The Seven Striped-Lass

[Slick Mongoose]

OK, but in theory it wouldn't take more than a day or two for a traveller to deliver a load of letters, and the attack didn't take long.

 

I don't know how long it would take to ride from Tar Valon to Caemlyn, but if it's more than 7-8 days then we're relying on a traveller - maybe an Aes Sedai going to give the news to Elayne gets overheard by a servant, or an undercover Asha'man, or possibly the rumours are being deliberately spread by Seanchan agents to make the tower look weak.

 

It's not too hard to come up with explanations for these things. It's perfectly possible that something coming up in the books will show the timeline here to be screwed, but I haven't seen anything definitive so far.

[yoniy0]

Slick, take a look at Steven Cooper's WoT Chronology. He based it on the books alone.

According to Team Jordan, he tends to be quite accurate, though there are mistakes here and there, so it's by no means cannon. Still, he puts Mat's meeting with Verin on May 5th, and Verin's death on May 31st. If you want to understand how he came by those dates, reading the commentary might help. It's all too complex for me to follow, but I trust his judgment.

[Slick Mongoose]

I can't see a link to a detailed commentary, am I being an idiot? The author does admit to a lot of ambiguity on the title page.

 

What we need, I guess, is some ambiguity in how long Mat spends getting from Ebou Dar to Trustair. That spans several months and 3 and a half books, so there must be a few weeks in there somewhere.

 

Although really going into the detail of it is more effort than i'm willing to put in, but if things seem to me to work out OK, then I don't really have a problem. It's not like Erikson with his baby to 5-year-old in a few months.

[yoniy0]

No, you're not being dense, that's what I meant. Take a look at the moon markings next to the different dates, that might help you farther if you're willing to do the leg work and check where Steven got them from. Also, he adds a question mark to occurrences that he can't pinpoint.

[Slick Mongoose]

Unfortunately the moon is screwed up over books 9 & 10, which is a period we need.

[mossman87]

Unfortunately the moon is screwed up over books 9 & 10, which is a period we need.

 

You'll drive yourself nuts trying to figure this out. Wait til the book is out, and the book tour questions start coming in and you'll have your answer most likely.

[Gor]

OK, but is there an in-book reason why the timeline is messed up? Without relying on statements from team Jordan? A thousand apologies if i've missed it.

 

IMO there isn't. If read as though Verin completed her business in a day or 2 - instead of 30 - everything written timeline-wise makes perfect sense. Guess we'll just have to wait and see though.

[yoniy0]

I think there is, you're just not looking far enough back. We have a basis for synchronizing the different timelines in the Cleansing of the Source, which everyone felt. If I'm not very mistaken, there's ample reason to believe Rand's and Egwene's timelines at the end of KoD are about one month ahead of those of the others. Perrin's timeline barely moved ahead by a day during TGS, but I'm not sure what if any mentions of time we have for Mat (i.e. how long it's been from the time he left Tuon to his meeting with Verin). That's the reason I find it easiest to just trust in Steven Cooper.

[Gor]

I think there is, you're just not looking far enough back. We have a basis for synchronizing the different timelines in the Cleansing of the Source, which everyone felt. If I'm not very mistaken, there's ample reason to believe Rand's and Egwene's timelines at the end of KoD are about one month ahead of those of the others. Perrin's timeline barely moved ahead by a day during TGS, but I'm not sure what if any mentions of time we have for Mat (i.e. how long it's been from the time he left Tuon to his meeting with Verin). That's the reason I find it easiest to just trust in Steven Cooper.

 

I suppose, but Mat did a LOT of things in KoD and tGS. He could very easily have caught up to Rand and Egwene's timeline (at the least to only be a week or so behind them).

[Zyntras]

concerning Elayne:

 

could it be that she is not in Caemlyn atm, but in Cairhien to lay her claim to the throne there?

[Phariah]

eh ok chapter but definately good lead in though.

 

have only 2 choices i would find appropriate for the victim. the man servant Lopin or finally killing off Olver. need a real good innocent's death and Olver fits it well. something to really goad Mat into action.

[Lisa Campbell]

concerning Elayne:

 

could it be that she is not in Caemlyn atm, but in Cairhien to lay her claim to the throne there?

 

 

Wasn't there something in one of her most recent POV's that mentioned the Sun Throne? You could be onto something there. What made you think it?

[Zyntras]

concerning Elayne:

 

could it be that she is not in Caemlyn atm, but in Cairhien to lay her claim to the throne there?

 

 

Wasn't there something in one of her most recent POV's that mentioned the Sun Throne? You could be onto something there. What made you think it?

