Towers of Midnight Speculation Thread (Spoilers for tGS)

[wotjunkie]

RJ doesn't reveal anything without reason, even the most innocuous piece of information can have wide reaching ramifications.

 

having the towers of midnight in seanchan and then refering to other towers as towers of midnight i thik would create too much confusion (hes the creator not the DO  ;D)

 

i think logically its a reference to the seanchan, the main sequence of books may never go back there but its definatley a seanchan reference.

 

unless its BS trying to be funny, in which case we can hunt him down and slap him into submission with the next book  :D mwahahahaha

[Belisarius]

From Min's viewing of Nynaeve where she saw her weeping over a man's body it makes me think that Lan will die in the next book or perhaps the final book. Sacrificing himself as a feignting attack at Tarwin's Gap for Rand.

[lillcheese]

RJ doesn't reveal anything without reason, even the most innocuous piece of information can have wide reaching ramifications.

 

having the towers of midnight in seanchan and then refering to other towers as towers of midnight i thik would create too much confusion (hes the creator not the DO  ;D)

 

i think logically its a reference to the seanchan, the main sequence of books may never go back there but its definatley a seanchan reference.

 

unless its BS trying to be funny, in which case we can hunt him down and slap him into submission with the next book  :D mwahahahaha

 

I believe the word you were looking for is "spank".  We will hunt him down and spank him into submission with the next book.

 

From Min's viewing of Nynaeve where she saw her weeping over a man's body it makes me think that Lan will die in the next book or perhaps the final book. Sacrificing himself as a feignting attack at Tarwin's Gap for Rand.

 

I mentioned this elsewhere, but I think Min's vision saw Nynaeve weeping over Tam.  It flickered out quickly for two reasons - 1. Rand was weaving BF which wouldn't leave a body and 2. it (obviously) wasn't certain that Rand would kill Tam.  Also, per the discussion about what happens if the DO wins and the pattern unravels, Min can have visions about things that would happen but for the destruction of the pattern, or in this case, the thread.

 

Page 745

And... what was that vision that was suddenly hovering above Nynaeve's head. She was kneeling over someone's corpse in a posture of grief.  The viewing was gone a moment later.

 

Oh, and very shortly after this viewing Tam bursts in angry as hell.  Just enough time for Rand to leave, Tam get up and charge down to give some AS spanking.  Verbally anyway.

[wotjunkie]

oh no! hes not getting away that lightly for what would have been the cruelest of misdirections so far  ;)

[Aeos]

Well, speculation or not, the story might not go there, but there will be some mention of the Towers of Midnight in Seanchan. It might be that, like I said, the damane go free from there, which is my perspective.

 

Also, on the whole prophecy of Callandor where the two become one. (wish I had my book with me so I could be more specific, but ahh wishful thinking) My very first instinct from hearing that was the one I will stick by until I read the final book. Lets think what it could mean for a minute.

 

1. The black a'dam used by two women controlling rand. Sure it could happen... not. I thought I heard somewhere in the earlier books that it was the only one. I know in TGS it was widely believed the Seanchan might have more, but really? I doubt it but I won't discount there could be.

 

2. Rand doing something wickedly awesome with moraine and cadsuane because you know how well they will get along haha (this was a joke, just needed more ideas)

 

3. Elayne and Aviendha with Rand, at the final battle.

 

My gut told me number three. Look at it this way, there is no way Elayne's story is done, and the same goes for Aviendha. So what could possibly be their big part in the last battle? Min is important already, finding out how to reseal/seal the bore is big. So how could Min get such a big part and none of it go to his other two lover's? Them all becoming one could be symbolic of marriage, or perhaps Min finds out her part and dies somehow? It would make even more sense. Elayne and Aviendha are first sisters, both are bonded to Rand, both are going to have children from Rand, and both should/will marry him.

 

Any takers?

[griz]

towers of midnight sound like malkieri towers to me...

[firstfishman]

What about the "Black Tower" that Moridin resides in out somewhere in the blight? Maybe there are multiple towers, Senchan towers of midnight, black tower, Moridin's tower... Just a thought

[Nargsmart]

Cadsuane said that to wield Callandor safely, one has to be linked with 2 women, with one of them weaving. 

 

That would be really lame.  Rand just sitting there while Elane/Avi fight the Dark One... 

[Leezus]

Cadsuane said that to wield Callandor safely, one has to be linked with 2 women, with one of them weaving. 

 

That would be really lame.  Rand just sitting there while Elane/Avi fight the Dark One... 

 

I've said it before, and I'm sticking by it: Cadsuane isn't exactly batting a thousand. I have no problem assuming that she is wrong about something.

[coteaz]

I'm really looking forward to how the whole Rand/Fortuona thing works out.

