Forsaken Power Rankings

[Dr Pepper]

These are my forsaken rankings in strength in the OP (Before Reincarnations)

 

1)Ishameal

2)Demandred

3)Lanfear

4)Aginor

5)Sammael

6)Rahvin

7)Be'lal

8)Graendal

9)Balthamel

10)Semirhage

11)Asmodean

12)Mesaana

13)Moghedian

 

What are your rankings? And where would you put Nynaeve in here at her full potental?

[Fryn]

In pure strength Aginor just below ishy, however he lacks teh battle sense so in effectiveness he is below many.

[Dr Pepper]

I'm sure i read that Aginor matched Lews Therin "Blow for blow". I guess i should rephrase my title as "forsaken rankings chosen by OP strength and OP one on one fighting strength" Combine the 2 and this is where i put them :)

 

So for e.g. i think 1 (ishy) would beat all those underneath them, while 2 would beat those underneath them bar 1,and 3 would beat all those underneath them bar 1 and 2..well you get my point  :P

[Nightstrike]

A lot of guesswork, but here is my bet:

1)Ishamael

2)Demandred

3)Lanfear

4)Aginor & Sammael & Balthamel & Rahvin

5)Asmodean & Be'lal

6)Graendal

7)Semirhage & Mesaana

8)Moghedien

 

Ishamael is probably very close to Rand's full potential. Nynaeve's full potential is probably just slightly over Moghedien - maybe something like Semirhage and Mesaana.

 

[Guest Dreadlord]

Semirhage needs to be in the top 5 for definite. Shes the ultimate in Healing and that requires a hell of a lot of strength.

 

Ishamael

Demandred

Lanfear

Semirhage

Aginor

Graendal

Mesaana

Rahvin & Sammael

Balthamel & Bel'al

Asmodean & Moghedien

[Thor]

Sorry I disagree with people who rank Aginor below Demandred.

[Dr Pepper]

So thor... Demandred VS aginor? My moneys on Demandred. Combination of power AND skill with one power. I always thought of Aginor as being VERY strong in the power. However a strong man can be beat by a slightly less stronger man whos better at fighting. I think this is the case with Demandred and Aginor.

 

And remember Demandred was slightly behind Lews Therin in everything he did. So we can assume that Demandred was slightly less stronger than LTT and Ishy. Demandred>Aginor

 

Btw I'd say Nynaeves full OP potential lies just above graendal. Remember Nynaeve isnt at her full power yet. And she easily matched Mogie. She still has a lot of growth in her.

[Thor]

Where was it ever said that Aginor is less skill?  I am pretty sure you need some skill to be an expert geneticist.

 

And just because Aginor has not much documented fame (because he's probably hiding in a lab most of the time) doesn't mean that he doesn't have ability to match Demandred.

 

I can;t recall but is there any passage where Demandred or Aginor comments about each other?

[Fryn]

Where was it ever said that Aginor is less skill?  I am pretty sure you need some skill to be an expert geneticist.

 

And just because Aginor has not much documented fame (because he's probably hiding in a lab most of the time) doesn't mean that he doesn't have ability to match Demandred.

 

I can;t recall but is there any passage where Demandred or Aginor comments about each other?

 

They are asking about combat capabilities. In combat Aginor is not that grand. Even he says as much in a PoV. On a pure who has the most OP potential then ya Aginor is above most of them, and he is quite handy in other places where direct combat is not needed. In a fight though, not that hot.

 

That said I would put Bel'al a lot higher, He is skilled in the sword, combat, strategy, and was only killed in a sneak attack from behind, from a target he didn't know was there. Basically Bel'al was killed in much the same way as Modg kills her opponents (Which again given the right environment Modg is more lethal than most of the other chosen. And she is smart about when she fights, which is why she didn't help at the cleansing).

 

I would say:

 

Ishy

Demandred, Balthamel (Reading her PoV's you get the impression he/she is crafty)

Lanfear, Bel'al, Rahvin

Semi, Modg (Someone that will stab you in the back is often more dangerous than those willing to fight you head on), Sammael

Graendel, Mesaana

Aginor (Strength wise he is basically at the top... combat and strategy wise he is in the dunce corner), Asmo

 

[lordofsoup]

lanfear says that Amso is the weakest. 

