Is there more going on here?

[Rinkai]

I'm doing a re-read of new spring, and something caught my attention. In the chapter where Siuan and mMoirane first get become AS, Suian gets her only POV.

 

To some it up, One AS calls Moirane a pretty porcelain doll. Siuan makes a mental note that Moirane isn't just a pretty porcelain doll, but a beautiful one.

 

Then: "Siuan could have kissed her (Moirane). In fact, she did."

 

It might be a stretch but there seems to be some affection beyond friendship in this chapter. I think RJs description of sexual things is usually understated. And this is almost as blatant as he would go.

 

-Rin

[Luckers]

Yes, they had a sexual relationship. That's what pillow friends are.

[Rinkai]

I knew what pillow friends are. I just didn't know that they were pillow friends.

 

I also find it strange that by the time the main series starts most of the AS seem to forget how deep their friendship runs. I mean, the two of them had a reputation of doing EVERYTHING together.

 

-Rin

[Luckers]

Keep in mind they've seen each other a bare handful of times over twenty years, and that they were actively trying to make people forget what good friends they used to be.

[Agitel]

It's hinted earlier in the book, but it's stated flat out in a later chapter that they are by another Aes Sedai, and Moiraine gets all offended that it was mentioned in public because she's a prude Cairhienin.

[Vulgir]

Its cool, since Aes Sedai stopped experimenting in the One Power they all decided to experiment with something else.

[Impressive Bosom]

Yes, they had a sexual relationship. That's what pillow friends are.

 

Its my favorite part of the book. It was the first time my little crush on Moraine actually became justified...

[Talmanes]

You'll notice that there are quite a few Aes Sedai referenced to have been  "pillow friends". Basically they feel really alone and overbond with the only other people there, other novices. This probably is a huge cause of the Red Ajah lol.

[lsm]

You'll notice that there are quite a few Aes Sedai referenced to have been  "pillow friends". Basically they feel really alone and overbond with the only other people there, other novices. This probably is a huge cause of the Red Ajah lol.

it's true there is a lot of pillow friends, but there doesn't seem to be as many married/traditional couples? can this be right?

[Impressive Bosom]

You'll notice that there are quite a few Aes Sedai referenced to have been  "pillow friends". Basically they feel really alone and overbond with the only other people there, other novices. This probably is a huge cause of the Red Ajah lol.

it's true there is a lot of pillow friends, but there doesn't seem to be as many married/traditional couples? can this be right?

 

The lives and very nature of being an Aes Sedai doesn't exactly lend itself to marriage or male/female flings beyond the momentary... keep in mind that the Aes Sedai would have to watch their lovers/husbands grow old and die - perhaps many times over. Also, obviously, their dedication to the White Tower and to their Ajahs would definitely take precedence over their relationships which many men might not accept, especially when without any notice they might have to leave for weeks or months at a time.

 

Not to mention the three oaths - how could any man (other than Lan, of course) be married to a woman who had to answer them truthfully when they asked whether or not 'size really mattered'?

 

:-*

[mb]

I think RJs description of sexual things is usually understated. And this is almost as blatant as he would go.

Robert Jordan probably intended this series to be targeted to teens; more explicit sex might be too mature for them.

 

[Tumeric]

I think RJs description of sexual things is usually understated. And this is almost as blatant as he would go.

Robert Jordan probably intended this series to be targeted to teens; more explicit sex might be too mature for them.

 

Or perhaps what's included is there to give the characters a sense of human realism, acknowledging that such things are part of their makeup, without either detracting from the primary storyline, nor turning it into porn for bookish-types... the characters are quite often "normal" people in extraordinary circumstances...

 

Makes for a good blend IMHO...

[CowboyNinjaD]

I also find it strange that by the time the main series starts most of the AS seem to forget how deep their friendship runs. I mean, the two of them had a reputation of doing EVERYTHING together.

 

 

I sort of assumed that some time after New Spring, they had a public falling out, or at least made it seem like they had a private one.

 

Based on references throughout the series, pillow friends are tolerated among novices and possibly accepted, but they're supposed to stop when they become full sisters. So it wouldn't necessarily be surprising if women who had an intimate relationship as girls became awkward and distant as adults. From either hurt feelings when one woman ended it or a mutual feeling of love that can't be acted on.

 

My point is that I don't think Siuan and Moiraine's situation (at least what was known publicly) was unique.

[Impressive Bosom]

I also find it strange that by the time the main series starts most of the AS seem to forget how deep their friendship runs. I mean, the two of them had a reputation of doing EVERYTHING together.

 

 

I sort of assumed that some time after New Spring, they had a public falling out, or at least made it seem like they had a private one.

 

Based on references throughout the series, pillow friends are tolerated among novices and possibly accepted, but they're supposed to stop when they become full sisters. So it wouldn't necessarily be surprising if women who had an intimate relationship as girls became awkward and distant as adults. From either hurt feelings when one woman ended it or a mutual feeling of love that can't be acted on.

 

My point is that I don't think Siuan and Moiraine's situation (at least what was known publicly) was unique.

 

I get the impression that its generally seen as something one, as an Aes Sedai, 'outgrows'... like reading those romance novels.  There are examples, however - even recently - of those sorts of relationships continuing in the WT.

[Talmanes]

I also find it strange that by the time the main series starts most of the AS seem to forget how deep their friendship runs. I mean, the two of them had a reputation of doing EVERYTHING together.

 

 

I sort of assumed that some time after New Spring, they had a public falling out, or at least made it seem like they had a private one.

 

Based on references throughout the series, pillow friends are tolerated among novices and possibly accepted, but they're supposed to stop when they become full sisters. So it wouldn't necessarily be surprising if women who had an intimate relationship as girls became awkward and distant as adults. From either hurt feelings when one woman ended it or a mutual feeling of love that can't be acted on.

 

My point is that I don't think Siuan and Moiraine's situation (at least what was known publicly) was unique.

 

I get the impression that its generally seen as something one, as an Aes Sedai, 'outgrows'... like reading those romance novels.  There are examples, however - even recently - of those sorts of relationships continuing in the WT.

 

 

Well it is never really addressed by any Aes Sedai as something known or tolerated, but they probably think it is a better alternative to novices trying to find comfort with a stable boy or such. Also I think it is more of a comfort thing than an actual sexual attraction and lasting relationship. Many times when novices first arrive they are scared and overwhelmed and seek commfort in the only people around. Also when someone is raised to Accepted they many times drift apart from their Novice friends. This happens much more with being raised to Aes Sedai and sometimes the friendship is not renewed when the other is also raised. With Siuan and Moraine they probably never had a falling out they were just apart for a long time, and most forgot about their closeness. This would explain why they are still close friends when they see each other again in EOtW. Sometimes people are just quick to forget things, like hiw quickly Siuan and Leane are forgotten about craftinesswise and generally dismissed as not important after they are stilled.