The WoT- YA or Adult?

[RAND AL THOR]

I'm not sure of the actual classification, but I was wondering whether you would classify the Wheel of Time as Yound Adult or Adult?

[Majsju]

Depends entirely on the reader. Some are ready wheny are 11-12, some people are probably never ready.

 

And it epends a lot on what the classification is based on. Just the violence and the nudity? The average 12 yo will have seen far worse on telly.

The complexity of the plot is a different matter, there is a risk that younger readers can not fully grasp all the political implications etc. But hey, they must learn eventually, might as well start early.

[Guest Dreadlord]

A teen/young adult might enjoy the story-the events that happen are good events, there are loads of cool characters, and its a colorful, gripping story, but a young adult wouldnt fully appreciate the series I think, firstly because of all the alter egos and mysteries and under cover bad guys, and secondly because of the sheer size of the series. There are exceptions both ways of course; I am 23, and I lent EotW to a mate who is nearly 20 and he stopped reading it because the series is too daunting for someone who isnt a reader. I am a reader, my friend isnt. As said already, it depends entirely on the reader.

[RAND AL THOR]

Hmm yes. But all books are classified into age groups. And the WoT must have a general classification as either YA or adult. I truly doubt a 12 year old could  handle the plot and, all things considered, I'd say YA or at least 15+

[Luckers]

I got the first book on my thirteenth birthday and never had an issue with it. I got George R. R. Martin's A Game of Thrones at the same time, and that i had problems with.

[Spirit1025]

I think I was about 12 or 13 the first time I read Eye of the World. I had no problems with it, but I also started reading at a very young age (2-3 years old!) and have been a serious reader my whole life. So, I'd say it depends on the kid. I'd have no problem letting my own children (if I had any) read it at 12 years old or so. Probably not much younger because of the violence and sexual references, but that's because I don't believe children should be exposed to that so much (I don't even get cable tv lol). I think a lot of us started reading around that age and sort of grew up with the books. And the books grew up with us; they do get more complex as the series goes on.

 

I got the first book on my thirteenth birthday and never had an issue with it. I got George R. R. Martin's A Game of Thrones at the same time, and that i had problems with.

Yes, me too. I first read that series at about the same age, and it was good at first, but it got way too graphic and violent, way too quickly. I couldn't deal with him killing everyone, so I quit and sold the books. I'm kind of sensitive to violence.

 

One of the things I like about the Wheel of Time is that its story spans ages groups and cultures. It can be appreciated and related to by people who are 12 years old, or 90 years old, and even though it takes place in an older time period, it still speaks to modern people, and not just those in one country, either. People all over the world can enjoy it. That is tough to do, as a writer.

 

My library keeps the books with the 'adult' books, rather than children/young adult. (They're back in the tiny, dark and dusty corner called 'science fiction'...I think I'm the only one who knows that corner exists around here) But, I don't trust their classifications much, as they keep Tolkien's books, Moby Dick, and War and Peace all with the young adult books...

[benr]

Yes - in stores or in libraries I've only seen the WOT in Fantasy/SF, never in YA (although, come to think of it, I don't frequent those areas too much).

[Mr Ares]

I'm not sure of the actual classification, but I was wondering whether you would classify the Wheel of Time as Yound Adult or Adult?

It's in the fantasy rather than childrens/young adult section of my local bookshops and library, so adult. Saves us having to draw arbitrary lines over what content is suitable for children, or what counts as too complex.

 

It can be appreciated and related to by people who are 12 years old, or 90 years old

Or older.

My library keeps the books with the 'adult' books, rather than children/young adult. (They're back in the tiny, dark and dusty corner called 'science fiction'...I think I'm the only one who knows that corner exists around here) But, I don't trust their classifications much, as they keep Tolkien's books, Moby Dick, and War and Peace all with the young adult books...

WoT in fantasy is reasonable. Hobbit in children's, reasonable, Lord of the Rings etc., less reasonable. Moby Dick and War and Peace should probably be shelved in classics. If they're in children's, either they've screwed up, or the children in your area have an interesting taste in their preferred reading material.

 

I got the first book on my thirteenth birthday.

I didn't. This is either because my thirteenth happened several decades before RJ was even born, or because my parents were a***holes. Well, blaming parents is always a safe option.