 

Rand totals Aginor even when he does not know he can channel, so that means Aginor is weak? or he is just a complete idiot when it comes to fighting?

 

Semirhage is strong, but not a good fighter everything is in healing

 

the seanchan woman who was freed from being damane is stronger than Lanfear even though she was supposed to be as strong a woman could be.  Clearly the Forsaken dont know everything

[Fryn]

lanfear says that Amso is the weakest. 

 

Rand totals Aginor even when he does not know he can channel, so that means Aginor is weak? or he is just a complete idiot when it comes to fighting?

 

He is a complete dunce when it comes to fighting. He had the element of suprise and Rand thought he was an ally, yet the best he could do was blindly channel into a room he could not see.

 

Semirhage is strong, but not a good fighter everything is in healing

 

The best killers are doctors. Most never would, but knowing the human anatomy is a large advantage. Add to that being able to do it from a distance and with teh power and a healer is an ideal killer. Just imagine dropping dead because your opponent snapped a single pathway in your brain... there is no defense against something like that.

 

the seanchan woman who was freed from being damane is stronger than Lanfear even though she was supposed to be as strong a woman could be.  Clearly the Forsaken dont know everything

 

I have made that mistake in the past, and it was pointed out to me that it was due to Alivia using an angrel at teh time. She is not stronger than lanfear was before going through the gateway. Lanfear was as strong as a woman could become unaided

[Jeynhir]

Wasn't Lanfear just beneath Ishy in strength?

I just read in TGH that Supposedly it was so.(Don't have the exact quote though)

[Thor]

 

 

Rand totals Aginor even when he does not know he can channel, so that means Aginor is weak? or he is just a complete idiot when it comes to fighting?

 

Semirhage is strong, but not a good fighter everything is in healing

 

 

First of all, Aginor's body was essentially a zombie, very severely decomposed.  We know that channeling requires physical strength hence it is safe to say he wasn't able to do as much as possible, which is why he burnt himself out when he tried to draw on the eye.  Rand never actually defeated him.

 

And if blowing off Rand's hand isn't good at fighting despite the fact that Rand had vastly superior numbers, then I don't know what is.

[sleddog116]

Why not 'Ask the Chosen'?  I'm sure that would yield some interesting answers...  ;)

[Ndshacker]

Rand could have very easily dodged it and captured her in one go, but min was behind him, so he didn't move.

[Hybrid]

And if blowing off Rand's hand isn't good at fighting despite the fact that Rand had vastly superior numbers, then I don't know what is.

Blowing off the hand of a sick, non-channeler attempting to protect those behind him isn't very impressive.  If Rand had been holding the Source, clear-headed and focused, and all alone, then it would be something worth noting.

[pxnsolid]

Semirhage needs to be in the top 5 for definite. Shes the ultimate in Healing and that requires a hell of a lot of strength.

 

on the contrary, while the basic form of healing requires more strength to be more effective, some of the best known healers are not the strongest. obviously semi is strong, but skill means more in healing then strength does.

 

"Elayne refrained from mentioning Nynaeve's complaints about Sumeko, who had certainly grown backbone; Sumeko had criticized several of Nynaeve's Healing weaves as "clumsy," and Elayne had thought Nynaeve was going to have apoplexy on the spot. " from The Path of Daggers page 403

 

finese > then strength for healing.

[Thor]

And if blowing off Rand's hand isn't good at fighting despite the fact that Rand had vastly superior numbers, then I don't know what is.

Blowing off the hand of a sick, non-channeler attempting to protect those behind him isn't very impressive.  If Rand had been holding the Source, clear-headed and focused, and all alone, then it would be something worth noting.

 

That is still no excuse.  What about Logain and Cadsuanne and all of them?  They were holding the source already, why did they not have defences up?  Or is it because that their defences got bypassed because Semirhage was too quick?

 

Rand on his own wouldn't be able to defeat the combined strength of Logain and Cadsuanne either.  So if Semirhage can bypass their defence, then she could bypass Rand's defence also, sickness or not.