 

well acoms razor =>

 

she wants to see Mat => she does not meet with mat => she does not know he is in camlyn => notes got sent to her => she did not get the notes => she is not in caemlyn => where would she go by herself?

 

a) Cairhien (Sun Throne)

b) Tar Valon (aknowledge Amyrlin / meet rand [feels him up there through bond and an important change] if the timeline is correct)

c) Tear (if its ealier in the timeline => meet rand because she feels he needs her (going crazy and all)

 

considering that she tries always to follow her duty i think a) is the most likely

 

(but i also like the nori DF thingy ^^ i dont beliefe it though)

[Lisa Campbell]

Yeah I think Norry is suspect too. We know that he has held back information from Elayne before from that time when he decides give her a spy report because Elayne reminded him of her mother. Maybe he just realised she's not just a pretty face and worries that she'll find out and he'll get busted if he doesn't blab... this time.

[Maji]

I'm sure someone has probably said this since before and I missed it but I wonder if Elayne could possibly be off in Tar Valon taking the Aes Sedai testing (to make it formal/official ascension to her position) and/or using the Oath Rod for the 3 Oathes.

 

There's still the possibility of Graendal but I'm not convinced Graendal knows about Elayne and if he is going to target any of Rand's pretties, it's going to be Min.

[Arthur55]

Is Matt using his real name when contacting Elayne. If he was to use his real name and there were DF near Elayne I believe they would come straight for him. As there is none of that happening at the present time we can deduce that it is something else that is keeping Matt from and audience with Elayne. Her absents from Caemlyn, I doubt that, may be someone in her palace is restricting access to her. I have no idea. One things for sure Matt's loosing time on Alura's project.

[DemandredFO]

Concerning Elayne and Tar Valon. I hope she's not stupid enough to possibly endanger the kids by taking the oaths, or has enough backbone to stand up to Egwene if she insists. I wouldn't put it past Egwene to try to bully a pregnant Elayne into swearing on the binder; after all, Egwene wants to possibly kill Kin just so they can be on the same level as AS.

Regarding Elayne and Mat. She could not be there because of the sun throne or someone's a DF. We know Duhara is and there are probably others. Sun throne is more likely but DF is possible too.

[TheAngryDruid]

Concerning Elayne and Tar Valon. I hope she's not stupid enough to possibly endanger the kids by taking the oaths, or has enough backbone to stand up to Egwene if she insists. I wouldn't put it past Egwene to try to bully a pregnant Elayne into swearing on the binder; after all, Egwene wants to possibly kill Kin just so they can be on the same level as AS.

Regarding Elayne and Mat. She could not be there because of the sun throne or someone's a DF. We know Duhara is and there are probably others. Sun throne is more likely but DF is possible too.

 

You know, if Elayne doesn't retake the oaths due to her pregnancy, she could be the most dangerous female channeler around (when she can channel, that is).

[Zyntras]

Is Matt using his real name when contacting Elayne. If he was to use his real name and there were DF near Elayne I believe they would come straight for him. As there is none of that happening at the present time we can deduce that it is something else that is keeping Matt from and audience with Elayne. Her absents from Caemlyn, I doubt that, may be someone in her palace is restricting access to her. I have no idea.

One things for sure Matt's loosing time on Alura's project.

 

which would be a good thing in my opinion, NOT inventing canons > inventing canons... i think it would be awsome if aludra is killed of and gunpowder stays unknown for a couple more years

 

 

Concerning Elayne and Tar Valon. I hope she's not stupid enough to possibly endanger the kids by taking the oaths, or has enough backbone to stand up to Egwene if she insists. I wouldn't put it past Egwene to try to bully a pregnant Elayne into swearing on the binder; after all, Egwene wants to possibly kill Kin just so they can be on the same level as AS.

Regarding Elayne and Mat. She could not be there because of the sun throne or someone's a DF. We know Duhara is and there are probably others. Sun throne is more likely but DF is possible too.

 

You know, if Elayne doesn't retake the oaths due to her pregnancy, she could be the most dangerous female channeler around (when she can channel, that is).

 

why is that ? (there aremany channeleres out there who are stronger and know nasty weaves,too (i.e. alivia))

[Auld Manriva]

You know, if Elayne doesn't retake the oaths due to her pregnancy, she could be the most dangerous female channeler around (when she can channel, that is).

 

why is that ? (there aremany channeleres out there who are stronger and know nasty weaves,too (i.e. alivia))

 

I think TAD means dangerous as in not bound by the oath rod. She could HUNT actively, not wait until threatened directly. Also.. there are only SOME, by no means many stronger or more knowledgeable. Alivia, Nyn, the Seafolk lass (but she doesn't KNOW squat) are about it stronger and thats merely a few, not many. Eggs and Avi are pretty much on level with Elayne and remember... Nyn and Elayne had Moggy teach them some "very nasty" weaves. Not for weapons so much but so they could know them and learn/devise counters....