[RAND AL THOR]

The reason why I asked is that when a writer queries agents, to find one who would represent his work, you need to mention both the genre and the target audience. A book is apparently, never both YA and Adult (several well known agents have said this). I think my current work targets an audience similar to those who would be interested in the WoT, so I was trying to classify it as YA or Adult. To me, its YA but I just wanted the opinions of the DM members who are very familiar with the WoT. Thanks for the advice.

 

PS: I'm not sure how GRRM's work is difficult to read if you have read RJ's work. I find many things on a similar level. The plot, way of telling and brutality of the authors are different, yes, but I found it very easy to read a SoFaI after WoT (but I'm 19 now so that may be the issue).

 

I couldn't deal with him killing everyone, so I quit and sold the books.

 

I just love that phrase!

[Nateku]

I think YA would be a fair rating for the level of reading involved. I read them once when I was 11-12, and I've reread the series multiple times since then. Sure I didn't grasp all of the nuances and there were words I didn't understand, but I think this is a great series to grow up with. As you grow up, so does your understandign of the books, making them more enjoyable as you go on.

[triadruid]

WoT is Adult Fantasy in every store/library I've ever seen it in. The early books are suitable for YA, but that's not the same thing.

 

But you can't really use what WoT is classified as to tell what your work should be classified as, RA'T. Unless you're literally copying the style, which will cause its own set of problems. Get a test audience to read it. Then ask them what it should be...

[Jambo]

I think YA would be a fair rating for the level of reading involved. I read them once when I was 11-12, and I've reread the series multiple times since then. Sure I didn't grasp all of the nuances and there were words I didn't understand, but I think this is a great series to grow up with. As you grow up, so does your understandign of the books, making them more enjoyable as you go on.

 

I don't know if I would agree with you there. I too started reading these books when I was 11 (mainly because I thought the cover for tEotW was awsome :P) and while you're right that if you are a strong reader you can get past the unfamiliar words, terms, and ideas, and understand the main ideas well enough to really enjoy it, you don't really understand the books as a whole. I mean the underlying ideas are quite complex and for myself I didn't pick up on important things until i was a little bit older. Then of course there is the length of the books, i mean  we all know the things are huge, too huge, in my opinion for the vast majority of young readers. If this series had been targeted at young readers it probably would not have sold as well becasue the sheer size of the books is intimidating. Then of course there are some parts that may be considerred inappropriate by some, so I would think a seriers like this should be targeted at adults, thou as many have pointed out already it's usually located in the fantasy/sci-fi section...

[Vemynal]

Bringing back up the age issue for a moment, i used to baby sit a kid just up the street from me and while i was i started letting him borrow the series.

 

Believe me, he got some of the fine details better then i did (I was 17 at the time and was able to hold detailed conversations with him about the books)

 

He stopped half way through book 10 because he was 'feed up' with the absolute boredom that that book is, but he did comprehend all that he read.

 

So age isnt so much the issue as maturity and intelligence

[Jambo]

Bringing back up the age issue for a moment, i used to baby sit a kid just up the street from me and while i was i started letting him borrow the series.

 

Believe me, he got some of the fine details better then i did (I was 17 at the time and was able to hold detailed conversations with him about the books)

 

He stopped half way through book 10 because he was 'feed up' with the absolute boredom that that book is, but he did comprehend all that he read.

 

So age isnt so much the issue as maturity and intelligence

 

That's true, but in general most kids don't have the experience to put a lot of what they would read in the WoT into context.

[Celdiruen]

In my opinion, WoT falls into YA. When I read it the first time back when I was 12, I had no problem with any of it. There's nothing overly dark and gritty like in GRRM or Erikson's writing, etc. It doesn't feel like it is adult, at least to me. It is still amazing, epic in scale, very interesting and all that but it only gets a YA on my scale.

[Nateku]

I think YA would be a fair rating for the level of reading involved. I read them once when I was 11-12, and I've reread the series multiple times since then. Sure I didn't grasp all of the nuances and there were words I didn't understand, but I think this is a great series to grow up with. As you grow up, so does your understandign of the books, making them more enjoyable as you go on.

 

I don't know if I would agree with you there. I too started reading these books when I was 11 (mainly because I thought the cover for tEotW was awsome :P) and while you're right that if you are a strong reader you can get past the unfamiliar words, terms, and ideas, and understand the main ideas well enough to really enjoy it, you don't really understand the books as a whole. I mean the underlying ideas are quite complex and for myself I didn't pick up on important things until i was a little bit older. Then of course there is the length of the books, i mean  we all know the things are huge, too huge, in my opinion for the vast majority of young readers. If this series had been targeted at young readers it probably would not have sold as well becasue the sheer size of the books is intimidating. Then of course there are some parts that may be considerred inappropriate by some, so I would think a seriers like this should be targeted at adults, thou as many have pointed out already it's usually located in the fantasy/sci-fi section...