[Luckers]

Firstly, I'd like to point out that despite everyones assumption that Moghedian is one of the weakest of the Forsaken we have no basis for that. Functionally we know that Ishamael, Aginor, Demandred, Lanfear and Graendal are stronger than she is, but no where she stands nexts to Mesaana, Semirhage, Rahvin*, Sammael, Asmodean, Be'lal, or Balthemel.

 

The fact is she is a coward--a trait she had even in dealing with much weaker women, and due to the numbers at play in the Age of Legends we know that held true. But that fact, and her personal weakness, skews our perceptions of her position in the strength hierarchy. Which is not to say she might not be the weakest, just that we are assuming it based on her personality, a personality that came about despite the fact that she would have been stronger than essentially everyone she dealt with.

 

lanfear says that Amso is the weakest. 

 

She said he has the weakest personality of the male forsaken.

 

Rand totals Aginor even when he does not know he can channel, so that means Aginor is weak? or he is just a complete idiot when it comes to fighting?

 

He didn't actually. Rand and Aginor never actually fought. Rand started drawing on the Eye and Aginor panicked, worrying he was going to lose control of it, and drew too much thus killing himself.

 

the seanchan woman who was freed from being damane is stronger than Lanfear even though she was supposed to be as strong a woman could be.  Clearly the Forsaken dont know everything

 

I have made that mistake in the past, and it was pointed out to me that it was due to Alivia using an angrel at teh time. She is not stronger than lanfear was before going through the gateway. Lanfear was as strong as a woman could become unaided

 

Indeed, though it might well be that Alivia is as strong as Lanfear was.

 

Semirhage needs to be in the top 5 for definite. Shes the ultimate in Healing and that requires a hell of a lot of strength.

 

Indeed, in addition to what pxnsolid pointed out, in KoD Elayne states that Sumeko had outstripped Nynaeve's ability.

 

[sleddog116]

Lanfear says that Asmo is the weakest

 

Wait, wait... we're basing our decision of "who's the fairest of them all" off of the opinions given by the Forsaken themselves?  Sometimes I wonder if they weren't awakened for the sole purpose of insulting one another.  (Which is great fun and a source of amusement, to be sure, but hardly definitive, I should think.)  I think Asmo may, in fact, be the weakest, but that's strictly by looking at his record, not going by what Lanfear says.

 

For one thing, do we really even need Lanfear to say it?  I mean, if you look at Asmo's track record, he's been sort of a loser from day 1 - he's nothing more than a frustrated artist/composer who can't seem to make anything work in his favor.  Even among the Forsaken, he has no real skill in battle or in the subtle manipulations that are such a staple of the Forsaken.

 

I may be slightly off-base, but it just struck me as somewhat strange..

[triadruid]

Wait, where is it said by RJ that Lanfear is as strong as a woman can possibly be in the OP?

[ChronoCrosS]

Are we talking pure one power strength or combat ability with the one power? When Rand fights Lanfear he gets owned. I don't think he could see the flows of Saidar so maybe that was why he lost. Even though Lanfear is as strong as is possible for a woman to be, we will never know how the womans full potential comapares to a mans.

 

 

[Mr Ares]

We will never know how the womans full potential comapares to a mans.

Except that it is slightly lower than the maximum male strength.

[ChronoCrosS]

We will never know how the womans full potential comapares to a mans.

Except that it is slightly lower than the maximum male strength.

 

Ya I knew that but I just don't know how great a margin separates womens and mens potential. But I guess in a comparison of remotely close power strength it is experience that would count in a battle.

[sheaff28]

Are we talking pure one power strength or combat ability with the one power? When Rand fights Lanfear he gets owned. I don't think he could see the flows of Saidar so maybe that was why he lost. Even though Lanfear is as strong as is possible for a woman to be, we will never know how the womans full potential comapares to a mans.

 

 

 

Moiraine mentions before she attacks Lanfear that Lanfear is holding some sort of angreal...that is one of the reason's she is destroying Rand. Also, Rand mentions that he can't make himself kill her so he was severely handicapped only being able to use basically non damaging weaves