 

I'm with ya' TAD on Elayne not taking the Oaths and really.. I think her chin would lift and she'd assume the "haughty" position and say "Mother's milk in a cup Egwene... mother. We agreed on this and I am NOT going to bind myself with the Oath Rod. I'm the Bloody QUEEN of Andor! And if you're going to deny me being Aes Sedai now for not touching that filthy thing ... then you can go boil Trolloc Guts." or something more colorful.

 

 

But she IS preggers after all, so this is all probably a moot point.

[Zyntras]

You know, if Elayne doesn't retake the oaths due to her pregnancy, she could be the most dangerous female channeler around (when she can channel, that is).

 

why is that ? (there aremany channeleres out there who are stronger and know nasty weaves,too (i.e. alivia))

 

I think TAD means dangerous as in not bound by the oath rod. She could HUNT actively, not wait until threatened directly. Also.. there are only SOME, by no means many stronger or more knowledgeable. Alivia, Nyn, the Seafolk lass (but she doesn't KNOW squat) are about it stronger and thats merely a few, not many. Eggs and Avi are pretty much on level with Elayne and remember... Nyn and Elayne had Moggy teach them some "very nasty" weaves. Not for weapons so much but so they could know them and learn/devise counters....

 

I'm with ya' TAD on Elayne not taking the Oaths and really.. I think her chin would lift and she'd assume the "haughty" position and say "Mother's milk in a cup Egwene... mother. We agreed on this and I am NOT going to bind myself with the Oath Rod. I'm the Bloody QUEEN of Andor! And if you're going to deny me being Aes Sedai now for not touching that filthy thing ... then you can go boil Trolloc Guts." or something more colorful.

 

 

But she IS preggers after all, so this is all probably a moot point.

 

 

true enough,

 

but she already is bound by something - for her - even stronger then the oath rod; to her people and the throne of andor; i do not think she will endanger her possition by going out *hunting*

 

but lets assume she does. She does know very nasty weaves and is one of the strongest channelers there are. And she has no concept of danger or tactics (in combat) or expirience (in fighting other channelers) or common sense.

 

Dont get me wrong i LIKE Elayne, but i just dont think she is a good *fighter*.

 

In my opinnion the best thing she could do, if she wants to fight, is to creat ter'angreal and provide an infrastructer for weapon production (like the Dragons [which i dont like, but it would be a strong weapon])

 

at the last battle she then can lead her people and encourage them if it comes to fighting shadowspawn etc. ...

[Maji]

Concerning Elayne and Tar Valon. I hope she's not stupid enough to possibly endanger the kids by taking the oaths, or has enough backbone to stand up to Egwene if she insists. I wouldn't put it past Egwene to try to bully a pregnant Elayne into swearing on the binder; after all, Egwene wants to possibly kill Kin just so they can be on the same level as AS.

Regarding Elayne and Mat. She could not be there because of the sun throne or someone's a DF. We know Duhara is and there are probably others. Sun throne is more likely but DF is possible too.

 

You know, if Elayne doesn't retake the oaths due to her pregnancy, she could be the most dangerous female channeler around (when she can channel, that is).

 

Because of the hormones going crazy? Or just because Elayne is crazy? Either way, if we pitted Elayne vs Aviendha, my money is on Aviendha and that she will win that fight 10/10. Aviendha is definitely more deadly, with or without the power, she has her own an'greal now too. She is also (and never will be since she is a Wise One) constricted by the Oathes.

[Zyntras]

btw who else thinks mat has to decide between moirain and verin ?

 

tPoD Ch 15:

 

“Mat, weighing two Aes Sedai on a huge set of balance scales, and on his decision depended....She could not say what; something vast; the world, perhaps.”

“Recently, all of her dreams about Mat were pale and full of pain, like shadows cast by nightmares, almost as though Mat himself were not quite real.”

[Cyf]

I am more wondering if the Finn, being more or less analogues to old-world fey and not the Disney stuff, have it as a joke and test to screw him over. There's two Moiraines. He gets to pick one. What if he chooses the wrong one, whoops? If he chooses the wrong one, perhaps it's a Finn actually able to walk the world and screw things up.

[Terez]

btw who else thinks mat has to decide between moirain and verin ?

Likely either Moiraine and Verin, or Moiraine and Elayne. I am thinking it's more likely to be the latter, because of the gholam.