Mat's Plotline (Spoilers for the whole book)

[Muad Cheade]

I have just noticed the similarity between the fact that both Moiraine and Verin wrote letters that Mat was supposed to read shortly before their deaths that they knew were close.

 

Anyways, I think he will end up reading it he knows it is important. It would be interesting to see if he heard of Verin's death when he reached Caemlyn.

 

Another thing that would be interesting to see is if Perrin and Rand will still be able to have visions of Mat when he's in Finnland.

 

I think we should steer the discussion away from how Mat was portrayed as that is merely a matter of perspective and is starting to get tedious.

[aunt_pol]

 

 

Ok, I've plainly spent waaaay too much time lately on bth my 4-6 reread (looking for TBUT) and here reading everyone's ideas. I dreamt, night before last, that I was carrying my own eye, half wrapped in cloth, in my hand. And curiously having no trouble whatsoever with my vision. Hope Mat finds it so easy whenever it happens to him!!

[ThomGrinwell]

 

 

Ok, I've plainly spent waaaay too much time lately on bth my 4-6 reread (looking for TBUT) and here reading everyone's ideas. I dreamt, night before last, that I was carrying my own eye, half wrapped in cloth, in my hand. And curiously having no trouble whatsoever with my vision. Hope Mat finds it so easy whenever it happens to him!!

I have had three dreams where I was Mat. Two I was leading the Band to battle, once in a shopping mall. And one dream where I was trying to escape some city. Oh, and I have had many dreams where I channel. :o

[Diederichos]

Given that he'll likely lose an eye, isn't it extremely likely that Mat will become a much less skilled fighter than before?

[Muad Cheade]

I have had three dreams where I was Mat. Two I was leading the Band to battle, once in a shopping mall. And one dream where I was trying to escape some city. Oh, and I have had many dreams where I channel. :o

Obviously, you are a dreamer and that shopping mall is in fact where the Tower of Ghenjei opens into.

 

Given that he'll likely lose an eye, isn't it extremely likely that Mat will become a much less skilled fighter than before?

It will change how he fights and gives him a blind side, but he will still be a good fighter. Also, I guess it is slightly possible that one of the men his memories is had one eye also.

[bigWalt]

In any case... I hope Setalle gets healed. I like her and she deserves it!

I am in agreement with regarding Setalle, I do so hope she gets healed and she so very much deserves it. :)

[Dakota]

Given that he'll likely lose an eye, isn't it extremely likely that Mat will become a much less skilled fighter than before?

 

Nonsense, it's just an eye.  The gods saw fit to grant him with a spare.

 

But anyway, yeah, Mat was a good fighter, but I think that his role in the Last Battle and things will hinge a lot more on his tactical genius than his fighting skills.

[Diederichos]

What if his losing one half of the world(or the light or whatever) refers to the Finn taking away his memories about fighting men past in exchange for Moiraine getting free? Along with the eye being lost of course. I've been thinking about how RJ could write outrigger novels based on Mat and Tuon's adventures in Seanchan(presumably retaking the throne) if Mat is so good that he'll most likely steamroll over opponents.

 

The only way that could happen with him keeping the memories and it remaining fair/a close-run thing is if Tuon were to give up damane in exchange for the cannons but the people they're fighting in Seanchan still use the damanes.

[Dakota]

I've been thinking about how RJ could write outrigger novels based on Mat and Tuon's adventures in Seanchan(presumably retaking the throne) if Mat is so good that he'll most likely steamroll over opponents.

Is that what the outrigger novels were going to be about?

[Calderis]

What if his losing one half of the world(or the light or whatever) refers to the Finn taking away his memories about fighting men past in exchange for Moiraine getting free? Along with the eye being lost of course. I've been thinking about how RJ could write outrigger novels based on Mat and Tuon's adventures in Seanchan(presumably retaking the throne) if Mat is so good that he'll most likely steamroll over opponents.

 

The only way that could happen with him keeping the memories and it remaining fair/a close-run thing is if Tuon were to give up damane in exchange for the cannons but the people they're fighting in Seanchan still use the damanes.

 

Havin a great general on your side helps tip the scales and all, but it's not suddenly a free ride. The best laid plans can get completely screwed and then it's all about recovery. And with the way the Seanchan sound, even WITH mat's memories, not to mention any other general's Tuon may have at her disposal, I think the only way they'd reconquer all of Seachan, is because it's a bunch of tiny civil wars over there, instead of a unified front.

[southwind505]

I've been reading a lot of post about Hinderstap being just a filler. I'm not so sure, i think maybe it was an example of the pattern useing a Ta`vern to stitch a hole in the fabric. If the bubbles of evil are ripping holes in the pattern maybe the pattern is useing it's strongest threads to stop the rot?

Perrin got the ghost town, Mat got zombieville, Rand got molten man. Do Ta`vern really attract bubbles of evil or have they just been woven where the bubbles will be?

I'm probably seeing something thats not there but I had never really trusted Verin since TGH.

Anyway i loved the book overall but mat was off.

Still came away with that ROFO feeling. Can't wait for the next book  :D

[Vambram]

What is a ROFO feeling?

[southwind505]

Read On & Find Out (ROFO)?

And after a second read of Mats parts don’t seem that off to me.

Loved that his elaborate plan fails... yet again :)

My first impression of this book was that it was the best in the series, I’ve had time to think and it’s now moved down a few places but the action and the pace are back and the middle series dead spots are a mere memory .

I’m really looking forward to the next books.

 

[Lilbaz]

Agree about Mat, I didn't notice too much of a difference but I haven't read the books for a while. He's still the unfortuanate guy who tries to think he's no heroe at all and wants nothing more than to play dice, but always finding himself in trouble through no fault of his own (yeah right). But he is growing up, some of his laughs (couldn't think of another way putting it) may not be as subtle as in previous books but I still cracked up.

