Aviendah's next move

[Neophyte]

Plus Padra makes a point of thinking that it's about 16 years since the Last Battle. Rand's kids are teenagers.

 

Also, Bruan is still alive. I doubt he made it to 150 or so.

[Elisaroth]

i re Read that part of avi future vision. Picked up lines that felt important.

 

 

-reentering waste-

1+3 blood lines from dragon. along whit aviendha will be 3 more bloodlines to dragon. avi child + 2 elyene child + 1 min child ?? wich 3 of them are dead when all fall to empire means andor and min child are in randland somewhere in ruling posision.

real truing point was entrance of other nations and made ravens able to collar more casters. this lead me think that dragon peace pact was that raven empire may not collar AS who is not in raven empire lands.

andoran war machines (dragons) lead to new hiss spear.

rand abound Aile and disappear but not mention he died. intresting

-3th generation from SG-

queen of talana - related to dragon blood. Means at least ely child rule but 40 years there is 3th generation drakand on throne mean there has been "Intresting time in andor"

40 years of war and andor has not been tuched. "indicate that dragon peace hold then again it might be just becose ael assault has hold them back"

u still carry spear ? this sounded odd like there was some indication that dragon had asked aiel to give spear and they have just ignored it completly

they are inviter who made dragon bow to empress. "looks like bow to crystal throne will be just bow to empress but then again alot cases they are same when i have read Seanchan parts"

plans to attack andor along whit assassination of queen, along whit tear illian two rivers contingency plans. no carine mentioned?. this show that two rivers will have major city again. illian i wonder if min has something to do whit that. and min blood line to dragon.

court of the sun-future of white cloacks in carine ? more and more i think that ely will push galad as steward of carine along whit white cloaks who understanding of world has changed allot during LB become more like enforcers of justice and law in dragon peace area.

if plans fail they leave wet landers to be conquered and go back to waste >.< lol how true that line is

 

 

Well what i see is Aiel need rejoin whit Covent they abandoned or they will be destroyed. Dedicated to peace again once for all and not be offended by losing wise ones to ravens.

wise ones who can channel could use binder to swear to hold peace Or make rule to enter radian colloms twice to keep aiel on track. Or make Prophecy like thing that eny clan who dont swear to peace will be hunted down until none of them are left.

 

All so some event during LB example who die and who live might change that future vision. anyway i see that this vision show that Aiel is only one who are relay at drift whit no course after LB.

[thisguy]

The 4 bloodlines she mentioned happened to be the 4 children of Rand and Aviendha. They had two girls and two boys.

 

Cairhien is mentioned at some point - they mention the Sun Throne. I don't remember thinking that the White Cloaks were there. I don't remember them being mentioned at all. If they are still around at that point, my guess is that their headquarters would be in Mayene.

[Elisaroth]

ok let me think. ---- 4 children from avi mean atleast close 3 and half year constant pregnancy . does rand intend to fight last battle or conquer hes 3 lovers beds ????.

 

nvm 4 children at once but somthing is odd about it hmm

[Neophyte]

ok let me think. ---- 4 children from avi mean atleast close 3 and half year constant pregnancy . does rand intend to fight last battle or conquer hes 3 lovers beds ????.

 

nvm 4 children at once but somthing is odd about it hmm

 

Aviendha's four children are quadruplets. They are all the same age, the result of a single pregnancy.

[ArveduiEreinion]

I can't see the Aiel that were not taken by the bleakness to swear off on violence. Maybe over generations. And the whole Aiel rediscovering Singing or the Song is doubtful to me. Maybe one or a few will but I was talking about how the Aiel were to avoid being scavengers. And from what I read Aviendha's daughter attacked the Seanchan that did not attack them first. That act seemed to be the official start to the Aiel's downfall. Prior to that they mentioned they were having Talks to free the Aiel and Wise Ones captured but something vauge Happened to Fortuona. This resulted in someone taking her place that would not return the prisoners....not likely Matt since Matt is on good terms with the Aiel.

 

It's not about what bad ass thing she does next. What will be the reason for the Aiel after the Last Battle is. And what is so bad about the Aiel having the purpose of defending people against those who do violence after the Dragon Treaty? It's not like they are rent a cops. They have a strong sence of honor and they hold true to their beliefs even if it brings them physical harm. They would be a perfect type of people to do such a thing. Something like this could have even been foreshadowed in the Shadow Rising when Rhuarc took the knives from Faile and Berlaine because they were violating a rule in the Stone by fighting. I won't look for the exact passage but I know most of you know what this is. He was defending some rule or law of no violence. Later in the series Rand used the Aiel for just that purpose to police the streets. So that's twice Robert Jordan showed the Aiel can be used as a police type of force.

 

And for the person who mentioned the Aiel will serve the Tower again....well that might also point toward the Aiel serving the world as protectors since Egwene wants to get back to the true purpose of the Ajahs. Just because the idea is not some great wonderful outcome for the Aiel its better than what Aviendha saw.

 

Coffe_Gurl has the right of it, I think. I'm surprised more people don't see her logic. First, let's dispose of the idea that the Aiel will change their culture overnight. It's not going to happen, they will not follow the Way of the Leaf, etc. Second, the post-Last Battle Aiel lacked purpose because they were excluded from the Dragon's Peace. FInally, "a remnant of a remnant" could refer to the size of the Aiel in the immediate aftermath of the Last Battle but it could also refer to a distant vision of the Aiel. I tend to favor the latter because the Aiel could have a role to play post-Last Battle and they could gradually die/inter-marry with non-Aiel to the point that only a fraction of "true" Aiel remain at some point in the future.

