begin with. Elayne really doesn't have any power to make them move. If they want to stay where they are, they will.

 

Well... she does have hundreds of female channelers, and a bucketload of ter'angreal--not to mention the Dragons, and an actual standing army. If she really wanted to, she could make a pretty serious pest of herself.

 

That being said, she wouldn't do that, though I am a fan of the Asha'men making the Black Tower were Elaida's Tower was to be--but I think it will be Pevara that instigates it. She'll rend the Black Tower in blood and fire, and as was foreshadowed it will ruin the land for miles around. With no reason to stay in a devestated farm, the survivors will follow Pevara back to the Tower. :)

 

Oh, she could make a pest of herself for sure. In fact I think she threatened to do so with Taim in WH if I remember correctly. Something about forcing them to travel for food. But she admited herself to the the Lords and Ladies of Andor that there really wasn't really anything she could do apart from pretend she had some authority over them by sending some guards to ride around the BT. As for her abilities to fight against them, well she can't, and doesn't want to anyway, order the Kin to fight the Ashaman as they would simply be enemies of Andor, and fighting the enemies of Andor isn't part of the Kin's job description. Even if she could get them to fight well, while they would be useful, their fighting abilities sort of pale before those of the Ashaman. I guess they could practise though.

If I'm not mistaken, the dragons are only used by the Band until the end of their contract. And convincing Mat to fight the Ashaman would be just as impressive as actually forcing the Ashaman out of Andor.

As for the standing army, that would be a small nuissance at best. If she can't get them inside the BT, they're all but useless. In the end, while she could make a pest of herself, she would probably be causing more harm to Andor than to the BT.

 

Well, I have a number of problems with Elaida's Tower as the new BT. First of all, the ruining the land for miles around is just you're interpretation of Elaida's foretelling right, because the "rending" of the BT could much more mild than that. And if there's no reason to move, well, they won't.

However, even if the BT was utterly devastated and litteraly nothing is left of it, that doesn't change the fact that the Ashaman and Aes Sedai hate each other's guts. How Egwene or whoever end up leading the Ashaman after the rending of the BT is convinced is beyond me. For Egwene it's like saying that the Ashaman are equal to the Aes Sedai, and for the Ashaman it's going into the heart of the Aes Sedai's power. Both are unlikely to accept that.

Also, the Elaida's Tower isn't even built yet, and construction has probably stopped. Are the Ashaman supposed to sleep on the ground until it's finished, or at least until it's possible to live in it? Again I doubt they'll accept that.

 

Overall, between the Ashaman's pride and the Aes Sedai's disdain of them, and 3000 years of hate and prejudice, it would just seem way to easy for both groups to forget everything and start working together again. Even if they don't work together living in the same city peacefully would be just as bad in my opinion. I mean come on! I can just see one of the Brown ajah coming up to the Ashaman and saying: "So we've got this plan to build a huge floating sphere that would be floating above the ground. It would be a research institute..."

 

As an aside, since the Aes Sedai dealt with their infestation themselves, I'd really prefer for it to be the same among the Ashaman. So, while I can see Pevara helping getting the word out, I hope she doesn't, and I don't see how she could anyway, lead the fighting against Taim and the dark Ashaman.

[David Selig]

I've always thought the Asha'man would be better off establishing their base somewhere in the vast lands which aren't claimed by any country. Less potential for conflicts with the White Tower, unlike the current situation, where they are a few miles of the capital of a country with traditionally close ties with the Aes Sedai and whose current queen is an Aes Sedai. The Asha'man can even build their own city like the Aes Sedai did.

[MasterAblar]

I've always thought the Asha'man would be better off establishing their base somewhere in the vast lands which aren't claimed by any country. Less potential for conflicts with the White Tower, unlike the current situation, where they are a few miles of the capital of a country with traditionally close ties with the Aes Sedai and whose current queen is an Aes Sedai. The Asha'man can even build their own city like the Aes Sedai did.

 

Well, that's actually what I think too, but I just don't think the Ashaman would bother with moving now that the BT is fairly developed, unless they absolutely have too.

[clu7ch]

Over their dead bodies, so to speak

[Negawonka]

I always figured the Black Tower would be rent in fire and blood as a result of the war between the two factions - not as a result of Aes Sedai work. Lets not forget how much stronger male channelers are as opposed to female channelers - roughly the same proportions as male to female physical strength is. While there are some impressively strong females, it is rare for them to be able to bench press 150 lbs or so but it is only uncommon for a male to be able to do so. Working with the power is probably similar to fighting with fists and legs (although I haven't seen any martial prowess described when weaving) so it really comes down to skill - but the Asha'man have that over the Aes Sedai as well. No I would suspect it would take 2 to 1 odds for Aes Sedai to rend the Black Tower in fire and blood and that simply wont happen.