 

Well, in my opinion, a YA book would be targeted towards kids probably in the latter half of their teenage years. So yeah, I definitely agree with you that targeting to a younger audience of 10-12 wouldn't be as effective, I'm just saying that as I am now 17, the books make more sense now and yet I've enjoyed them just as much each time I read them, no matter my age.

[RAND AL THOR]

 

But you can't really use what WoT is classified as to tell what your work should be classified as, RA'T. Unless you're literally copying the style, which will cause it's own set of problems. Get a test audience to read it. Then ask them what it should be...

 

It's not possible to copy another writer's style. Ideas,yes but style? no.

 

My work is not like the WoT, but I would say that it appeals to the same audience. There is much much less description, primarily because extensive description would double my word count from 90K to over 170K, and more than 100K is not advised for first time authors.

 

 

 

[Janxeyzellia]

As far as I know young adult books are meant to target aduicences from about 12-18 years old. I don't think that reading level matters so much in the classification, considering that the ages would range reading levels from about 7- 12th grade.

 

I started reading when I was 11 and finished Knife of Dreams when I was 12. I have reread them, but I think understood the plots well. I have been a pretty good reader all my life though. I think everyone is underestimating a 12 year old's comprehension level. I can talk to other kids I know and have as involved conversations as I could on DM.

 

The Wot books range anywhere from a sixth grade to an eight grade reading level. Most adult books are written at about a seventh grade level though. Personally I would say that they are young adult books based on the age of the characters and the genre. I think most fantasy books are young adult because that's the age group the reads most of them, but it doesn't mean adults don't either, look at Harry Potter. I doubt RJ wrote them to target teenagers, but I think that would be how they were released.

 

[Graendals favourite]

I think a book being for young adults means it is specifically targeted for a young audience. Generally books are not so, these are adult books since they are not written for a particular age group.

 

It is a completely different matter what a young person, especially an avid reader, may enjoy, I am sure there are plenty of kids who enjoy classics, just as there are people who enjoy a wider range of music at a young age instead of only the stuff that fills half of the charts.

 

The WoT appeals also to younger audiences, however it is not YA because it has the substance that is suited for any age. For YA, you would assume such a thing were missing. Things are often, to a degree, left to the imagination in WoT, so there is nothing too traumatic written in the books, though this is in part that it may be people don't necessarily realise what it is they are reading. Good versus evil is not a light matter when treated seriously like this, but the mind imagines what it can grasp, and misses the rest, unless perhaps it is a very trained mind. Anyway, aside from the marketing perspective (there are always more adults than teenagers, and the markets are distinctly different, people generally will not consider what they think is not made for them), the key issue is not whether or not young people can survive and enjoy reading a book, but whether other people do survive and enjoy it and find it worthwhile.

[Mr Ares]

I think most fantasy books are young adult because that's the age group the reads most of them, but it doesn't mean adults don't either, look at Harry Potter. I doubt RJ wrote them to target teenagers, but I think that would be how they were released.

Harry Potter was childrens/YA. It  achieved success with people of all ages. WoT isn't YA, although it may have some success with people within that age range. Most fantasy books may be read by young adults, but the primary readership of most fantasy books is likely to be adults. Because they are shelved with fantasy, rather than YA. Presumably, publishers do market research to find out who is reading their books. And if most of the people reading fantasy are YA, why not aim for the YA market, rather than the fantasy market, which they currently aim at?

 

Most adult books are written at about a seventh grade level though.

You've read most adult books?!?!?

 

Personally I would say that they are young adult books based on the age of the characters and the genre.

So a book about people aged from early 20s to several centuries in age must be for young adults? So adult books are thus those that feature teenage or younger protagonists? Also, I fail to see these books being fantasy makes them YA. Because the genre is fantasy and not YA. So fantasy books, from the fanatsy section are targeted at young adults, while young adult books, from the young adult section, are targeted at...?

 

I doubt RJ wrote them to target teenagers, but I think that would be how they were released.

No. It wouldn't. Especially considering that they actually did release YA editions of the first two books. If you're already getting the YA market, why release a YA edition, which would be targeting the market which is already buying them?

 

RAND AL THOR, try for the adult fantasy (not like that) section would be my recommendation. That's where RJ is.