 

- Will Rand find out that Mat is the Prince of Ravens and married to Fortuona?  Will he find it out before he meets with her again, or while they are meeting?

- How willing will Fortuona be to meet with him again?  He scared the bejeebers out of her, and rightly so.  Of everyone that he needs to convince that he isn't DarkRand anymore, the Empress will be the hardest.

- If Rand finds out about the WT raid before he meets with her again, how will that affect him? 

 

I think that it would be great if Rand takes Mat along to the meeting, without the Seanchan knowing.  I also think that the only way that Rand will get the Seanchan to agree to a truce will be to kneel to the throne.  He has seen how much better they are at governing than he is; I think that he'll see that his opposition is hindering his cause.  He needs to bend alot here.

 

He knows what they do with women (and now men, with them copying the male adam) who can channel, he wont put his lands through this willingly, although from what he said in TGS, it seems that he is going to leave his lands to be conquered while he focuses on the blight.

[Durinax]

I'm really looking forward to how the whole Rand/Fortuona thing works out.

 

- Will Rand find out that Mat is the Prince of Ravens and married to Fortuona?  Will he find it out before he meets with her again, or while they are meeting?

- How willing will Fortuona be to meet with him again?  He scared the bejeebers out of her, and rightly so.  Of everyone that he needs to convince that he isn't DarkRand anymore, the Empress will be the hardest.

- If Rand finds out about the WT raid before he meets with her again, how will that affect him? 

 

I think that it would be great if Rand takes Mat along to the meeting, without the Seanchan knowing.  I also think that the only way that Rand will get the Seanchan to agree to a truce will be to kneel to the throne.  He has seen how much better they are at governing than he is; I think that he'll see that his opposition is hindering his cause.  He needs to bend alot here.

 

He knows what they do with women (and now men, with them copying the male adam) who can channel, he wont put his lands through this willingly, although from what he said in TGS, it seems that he is going to leave his lands to be conquered while he focuses on the blight.

I think that now he will revisit the seanchan and  gain the peace treaty, and then he will feel the wrath of the amyrlin seat, cause egwene will be pissed

[coteaz]

Egwene has adopted the typical aes sedai arrogance or as we call it "im always rightness", rand just needs to show her that he knows what he is doing and that he doesn't need her interference. 

[karehiro]

Don't really understand why people keep saying Rand will be linked with Elayne and Aviendha.  Elayne and Aviendha really have no relevance to Rand's story besides as romantic interests.  The women that have consistently been portrayed as tied to his story and are destined to do things by his side are Moiraine, Cadsuane, Alivia, Nynaeve, and Min.  Rand needs Moiraine to win, Alivia to help him die, Cadsuane to learn from, works best with Nynaeve, and takes direction and guidance from Min.  And if he needs to link with anyone via Callandor, most assuredly it would go with two of the mentioned.  Unfortunately babies and romantic interests won't be what helps Rand at Tar'mon Gaidon, so what exactly would Elayne and Aviendha help him out with?

 

That's not even counting the fact that Elayne will be in the midst of childbirth and Aviendha will be pregnant at the time.  They are not gonna be with Rand when everything goes down; there's simply no hint of it.

[navahgar]

With respect to the Towers of Midnight on the Seanchan continent thing...someone earlier mentioned Moridin's tower in the northeast of the blight.  Well, if Randland is a past/future earth, then shouldn't it be round(spherical).  If so, then maybe the higher up you go in the blight the closer you get to these other 'Tower's of Midnight' in the northern part of Seanchan.  They could even be in a different continent than Seanchan just to make Jordan's prohibition stand.

[Eelfinn Lord]

Elayne and Aviendha really have no relevance to Rand's story besides as romantic interests.

 

You're forgetting Elaida's fortelling that the house of Trakand is the key to winning TG.

[b3arz3rg3r]

I bounce the ideas off the wall.... You discuss them... Which ones did you think were good/bad and for what reasons?

ok, let's do this

 

4. Matt assuming control over the ever victorious army as the prince of ravens, trading his eye for Moiraines release, finding out that Olver is Gaidal Cain and him getting some nookie off of Birgitte. I dont think Matt needs the horn anymore, as almost all the dead heroes have been reborn. (how do you call someones soul from his reborn shell to fight for you? They are already going to fight)

 

RJ denied that one. Olver isn't Gaidal Cain, he's just ugly. Birgitte is the only hero confirmed to be alive right now. It's only been speculated that Gaidal will soon be born, because of her.

 

5. Thom giving the tinkers their song... I believe there was reference to him "finding a few paragraphs" of some long forgotten song. He will also get back togeather with Morgase.