 

So, now to Cofe_Gurl's logic. We know that the Aiel were servants in the AoL though it might be better to say that they found a purpose in public service. Aviendha's vision shows that the Aiel, post Last Battle, would be tempted to find purpose in violence/warfare/warrior ethos. This temptation is only increased by their exclusion from the Dragon's Peace. So, Rand could give them a purpose, that essentially comports with their current nature, by having them enforce the peace. Given the current state of Randland, it seems like they could provide a credible threat to anyone who chose to breach the peace for the foreseeable future. The beauty of this idea is that the commitment to "peace", as the Wheel turned, could eventually lead to the Aiel culture we know from the AoL.

 

One last thought: I think Fionwe is wrong on this one. One need only think of his idea from the Seanchan point of view. The Seanchan are already deeply suspicious of the motives of the White Tower. They also likely think that Rand's Aiel are the most potent non-channeler force in Randland. How could the Seanchan stand by while these two forces joined together or see their union as anything but aimed at the Corenne?

[thisguy]

I'd just like to say, if Rand doesn't have sex with Aviendha before the LB, he's going to live or be resurrected for sure.

[Neophyte]

I'd just like to say, if Rand doesn't have sex with Aviendha before the LB, he's going to live or be resurrected for sure.

 

Maybe she has sex with his Tel'aran'rhiod self after he gets killed, and that's why her kids have funky powers?

 

Does anyone know - if you go to Tel'aran'rhiod in the flesh and have sex, can you actually get pregnant?

[thisguy]

I'd just like to say, if Rand doesn't have sex with Aviendha before the LB, he's going to live or be resurrected for sure.

 

Maybe she has sex with his Tel'aran'rhiod self after he gets killed, and that's why her kids have funky powers?

 

Does anyone know - if you go to Tel'aran'rhiod in the flesh and have sex, can you actually get pregnant?

 

I can't, but I'm a man. Maybe, we should ask the ladies.

 

Actually, I think if you're there in the flesh in TAR your body functions should work pretty much as they do here. Just my opinion.

[Neophyte]

I can't, but I'm a man. Maybe, we should ask the ladies.

 

Actually, I think if you're there in the flesh in TAR your body functions should work pretty much as they do here. Just my opinion.

 

If a Tel'aran'rhiod knife can cut your real flesh and blood arm, in a way that lasts when you return to the "real world," then I can't think of a physiological reason why a Tel'aran'rhiod sperm can't fertilize your real egg, in a way that lasts when you return to the "real world." But hey, the authors could have a different take on it.

[Elisaroth]

emm..

BTT:What if remnant of remnant is aiel who throw away spears and joined tinkers ? they crowded around ebu dar making them safe unless ravens are brutal enough to scatter them there as well.

[Maleshub]

The Aiel know that all of them will die if they do not follow Rand in the Last Battle. Their effort is to save as many of their people as possible, which won't be much. The Aiel nation will be the ultimate sacrifice to save humanity. How they will get around to saving the remnant is a tangled mess. There are so many loose ends: bleakness, Shaido, Aiel still in the Waste (the clans that followed Rand left enough to defend holds and herds) as well as those still with Rand. It all depends on what a remnant means!

 

Aviendha's next move is obviously talking with Rand about what he needs to do to save the Aiel. She met the Wise Ones and they have all but gave her the task of convincing Rand to take better care of the Aiel and not make a fatal mistake of misunderstanding them. Only a few months to wait and find out.

[b3arz3rg3r]

emm..

BTT:What if remnant of remnant is aiel who throw away spears and joined tinkers ? they crowded around ebu dar making them safe unless ravens are brutal enough to scatter them there as well.

 

They aren't. They are part of the deadwood. The Tinkers are doomed anyways. They managed to retain their culture because of their nomadic way of life. Now that they are actually settling down, the Tinkers will lose their special cultural identity in short order. In a hundred years or so there probably won't be much left of the "Travelling People".

[ArveduiEreinion]

Quick thought: the Aiel that Aviendha sees in her viewing are in Arad Doman. Why wouldn't they consider populating the Two Rivers? In TSR, Gaul makes a comment about how the area around Manetheren's waygate appears more like the "wetlands" he imagined before crossing the Dragonwall. As the People of the Dragon, why not remove to where the Dragon Reborn was raised? It's isolated, though less so now, from the rest of the world. Also, it would be apart of a special region where the Aiel might be welcomed by Andor as a strong ally. From there, the Aiel could enforce the Dragon's Peace.

[Elisaroth]

Problem isint location but aiel belef and they understanding. Rand need give aiel job that never disappear. example they have toh before AS becose they were sworn servants of AS before brakeing and broke that promise etc.

 

Then again they rand culd say that LB will clean toh for leavin leaf. But if they continue to brake peace they will earn new toh before world. That way they cant go in battle unless they earn toh.

 

 

Now that i think about it aiel prophecy told that they served AS and if they fail AS again they will be destroyed. (might this was ment to be to avoid that future what aiel atm dift awey becose of they understanding of AS has changed)

 

If rand tell them to serve AS again as last AOL AS who is not turned to shadow that they need serve AS again as AOL or they will be destroyed it would work i think.

[TootThatHorn]

Avi's immediate next move; marry Rand, probably in some kind of multi ceremony with Elayne and Min. She said she couldn't marry him being an apprentice as she couldn't bring any honor to the marriage but now that is possible. I think then Min and Elayne will defer the night to Avi where they will consumate the marriage and Avi will get pregnant. Then some pillow talk will lead to how to change the fate of the Aiel.

[jmniles]

I think I said this on another thread but I'll post it here anyway. We have to look at this in a way that makes sense in our own times as well. I don't think it is possible for the Aiel to avoid being forced into a position that they are left with out purpose. They have to get to the point where they are still warriors with a still warriors with a strong sense of honor but with no purpose beyond their own survival. That and the obvious parralels between the Ravens and the Romans and the conquest of Gaul.