 

The exchange between Pevara and one of Taim's special coterie would go something like this:

 

Pevara skidded to a halt seeing the man in the large black coat sitting on a bench enjoying a relaxing read in the shade. She sniffed and began to weave death in his direction when he looked up from the book and frowned at her. That was when the entire world went black for her.

 

Birds flew away at the noise which sounded as if a giant watermelon had been struck by lightning.

 

While I am sure it would be a little more in depth that would be the gist of it.

[FarShainMael]

Of course, we saw exactly this scenario in LoC 51, when Coiren et al decided most unwisely to take on the Dragon Reborn. He balefired the lot of them and walked away grinning.

 

...er, no, that's not right..

 

/sarky

 

I just hope Pevara has a box handy!

[Never]

Of course, we saw exactly this scenario in LoC 51, when Coiren et al decided most unwisely to take on the Dragon Reborn. He balefired the lot of them and walked away grinning.

 

...er, no, that's not right..

 

/sarky

 

I just hope Pevara has a box handy!

 

 

So, what you're saying is that as long as the Aes Sedai outnumber the Asha'man 13 to 1, they will win?

[Never]

Of course, we saw exactly this scenario in LoC 51, when Coiren et al decided most unwisely to take on the Dragon Reborn. He balefired the lot of them and walked away grinning.

 

...er, no, that's not right..

 

/sarky

 

I just hope Pevara has a box handy!

 

 

So, what you're saying is that as long as the Aes Sedai outnumber the Asha'man 13 to 1, they will win?

[MasterAblar]

The reason why I can't see the Aes Sedai blowing the BT to smitherings doesn't have anything to do with the difference in strength. Dexterity is supposed to make up for lesser strength. That said, perhaps strength is better in battle. I would also point out that great strength or great dexterity doesn't neccesarily mean incredible fighter. Look at Aginor. Being good in battle goes past your channeling abilities.

 

Regardless the reason why I don't see the Aes Sedai really having a chance against the Asha'man, is simply because the Asha'man are trained for battle, and for battle only. They're made to be living weapons who blast everything out of their way, and their training is pretty much a living hell. Aes Sedai training is much more general, and focused on all around skills and abilities. Not to mention people are terrified of male channelers, a fear that is deeply ingrained.

[FarShainMael]

Of course, we saw exactly this scenario in LoC 51, when Coiren et al decided most unwisely to take on the Dragon Reborn. He balefired the lot of them and walked away grinning.

 

...er, no, that's not right..

 

/sarky

 

I just hope Pevara has a box handy!

 

 

So, what you're saying is that as long as the Aes Sedai outnumber the Asha'man 13 to 1, they will win?

 

I'm saying they can win if they use strategy and tactics. Which may well involve a 13-circle; or a kettle full of forkroot tea; or an ambush; or..

 

could be an interesting subject for a thread, that.

[DemandredFO]

Pevara and the other reds still loyal(if any) ARE reds. They specialize in capturing men who can channel, and linking with Ashaman would help. It will only be pevara's group and possibly Myrelle's group, if they can get inside. If Perrin makes his attack when the showdown begins that might be a distraction if some of Taim's men are in TAR guarding the Dreamspike.

[FarShainMael]

And then there's this, from Star Trek: The Next Generation, episode 'Peak Performance':

 

Riker: You're outmanned, you're outgunned, you're outequipped - what else have you got?

Worf: Guile.

[MasterAblar]

And then there's this, from Star Trek: The Next Generation, episode 'Peak Performance':

 

Riker: You're outmanned, you're outgunned, you're outequipped - what else have you got?

Worf: Guile.

 

Problem is Taim is certainly no fool. So I'm not sure they would have the advantage in guile.

[FarShainMael]

Hey, he's (almost certainly and at the very least) a DF! Since when have any of them shown any sort of intelligent cunning?? Or shown themselves able to recognise it?

[Negawonka]

Pevara is going to escape, join with someone strong enough to actually do the deed, or be destroyed. Oh sure she can try to outsmart 400+ people with her motley crew of Aes Sedai (a lot of which are probably turned and she doesn't know that). I can try to outsmart the government on my taxes by claiming to be 13 disabled people too.

[FarShainMael]

We frequently hear reports of people in the UK doing something very similar.. (making fraudulent claims, that is)

[Rcurran]

We frequently hear reports of people in the UK doing something very similar.. (making fraudulent claims, that is)

 

It's the Edinburgh festival you want if you're looking for someone pretending to be 13 disabled people.

[ptolemy99]

Maybe Logain's glory will be to unite the two towers and become the first t'amyrlin of the new age.