 

The tinkers are looking for an illusion. During the Breaking they mixed up that farming singing the Aiel did with their hopes and dreams. And in the first place any song Thom would be able to find would be thousands of years younger than what the Breaking.

Oh and there's no way in hell he and Morgase can get back together. She has Tallanvor and he has Moiraine.

 

6. Egwene finds and defeats Mesanna, uses her ter'angreal making talent to copy a bunch of sa'angreal, etc for use in the final battle, marries Gawyn and makes him her warder. Recruits the Wise Ones and takes control of the world of dreams.

 

Elayne is the one with the talent of making ter'angreal and even she has no idea how to make an angreal or a sa'angreal.

And how is Egwene supposed to control the world of dreams? That's just nonsense.

 

 

8. Mazrim Taim is, in fact, Damondred

 

Also denied by RJ

 

 

[karehiro]

Elayne and Aviendha really have no relevance to Rand's story besides as romantic interests.

 

You're forgetting Elaida's fortelling that the house of Trakand is the key to winning TG.

 

It's actually the royal house of Andor, of which Rand is descended by Tigraine.

 

The prophecy has already been fulfilled since Rand is the Dragon Reborn.

[navahgar]

Elayne and Aviendha really have no relevance to Rand's story besides as romantic interests.

 

You're forgetting Elaida's fortelling that the house of Trakand is the key to winning TG.

 

It's actually the royal house of Andor, of which Rand is descended by Tigraine.

 

The prophecy has already been fulfilled since Rand is the Dragon Reborn.

 

Ok, I agree with you that we all made that connection about Rand and the royal line of Andor.  But I feel uncomfortable about how many times in the books Elaida's thoughts about that prophecy are mentioned.  Practically every time we get her POV she mentions how she had that foretelling and needs to find Elayne.  It's annoying and repetitive because we all get that she's wrong.........unless she's not.  Maybe this is just another abstraction of Jordan giving us an easy answer, except this time, we easily come to the conclusion that the character is obviously wrong, when in fact she isn't.  Granted this theory is purely based on speculation, and the tendency of WOT to have red herrings, but I think that either Elayne, Gawyn or Galad is the person that Elaida's foretelling refers to....

[Eelfinn Lord]

 

It's actually the royal house of Andor, of which Rand is descended by Tigraine.

 

The prophecy has already been fulfilled since Rand is the Dragon Reborn.

 

I'm still not convinced... Rand is a decendent but Elayne actually represents the house of Andor. Anyways... It's all semantics. Maybe you're right.

[WWWwombat]

Egwene has adopted the typical aes sedai arrogance or as we call it "im always rightness", rand just needs to show her that he knows what he is doing and that he doesn't need her interference. 

 

Yeah because coming within an eyelash of raining fire on the Borderlanders or balefiring the Tarasin palace wasn't scary or anything.  Even though Rand reintegrated and seems to be sane he still needs guidance until he shows people he's not bonkers.

[WWWwombat]

Elayne and Aviendha really have no relevance to Rand's story besides as romantic interests.

 

You're forgetting Elaida's fortelling that the house of Trakand is the key to winning TG.

 

It's actually the royal house of Andor, of which Rand is descended by Tigraine.

 

The prophecy has already been fulfilled since Rand is the Dragon Reborn.

 

I'm of the opinion that both Trakand and Mantear are critical.  The interpretations of the foretelling don't have to be mutually exclusive.

[navahgar]

Random thought.  Any chance that knowledge will be shared and Siuane and Leane will both be restored to full power?

[wotjunkie]

What about the "Black Tower" that Moridin resides in out somewhere in the blight? Maybe there are multiple towers, Senchan towers of midnight, black tower, Moridin's tower... Just a thought

 

i think if the Blacktower, the tower moridin resides in or towers of malkier were what the towers of midnight were a reference to, wouldn't it have been more concise to have called the book "Towers of Shadow" or "Towers of the Shadow" or even "Towers of the Dark" as opposed to a very specific place that already exists?

[coteaz]

Midnight means literally, "the middle of the night." It is when one day ends and the next begins. So with that in mind we can deduce that it will be a shadow heavy book "the middle of the night(DARK)". So if we think about it in that light, perhaps we can uncover hidden meaning the the title.

[wotjunkie]

Midnight means literally, "the middle of the night." It is when one day ends and the next begins. So with that in mind we can deduce that it will be a shadow heavy book "the middle of the night(DARK)". So if we think about it in that light, perhaps we can uncover hidden meaning the the title.

 

perhaps but sometimes a cigar is just a cigar

 

book 1 is called the eye of the world because TEOTW had a rather definite meaning to the story line the great hunt also, theres never really been any ambiguity from book title to content at least not that ive noticed ...