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Perrin and The Song?


Guest The Thin Inn Keeper
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Guest The Thin Inn Keeper

Rereading the TEOTW again and have found the following when Min is first speaking to Rand in Baerelon:

 

TEOTW, Strangers and Friends, P. 216.

"...I see about the big, curly-haired fellow are a wolf, and a broken crown and trees flowering all around him..."

 

We've done the wolf and the crown to death, but how about the trees flowering?

 

Is it a reference to the Song?

 

It might make sense, of all 3 of the Tav., Perrin has had most experience of dealing with the Tinkers. If any of them were to find it, Perrin would be the obvious choice, in my opinion.

 

Any thoughts?

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I can't really see how it would fit into AMOL, but I would like to see that as I kind of see Perrin as LotR's Sam. his character would fit that the most. But I myself have always thought it would be Rand, as he remembers/knows the song from Rhuidean, all Aiel chiefs and WOs do for that matter too. But I think Rand will be the catalyst that gets the Aiel to start singing again along with the tinkers that have the Voice. I always thought the prophecies referred to this when they said he would "break the spears and make them see, truth long hidden in the ancient dream". And again with "He shall slay his people with the sword of peace, and destroy them with the leaf" though that might be talking of him revealing their past as tinkers, and Aiel running off to live the Way of the Leaf.

 

Also an interesting point in the prophecies I just found. It says:

 

"The unstained tower breaks and bends knee to the forgotten sign.

The seas rage, and stormclouds gather unseen.

Beyond the horizon, hidden fires swell, and serpents nestle in the bosom.

What was exalted is cast down; what was cast down is raised up.

Order burns to clear his path."

 

I think the first three lines are self-explanatory (unstained tower=WT, forgotten sign=Banner of the Light, 2nd and 3rd lines=Seanchan empire crumbling and Anath being Semirhage), but the fourth I think refers to the sul'dam being cast down and the damane being raised up. Just thought I'd share that as I just came across it myself.

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Guest The Thin Inn Keeper

I always thought the prophecies referred to this when they said he would "break the spears and make them see, truth long hidden in the ancient dream". And again with "He shall slay his people with the sword of peace, and destroy them with the leaf" though that might be talking of him revealing their past as tinkers

 

I'd say that both of the above might relate to their past. The "truth" being their role in the AOL. I think it's a theme that could be resolved. The tinkers, and their  have been in the series from early on, it'd be good to see it resolved in some way.

 

I'd have thought that, given that they're allowed into the Waste, they'd have spoken to the Aiel before. They always mention the Song, I guess it would make for a nice twist if the Aiel suddenly go "Oh that song, yeah, we've had it for years."

 

but the fourth I think refers to the sul'dam being cast down and the damane being raised up. Just thought I'd share that as I just came across it myself.

 

It certainly sounds like a major upheaval and the channelers rising to positions of power would make sense. Though wasn't Seanchan ripped apart by Aes Sedai, or channelers, fighting for power? It might make it all a little more complicated.

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Guest leebarr

Loial said Manetheren had the prettiest grove. The flowering trees could have to do with him being it back from the grave

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I reckon Rand wins TG. obviously there are Aiel about and Ogier and when all is won the Aiel sing and the Ogier join in and ta da... Some aiel return to the way of the leaf (Dai'shain)due to their toh to the Aes sedai who told them to keep to the way of the leaf, and a remanent of a remanent remain as the Aiel are now thus they are destroyed and saved (back to original purpose)

 

Although to be fair in Rands flashback in Rhuidean you had Aiel, Ogier AND the green mans race (forgotten the true name). And as he was the last and died I think the song is redundant and the tinkers Quest useless.

 

I don't think the song is something RJ was planning to cover in aMoL I think there were plans for some other books to tie up other loose ends.

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I always thought the flowers blooming all around him refers to when he visits the graves of his family under the apple/pear/fruit? trees.  Weren't the tress in bloom by the time he got a chance to go visit?

 

I too thought this.  He thinks about how much some of his family (sister or something) liked the apple blossoms and they are buried there and he later visits the grave site.  I thought the viewing Min saw was fortelling the death of his family and his visit to the grave site.  Although, Min would have no idea and not be able to make the connection, unless she went with Perrin to that location.

 

 

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I do not think Perrin will have anything to do with finding the Song, or that the Song will be found at all. For the same reason I do not think Malkier or Manetheren will be brought back from the grave. The Wheel is moving forward, and those were things of the past. The Song is a thing from the AOL, and there are quite a few Ages before that comes again.

