New Spring: Elaida & the girls

[Beer Rot]

Why on earth would Elaida want Moiraine/Siuan to pass the test she would go to such lengths?

 

Did she have the hots for Moiraine?  Maybe she wanted them to feel a sense of gratitude after they pass, but for why?

 

 

Just doesn't fit in with "Elaida".

[Vicious Circle]

Maybe she was jealous of their potential and hoped they would burn out.

[mb]

Another possibility for the reason might be so that Moiraine and Siuan would join her Ajah.

 

I doubt 'having the hots for Moiraine'.

That other could be likely.

 

Like another poster, jealousy could be another likely reason.

 

[Vicious Circle]

Of course, it might be because she's a psyco and her zealotry just happened to get focused on them at the time.

[Vicious Circle]

Oops, dropped my h, that's "psycho" as in Elaida.

[Summer]

Maybe she's psychic and knew that Siuan was going to be the Amyrlin one day, and took like 22 years to plan her rise to power.  Moiraine was just an extra.

[mb]

As far as I am aware, Elaida had no prior knowledge that Siuan would become Amyrlin.

 

Elaida's actions seem to indicate that she was not psycho.

 

[Vicious Circle]

I meant psycho in the sense that she rabidly thinks she is doing the right things but they turn out to be for all the wrong reasons or intents.

[JenniferL]

I've always assumed that Elaida had a Foretelling that Siuan and Moiraine were going to be important somehow.

[Vicious Circle]

Did you feel that was implied in the books at the time?

[Agitel]

Did you feel that was implied in the books at the time?

 

No, but it is a possibility. Otherwise, Elaida doesn't seem to make friends easily, her relationship with Moiraine and Siuan up to that point was probably a little odd, maybe she felt some kind of kinship for them, or she wanted to be able to point to their fast progress and be able to claim some of their success.

 

 

[amy93]

No, but it is a possibility. Otherwise, Elaida doesn't seem to make friends easily, her relationship with Moiraine and Siuan up to that point was probably a little odd, maybe she felt some kind of kinship for them, or she wanted to be able to point to their fast progress and be able to claim some of their success.

 

I agree.

 

Also we have to remember that Elaida wants the Tower to be whole and strong, so maybe that's why she took Moir and Siuan under her protection, to make sure they both pass the test.

Perhaps she thought she still had a chance to make them choose the Red Ajah, who knows..

Or maybe she's just sadic and enjoys exerting power over people, especially people who should be stronger than her lol

 

 

 

[mb]

I've always assumed that Elaida had a Foretelling that Siuan and Moiraine were going to be important somehow.

Something in the notes or some scene in the books?

If in books, where?

 

[Beer Rot]

Only problem about that is the fact that we don't hear about her trying to help anyone else.

 

Remember that Ellid had just almost as much potential, did almost everything right the first time.. and didn't make it out of the testing.  If Elaida had trained her as well, maybe she would've survived.

[Paerish Swar]

I don't have the books close to find the quote right now, but there was an Aes Sedai who made the comment that Elaida was particularly harsh on her favorites.

 

I totally think that Elaida was crushing on either Siuan or Moiraine, most likely Siuan.  When Elaida gets in trouble (and is somewhat humiliated) after she "helps" prepare them for the test for the shawl, she seems to think that the girls betrayed her.  Then she turns her massive crush in to a massive hatred.  Elaida has always been a woman of extreme emotions.

 

I always thought that Elaida's comment to Siuan that she was never fit to be Amyrlin went a little beyond just hatred.  It almost felt like her saying, "I was always the most fit to be Amyrlin, and you, Siuan, were never fit to be my lover - you ungrateful heartbreaker!"

 

That's just my impression of it.

[divinorum]

When I read it I assumed Jordan simply wanted to establish the grounds for Elaida's animosity towards Siuan. Elaida tries to help her, gets punished for it and assumes Siuan betrayed her. Why Elaida wanted to help Siuan is not really relevant to the plot, Jordan couldn't think of any good reasons, so he didn't bother explaining it.

[scion9]

Elaida is mentally unstable.  She's obviously unhinged later in the series.  She was always probably mentally 'delicate'. 

 

I believe their are clues dropped about Elaida's insanity as well, and will have to remember to comb through her dialogue next time I read through the earlier books.  I'm almost positive she, bound by the Oathrod to tell no word that is not true, threatens death and/or maiming at some point in the 1st four books.  Saying, "I'm going to flay the skin from your hide" isn't terribly off-centre for most people but it is if you have to mean it literally to speak the words.

 

Elaida having a crush on one of the girls is plausible, but it seems it would have come up.  If you wanted non-psychotic motivation, both Moiraine and Siuan are strong in the OP like Elaida.  We know Elaida likes to hang around Aes Sedai that are strong in the OP based on her chosen company in New Spring.  Even though Ellid has a lot of potential, she isn't the niece to a King and she doesn't already have the buzz of 'future Amyrlin' that Siuan did.  Moiraine and Siuan were both rock stars even as Accepted and Elaida wanted a thumb on them.  She treated them like crap even still because she treats everyone she has any power over at all that way.

[Taura-Tierno]

I think it was because Elaida simply thought that Moiraine and Siuan could become very great Aes Sedai that could aid the Tower in the conflict she did know was coming. Therefore, she wanted to push them as hard as possible to make sure they became Aes Sedai.

 

I'd wager that she hates them because they chose Blue Ajah. I mean, Reds and Blues hate each other. Even if she didn't start hating them right away, 20 years of Ajah conflicts probably did the trick.

[Beer Rot]

I think it was because Elaida simply thought that Moiraine and Siuan could become very great Aes Sedai that could aid the Tower in the conflict she did know was coming. Therefore, she wanted to push them as hard as possible to make sure they became Aes Sedai.

 

I'd wager that she hates them because they chose Blue Ajah. I mean, Reds and Blues hate each other. Even if she didn't start hating them right away, 20 years of Ajah conflicts probably did the trick.

 

I'd have to go through New Spring again, but I swear Ellid had just as much potential.  This is why I didn't understand Elaida's helping them.

 

If she wanted to help strong students, she would have included Ellid.  My impression from reading, she only included Suian because she was Moiraine's friend and they were together... it was Moiraine she wanted to gain the shawl.

 

Sure I can understand this is a setting for her animosity for the two 20yrs later, but the WHY she would at all is what gets me.  I just can't figure it out.

[Cheyboygan]

New Spring had a lot of illogical stuff that seemed designed to "foreshadow" things that happened 20 years later in real time, but had already happened in the books. I suppose that is a danger with any prequel but New Spring felt more like fanfiction than an actual Jordan written WoT book.  The style seemed even less Jordanesque than the Sanderson WoT books. 

[Sabio]

The companion states "while she did not particularly like that they equaled her speed in reaching the next level, she pressed them very hard, expecting only the best from them and accepting nothing less.  They had potential equal to hers. and they had an obligation to live up to it -- and an obligation to live up to her standards in other ways as well.  While in Andor she would visit the WT often while they were in training and always took an interest in their progress.  Elaida's dislike for Siuan came later, beginning when Siuan was selected as Amyrlin over her."

 

So it seems more of a since they had a lot of potential she took an interest and pressed them hard to ensure they would live up to her expectations.