Some of the other scenes I thought were a bit sped up (not going to say rushed) like Rand going to blow up the Seanchean. If that was his beggar prophesy they may have spent a little more time on it. But overall it needed to be a bit quicker paced. We had waited a long time for this book and it needed to grab us by the balls, and as usual there were some brilliant scenes. Overall I can't wait for the next 2.

 

[Vermillion]

I have to say I think when Mat first is freed from the dagger he is the best character in the book.  Mat was really a blah character until we went his own way.

 

I do think he was different than the Mat RJ wrote.  He was far removed in the later books from the rogue like character he was during the 3rd book anyways.

[Muad Cheade]

If that was his beggar prophesy they may have spent a little more time on it.

Sanderson says it was.

 

He was far removed in the later books from the rogue like character he was during the 3rd book anyways.

Yep. All of the ta'avern have changed very much from the beginning which was written by RJ. I'm surprised people haven't remembered that.

[bigWalt]

... then we might get a more BS Mat.

Mat's Character was pure BS(I don't mean Brandon Sanderson).  The guy who alway wanted to read the Jain Farstrider book but never got around to it becuase we all know how busy the night life is in the Two Rivers, writes the cover stories for the members of the team he intends to send into the next village?  Out of Character.  The same guy who was incredulous at the thought of other people reading a book.  I just don't see it.  He just did not feel like the Mat of Robert Jordan that came to be my favorite character in the series.

[Muad Cheade]

Mat's Character was pure BS(I don't mean Brandon Sanderson).  The guy who alway wanted to read the Jain Farstrider book but never got around to it becuase we all know how busy the night life is in the Two Rivers,

What does not having read a book have to do with him providing backstories for he and his men to spy?

 

writes the cover stories for the members of the team he intends to send into the next village?  Out of Character.

After seeing the living nightmare that is Hinderstap and almost being assassinated by Darkfriends in an alley, when he finds out a woman is looking for him and Perrin, he decided to take every precaution (including sending in his army) to make sure he keeps his hide intact. Something we'd all do (atleast I hope so).

 

The same guy who was incredulous at the thought of other people reading a book.  I just don't see it.

His thought about the incredulity of reading a book was when one of his soldiers was doing so right before a battle, which would surprise even myself.

 

He just did not feel like the Mat of Robert Jordan that came to be my favorite character in the series.

Funny. He did to me.

 

 

[Calderis]

Hahaha, Same arguments with a different group of people. The Mat thread is doomed to repeat this cycle. It is it's own wheel.

[Mr Ares]

The same guy who was incredulous at the thought of other people reading a book.  I just don't see it.

His thought about the incredulity of reading a book was when one of his soldiers was doing so right before a battle, which would surprise even myself.

I used to read books before going into battle. And during, a couple of times.

[bigWalt]

Mat's Character was pure BS(I don't mean Brandon Sanderson).  The guy who alway wanted to read the Jain Farstrider book but never got around to it becuase we all know how busy the night life is in the Two Rivers,

What does not having read a book have to do with him providing backstories for he and his men to spy?

It does not seem that he would be of a mind to sit down and do all that writing.

writes the cover stories for the members of the team he intends to send into the next village?  Out of Character.

After seeing the living nightmare that is Hinderstap and almost being assassinated by Darkfriends in an alley, when he finds out a woman is looking for him and Perrin, he decided to take every precaution (including sending in his army) to make sure he keeps his hide intact. Something we'd all do (atleast I hope so).

I just do not see it in his character.

The same guy who was incredulous at the thought of other people reading a book.  I just don't see it.

His thought about the incredulity of reading a book was when one of his soldiers was doing so right before a battle, which would surprise even myself.

Maybe the soldier wanted to finnish the book before going into battle where he might be killed and not be able to finnish the book.

 

He just did not feel like the Mat of Robert Jordan that came to be my favorite character in the series.

Funny. He did to me.

Just a difference of opinnion then

[Knobs Mahoney]

Am I the only one who has seen a flair for the dramatic in Mat? It doesn't seem that far-fetched to me that he'd have the imagination to write up something like he did for his men. Furthermore, look at all the past lives and memories he has to draw back upon. They aren't all of battles; some of his memories are of being in the Court of Eharon dancing, and things of that nature.

 

I don't know, I guess I just find it amazing how people buttonhole his character as being nothing but a drinking and womanizing rogue, when the series has proven over and over how noble and selfless he truly can be in the right circumstances. For example, in the battle where he ultimately killed Couladin. He was just trying to get away from it all, sees that a bunch of men who he had no care for or stake in are about to get slaughtered by the Shaido, and rallies them and ultimately leads them to victory. He had no reason to risk his life for strangers...

 

Mat is a multi-faceted character, and I have no problem seeing him do as he did in TGS.

[WolfDragonFox]

I just wonder what we are talking about when we look at the Title Towers of Midnight.  Is it just Ghenji or is it basically telling us (which is my take) that the book will be based on events in all of the important tower locations in the series.

 

1. Tower of Ghenji

2. White Tower

3. Black Tower

4. 7 Towers of Malkier

 

I'm really praying for that #4 to show up...I can't wait to see the Army that Nynaeve set in motion across the borderlands to join with under the Golden Crane.

[WolfDragonFox]

Just so I don't sound retarded and incomplete in thought, I mean to say that around 80% of the content will be these locations, because obviously we gotta look elsewhere every now and again and I don't want to come off as stating the obvious of what will be covered in the next book...lol just the dosage.

[Vulgir]

The 7 Towers are destoryed. But i agree that tittle seems to implye alot of action around these places. Also you cant forget Morridins "Tower" in the blight that was intro duced in TGS, if it is a Tower