 

And of course, there are no more Nyms, and it seems quite obvious the Ogier will pack their bags and leave once the dust settles after TG.  Bit hard to perform the Song when 2/3 of the performers are gone...

 

What the flowering trees means...One possibility is that Perrin after TG will embrace the lifestyle of the Tuathan. Maybe a bit difficult if he is married to the queen of Saldea, but who knows.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I think it is all tied up in Perrin's Choice.  What choice?  Well if you don't know what I'm referring to then you haven't been paying good attention now have you? ;D  I am of couse refering to his choice between the ax and the hammer.  However, the way I see it Perrin has a third choice as well, to chuck them both an embrace the Way of the Leaf.

 

Perrin has become associated with two particular groups of the decendets of the Jenn Aiel, namely the Tinkers and the Shaido and IMHO each represents them at thier worst.  The Tinkers have rejected violence all together and feel that it is immoral and unnecessary requardless of the situation.  Personally I think this is why they are unable to find the song, for the Way of the Leaf is a foolish way to live one's life and certainly is not how things are meant to be.  The Shiado on the other hand have gone to the other extreme.  To them violence is everything, it is the solution to every problem and they, unlike the other Aiel, use it for selfish desires.  While the Shaido represnt the Aiel at their worst, I believe that the other clans have also lost the song because they too rely a bit too much on violence.  They are not as selfish as the Shiado, but their culcture is heavily based on war and voilence is all too often sought as the solution to their disputes.  So to sum up, the Aiel have lost The Song because they rely too heavily on violence, while the Tinkers have lost it because they have rejected violence alltogether.  The song can only be rediscovered when a happy median between these two extremes if found.

 

Now remember that Perrin still has a choice to make amoung A) A battle axe, an instrument designed for the sole purpose of enacting violence against other men (remember there is a big differnece between a battle axe and the sort of axe that is used for cutting wood), B) The Way of the Leaf which reqires the rejection of violence even to the point of allowing one's self and one's loved ones to be killed and C) a blacksmith's hammer a tool that has its main use in peace time but that could be used as an effecive weapon if necessary.  So basically the Axe represnts the Aiel and their overdependence on violence (though they are a bit closer to the mark than the Tinkers b/c they do reject weapons designed solely to kill others, but still they rely too heavily on violence).  The Way of the Leaf, of course, represents the Tinkers and their total rejecton of violence.  The Hammer reprents the happy median between the two as it is an insturment that is very usefull during peace time but can be used to defend onself if necessary.

 

So this is roughly how I think it will play out: 

 

I will first state that Perrin is still one of my favorite characters but I must admit that he has done some disturbing things lately, namely cutting of that Aiel's hand as part of the interigation process (hardly Genevia friendly) and cutting down Rollen in his rescue of Faile.  I do believe, however, that these are things that Perrin will come to regret and that will haunt him.  While Faile was intiailly elated to see her husband again I don't think she is so heartless that she will just forget about Rollen and all he did for her.  I think she will ultimatly come to resent Perrin for killing him and will let Perrin know exactlly who he cut down that day.  Perrin will be devistated by this news and this along with the guilt he feels over cutting off the Aiel's hand and the responsibility he feels for what happend to Aram, will lead him to embrace The Way of the Leaf.  However, eventually a situation will arise when his beloved Faile (WOT's consumate damsel in distress) will once again find herself in grave danger. Perrin will realise that the only way to save her will be to get agressive.  Perrin will have long since abandoned the Axe but because the Tuathan need blacksmiths too he will still have the hammer handy, and he will use it to do what he has to do to save Faile (namely bash brains) and thereby will realize that The Way of the Leaf is not such a good idea afterall.  Of couse Perrin is not decended from the Jenn Aiel so he will not directly rediscover The Song.  However, one of Perrin's good buddies just happens to be decended from the Jenn.  You guessed it, Perrins old pal Gaul will be at his side for this event and thus he will be the first decendent of the Jenn to finally get it.  He will finally understand how an over dependence on voilence can destroy a person (a point also illustrated through Aram who litterally went from one extreme to the other) but also that violence should not be rejected alltogether (not that Gaul, as an Aiel would ever have entertained that notion).  So it will actually be Gaul who will rediscover The Song but it will be through Perrin's example.  I can see this part happening one of two ways, either Gaul will come to this realization on his own because of Perrin's example, or Perrin will be the one who comes to the realization that then convince Gaul to sing.

 

Anyway that's my two cents on the issue. 

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